Pere - 001

[Elmarae]

Preflight
Change reg swordsman build to galley

290 BC
Discover Monarchy > Construction for now (will trade)

Pretrade summary:
Babylon knows Monarchy, Currency, Construction and has 39g
Zulu knows Currency, Construction and has 87g
Rome lacks Literature and Monarchy and has 40g
Celts knows Monarchy, Currency, Construction and has 164g
India lacks Monarchy and has 3g
England knows Currency and Construction and has 103g
Egypt lacks Monarchy and has 26g
Germany lacks Code of Laws, Literature and Monarchy and has 2g
Mongol has Currency and Construction and 140g
Iroquois lacks Philosophy, Code of Laws, Literature and Polytheism and has 0g
Spain lacks Philosophy, Code of Laws, Literature and Polytheism and has 80g

Sell Monarchy to:
Mongol for: Currency + 140g
England for: Construction + 103g

Checking Trades again
Babylon and Celts know Engineering they won't trade for 307g

Zulu: Monarchy for 87g
Rome: Literature for 40g
Spain: Philosophy for 80g
Egypt: Monarchy for 26g

Dropping lux to 0% to look at towns pre revolt, every town is going to go into disorder in anarchy. Hire clowns/taxmen as needed. In anarchy there are no MP. our lack of luxes is going to hurt here.

Revolt to monarchy: 5 Turns

Engineering is known by 2 civs so gambling on them going for Feudalism or Republic I start research on Monotheism in 50. When Anarchy is over we may be able to quicken the pace.

270 BC
Nothing much happening during anarchy, just upgrading the Curraghs and vet warriors. moving the forces to Rusaddir to prepare for invasion of Spain.

250 BC
Celts demand 38g. I tell him to go swim in the ocean. He declares war. (War happiness too much to hope for?)

190 BC
We are now a monarchy! All hail the King!
Set lux to 10%, research to 0% Monotheism in 45. 28gpt.
Changed Lepis Minor to Settler farm to settle Spain (ICS Spain?)
MM Carthage to use of all 4 bonus grassland. Changed to Hanging Gardens.

Unit costs: 46/32 (costing us 14gpt) at 42gpt we can create another 42 units. Each town we settle will save us 2gpt.

170 BC
Declare war on Spain with a force of 6 Sword and 4 Cats. (outside their borders) and then landing near Madrid

150 BC
Catapult bombardment damages 1 spear. 1 Sword dies taking Madrid. 1 Promotes to Elite. 2 Resistors. 3 Slaves.
2 Galleys die sinking Spanish Galley.

130 BC
Spains devastating counter attack consists of 4 reg Warriors. The Cats reduce them to 2/3, our Sword decimate them. Only one injury 2/4.

Babylon and Mongols now know The republic. They want all our gold and gpt for Engineering. They won't trade Republic. Hopefully they will go for Feudalism next.

110 BC
Egypt wanted Construction, told her to go swim with the Celts. She declared war as well.
Spain attacks with an archer, flawless defence, Sword promotes to elite.

Forces move towards Barcelona. Settler and reinforcements outside of Madrid in Galleys

- Roster -
mach - On Deck
dbear -
predesad -
elmarae - Just done
gunner - UP

 

[Mach]

Nice, Elma! Two elites in Spain is good news! Looks like war happiness is kicking in, too...

I like the single scientist on mono. Not much else to say, it looks pretty good. Oh, our fishing villages should be on harbor/libraries now, though. A few more cats, slow built, won't mean anything to our wars...

 

[Elmarae]

I'm curious though why you would put libraries or temples in fishing villages... My understanding is you get them to grow as much food as they can and use them to build workers or other menial things... You can never have too many cats

During anarchy to keep the population happy I hired alot of taxmen, for the 5 turns of anarchy we were making 18-24g

 

[Mach]

Yeah, I saw how much money we had, and I wondered how you did it. Nice!

The purpose of fishing villages, in my mind, is to make gold. That is what the ocean squares are good for. We do markets & libs because they essentially double the village's money. Libs also expand the city, so we can reach more ocean squares, for more gold. A decent village at size 6, working all water squares, with a market and lib, can make us 20gpt or better, depending on corruption. Notice how the market & lib can pay for themselves! We can skim workers off, sure, but we should do it when the city is at max size (i.e. when it's at size 6 and the aqueduct isn't done yet, or when all the ocean squares are being used), so the loss of population doesn't hurt the village's gold production very much.

I guess the bottom line is, if a city can't make shields, then make gold. Does this make sense?

I believe that the one thing that's really gonna carry us though this game, (since we have no luxes and no easy military access), is our economy -- we need to research, we need to buy stuff, and we need to keep our people happy somehow. So fishing villages, IMO, are going to be key.

