On Power (electrical)

[Azurian]

Okay I tried it with multiple properties

	<PropertyManipulators>
				<PropertySource>
					<PropertySourceType>PROPERTYSOURCE_CONSTANT</PropertySourceType>
					<PropertyType>PROPERTY_AIR_POLLUTION</PropertyType>
					<iAmountPerTurn>5</iAmountPerTurn>
					<Active>
						<Has>
				   			<GOMType>GOM_TECH</GOMType>
				   			<ID>TECH_CYBERNETICS</ID>
						</Has>
					</Active>
				  </PropertySource>
					<PropertySource>
					    <PropertySourceType>PROPERTYSOURCE_CONSTANT</PropertySourceType>
					     <PropertyType>PROPERTY_CRIME</PropertyType>
					    <iAmountPerTurn>10</iAmountPerTurn>
					<Active>
						<Has>
				   			<GOMType>GOM_TECH</GOMType>
				   			<ID>TECH_FUSION</ID>
						</Has>
					</Active>
					</PropertySource>
					<PropertySource>
					<PropertySourceType>PROPERTYSOURCE_CONSTANT</PropertySourceType>
					<PropertyType>PROPERTY_DISEASE</PropertyType>
					<iAmountPerTurn>1</iAmountPerTurn>
					<Active>
						<Has>
				   			<GOMType>GOM_BONUS</GOMType>
				   			<ID>BONUS_VEGETABLES</ID>
						</Has>
					</Active>
					 </PropertySource>
			</PropertyManipulators>

 

[Thunderbrd]

Now we need to work out how population consumption can increase with techs...

 

[Faustmouse]

Hydro had a good table to start with, but it was to plain IMHO. He added +2% with 50 techs for a total of +100%. But I think there are techs that increase the power usage by less then 2% and some that will easily increase it by 10% and more. Also, some resources would increase the Power Usage like Washer Dryer, Computers....

I also think that Solar Roofs should decrese the Power usage by a fair amount and later we could have self sustaining houses that eliminates the power usage from pop completely (maybe gradually, so first the rich get solar panels etc, then middle class, too, then the poor). Woulld work with Hydro's Housing System.

This would be a nightmare to add in conventional ways but I HOPE Nimek's Parser could handle that, too, if we feed it with a table.

 

[Hydromancerx]

Here were my original topics again ...

Here are my old topics on this ...

Power Mod (Original Topic)
Revisiting the Power Mod

However I think you ment this list. Note this list is for RoM/AND so we would have to redo it for C2C since we have WAY more techs ...

Tech % Usage

Electricity = +2% Electricity Use
Refrigeration = +2% Electricity Use
Telegraph = +2% Electricity Use
Refining = +2% Electricity Use
Radio = +2% Electricity Use
Civil Engineering = +2% Electricity Use
Combustion = +2% Electricity Use
Industrialism = +2% Electricity Use
Plastics = +2% Electricity Use
Fission = +2% Electricity Use
Mass Transit = +2% Electricity Use
Electronics = +2% Electricity Use
Manufacturing = +2% Electricity Use
Computers = +2% Electricity Use
Mass Media = +2% Electricity Use
Semiconductors = +2% Electricity Use
Nuclear Power = +2% Electricity Use
Superconductors = +2% Electricity Use
Microprocessor = +2% Electricity Use
Robotics = +2% Electricity Use
Computer Networks = +2% Electricity Use
Globalization = +2% Electricity Use
Fiber Optics = +2% Electricity Use
3D Modeling = = +2% Electricity Use
Communications Networks = +2% Electricity Use ------------- 50%
Magnetic Levitation = +2% Electricity Use
Virtual Reality = +2% Electricity Use
Fuel Cells = +2% Electricity Use
Wearable Electronics = +2% Electricity Use
Cognitive Robotics = +2% Electricity Use
Knowledge Management = +2% Electricity Use
Rapid Prototyping = +2% Electricity Use
Biofuels = +2% Electricity Use
Automated Traffic = +2% Electricity Use
Controlled Plasma = +2% Electricity Use
Fusion = +2% Electricity Use
Skyroads = +2% Electricity Use
Advanced Computers = +2% Electricity Use
Wireless Electricity = +2% Electricity Use
Quantum Computing = +2% Electricity Use
Plastic Electronics = +2% Electricity Use
Personal Robotics = +2% Electricity Use
Nanoelectronics = +2% Electricity Use -82
Megastructure Engineering = +2% Electricity Use
Shielding = +2% Electricity Use
Mind Uploading = +2% Electricity Use
Advanced Shielding = +2% Electricity Use
Terra Computer = +2% Electricity Use
Teleportation = +2% Electricity Use
Sentient Earth = +2% Electricity Use ------------- 100%

