Northern Pike
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OFW1 Science and Industry
- Thread starter OneFastWarrior
- Start date
Northern Pike
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Screenshot 1--Cleo's seductive small talk:
Northern Pike
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Screenshot 2--the Korean front:
Northern Pike
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THE KIMCHI AND THE GLORY
530 AD (0): I switch Persepolis from settler to library. It's time for Pers. to become a size-twelve powerhouse, I think, and at this point we can cash-rush settlers from bad cities with fast population growth.
I make peace with the Egyptians and the Chinese, after which we're able to cut the luxury rate to 0% and pull in 128 gpt.
We get a palace expansion.
And:
530 AD (0): I switch Persepolis from settler to library. It's time for Pers. to become a size-twelve powerhouse, I think, and at this point we can cash-rush settlers from bad cities with fast population growth.
I make peace with the Egyptians and the Chinese, after which we're able to cut the luxury rate to 0% and pull in 128 gpt.
We get a palace expansion.
And:
Northern Pike
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540 AD (1): We trade iron to the Carthaginians for dyes and minor considerations. Given their location, I don't mind helping the Carthaginians a little.
Our cities in China and Egypt are getting the benefit of our luxuries, even though we don't have a harbour on this continent. Looking at the map, the luxuries must be coming through Roman Cumae, almost at the North Pole.
550 AD (2): I get Pasargadae back up to size twelve with two worker merges.
I unhook all our saltpetre and begin cash-rushing pikemen in Egypt and China.
We trade Republic and 70 gold to the hopeless Americans for incense.
We found River Palace, our future capital, on the agreed site. I decide there's no reason to raze Nanking until we're able to do the palace jump.
We get another palace expansion.
560 AD (3): Zzzzzz....
570 AD (4):
Our cities in China and Egypt are getting the benefit of our luxuries, even though we don't have a harbour on this continent. Looking at the map, the luxuries must be coming through Roman Cumae, almost at the North Pole.
550 AD (2): I get Pasargadae back up to size twelve with two worker merges.
I unhook all our saltpetre and begin cash-rushing pikemen in Egypt and China.
We trade Republic and 70 gold to the hopeless Americans for incense.
We found River Palace, our future capital, on the agreed site. I decide there's no reason to raze Nanking until we're able to do the palace jump.
We get another palace expansion.
560 AD (3): Zzzzzz....
570 AD (4):
Northern Pike
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580 AD (5): I unhook our iron (except the Egyptian iron which goes to Carthage) and begin cash-rushing spearmen.
Heliopolis completes its harbour, our first in Egypt/China.
We get yet another palace expansion.
590 AD (6): The Greeks discover Astronomy and begin Copernicus.
We get still another palace expansion.
600 AD (7): We buy the Korean TM for one gold--tactical intelligence on the cheap! Korea's cities are just as pathetic as they looked when our map was out of date.
We declare war on the Koreans (honourably, with no forces in their territory) and land nine units next to Namp'o, while another nine wait in their galleys for a moment.
We found Shiraz on the southern yellow dot from the dotmap.
610 AD (8): We take Namp'o from its garrison of two spearmen and one archer.
We land nine units next to Cheju.
A forest chop near Susa reveals BG.
620 AD (9): Our horses-for-ivory deal with the Greeks expires. I don't renew it, since we're going to be grabbing a Korean luxury and poaching a Greek one (see below) soon.
We take Hyangsan (garrison of two spearmen), Cheju (two spearmen, one archer), and Pyongyang (two spearmen).
We found Kandahar near the northern tip of the second eastern island--on the wrong tile, but the Greeks were about to beat us to the punch.
Pasargadae completes its university ( four culture/turn
) and begins a palace prebuild.
630 AD (10): We found Altin Tepe in southern Korea. The point of this is that once AT gets a cultural expansion, it will poach one elephant from around Delphi--yet there's no actual overlap with Delphi, and so no flip risk.
General: Astronomy is the only tech in circulation we don't have, and only the Greeks have it.
We've suffered no losses so far in the Korean campaign, but on the other hand, six elite victories haven't produced a Great Leader.
Heliopolis completes its harbour, our first in Egypt/China.
We get yet another palace expansion.
