More Civ 6 leaks?

[Brutus2]

No, he can levy City-State units at half-cost.

Right that makes sense. I was thinking that was part of his leader ability but I suppose it could be part of the civilization bonus.

 

[Ovarwa]

Gorgo's ability is sickly good if it also applies to killing barbarians.

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

Gorgo's ability is sickly good if it also applies to killing barbarians.

I was underwhelmed with it when it belonged to the Aztecs in Civ V.

 

[Wellfooled]

If these leaks turn out to be accurate Gorgo is a great debut alternate leader. She has the same general focus as Pericles (culture), but turns the how on its head (war instead of peace) and her LUA still jives well with the rest of the Civilization. Pretty much just what I'm looking for in an alternate leader. Can't wait to see the first look.

 

[Krajzen]

Just wanna add that "Last Prophet" seems to also provide +1 science for every foreign city that follows the religion founded by Arabia.

I love it.

Btw, does anybody know what are exact upsides of crouching tiger over regular crossbowman?

 

[ehecatzin]

Gorgo, aside from the agenda, is pretty much Montezuma from Civ V, non?

Yes but with a whole bunch of cultural bonuses besides culture on kill. Man Gorgo teaming up with Japan or Sumeria is going to be annoying.

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

I love it.

Btw, does anybody know what are exact upsides of crouching tiger over regular crossbowman?

I didn't see any specific info, just the same blurb we already know.

 

[Galbias]

Not sure if I like Gorgo's ability, it was underwhelming in Civ 5 though combat strength numbers seem higher here. Still sounds like it'll really fall off mid-late game. She sounds like a good warmonger buddy though given that agenda, as does Gilgamesh.

I guess Peter likes other civs that are ahead in Science/Culture and behind in other areas?

 

[Olleus]

With combat strength rising much more slowly in Civ 6 than 5, I think Gorgo's ability will wain very quickly. On the other hand, the beefed up barbarians and lack of warmonger penalty will enable her to leverage it and hoplites *very* effectively. Should be able to power through the start of the civic tree and expand at the same time. Seems like a good combination to me. Hard hitting than Pericles, but burning out much much earlier.

 

[KrikkitTwo]

Anyone notice that Rough Riders skip tanks and upgrade straight to ModernArmor?
Redcoats and Gard Imperial both upgrade to Mech Inf. Saka Horse Archers upgrade to Field Cannon lol.

Interesting... instead of a 1 era upgrade (when 2 era upgrade is the norm) they go for 3 era upgrade.. makes sense, your UUs last for a while.

With combat strength rising much more slowly in Civ 6 than 5, I think Gorgo's ability will wain very quickly. On the other hand, the beefed up barbarians and lack of warmonger penalty will enable her to leverage it and hoplites *very* effectively. Should be able to power through the start of the civic tree and expand at the same time. Seems like a good combination to me. Hard hitting than Pericles, but burning out much much earlier.

Well that's what the rest of the greek abilities are for.... she can race to the wild card policies, and race to the Acropolises. Those then support Greece's Spartan culture for the rest of the game.

Pericles is for maxing the end of the tech tree... Sparta is for maxing the beginning to get a rapid bonus.

 

[UncivilizedGuy]

Deathknight Spa! Sounds like a wonderful relaxing place . . .

It is! I hang out there all of time. Just need to be careful where you stick your sword

 

[Nightsong]

So does this leak mean we can riot outside the Firaxis office with pitchforks if we don't get a First Look: Gorgo video tomorrow morning?

Anyways, here's the info on Gorgo (the stuff in italics is what she shares with Pericles):
Agenda: "With Your Shield, or On It
Refuses Peace Treaties that are not beneficial to Greece, and likes leaders that do the same. Dislikes leaders who accept non-beneficial treaties.

Leader Ability: Thermopylae
Upon killing an enemy unit, gain Culture equal to 50% of its combat strength.

Civilization Ability:
Plato's Republic

Unit Unique:
Hoplite

Unique Infrastructure:
Acropolis

If this leak does turn out to be true, I find it interesting how they've contrasted Pericles and Gorgo. Pericles, through his Surrounded by Glory LA gains additional culture through being the suzerain of the various city-states and this is very much in line with history and how Athens created the Athenian Empire with various Greek city-states under her control. Gorgo on the other hand has the Thermopylae LA and gains additional culture through killing enemy units. Now if that LA carries through the entire game it would give them an incentive towards being a more warmongering style civilization which ties back into history with Sparta being a militaristic Greek city-state and having the strongest Greek military at that time.

Also, nice to know that with multiple leaders that the Civilization Ability, the Unique Unit and the Unique Infrastructure all carry over between leaders with the differentiating factor being the Leader Agenda and the Leader Ability.

 

[Nightsong]

So apparently Gandhi's Leader Agenda is called either Pacifist or Peacekeeper wherein he likes peaceful civilizations and dislikes warmongering civilizations. And yet... I still feel that Gandhi is going to want to denounce and then nuke you and your cities at some point in the late game.

