I expect that once we know more about Social policies we will see accusations of political bias because some ideologies will implicitly be superior to others. 
More info from an E3 demo
- Thread starter mjs0
- Start date
A huge difference between "a puppet city" and "a vassal state" is that a vassal state could be x number of cities working together, being a lot more organised than x amount of seperate cities.
If, in cIV, you manage to get Monty a 10 city vassal state (and give hime some time to rebuild his crushed army), he'll be a pretty decent military help in warfare; if those 10 cities all had to fend for themselves individualy, they'd easily be destroyed by another civilization and could never mount an offensive.
Difference between a puppet city and a city-state probably lies in their independance and the diplomatic effects they have on other mayor civilization. City-states also seem to give some kind of empire-wide boost if you managed to ally them (No idea what, but if might be for example Maritime city-states give extra trade routes and militaristic city states grant some extra units or experience?), puppets only give resources and income.
As for the slow razing; I really hope this gives some kind of diplomatic penalty (Civ4 style would be "-3: You are committing genocide!").
If, in cIV, you manage to get Monty a 10 city vassal state (and give hime some time to rebuild his crushed army), he'll be a pretty decent military help in warfare; if those 10 cities all had to fend for themselves individualy, they'd easily be destroyed by another civilization and could never mount an offensive.
Difference between a puppet city and a city-state probably lies in their independance and the diplomatic effects they have on other mayor civilization. City-states also seem to give some kind of empire-wide boost if you managed to ally them (No idea what, but if might be for example Maritime city-states give extra trade routes and militaristic city states grant some extra units or experience?), puppets only give resources and income.
As for the slow razing; I really hope this gives some kind of diplomatic penalty (Civ4 style would be "-3: You are committing genocide!").
Shiggs713
Immortal
sounds like I'll be playing with cultural victory permanently turned off once again, that is if I do decide to buy this eventually. A mega wonder called utopia sounds absolutely ridiculous. Probably the dumbest thing I've ever heard of actually. Where does that fit in with recreating history?
Ahriman
Tyrant
But it won't matter, because you can run all of them at once simultaneously.
More so than any other cultural victory?
grumbler
Prince
Well, if we're going by this standard (limiting Civ to recreating history), then all victory conditions would be out.
Chimera1804
King
Expected, but good to hear. Might be better if you have flanking units that add to this bonus (i.e. cavalry would give +25% bonus by virtue of the fact that they are mounted and much better suited to flanking than riflemen.)
M
Me,myself,and,I
Guest
Puppets act as a city except you don't get to manage it, no happiness or unhappiness messing with your empire, automated production, etc etc...
SammyKhalifa
Deity
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Where does conquering every continent in the world fit in with recreating history? Where does building a rocket to Alpha Centauri fit in with recreating history?
What? You can run a bunch of them simultaneously but you can't run every single one simultaneously can you? My point is that one of the branches might have more than one policy which to some people will represent the wrong order. Blurgh, we can't tell without the real info anyway.
KrikkitTwo
Immortal
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It appears they are bonuses like techs...once you research a tech you have its benefit for the whole game
Ok so with no tech trading, civic choices now are effectively determined by your tech path. Could be an interesting simplification over what civ4 did.
The comparison made to WoW worries me. As far as I'm concerned any likeness there is not to be taken as a good thing.
The comparison made to WoW worries me. As far as I'm concerned any likeness there is not to be taken as a good thing.
KrikkitTwo
Immortal
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No not the you Research Civil Servic and have the benefits of Bureaucracy the whole game
If you research Civil Service, you have the OPTION os spending Culture to get the benefits of Bureaucracy for the whole game.
lol ok. So it's choice of tech path and culture spending that replace civic choices. Sorry I'm not understanding this new system very well yet. It would be great to see it in video.
Sorry I'm not understanding this new system very well yet. It would be great to see it in video.Tech benefits can be obsoleted when a newer tech is discovered. I see no reason to expect that you will get the benefit of every social policy you've ever unlocked. It's entirely reasonable to think that it might only be the furthest one you've unlocked in the category.
Speculating is fun, but I'd advise against taking any stands based on it.
Speculating is fun, but I'd advise against taking any stands based on it.
Ahriman
Tyrant
Yes, if you have the culture to buy them.
This sounds right, except that some of the 5 elements in a given tree might require that you first purchase lower versions of them first.
It also sounds like a very fixed system; if your civ spends its culture purchasing tradition and autocracy ways, it doesn't seem like there is an easy way that you could have a revolution and change to a radically new society; you'd have to start purchasing liberty/commerce policies from scratch.
Sciguy001
CiV Great Scientist (duh)
Wait, you use culture to buy civic techs! Awesome, culture will actually have a purpose in this game!
Ahriman
Tyrant
Note their actual quote:
"Rather than having to switch out of one policy to adopt another, you build upon the policies already unlocked. The thought process we want to promote is "What cool new effect do I want?" rather than the feeling of needing to perform detailed analysis to determine if switching is a good idea."
http://e3.gamespot.com/story/626533...a-first-e3-details?tag=topslot;thumb;1&page=1
Yeah, that's the nice part about it - very good design idea.
KrikkitTwo
Immortal
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Not Necessarily....There might be a Revolution possibility... a way to "Trade in" Social Policies to either make other ones cheaper or just cash them in for culture to spend on different ones. (at a steep discount of course... you spend 1000 to get monarchy you only get 500 back by chopping off their heads.)
Sciguy001
CiV Great Scientist (duh)
So from what i understand in order to radically change your government "ideology" or whatever it would be a slow transition working your way towards a different end of the "ideology tree" as opposed to 1-2 turns of anarchy. I geuss that's historically accurate in some (but not all) occasions. Interesting.