590 AD (6): The Greeks discover Astronomy and begin Copernicus.
We get still another palace expansion.
600 AD (7): We buy the Korean TM for one gold--tactical intelligence on the cheap! Korea's cities are just as pathetic as they looked when our map was out of date.
We declare war on the Koreans (honourably, with no forces in their territory) and land nine units next to Namp'o, while another nine wait in their galleys for a moment.
We found Shiraz on the southern yellow dot from the dotmap.
610 AD (8): We take Namp'o from its garrison of two spearmen and one archer.
We land nine units next to Cheju.
A forest chop near Susa reveals BG.
620 AD (9): Our horses-for-ivory deal with the Greeks expires. I don't renew it, since we're going to be grabbing a Korean luxury and poaching a Greek one (see below) soon.
We take Hyangsan (garrison of two spearmen), Cheju (two spearmen, one archer), and Pyongyang (two spearmen).
We found Kandahar near the northern tip of the second eastern island--on the wrong tile, but the Greeks were about to beat us to the punch.
Pasargadae completes its university ( four culture/turn
) and begins a palace prebuild.630 AD (10): We found Altin Tepe in southern Korea. The point of this is that once AT gets a cultural expansion, it will poach one elephant from around Delphi--yet there's no actual overlap with Delphi, and so no flip risk.
General: Astronomy is the only tech in circulation we don't have, and only the Greeks have it.
We've suffered no losses so far in the Korean campaign, but on the other hand, six elite victories haven't produced a Great Leader.
Northern Pike
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THE FUTURE:
We could probably get Copernicus built in Persepolis (repeat, Persepolis), since the Greeks are building it in a mediocre city (Thermopylae). But to do this we'd have to get Astronomy pretty quickly, since the university prebuild in Pers. (which would also be a perfectly good thing actually to build) won't last long.
Of course, we could also keep an eye on our rivals' progress towards Bach, and try to sneak Copernicus in before Bach in Pasargadae if we think they're moving slowly enough.
A cash-rushed library in Altin Tepe is obviously a high priority.
The settler near Nanking is on the northern yellow dot from the dotmap.
Note the irritating location of Taejon, in the far north of the Babylonian/Greek/Korean continent. It would probably be easiest to reduce the Koreans to Taejon and Pyongsong, get Taejon in the peace settlement, and take Pyongsong twenty turns later (conveniently, Pyongsong is close to China's remaining city). Taejon has furs, so this complication isn't all bad.
Susa should probably be boosted up to size twelve with worker merges as soon as it completes its cathedral.
We could probably get Copernicus built in Persepolis (repeat, Persepolis), since the Greeks are building it in a mediocre city (Thermopylae). But to do this we'd have to get Astronomy pretty quickly, since the university prebuild in Pers. (which would also be a perfectly good thing actually to build) won't last long.
Of course, we could also keep an eye on our rivals' progress towards Bach, and try to sneak Copernicus in before Bach in Pasargadae if we think they're moving slowly enough.
A cash-rushed library in Altin Tepe is obviously a high priority.
The settler near Nanking is on the northern yellow dot from the dotmap.
Note the irritating location of Taejon, in the far north of the Babylonian/Greek/Korean continent. It would probably be easiest to reduce the Koreans to Taejon and Pyongsong, get Taejon in the peace settlement, and take Pyongsong twenty turns later (conveniently, Pyongsong is close to China's remaining city). Taejon has furs, so this complication isn't all bad.
Susa should probably be boosted up to size twelve with worker merges as soon as it completes its cathedral.
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Well NP, we're all wading through the AI as if it is't there. We'll be at the domination limit by 1200AD at this rate.
What then? Do we each take it in turns to press "next turn" ten times until the 20k trigger?
Well played.
I can't add anything to what you've said already. I agree with it all. The leader for the palace will surely come.
Am I up?
What then? Do we each take it in turns to press "next turn" ten times until the 20k trigger?
Well played.
I can't add anything to what you've said already. I agree with it all. The leader for the palace will surely come.
Am I up?
Northern Pike
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Yes, you're up. Was that a question about the order in which we've been playing, or about whether I'd finally finished posting?
If we really do reach the pressing-enter stage, I suppose we could play in blocks of twenty or even thirty turns to speed things along.