As you can see gradually over time as they discover diffrent technologies then the % of electricity used goes up by 2%. Until by the end of the game you are 100% usage. Thus a level 10 city in the modern era will require significantly less power than a level 10 city in the trans-human era.

 

[Faustmouse]

Yes excactly!
I didn't know it was for RoM so yes, we have to figure out more techs.

Also:
1) PLEASE make Powerplants normal buildings. No matter how advanced a Fusion Power PLant seems now, it will be standart one day. Like Nuclear Power Plants are now. We can make a national Wonder / Project Prototype Fusion Power Plant that only produce 100 MW instea of 1000, and then later make a Fsuion Power Plant, a normal buildings, which 1000 MW. same with the Updraft / Downdraft Power Plants. I know "it has been a National Wonder since RoM", but that#s not an argument. The latest era was modern in Vanilla, and you nevertheless added more.

2) Remove the Meltdown from the Orbital Solar Power Plant. Yeah, this idea comes from Sim City, but let's just assume scientists here are smart enough to have an emergency power-off in the saltellite if it turns for whatever reason. Also, you can use harmless radioation for transport. It does not have to be a super 1000 TW laser.

3) I don't think a normal Meltdown on Nucelar Powerplants is reasonable. The Accident in Tschernobyl was more or less "intended" ("Hey, let's try what happens if we really f**k up our systems, lol" <- original Quote ) and the accident in Fukushima was due a really bad luck combo of a strong earthquake and tsunami. Compared to the total combined life-time of all Nuklear Powerplants, this is a somewhat rare event. If you wanna keep it, then add also meltdowns due Coal Power Plant explosions, Fertilizer Explosions, Ammunation explosions... They are a lot more commen and also very devastating.

 

[Thunderbrd]

Personally, I consider nuclear power the most dangerous thing we've ever done and continue to do... We are so arrogant to think that we can protect ourselves and properly harness this incredible power so safely as we like to believe we can... we're setting ourselves up for irreversible devastation with this things! You can't tell me it's impossible for them to become huge problems for us - we can't predict all things enough to ensure the perfection of our 'safety methods'. What we've seen of 'meltdowns' so far is child's play compared to what we could see someday and I shudder to think of how much actual long term damage we've done to the Pacific that isn't being widely published already.

Along those lines I was thinking too... we REALLY should consider doing a Radiation property! Please take that idea and run with it as y'all seek to expand our property system applications. This is one I've wanted to do for a long time now. The basic Civ mechanism of scrubbing fallout seems to really minimize the horrid reality of radioactive half-life.

 

[Azurian]

Thunderbrd

Radiation is a very good idea

Lead +1 :radiation :

Radiation increases disease and flammability .

The positive is it provides a huge energy boost.

I added some Transhuman techs that are more powerful than Fusion, Photon Thermodynamics and Artifical Nucleosynthesis to provide more energy.

 

[Maxima7]

2) Remove the Meltdown from the Orbital Solar Power Plant. Yeah, this idea comes from Sim City, but let's just assume scientists here are smart enough to have an emergency power-off in the saltellite if it turns for whatever reason. Also, you can use harmless radioation for transport. It does not have to be a super 1000 TW laser.

