Patch v3.13 change list

[Mortac]

Of course, such concerns didn't bother them from releasing Vanilla, Warlords and BtS before they were ready when it suited their interests and pocketbooks to do so.

That might be true, but considering the great amount of support through patches the Civ games have been getting after release, I just can't complain.

 

[JungleBoot]

The poster is an official member of Firaxis, come on...

How do I know this? Just because he said so? Plus, the current status of the patch was never mentioned in the original post. I don't recall reading about it currently going through Q&A (or the quality control process).

For those who have forgotten, here is the beginning once again:

We are done with the patch, but unfortunately we will not be able to release it this week as we had hoped.

I wouldn't make such a statement without qualifying the current status of release. And no, the one made doesn't qualify anything. It only states they have it and can't release it. It would have been far better to mention the patch was forth coming and would be released soon followed by all of the fixes. Once you tell people your product is completed they expect to see it.

How would you feel if your mechanic told you your car was ready but you couldn't pick it up yet? They aren't allowed to release it into your possession until a week from now. Wouldn't you want to know why? Somewhere in your mind you would want to know what is going on.

My advice: Please communicate with the community -- just do it better.

 

[Arlborn]

How do I know this? Just because he said so? Plus, the current status of the patch was never mentioned in the original post. I don't recall reading about it currently going through Q&A (or the quality control process).

For those who have forgotten, here is the beginning once again:


I wouldn't make such a statement without qualifying the current status of release. And no, the one made doesn't qualify anything. It only states they have it and can't release it. It would have been far better to mention the patch was forth coming and would be released soon followed by all of the fixes. Once you tell people your product is completed they expect to see it.

How would you feel if your mechanic told you your car was ready but you couldn't pick it up yet? They aren't allowed to release it into your possession until a week from now. Wouldn't you want to know why? Somewhere in your mind you would want to know what is going on.

My advice: Please communicate with the community -- just do it better.

Ow, quality of posting higher just like that an?

It wouldn't be sticky if it wasn't real by the way.
And if you did read on though some more posts you would see people commenting about waiting for quality test, so you would know why you are still waiting...

 

[LordGek]

How do I know this? Just because he said so? Plus, the current status of the patch was never mentioned in the original post. I don't recall reading about it currently going through Q&A (or the quality control process).

For those who have forgotten, here is the beginning once again:


I wouldn't make such a statement without qualifying the current status of release. And no, the one made doesn't qualify anything. It only states they have it and can't release it. It would have been far better to mention the patch was forth coming and would be released soon followed by all of the fixes. Once you tell people your product is completed they expect to see it.

How would you feel if your mechanic told you your car was ready but you couldn't pick it up yet? They aren't allowed to release it into your possession until a week from now. Wouldn't you want to know why? Somewhere in your mind you would want to know what is going on.

My advice: Please communicate with the community -- just do it better.

Clearly Firaxis didn't know who they were dealing with, this is JungleBoot (Yes, THE JungleBoot of CFC fame) and you better think twice before you try to jerk him around!

(I hope the sarcasm of this post is noted)

 

[Lobsang1979]

Of course, such concerns didn't bother them from releasing Vanilla, Warlords and BtS before they were ready when it suited their interests and pocketbooks to do so.

I suppose if I wanted to pursue a hobby in which there was never ANY chance of purchasing a product which is flawed, I could always collect rocks. The average rock has spent billions of years in the development phase and, as such, I am unlikely to be unsatisfied with its standard of 'rockiness'.

However, I have instead chosen as one of many hobbies the playing of computer games which have, on average, spent about 2-3 years in the development phase. As such, I understand that a few flaws will be bundled with what is essentially an incredibly complex product that remains amazing to a simple bloke like myself who grew up playing Space Invaders and Pong. And, as time passes and these flaws are ironed out, I live in an age where the product I originally bought can be improved upon at no extra cost to myself.

To me the 3.13 patch looks to be packed full of fixes to the majority of major bugs currently existing within BTS, and also addresses quite a few other fixes that may have slipped past most people's radars. That to me is the sign of a company that while having to face up to hard decisions in a market driven business, also listens to the suggestions of the community it caters towards.