 

[King Jason]

I think gorgo's agenda specifically has to do with cities. When you attempt to negotiate a peace in war, the only way you can keep a city you've taken now is if you formally get the enemy to cede it to you. Keeping any cities you capture becomes part of the peace agreement. So I don't think Gorgo will care if somebody surrenders over a bunch of gold and luxuries, she's just going to care if they give up their cities.

For me, the most exciting part of this is that you literally cannot capture any cities from Gorgo unless you plan to wipe them out completely. She won't make peace with you. So either way it's scorched earth against her - raze any city you take, or fight her to the death.

Otherwise, if you have to make peace, the only way it will happen is if you return her cities. Brilliant.

 

[KrikkitTwo]

D

So apparently Gandhi's Leader Agenda is called either Pacifist or Peacekeeper wherein he likes peaceful civilizations and dislikes warmongering civilizations. And yet... I still feel that Gandhi is going to want to denounce and then nuke you and your cities at some point in the late game.

Dislikes warmongers= will declare war on warmongers...and with high tech from high pop and multiple religious beliefs, India will have nukes

 

[Brutus2]

I think gorgo's agenda specifically has to do with cities. When you attempt to negotiate a peace in war, the only way you can keep a city you've taken now is if you formally get the enemy to cede it to you. Keeping any cities you capture becomes part of the peace agreement. So I don't think Gorgo will care if somebody surrenders over a bunch of gold and luxuries, she's just going to care if they give up their cities.

For me, the most exciting part of this is that you literally cannot capture any cities from Gorgo unless you plan to wipe them out completely. She won't make peace with you. So either way it's scorched earth against her - raze any city you take, or fight her to the death.

Otherwise, if you have to make peace, the only way it will happen is if you return her cities. Brilliant.

I was wondering how exactly the game would determine what is or isn't beneficial. Keeping it to just cities rather than trying to determine who got the better deal in gold, luxuries, etc. would make a lot more sense.

 

[shyPiano]

For me, the most exciting part of this is that you literally cannot capture any cities from Gorgo unless you plan to wipe them out completely. She won't make peace with you. So either way it's scorched earth against her - raze any city you take, or fight her to the death.

Otherwise, if you have to make peace, the only way it will happen is if you return her cities. Brilliant.

Welp, I guess we just found out who the most hated leader of Civ VI will be!
Seriously, while it won't be hard (for a certain section of players) to appease her by going to war and forcing the enemy to cede their cities to you, if there's one thing that players dislike is AI that simply won't give them a favorable peace deal.
In other words, we're going to see Gorgo's Defeated animation a lot.

 

[Abraxis]

I think gorgo's agenda specifically has to do with cities. When you attempt to negotiate a peace in war, the only way you can keep a city you've taken now is if you formally get the enemy to cede it to you. Keeping any cities you capture becomes part of the peace agreement. So I don't think Gorgo will care if somebody surrenders over a bunch of gold and luxuries, she's just going to care if they give up their cities.

For me, the most exciting part of this is that you literally cannot capture any cities from Gorgo unless you plan to wipe them out completely. She won't make peace with you. So either way it's scorched earth against her - raze any city you take, or fight her to the death.

Otherwise, if you have to make peace, the only way it will happen is if you return her cities. Brilliant.

Is it though? Or will the default to starting next to her now just be to immediately do everything you can to wipe her out before warmonger penalties stack? It seems up there in eliminating every choice you have along with starting next to Aztec. Neither I think are very good for design.

Unless maybe she'll respect you more and more if your wars with her end in stalemates. That would be kinda cool, both thematically and mechanically.

 

[King Jason]

depending on your goals, I would argue if you can do that for one civ then you should do it for every civ. So that point is pretty moot. Taking issue with threatening civs because it encourages the players to treat them as threats seems... well, ridiculous.

That said, I can think of far more threatening civs to have nearby that will begin to hate you literally just because you're playing the game. China, Pericles, Germany, to name a few - all will begin to dislike you because of actions that you will normally take in the course of the game.

Gorgo isn't a threat - she's just a difficult target. Which isn't really the same thing.

 

[Abraxis]

depending on your goals, I would argue if you can do that for one civ then you should do it for every civ. So that point is pretty moot. Taking issue with threatening civs because it encourages the players to treat them as threats seems... well, ridiculous.

That said, I can think of far more threatening civs to have nearby that will begin to hate you literally just because you're playing the game. China, Pericles, Germany, to name a few - all will begin to dislike you because of actions that you will normally take in the course of the game.

Gorgo isn't a threat - she's just a difficult target. Which isn't really the same thing.

But you could knock them down a peg if and when they do attack you. With Gorgo your only choice is to become the most hated civ in the game by razzing cities or wiping her out. If she declares war on you that's it, it's like every turn the game rolls a dice to see if you lose today. Your only choice now is lose the war or become a pariah. Playing a peaceful civ? Sorry, better luck next game.

The only way it would work is if you're rewarded for fending her off with decreasing likelihood of aggression from her.

It's not about being annoying, it's about her removing any and all control from you over your circumstance simply by existing. There needs to be some counter play.