If we really do reach the pressing-enter stage, I suppose we could play in blocks of twenty or even thirty turns to speed things along.
OneFastWarrior
Asthma Hound Chihuahua
way to get a foothold on another continent. All sounds good to me!
Have fun finishing off Korea mad-bax,..., unless they settle a city far away like everyone we attack does
Have fun finishing off Korea mad-bax,..., unless they settle a city far away like everyone we attack does
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This is just to say that I have played 6 turns, and will play the rest tomorrow.
I tried my best for a leader, but didn't get one. Korea are left with a single city on a different landmass as per Pikes last post. So that's 3.
I allowed the university to complete in Persepolis. I traded for MT and then tried to trade it for astronomy to the Russians. But it was too expensive IMO. We could probably get it in Susa if I trade for astronomy b4 its next build completes. We could always have a pop at the Greeks if we want it that badly.
Any thoughts as to our next target?
Sorry for the delay, but this is a holiday weekend in Britain, and I am supposed to do stuff with my family.
I tried my best for a leader, but didn't get one. Korea are left with a single city on a different landmass as per Pikes last post. So that's 3.
I allowed the university to complete in Persepolis. I traded for MT and then tried to trade it for astronomy to the Russians. But it was too expensive IMO. We could probably get it in Susa if I trade for astronomy b4 its next build completes. We could always have a pop at the Greeks if we want it that badly.
Any thoughts as to our next target?
Sorry for the delay, but this is a holiday weekend in Britain, and I am supposed to do stuff with my family.
Northern Pike
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Well, I suppose that's the problem with fighting an enemy as feeble as Korea: one gets about ten elite attacks and then the war is over. Our position is so strong that the delay in getting our second core going is just an inconvenience, though a maddening one.
I think it's worth taking some trouble to get Copernicus in Susa. The only measure I'd rule out in our attempts to get Astronomy would be anything which might help the Greek military--no saltpetre for Alex!
Ideally, I think, the Greeks should be our next target. They, and the Babylonians beyond them, look like the most serious candidates to threaten us with a launch before we hit 20k. We might as well do something about it while our army is in the area. Greece's best cities are near the Korean border, too, which is useful.
On the other hand, if we decide that we don't want to fight the Greeks until we get cavalry, we might want to take on the Mongols or Romans just to leader-fish. A lot depends on whether Greece's cities are garrisoned by pikemen or musketmen right now. Could you do a little trespassing and find out what's in Delphi?
The fact that we weren't in control of when MT would become available concerned me, and I'm glad that we've got it.
Don't worry about the delay. Having my turn come up simultaneously in three games a few days ago burned me out a little, and I'm enjoying the break.
I think it's worth taking some trouble to get Copernicus in Susa. The only measure I'd rule out in our attempts to get Astronomy would be anything which might help the Greek military--no saltpetre for Alex!
Ideally, I think, the Greeks should be our next target. They, and the Babylonians beyond them, look like the most serious candidates to threaten us with a launch before we hit 20k. We might as well do something about it while our army is in the area. Greece's best cities are near the Korean border, too, which is useful.
On the other hand, if we decide that we don't want to fight the Greeks until we get cavalry, we might want to take on the Mongols or Romans just to leader-fish. A lot depends on whether Greece's cities are garrisoned by pikemen or musketmen right now. Could you do a little trespassing and find out what's in Delphi?
The fact that we weren't in control of when MT would become available concerned me, and I'm glad that we've got it.
Don't worry about the delay. Having my turn come up simultaneously in three games a few days ago burned me out a little, and I'm enjoying the break.
OneFastWarrior
Asthma Hound Chihuahua
Thats fine mad-bax, I still need to catch up on reading the TDG game, and try to finish GOTM. I don't know if I can win, but I am trying.
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Turnlog:
630AD: Pre-Turm check - OK
IBT:
Susa Cathedral - Library
Arbela Aqueduct - Market
HAmadan horse - horse
Ergili Market - horse
Hyansang Library - Spear
Ghulaman spear - Horse
640AD:
Joined 2 workers to Susa
Rushed Library in Altin Tepe
Found Bunyan - Rax
Will abandon Nanking when worker completes.
Move lots of troops around Korea without actually killing anything.