They don't need an "emergency power-off". From my understanding, it's passive.

"In antenna theory, a phased array is an array of antennas in which the relative phases of the respective signals feeding the antennas are varied in such a way that the effective radiation pattern of the array is reinforced in a desired direction and suppressed in undesired directions."

If the pilot beam is lost, it defocuses.

Personally, I consider nuclear power the most dangerous thing we've ever done and continue to do... We are so arrogant to think that we can protect ourselves and properly harness this incredible power so safely as we like to believe we can... we're setting ourselves up for irreversible devastation with this things! You can't tell me it's impossible for them to become huge problems for us - we can't predict all things enough to ensure the perfection of our 'safety methods'. What we've seen of 'meltdowns' so far is child's play compared to what we could see someday and I shudder to think of how much actual long term damage we've done to the Pacific that isn't being widely published already.

All the newer Gen III and above reactors are much less likely to have their core damaged, so the timescale for the older designs is rather short, and during that timescale, they have had a better track record than coal.

Gen III+ Reactor

"In case of an accident, the ESBWR can remain in a safe, stable state for 72 hours without any operator action or even electrical power. [...]The final safety evaluation report accepted by the NRC reports an overall core damage frequency of 1.65 * 10-8 per year."

Gen III Reactor

"According to GEH's Probabilistic Risk Assessment, a core damage event would occur no more often than once in six million years as the core damage frequency (CDF) of the ABWR is 1.6 x 10&#8722;7, second in lowest CDF probability to the ESBWR."

 

[Thunderbrd]

Thunderbrd

Radiation is a very good idea

Lead +1 :radiation :

Radiation increases disease and flammability .

The positive is it provides a huge energy boost.

I added some Transhuman techs that are more powerful than Fusion, Photon Thermodynamics and Artifical Nucleosynthesis to provide more energy.

I was thinking along the lines of Radiation is very bad. We're not talking about controlled reactions but about radioactivity like fallout that causes horrendous birth defects, poisoned crops, etc...

 

[Maxima7]

Lead +1 :radiation :

More like lead poisoning lol.

Radiation varies in areas. If there's granite infused sediment in an area, it can seep into homes. Granite tabletops also can have significant amounts of radiation.

 

[Hydromancerx]

Yes excactly!
I didn't know it was for RoM so yes, we have to figure out more techs.

Also:
1) PLEASE make Powerplants normal buildings. No matter how advanced a Fusion Power PLant seems now, it will be standart one day. Like Nuclear Power Plants are now. We can make a national Wonder / Project Prototype Fusion Power Plant that only produce 100 MW instea of 1000, and then later make a Fsuion Power Plant, a normal buildings, which 1000 MW. same with the Updraft / Downdraft Power Plants. I know "it has been a National Wonder since RoM", but that#s not an argument. The latest era was modern in Vanilla, and you nevertheless added more.

2) Remove the Meltdown from the Orbital Solar Power Plant. Yeah, this idea comes from Sim City, but let's just assume scientists here are smart enough to have an emergency power-off in the saltellite if it turns for whatever reason. Also, you can use harmless radioation for transport. It does not have to be a super 1000 TW laser.

3) I don't think a normal Meltdown on Nucelar Powerplants is reasonable. The Accident in Tschernobyl was more or less "intended" ("Hey, let's try what happens if we really f**k up our systems, lol" <- original Quote ) and the accident in Fukushima was due a really bad luck combo of a strong earthquake and tsunami. Compared to the total combined life-time of all Nuklear Powerplants, this is a somewhat rare event. If you wanna keep it, then add also meltdowns due Coal Power Plant explosions, Fertilizer Explosions, Ammunation explosions... They are a lot more commen and also very devastating.

1. The reason the Fusion Power Plant is a wonder is because it gives a psudo-building to every city. Thus of you made more than one of them on the same contentment those buildings would not stack.