Would I like to live in a world where every product I bought worked perfectly from the moment I left the shop? Well, yes, of course. No more car repairs, faulty washing machines, dodgy phone lines, etc. etc. But I don't, so while I eagerly await patch 3.13 I will simply engage in some of my other hobbies and appreciate what I already have.

 

[SlipperyJim]

You don't have to destroy city after city, you just have to stay at war with at least one nation all the time (should be easy in general, even a very weak one will make it) and you can reach conquest without reaching domination... Domination can only be reached at peace.

Not true. I won a Domination victory about a month ago while at war. Domination victories are triggered by land and population, and that's it.

Of course, such concerns didn't bother them from releasing Vanilla, Warlords and BtS before they were ready when it suited their interests and pocketbooks to do so.

Huh? Every version of Civ4 has played reasonably well for me out of the box. Okay, it didn't play well for you. But Civ4 seems to have played well for someone: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=203091

 

[bardolph]

Huh? Every version of Civ4 has played reasonably well for me out of the box. Okay, it didn't play well for you. But Civ4 seems to have played well for someone: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=203091

Hrm. Civ 4 was a slide-show for me, playing on a system well over recommended specs. It plays great for me now, but my new system is at least double the recommended specs, in just about every dimension.

 

[JungleBoot]

Clearly Firaxis didn't know who they were dealing with, this is JungleBoot (Yes, THE JungleBoot of CFC fame) and you better think twice before you try to jerk him around!

(I hope the sarcasm of this post is noted)

Ask me if I care. And, yes, I recognize the sarcasm.

For those ragging on me, may a thousand immortals descend upon your empire led by Achilles. May their spears lodge between your ribs and rot for eternity.

( I hope the sarcasm is noted.)

I am not whining. I am merely stating the facts. And just because other members on the board state the delay is due to testing doesn't make it so. How do they know? I simply request better communication.

By the way, I agree with Lobsang1979 minus the eagerly waiting.

 

[SlipperyJim]

Hrm. Civ 4 was a slide-show for me, playing on a system well over recommended specs. It plays great for me now, but my new system is at least double the recommended specs, in just about every dimension.

My comment on Civ4's performance can be found in my sig. My system is very nearly at the minimums, and yet the game plays. Yeah, it slows down a bit in the end-game, and I don't play the Huge maps ... but it plays. I can still get quite a lot of enjoyment out of the game, and I definitely don't have a Gamer's Uber-Rig.

That said, I understand that some people have had problems. IIRC, the original Civ4 had quite a problem with ATI video cards for a while. But I also understand a little bit about computers, and I know something about how hard it is to make a piece of software that will run reliably on a wide range of end-user systems.

First, the developer has to contend with hardware differences. I play Civ4 on an old Dell laptop. You might play it on a sweet Alienware rig. I have a poky old nVidia card; you might have a smokin' new ATI card. Different drivers. Different capabilities. Different problems for the developer to deal with....

Then there's the software environment. I play on Windows XP Professional SP2 with all of the latest patches. I don't run too many other processes on my laptop: Symantec AntiVirus Corporate Edition 10, some assorted Dell utilities (QuickSet, mainly), a hard-drive tracking utility called HDD Health, and the Cisco VPN Client. What OS are you running? What other processes do you have running? Could any of those processes conflict with Civ4?

And don't get me started about hardware drivers and such....

Modern computers are ferociously complicated. That's why we have a whole sector of our economy that employs people like me to take care of them. (I'm actually a sysadmin now, but I did my time on the Help Desk.) There are many, many variables that can influence the performance and stability of software. That's why no software is bug-free anymore.

Please note that I'm not trying to blame you ... or anyone else. I'm simply trying to make a general argument for why all games have bugs. It's not that developers are lazy or greedy. (Well, some certainly are, but not all of them.) It's just that modern computers are ferociously complicated, so they simply can't squash every bug before release. Developers are human beings, not gods.

 

[BSmith1068]

@Lobsang1979: Welcome to CFC!

 

[LiDDiS]

So.... is it released yet? D:

 

[~Bamboo~]

nope....still waiting

 

[The Foo]

For those ragging on me, may a thousand immortals descend upon your empire led by Achilles. May their spears lodge between your ribs and rot for eternity.

( I hope the sarcasm is noted.)

So you're actually wishing everyone well, then? Or is this like being told, "May you live forever" by a Spartan? (Y'know, like Master Chief.)