Greek settler archer pair look as if they could be a niusance on the crappy island.
IBT:
Gordium Library - Cathedral
Samaria duct - Horse
Altin Tepe Library - Temple
650:
Kill spear in Pusan with Elite Knight - no leader. Wait for Elite Immortal to take city next turn. Other vet knights turn north. Moved stuff.
IBT:
Tarsus horse - horse (This town needs an irrigated grassland)
The Greeks start Bachs.
660AD:
Elite immortal kills spear in Pusan - no leader
Elite Knight takes Pusan - Library - no leader.
Could just take out the Koreans this turn, But I will continue to fish.
Both Mongols and Greeks have MT. Greeks are cheapest.
Buy Greek MT for WM + 13gpt + 351g
Catherine has Astronomy but no MT. The trade is very expensive ATM. If I had known how low a value she placed on MT I would never have traded for it yet.
Change 20K city to Bachs in case we forget.
IBT:
Susa Library - Uni (At 18spt building horses is a waste).
Bactra galley - market
Dariush Kabir harbour - rax
Russians start Copernicus
670AD:
Capture Seoul with two Elite Knights. No leader - Library.
Seoul is built on silks. How pleasing.
Attack Wotan with Elites. Left red-lined spear for one more leader attempt.
IBT:
Persepolis Cathederal - Musket?
Memphis worker - worker
Antioch Market - Library
Sidon Worker - Worker
Samaria horse - horse
Hamadan horse - horse
680AD:
I wondered why Kaifeng was unconnected. It's sitting on Saltpetre. I'd better stop the worker roading to it then
No attacks as no elites available. Hopefully Korea will get another defender too.
IBT:
American trade for gems expires. Renew (Gems + 2g for horses Monotheism and Feudalism). They are so impaired it doesn't matter IMO.
Nanking worker - worker (sell library)
Tarsus horse - horse
Tyre aqueduct - horse
Ergili horse - horse
Borazjan settler - settler
690AD:
Abandon Nanking
Elite Immortal dies against korean spear.
Elite immortal wins taking city - library. No Leader
No message to say Korea is finished. They have 2 cities
Make peace with Korea. Get Taejon for deal.Pyonsong their last city is 10 tiles NW of Seoul.
Couldn't understand why the Saltpetre under Dariush Kabir shows up as connected.Spent a couple of turns thinking about it. Well it completed its' harbour 2 turns ago. Et voila. So I'll road to it.
Trade Russian astronomy and WM for MT + WM + 11gpt + 503g (ouch).
Perepolis switched to Copernicus (in 16 with MM which adds a turn to Bachs)
IBT:
Istakr settler - harbour
700AD:
Prepare for evacuation of Korean troops to Mongolia. I'd rather fight Greece with Cav. frankly.
Do a complete MM round to put the prospective new core on a fast food diet.
IBT:
Thebes settler - settler
Tarsus horse - horse (who sited Tarsus there ) We'll have to irrigate a few of the grassland tiles to allow growth an use of the mined hills).
Samaria horse - harbour
Ghulaman horse - horse
Taejon warrior (rushed) - library
710AD:
Worker turns. Move troops.
Greece has Navigation.
Hawk WM for loose change. Greece and mongolia lack Saltpetre still.
IBT:
Antioch library - harbour
Tyre horse - horse
Avaris riots clown
Greeks start Magellans. We will need to chop them off at the knees pretty soon.
Beginning to regret going for Mongolia.
720AD:
Realise how many harbours I'm building. Lack of imagination. Please veto if
IBT:
Susa uni - horse
Kaifeng riots. Thats 2. Clown.
Mongols start Bachs (ROTFLMAO)
730AD:
Found Charsadda aggressively - Library
Troopships are about to dock at Pi-Ramases.
Other than that I don't know what to say.
Pasargadae is at 56cpt with a total culture of around 2777. I guess we're looking at 20K around 1800. We need a lot of leaders to do it quicker. I might fill in the culture calculator at work tomorrow.
There is no screen shot because it's late, it hasn't changed much, I'm lazy and I now have to do my turns in another SG.
Have fun with the Mongols OFW. I hope they have keshiks when you knock on their door. I've never seen them in action b4. I want a full report
Mongolian Calling Card.