2. No way! That's one of the fun Easter eggs I wanted to keep in the game when it comes to the Microwave Power Plant.

3. But then everyone would build Nucular Power Plants. I know its not realistic but I thought that was a fun feature both in Civ4 and SimCity.

 

[Thunderbrd]

More like lead poisoning lol.

Radiation varies in areas. If there's granite infused sediment in an area, it can seep into homes. Granite tabletops also can have significant amounts of radiation.

Good point on Radon... it's actually a second step in the halflife breakdown of uranium deposits deep underground so it would be quite appropriate for a tile with uranium (whether revealed or not) to be generating some small amount of radioactivity.

 

[Azurian]

Yes excactly!
I didn't know it was for RoM so yes, we have to figure out more techs.

Also:
1) PLEASE make Powerplants normal buildings. No matter how advanced a Fusion Power PLant seems now, it will be standart one day. Like Nuclear Power Plants are now. We can make a national Wonder / Project Prototype Fusion Power Plant that only produce 100 MW instea of 1000, and then later make a Fsuion Power Plant, a normal buildings, which 1000 MW. same with the Updraft / Downdraft Power Plants. I know "it has been a National Wonder since RoM", but that#s not an argument. The latest era was modern in Vanilla, and you nevertheless added more.

2) Remove the Meltdown from the Orbital Solar Power Plant. Yeah, this idea comes from Sim City, but let's just assume scientists here are smart enough to have an emergency power-off in the saltellite if it turns for whatever reason. Also, you can use harmless radioation for transport. It does not have to be a super 1000 TW laser.

3) I don't think a normal Meltdown on Nucelar Powerplants is reasonable. The Accident in Tschernobyl was more or less "intended" ("Hey, let's try what happens if we really f**k up our systems, lol" <- original Quote ) and the accident in Fukushima was due a really bad luck combo of a strong earthquake and tsunami. Compared to the total combined life-time of all Nuklear Powerplants, this is a somewhat rare event. If you wanna keep it, then add also meltdowns due Coal Power Plant explosions, Fertilizer Explosions, Ammunation explosions... They are a lot more commen and also very devastating.

1.Agree
They should be normal, but I think Fusion one gives extra buildings so it stays a wonder .

2. Agree, there shouldn't be Meltdown, it would have an automated safety protocol . It's should be called a Solar Collector Satellite, the name "power plant" means it had connectors and power line stems, it would be stand alone. A power plant like a nuclear power plant is connected to many modules.

3. Yeah, meltdowns are rare. It depends on isotope and it's more common like u said on other factories.

 

[Azurian]

Faustmouse

.PNG with Transparency for Electricity Property icon (if you want it).

 

[Thunderbrd]

Faustmouse

.PNG with Transparency for Electricity Property icon (if you want it).

I think your icons are not taking the low resolution into consideration. This would be much better as simple as a lightning bolt alone for that reason. We just don't have enough pixels to get the point across.

 

[Azurian]

I think your icons are not taking the low resolution into consideration. This would be much better as simple as a lightning bolt alone for that reason. We just don't have enough pixels to get the point across.

 

[Faustmouse]

1. The reason the Fusion Power Plant is a wonder is because it gives a psudo-building to every city. Thus of you made more than one of them on the same contentment those buildings would not stack.

2. No way! That's one of the fun Easter eggs I wanted to keep in the game when it comes to the Microwave Power Plant.

3. But then everyone would build Nucular Power Plants. I know its not realistic but I thought that was a fun feature both in Civ4 and SimCity.

1. When Electricity is added, the Fusion Powerplant will no loger give a free building (or does it?) Then it could be changed.

2. Well ok, if you want to keep it... I still think a Meltdown is the wrong word (it would not contaminate the area for example). I don't think this building will be build often.

3. What's wrong if everybody would build it?

 

[Hydromancerx]

2. Well if we had someone who could make a custom event for it that would be nice. Especially if the event raised the flammability of the city a lot. Basically causing massive fires across the city.