 

[JFLNYC]

And, as time passes and these flaws are ironed out, I live in an age where the product I originally bought can, after many months -- sometimes years, be made to perform almost as well as it was advertised to when it was sold to me at no extra cost to myself.

Fixed your post.

Would I like to live in a world where every product I bought worked perfectly from the moment I left the shop? Well, yes, of course. No more car repairs, faulty washing machines, dodgy phone lines, etc. etc. But I don't, so while I eagerly await patch 3.13 I will simply engage in some of my other hobbies and appreciate what I already have.

Sorry that's your world. In the world in which I live, all the consumer products you mention (plus others, e.g., flat screen TV's, microwaves, audio equipment, air conditioners, snow blowers, ovens, ranges, refrigerators, etc.) usually work for years needing no repairs, and only occasional maintenance. I can count on one hand (and still have a finger or two left over) the number of repairs needed to all such products I've purchased within the last 30 years. Admittedly, though, there was a time about 17 years ago when I received a notice to bring in my car for a fix to the onboard computer. That's about as close to a "patch" as I've seen.

Huh? Every version of Civ4 has played reasonably well for me out of the box. Okay, it didn't play well for you. But Civ4 seems to have played well for someone: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=203091

Hmmm.... I guess all these people were just exceptions:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/forumdisplay.php?f=159

 

[JungleBoot]

Sorry that's your world. In the world in which I live, all the consumer products you mention (plus others, e.g., flat screen TV's, microwaves, audio equipment, air conditioners, snow blowers, ovens, ranges, refrigerators, etc.) usually work for years needing no repairs, and only occasional maintenance. I can count on one hand (and still have a finger or two left over) the number of repairs needed to all such products I've purchased within the last 30 years. Admittedly, though, there was a time about 17 years ago when I received a notice to bring in my car for a fix to the onboard computer. That's about as close to a "patch" as I've seen.
http://forums.civfanatics.com/forumdisplay.php?f=159

And there once was a time when people primarily purchased products made in their own country. Today, made in Korea seems stamped/sewed on everything.

Way too funny. I really like the post above.

 

[oaklanbash]

The only thing made in Korea is electronics..... some high end women's fashion perhaps. But 90% of what American's buy is Made in China....

edit - sorry forgot about cars

 

[Gre_Magus]

You can't really compare computer software to consumer products in terms of reliability and "bugs."

A microwave maybe has a few dozen functions (time cook, sensor cook, and who knows what else) that all can be tested in a pretty straightforward way.
You try each one in sequence and it either works or doesn't.

A computer program has thousands of functions that are all mutually interactive and dependent in often unforeseen ways. In a game like Civ there are thousands and thousands of combinations possible - what civilizations are in the game, what techs are researched, what units are in play, and more. It would take a team of testers years to try them all out to see if any thing causes a crash.

And that's without even introducing the massive wild card of the different system configurations people have.

But once you get a game out to the public, all the sudden you have hundreds of thouands (if the game is successful!) people playing instead of a few dozen testers. Some of them are bound to come up with combinations that cause results no one anticipated, including crashes.

Could computer companies do better about testing to ensure less bugs? Yes, especially with frequent crashes and features not working as advertised. The fact is, the computer software culture tolerates patches, and patches are way cheaper than paying for tons more testing to find a few bugs.

If there were some sort of law that said no computer game could be released with any bugs at all, we'd see very few games and they'd be very expensive and probably very simple. The extra money spent on testing the interactions of complex systems would be passed on to the customer for sure.

Obviously sometimes companies release games that are so buggy that they are no longer enjoyable or even playable. Read reviews and don't buy those games! People buying games w/o knowing what they're getting means that companies can make money by investing no money in development and testing and hoping some nice cover art will make someone drop 19.99 on their game at Walmart.

 

[JFLNYC]

You can't really compare computer software to consumer products in terms of reliability and "bugs."

Normally I wouldn't. But the comparison was invited by:

No more car repairs, faulty washing machines, dodgy phone lines, etc. etc.

 

[Mortac]

Any word on if this patch is backwards compatible with saved games from the current version? I'm in a really great multiplayer game that I don't want to abandon and at the same time not play without the patch.

 

[Ingot]

move to strike