630AD: Pre-Turm check - OK
IBT:
Susa Cathedral - Library
Arbela Aqueduct - Market
HAmadan horse - horse
Ergili Market - horse
Hyansang Library - Spear
Ghulaman spear - Horse
640AD:
Joined 2 workers to Susa
Rushed Library in Altin Tepe
Found Bunyan - Rax
Will abandon Nanking when worker completes.
Move lots of troops around Korea without actually killing anything.
Greek settler archer pair look as if they could be a niusance on the crappy island.
IBT:
Gordium Library - Cathedral
Samaria duct - Horse
Altin Tepe Library - Temple
650:
Kill spear in Pusan with Elite Knight - no leader. Wait for Elite Immortal to take city next turn. Other vet knights turn north. Moved stuff.
IBT:
Tarsus horse - horse (This town needs an irrigated grassland)
The Greeks start Bachs.
660AD:
Elite immortal kills spear in Pusan - no leader
Elite Knight takes Pusan - Library - no leader.
Could just take out the Koreans this turn, But I will continue to fish.
Both Mongols and Greeks have MT. Greeks are cheapest.
Buy Greek MT for WM + 13gpt + 351g
Catherine has Astronomy but no MT. The trade is very expensive ATM. If I had known how low a value she placed on MT I would never have traded for it yet.
Change 20K city to Bachs in case we forget.
IBT:
Susa Library - Uni (At 18spt building horses is a waste).
Bactra galley - market
Dariush Kabir harbour - rax
Russians start Copernicus
670AD:
Capture Seoul with two Elite Knights. No leader - Library.
Seoul is built on silks. How pleasing.
Attack Wotan with Elites. Left red-lined spear for one more leader attempt.
IBT:
Persepolis Cathederal - Musket?
Memphis worker - worker
Antioch Market - Library
Sidon Worker - Worker
Samaria horse - horse
Hamadan horse - horse
680AD:
I wondered why Kaifeng was unconnected. It's sitting on Saltpetre. I'd better stop the worker roading to it then
No attacks as no elites available. Hopefully Korea will get another defender too.
IBT:
American trade for gems expires. Renew (Gems + 2g for horses Monotheism and Feudalism). They are so impaired it doesn't matter IMO.
Nanking worker - worker (sell library)
Tarsus horse - horse
Tyre aqueduct - horse
Ergili horse - horse
Borazjan settler - settler
690AD:
Abandon Nanking
Elite Immortal dies against korean spear.
Elite immortal wins taking city - library. No Leader
No message to say Korea is finished. They have 2 cities
Make peace with Korea. Get Taejon for deal.Pyonsong their last city is 10 tiles NW of Seoul.
Couldn't understand why the Saltpetre under Dariush Kabir shows up as connected.Spent a couple of turns thinking about it. Well it completed its' harbour 2 turns ago. Et voila. So I'll road to it.
Trade Russian astronomy and WM for MT + WM + 11gpt + 503g (ouch).
Perepolis switched to Copernicus (in 16 with MM which adds a turn to Bachs)
IBT:
Istakr settler - harbour
700AD:
Prepare for evacuation of Korean troops to Mongolia. I'd rather fight Greece with Cav. frankly.
Do a complete MM round to put the prospective new core on a fast food diet.
IBT:
Thebes settler - settler
Tarsus horse - horse (who sited Tarsus there
) We'll have to irrigate a few of the grassland tiles to allow growth an use of the mined hills).Samaria horse - harbour
Ghulaman horse - horse
Taejon warrior (rushed) - library
710AD:
Worker turns. Move troops.
Greece has Navigation.
Hawk WM for loose change. Greece and mongolia lack Saltpetre still.
IBT:
Antioch library - harbour
Tyre horse - horse
Avaris riots
clownGreeks start Magellans. We will need to chop them off at the knees pretty soon.
Beginning to regret going for Mongolia.
720AD:
Realise how many harbours I'm building. Lack of imagination. Please veto if
IBT:
Susa uni - horse
Kaifeng riots. Thats 2. Clown.
Mongols start Bachs (ROTFLMAO)
730AD:
Found Charsadda aggressively - Library
Troopships are about to dock at Pi-Ramases.
Other than that I don't know what to say.
