Nubia First Look

MooFreaky said:
Actually the title Kandake implies both warrior and leader. Just like Roman terms like Consul and Augustus implied military leadership in the Republican & early to late-mid (even quite late) Imperial period respectively, or Pharaoh during virtually all of Egyptian times. There will always be exceptions, but someone in said role is expected to be militaristic.
Also evidence we have uses phrases that translate to "the Kandake" meaning it's very unlikely to have been a general term used for generic royal women. That concept is often confused because it could be held by several women at once, such as the current Queen and the Queen-Mother.
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Interestingly enough, Candace is an uncommon girl's name and is etymologically from Kandake.
 
God of Kings said:
Interestingly enough, Candace is an uncommon girl's name and is etymologically from Kandake.
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Not so uncommon, at least among Christians, thanks to the Book of Matthew. I know a couple Candaces.
 
Ed Beach tweeted 50 minutes ago. Could mean something. Could mean nothing.

Hyped!!

(did not have any content related to what we are all hoping for)
 
So once again Firaxis announced the new DLC on a Tuesday as always.

How long does it usually take after an announcement before the DLC becomes available. Has anyone kept an eye on that?
 
Sporally said:
So once again Firaxis announced the new DLC on a Tuesday as always.

How long does it usually take after an announcement before the DLC becomes available. Has anyone kept an eye on that?
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it is available now
 
Oh really?? Sorry I didn't check that. Just saw some of the last posts in this thread and understood that people were hoping for a release next week.

Thanks a lot for the info!
 
After the patch was released with a boost to the Maryannu, I have updated my analysis of Egypt vs Nubia, although the conclusion remains the same. For convenience, I have quoted the updated post below.

KayAU said:
So, since Nubia is supposed to be Egypt's rival, and have some similarities in the types of advantages they get and terrain they like, let's compare them:

UPDATE: With the newly released patch, the Maryannu got a much needed boost (+2 strength, +2 ranged strength, -20 production cost). I have updated the analysis below accordingly. I have used italics to highlight the bits I have changed.

Unique units: Maryannu Chariot Archer versus Pitati Archer

Unlocks with: The Wheel, 105 science into the tree (Maryannu) versus Archery, 75 science into the tree (Pitati). Both these are near the beginning of the research tree, so no major difference in availability.
Cost: 120 production (Maryannu) versus 70 production (Pitati). Even after the patch, this is still a big deal. With Nubia's production bonus for ranged units, they can build about 2.6 units in the time Egypt can build 1.
Strength: 35 ranged, 25 melee versus 30 ranged, 17 melee. The Maryannu has a decent strength edge here, with a ranged strength equal to that of a crossbowman, but earlier in the game, and significantly stronger melee defence. This is made less significant by the fact that Nubians can upgrade their archers more quickly.
Attack range: 2 versus 2
Movement: 2, 4 if starting in open terrain versus 3. So, this one depends on the terrain, but in most cases, I would take a flat 3 over a situational 2 or 4.
Upkeep: 2 gold vs 1 gold. In the base case, you can pay for 2 Nubian archers for each Maryannu. However, if you use the very popular policy which reduces maintenance by 1 gold, the archers have no upkeep, while the chariot archers still cost 1 gold.
Upgrades to: Crossbowman versus Crossbowman
Other:
* Nubian archers synergize with Nubia's UA, giving 50% more experience for ranged units
* Nubian archers upgrade from Slingers, while the chariot archers need to be built from scratch
* Maryannu Chariot Archer replaces the Heavy Chariot, which is a far less expensive melee unit that upgrades to Knight. Losing this early cavalry melee unit may hurt more than what is gained by having access to the Maryannu.

Overall, this is a very clear victory for Nubia.


Unique infrastructure: Sphinx versus Nubian Pyramid

Unlocks with: Craftsmanship, 60 culture into the culture tree versus Masonry, 105 science into the science tree. I'm guessing most of the time, you will get to the Sphinx a bit earlier, although it is not a huge gap.
Base yield: 1 culture, 1 faith versus 1 faith
Additional yields: 2 faith if next to a wonder, 1 culture with Natural history versus 1 yield of any type depending on adjacent districts
Maximum yields: 3 faith, 2 culture versus 1 faith, 6 other yields of various types
Build restrictions: Any land terrain, not adjacent to other Sphinx versus desert terrain, can be adjacent to other pyramid
Other: Pyramid next to city center increases district build bonus from 20% to 40%

This one is less clear. The Sphinx has an advantage in that it is a source of early faith and culture, which is very useful to secure a pantheon and the better forms of government. The pyramid on the other hand, has much higher yield potentials, and I can see it being useful and interesting to build in various spots around the districts in a desert city. It also provides early faith. The district building bonus feels like it is somewhat separate from the tile improvement itself, but it makes the Nubian pyramid a must-build if you have a desert tile next to your city center. Overall, I personally like the pyramid better due to its higher yield potential, but if we don't consider the district build bonus, I think this would be a draw, perhaps a slight win for the Sphinx, since it can be built on any land terrain, and provides that important early game culture.

I'll call this a draw for the tile itself, I'll cover the district bonus separately.