I think that fishing villages are a standard thing, although when I looked I couldn't find an article on them. I coulda sworn that I once saw a good layout of them written down by Sirian in some sg or other, but I couldn't find it, unfortunately...

 

[TimBentley]

lurker's comment: I'm pretty sure this is the SG. I didn't look hard enough to find it, though.

 

[Mach]

Heh, thanks TimBentley. One for the Right In Front Of My Nose Department.

 

[gunnerxtr]

im super busy for the next two days, but want to play. Anyone want to swap? if so take it and ill take your turn.

 

[Mach]

I guess that's me, gunner. So got it! Not sure when I can play, but it'll probably be tomorrow. Any advice anyone?

- Roster -
mach - Up
dbear - hibernating?
predesad - permanent skip...
elmarae - Just done
gunner - On Deck, swapped with yours truly

 

[Elmarae]

Whittle Madrid down to 1 by building a worker. Take Barcelona and then Toledo. Chances are Spain will give use her last 2 cities in peace. Then ICS Spain for unit support. Build a settler each from the size 3/4 towns and port them over. Build more swords or may go to building Horsemen ready to upgrade to knights.
If you get a leader make an army with it but leave it empty until we can put knights in it. This is the warmonger in me... There is also the fact that it is unlikely that Spain and Iroquios know the other civs. We can be as brutal as we want as long as we wipe them out. Make peace with Spain for her remaining cities and then take her capital. Then it's the Iroq turn.

 

[DBear]

I don't know, Elmarae. Spain is a seafaring civ also, and it's quite possible they sent curraghs out that we didn't see. I'd hate to see our rep get trashed this early.

 

[Mach]

I agree with DBear there, I'd rather not break a peace treaty. Also, I think we can wipe them out, so we shouldn't make peace unless we get gassed.

I'll try to make some mercs to trigger our ga with.

Also, I think a leader should go toward building the FP in Spain somewhere -- then we wouldn't want to ICS Spain for the support, since they will be productive cities, and we're not going to want a huge army. Remember, this isn't a warmonger game primarily; it's only one for now until we take our neighbor's lands.

 

[Mach]

Preflight -- change some builds, move some mps

T1 (90BC) Merge 2 workers into Carthage, HG in 12
Move stuff
(I) Babs establish embassy with us
HG in 11...

T2 (70BC) We take Barcelona, losing an elite sword against a killer redlined spear, grr...
(I) Minor riots, oops...Spanish warriors are making a nuisance of themselves
HG in 10...

T3 (50BC) zzz
(I) HG in 9...

T4 (30BC) zzz
(I) HG in 8...

T5 (10BC) Troops move off toward Toledo
(I) HG in 7...

T6 (10AD) zzz
(I) HG in 6...

T7 (30AD) zzz
(I) HG in 5...

T8 (50AD) We take Toledo, losing 1 sword.
Found Carthago Novo in Spain
(I) Zulu finish ToA
English finish GL
Mongols finish GW
The HG holds! HG in 4...cross fingers...

T9 (70AD) There's a 2fer available (Feud for Eng), but Feud is waay expensive...I hold off. Maybe when mono popps up, we'll get a discount on it, and jockey Feud with that.
(I) Babs finish HG.

T10 (90AD) zzz

No leaders.

Ok, so we have two problems. I did everything I could, but we missed the HG by 3 turns, so now we have about 270 shields in Carthage with nothing to switch to. We can buy feud from Egypt for all our gold plus 38gpt, I say we do it, that way we can switch to Sun Tzu, hopefully that will hold long enough for us to switch to Sistine or something. (We really have no use for Sun Tzu.) The 2fer for Eng is gone.

The other problem is we probably can't move our cats forward anymore in Spain, because there's a wall of jungle between us and them. The only chance is if we move them along that line of hills, and hope they've built a jungle road near Seville. I'm not sure what to do about this.

Some good news: we have mercs in theater in Spain, and Utica is at a cool 10spt! We are still at only 10% lux. Spain will make peace with us for their remaining 2 cities, but if we do that the flip chances will be more than we can handle, IMO.

Teh Save

And Spain. The red arrow marks the only way we can move our cats forward.

Edit: This just occurred to me: for the cat/jungle problem, maybe someone might think of something clever involving galleys...

 

[gunnerxtr]

good turns Mach! I got it. So I'll trade for Feudalism and go after spain.... should i be razing cities? or are we trying to keep them?

It looks like we could shipt our cats up and land them 1 NWof their capital, does anyone know if you can have cats land on jungle?

 

[gunnerxtr]

oook so i looked at the save, and everything looked good, however i have two concerns:

1) we only have 1 embassy (babylon) do you want me to build more during my turns?
2) troops in Spain are fairly slim, and the catapult dilemma....sucks. The way i see it we have two options:
a) heal our swordsmen and go for murcia, while that is happening, ship our cats up by seville and park them on that grassland.
B) take peace and leave them with 1 city....

hopefully i can get some response as what you guys want to do.