Pasargadae is at 56cpt with a total culture of around 2777. I guess we're looking at 20K around 1800. We need a lot of leaders to do it quicker. I might fill in the culture calculator at work tomorrow.
There is no screen shot because it's late, it hasn't changed much, I'm lazy and I now have to do my turns in another SG.
Have fun with the Mongols OFW. I hope they have keshiks when you knock on their door. I've never seen them in action b4. I want a full report
Mongolian Calling Card.
OneFastWarrior
Asthma Hound Chihuahua
Just to say, I gotit! any thoughts from either of ya before I play. I probably won't get to it till tomorrow or Wednesday.
Mongolia is up to bat eh?
Mongolia is up to bat eh?
Northern Pike
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Mad-bax, good work arranging the maximum number of elite attacks. It looks as though we won 13 elite victories in the Korean war, meaning we had about a 68% chance of generating at least one Great Leader. So the theory was good even if the result was disappointing.
OneFastWarrior, our peace treaties with Egypt and (more relevantly) China are just about to expire. I'm not suggesting that you should divert troops from the Mongolian campaign, but it's something to bear in mind.
OneFastWarrior, our peace treaties with Egypt and (more relevantly) China are just about to expire. I'm not suggesting that you should divert troops from the Mongolian campaign, but it's something to bear in mind.
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We have a fair number of boats, so taking the last Egyptian and Chinese cities would not be a problem. It's just gaging what to attack them with. If you send 4 Elites and you win on the first turn without getting a leader it's a waste. I'd wait 'till our new capital is set up then take them out "en passant" on a future military campaign.
I'm not sure how many elite victories I had. I had two losses, losing 1 immortal and red-lining a knight. But around a dozen is about right. But we have a fair number of elites and would feel reasonably confident that we would get a leader for the palace.
I'm beginning to get nervous about Bachs' so I would press on militarily for two leaders anyway. That will probably put us in the Romans' face who have connected iron, so we will be fighting them through their GA.
The more I think about it, the more I realise that not going for Greece was a tactical error of judgement. I should have taken your advice Pike.
I'm not sure how many elite victories I had. I had two losses, losing 1 immortal and red-lining a knight. But around a dozen is about right. But we have a fair number of elites and would feel reasonably confident that we would get a leader for the palace.
I'm beginning to get nervous about Bachs' so I would press on militarily for two leaders anyway. That will probably put us in the Romans' face who have connected iron, so we will be fighting them through their GA.
The more I think about it, the more I realise that not going for Greece was a tactical error of judgement. I should have taken your advice Pike.
Northern Pike
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OneFastWarrior, it looks as though mad-bax and I have both lost our enthusiasm for the Mongolian project. You could move our strike force back to Korea for an attack on Greece with no significant loss of time, if you decide this is what you want to do.
We probably aren't strong enough to crush the Greeks quickly, but even if we just take (and definitely raze) Delphi with our first strike and then proceed cautiously, we'll start getting chances to generate Great Leaders long before we would by sending our elites up to Mongolia.
Cutting down all the forests around Pasargadae to look for BG was a good idea, but now that we've done it, we should re-plant forests on two non-bonus grassland tiles to gain Pas. two more shields and get rid of its useless food surplus.
Persepolis has a clown who should be assigned to real work. I assume that the idea was to put the city into Love status, but there's still one unhappy citizen there, so there might as well be two.
The tactic of unhooking iron to build horsemen has worked beautifully, but now that we've got 11 horsemen it might be time for a round of upgrades to knight.
We probably aren't strong enough to crush the Greeks quickly, but even if we just take (and definitely raze) Delphi with our first strike and then proceed cautiously, we'll start getting chances to generate Great Leaders long before we would by sending our elites up to Mongolia.
Cutting down all the forests around Pasargadae to look for BG was a good idea, but now that we've done it, we should re-plant forests on two non-bonus grassland tiles to gain Pas. two more shields and get rid of its useless food surplus.
Persepolis has a clown who should be assigned to real work. I assume that the idea was to put the city into Love status, but there's still one unhappy citizen there, so there might as well be two.
The tactic of unhooking iron to build horsemen has worked beautifully, but now that we've got 11 horsemen it might be time for a round of upgrades to knight.
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