Build-related ability: Iteru versus Kandake of Meroe

Iteru: 15% production bonus for building districts and wonders next to river, can build on floodplains
Kandake of Meroe: 20% production for building districts, 40% if there is a Nubian pyramid next to city center

This is another clear victory for Nubia. Egypt's bonus is either a bit smaller or much smaller, and only applies to to tiles adjacent to a river. There is a small advantage in that it applies to wonders, but in general, this is not the best use for your high-yield floodplains, and only occasionally for other river tiles. Nubia wins.


Other ability: Mediterranean's Bride versus Ta-Seti
Mediterranean's Bride: Plus 4 gold for trade routes to other civilizations. Trade routes to Egypt provide 2 gold, and give 2 food to the trading partner.
Ta-seti: 50% production towards Ranged units, 50% more experience for Ranged units. Plus 1 production for mines over strategic resources, plus 2 gold for mines over luxury or bonus resources.

Once again, Nubia beats Egypt very clearly. I usually prioritize internal trade routes for growth and development. As for incoming trade routes, I have no control over those, and it seems that they will be more beneficial to my trading partners and competing players, than to me. The Egyptian ability may make you a bit of extra gold, but you will have to prioritize foreign trade routes. The Nubian abilities, meanwhile, are universally good. You will always want to improve strategic and luxury resources. Bonus resources you may harvest or improve as you please, but Nubia has an extra incentive to improve them. On its own, I would have preferred this ability over Egypt's, and that is before we get to the part about Ranged units. Ranged units are important throughout the game, and especially in the early game. 50% production is very significant, and 50% experience is also very good. To make it all even better, this synergizes with the excellent unique unit, which can be built in about the same time as regular archers, and will level up quickly. Nubia wins.


So yeah, Nubia just seems vastly superior to Egypt. I know I'm not saying anything controversial here. Egypt is one of the weakest civs in the game, while Nubia, by the looks of it, is going to be one of the most powerful.
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The new patch also made the basic archer worse, and the Pitati Archer even better than it already was. It is now only slightly more expensive than the basic archer. Post with updated calculations quoted below.

KayAU said:
You are right, if you are using that policy (Agoge), or another production modifier, the higher base cost will cancel out the build speed advantage, and the increased base cost will be slightly more significant. I didn't think of that. Some calculations:

UPDATE: With the new patch, the basic archer got nerfed with a +10 to production cost, making the Pitati Archer even better, as it will now build faster in all instances. The new values are added in italics below. I have kept the old ones for comparison.

Base case
Nubia building UU: 93,33% of production time compared to other civ building archer
After patch: 77,78%

With Agoge
Nubila building UU: 105% of production time compared to other civ building archer
After patch: 87,5%

With God of forge
Nubila building UU: 100% of production time compared to other civ building archer
After patch: 83,33%

With Agoge and God of Forge
Nubia building UU: 108,89% of production time compared to other civ building archer
After patch: 90,74%

It's not a huge difference in any case, but the production bonus for Nubia does more than compensate for the higher production cost in the base case (I actually don't use Agoge all that often myself), and goes a long way towards offsetting it even with other modifiers in place. Additionally, you will probably be using the production bonus to get some Slingers first, which are then upgraded into the UU.

Overall, I still think this is a very nice UU. It is affordable thanks to the production bonus, available early, has better strength than the already good archer, synergizes with the XP bonus for ranged units, and can get around more quickly.

EDIT: Another way to think of it, just as Nubia's production bonus is a bit less significant when you are using Agoge, relatively speaking, Agoge's production bonus is a bit less significant when you are playing as Nubia. As another Civ, Agoge gives you +50% for ranged and melee units. As Nubia, you will still get +50% for melee, but since you already have a 50% bonus for ranged, the Agoge bonus only adds another 33% to your total. So, with the base 10 production example from earlier, as another Civ, Agoge takes you from 10 to 15 when building ranged units. As Nubia it takes you from 15 to 20. This means Agoge is worth a bit less if you're Nubia.
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So the tooltip is recommending I build multiple Nubian pyramids (next to each other), is this a good idea? I can't see the purpose, even if they are in desert squares (which I may put districts later). I was thinking 1 per city, do I need more?

Edit: In case anyone is wondering, nubia's archers have cheaper upgrades to crossbowmen. Not a whole lot cheaper, but cheaper nonetheless.
 
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Disgustipated said:
So the tooltip is recommending I build multiple Nubian pyramids (next to each other), is this a good idea? I can't see the purpose, even if they are in desert squares (which I may put districts later). I was thinking 1 per city, do I need more?
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I would nestle them in the flanks of multiple districts, like Paireidezas, particularly next to the city center, and particularly on floodplains. But don't go overboard.
 
Disgustipated said:
So the tooltip is recommending I build multiple Nubian pyramids (next to each other), is this a good idea? I can't see the purpose, even if they are in desert squares (which I may put districts later). I was thinking 1 per city, do I need more?
Click to expand...

I think its just doing that because there's so few tile improvements you can build in a desert combined with the fact that the recommendation thing has always been pretty zealous in making suggestions IMO
 
bite said:
it is available now
Click to expand...

.... How come I didn't notice in Steam? :confused:
Or maybe I assumed that the thing that I just downloaded 4 hours ago was the patch, but in fact the DLC also came with it...
 
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