 

[Mach]

The Babs opened that embassy on their own. Pretty nice of them. I think Feudalism will cost us most of our money, so I don't think we should open any of our own right now. Can anybody think of any reason embassies will help us in our current situation?

Yeah, the cats thing is irritating. I'm okay with making peace, but do what you think you can do. I wish I had built a few more galleys during my turns, then things would be a lot easier. If you do take peace, send some workers up to build us roads for the final attack in 20 turns.

Edit...

Here's something to toy with, gunner. Although I've never done anything like it before, so I'm speaking out of my league. But what the heck.

Germany, a scientific civ, is still in the ancient age! Maybe we should gift them up: give them currency and const. They will get a free tech when we do that! And we'll still be up monarchy on them...

Worst case, if they get feud, the price of feud will go down, so we should get it from them, for monarchy plus cash.
If they get eng, we can get feud (from egypt?), then trade feud and monarchy to germany for eng (and cash?).
If they get mono, try to pry it out of them. Try monarchy and cash, or get feud and try monarchy and feud and cash, or get feud from someone and republic from the romans and try monarchy and rep and feud and cash... In this case I think we can really sell out our economy, since we'll get a lot of money back by selling mono around.

Rome is up republic and down currency. Maybe this could help...

All this is incoherent, I know, sorry. But I think gifting Germany up could be a Really Good Thing. You're going to have to play around with it and see what's possible, gunner...

 

[Mach]

Sorry, I made an edit. Please reread previous post...

 

[gunnerxtr]

ok, ill try and do those things you suggest.

sorry i havent played.... work/school/sports is killing me lately but i SHOULD be able to play tommorow morning, i really want to

 

[gunnerxtr]

PT-
-Change a clown in Rusicade to a tax collector
-Scout out for a jungle road to Seville.... so far not so good
-Trade Currency and Construction to Germany for 69 gold lol, and they get MONOTHEISM as their free tech...DAMN emptying our entire economy for monotheism doesnt quite cut it for bismarck... i guess ill go for feudalism, So i sign peace with Egypt and give them EVERYTHING for feudalism... and Germany still wont trade monotheism... Im sorry if i did something wrong here...

1-
-Leptis Minor builds Settler> Library
-So all the sudden a lot of AI's have Mono and germany is at parity... lol

2-
-nothin

3-
-just moving some cats...

4-
-Sabratha catapult>numidian
-kill an archer thats going for our cities

5-
-Ready to attack Murcia... lets see how it goes
- ugggh started out good, but then a redlined spear killed two swordsmen... oh well we raze Murcia.
-Im kinda nervous about all these iroqouis galleys floating around our islands..
6-
- Ok so basically these turns have gone from bad to worse... my catapult plan failed, stupid Spanish galleys sunk our ships, if you guys want to banish me from the team i would understand.
-OH, and Celts and England signed a military allaince against us
7-
-kill spanish units try to get a leader...not working just like everything else i tried these turns
8-
- swordsman fends off attacking archer and gets promoted to elite wooohooo the best thing that has happened yet haha.
-
9-
-moving units
10-
-alright im leaving it here, theres guys ready to attack Seville, theres a settler going to settle a new city in Spain and most of all there is a trade availible wiht India. Eng and Mono for Feudalism. Dont criticize the cats that are just sittin on that hill i took them with me on the trip to Seville cuz they redlined a lot of units and i was hoping to leader fish, any ways its not that bad, just some bad luck, hope the next player can figure out the whole spain situation i wish i woulda made peace with them during my turns... oh well.

 

[Mach]

Don't sweat it, gunner. I can't look at the save until after work, but it looks like you did ok. The trades happened as they happened, there wasn't anything more you could have done there, and if feud does net us mono and eng then it was all worth it. A 3fer!

Bad luck with the cat galleys, but it's not so bad -- we just lost some units we couldn't have moved in the short term anyway. Better for our (strained) economy. Meanwhile, you razed Murcia, Seville will be gone soon, so the Spanish shouldn't last much longer.

What should we do about the GA? We can pretty much trigger it at will now, as we have mercs in Spain. I think we should try to start it asap, build markets & libs in all our cities, then start the buildup toward the Great Spice War against the 'Quois. We'll need lots of galleys...

- Roster -
mach -
dbear - UP
predesad - permanent skip...
elmarae - on deck
gunner - Just Played

 

[gunnerxtr]

yeah i wasnt sure about what infrastructure we wanted in each of our cities so i kept building mostly units, i wasnt sure if we wanted librarys because we arent researching and we dont have luxuries to make marketplaces incredibly useful.