 

[Faustmouse]

EDIT: OK, I've looked over your list and one thing I noticed is that you assign energy use to a lot of small stores. -Their energy use is on par with family houses, so I wouldn't make them consume any energy at all (or rather have it be a part of the energy consumed by general population).

Yeah, because the alternative would be to make them require no power. Just assume that there are multiply shops in a city.

And I finished the list if someone wants to have a look (really appreciated^^)

Few things:


1) Should Wonders require Power? -> It seems reasonable for some like the Medical Data Base, but on the other hand this means

they can be turned off when a blackout occurs. Will this cause weird effects?

2) Biofuels are mostly grown on land so maybe they should have an impact on food production. Like you need a Biofuel Farm as

requirement for Ethanol Station, and the Biofuel Farm has like -20 . Maybe also ad a Biofuel Refinery (if we haven't one already)

3) Some buildings (like Restaurants) require very low amounts of power (0.1 MW). Therefore, I suggest we can imagine we don't have only one store in our Pop 100 Mega city. For example, I know that there are 50 MC Donald's in Berlin. Here would be a
"cost per pop" and an "Energy per Pop" tag usefull, but for now, we can just say that the average big city has like 20 (sounds reasonable?) Restaurants, Application Stores, Pet Shops etc in it. Opinions?

4) With certain techs, there should be a - 1 MW for all buildings (or maybe -1 MW per 5 Buildings). Is this possible?

5) Are Electric Lamps "Electric Street Lamps"?

6) Should power consumption of pop be calculated by both: Pop and Housing? Should Housing consumes Energy? I'd say yes. The

richer, the more. But expensive houses should benefit from Solar Roofs and Self sustaining Houses first. Any idea for a good

mechanism?

7) Industrial Park should be the prereq for most if not all factories.

8) When we have "combat classes" for buildings, I was thinking of just making Factories (most of them) 0 Power Consumption but give ALL Factories -2 Power with Machine Tools and additional -2 with Robots for example. Is this possible?

9) Is "Public Transportation" a bit obsolete since we have Bus and Subway and Monorail etc?

 

[Azurian]

Yeah, because the alternative would be to make them require no power. Just assume that there are multiply shops in a city.

And I finished the list if someone wants to have a look (really appreciated^^)

Few things:


1) Should Wonders require Power? -> It seems reasonable for some like the Medical Data Base, but on the other hand this means

they can be turned off when a blackout occurs. Will this cause weird effects?

2) Biofuels are mostly grown on land so maybe they should have an impact on food production. Like you need a Biofuel Farm as

requirement for Ethanol Station, and the Biofuel Farm has like -20 . Maybe also ad a Biofuel Refinery (if we haven't one already)

3) Some buildings (like Restaurants) require very low amounts of power (0.1 MW). Therefore, I suggest we can imagine we don't have only one store in our Pop 100 Mega city. For example, I know that there are 50 MC Donald's in Berlin. Here would be a
"cost per pop" and an "Energy per Pop" tag usefull, but for now, we can just say that the average big city has like 20 (sounds reasonable?) Restaurants, Application Stores, Pet Shops etc in it. Opinions?

4) With certain techs, there should be a - 1 MW for all buildings (or maybe -1 MW per 5 Buildings). Is this possible?

5) Are Electric Lamps "Electric Street Lamps"?

6) Should power consumption of pop be calculated by both: Pop and Housing? Should Housing consumes Energy? I'd say yes. The

richer, the more. But expensive houses should benefit from Solar Roofs and Self sustaining Houses first. Any idea for a good

mechanism?

7) Industrial Park should be the prereq for most if not all factories.

8) When we have "combat classes" for buildings, I was thinking of just making Factories (most of them) 0 Power Consumption but give ALL Factories -2 Power with Machine Tools and additional -2 with Robots for example. Is this possible?

9) Is "Public Transportation" a bit obsolete since we have Bus and Subway and Monorail etc?

9) we should add Trolley, Aerial Ropeways (ski lift), Carpool Service, Taxi System , and Ferries to that Tech if we don't already have them
.