Planning cIV BTS MTDG III

Discussion in 'Civ4 -ISDG 2012' started by Sommerswerd, Aug 17, 2011.

  1. ainwood

    ainwood Consultant. Administrator

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    Sorry for the delay - it isn't that I needed that info specifically, more that I was ill.

    I wanted the info, because in other demogames, we've provided private team forums here so that when the game is over, we can open up all the forums, and the game is catalogued / chronologged all in once place. If you don't want all team forums here, then I don't need the team info.

    I've set-up the forum here. Players wanting to join Team Civfanatics will need to apply for group membership here (find the Civ4 MTDG3 - Team Civfanatics group).
     
  2. nabaxo

    nabaxo King

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    Can this thread be moved to the new forum?
     
  3. Lord Parkin

    Lord Parkin aka emperor

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    Thanks ainwood. :)

    And also this one please.
     
  4. HUSch

    HUSch Secret-monger

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    I agree in generally with 2metranja's post above

    I think the first round of elimination is with diplo, but after this round comes the time, when every team thinks about leaving the pact like in the last MTDG here and I 've seen the same in many dgs. Diplo is more important than any other feature of the game, because that is the reality.

    We are human and want to win the game, so making the words in diplo so that there is different meaning in it, in the hope to get victory together with honor.

    With AW there is also diplo, we couldn't prevent it. If 3 teams attack the leading team in the same turn, some 'll think it was diplo, but perhaps is was only chance?

    I like the pure game and would play with all possibilities, nukes on gives a following team the chance to strike the leading. But this is my personally vote.

    btw
    How can you prevent certain spy-missions, is there a game-option or a rule only?

    Another question
    How can we/anybody prevent a situation that 2 teams want conquer the same city (like Sirius and Amazon a year ago) and the winner is the team which is earlier at game? Imo the reason for bad feeligs in both teams.

    Btw
    Has anybody played a PB when 2 (or more) players (with peace-treaty together) conquer the same city? What is the systems anwer about this? Particularly if both make staple-attack?
     
  5. Bowsling

    Bowsling Deity

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    Civfr.com is planning on participating, but they are waiting until the settings are decided. :confused:
     
  6. 2metraninja

    2metraninja Defender of Nabaxica

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    I think this is the essence - winning with honor. This is just a game and winning at all cost is not a good deal.

    I think they can be modded easily if we go with a mod. And even if not, they can be banned and players just are not allowed to use them. If they use them, the game is reloaded.

    There is no way to prevent such things. Civ is a turn-based game, but we cant realistically play it in MP with so many teams in sequential, so there will be always situation like this or for a rush for claiming a certain spot settling a city. They cant be avoided. But we have to live with them.

    Such situation cant arise. The game will ALWAYS favor one of the sides - being it a lag, or a millisecond earlier attack by one of the players, so the game will give the city to one of the players and the other will only enter the city, which now belongs to his ally.

    Such situations and bad feelings must be avoided and well handled by preliminary agreements about who gets what from war and border settling agreements.

    If you have any contact with them, can you please ask them to elect a team captain and then he to presents himself here and to present their preferences on the settings, because based on the desires of the teams the settings for this MTDG will be decided.
     
  7. Bowsling

    Bowsling Deity

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    They don't have any formal thread. You can probably appoint Moineau as team captain, since he has been the most active in the regard.

    Also, can you add me to the CFC team please?
     
  8. I_Play_Civ

    I_Play_Civ Chieftain

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    Hello all,
    I am one of the players representing civplayers and I have a few questions.
    1) When are we planning to start the MDTG game? If you don't have an exact date please approximate so I can plan ahead.
    2) Have the rules been decided or are you all still discussing the rules?
    3) How many teams are participating as of now?
    Thank you.
    -IPC
     
  9. Aivoturso

    Aivoturso King

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    Few suggestions:
    • Randomly predetermined turn order that can be temporarily be set in place between two team. Temporary sequential turns can be demanded by either team by sending notification (including justification) to the other team and admins and will last until the dispute is resolved. Sequential moves in can in this case be restricted only to a small area if area of dispute can be agreed between the teams (e.g. any troops attacking a given city).
    • Same as above but the turn order will be randomized separately for each time it is needed.
     
  10. Lord Parkin

    Lord Parkin aka emperor

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    Okay, things seem to have stagnated a little here, so I thought we could do with a firm push and a deadline.

    I've started this thread where every team should have one person make one post containing their team roster. This will allow us to see at a glance who is committed to playing.

    I propose that any team which has not posted in this thread by 31 May 2012 (i.e. within one week) will be assumed not to be playing. I hope everyone can agree that's a reasonable time frame. To move forward, we really need to start setting deadlines and getting firm numbers about who is playing. I hope no-one minds me taking the initiative - I just thought we could use some momentum at this point in time.

    Once we firmly know the exact number of teams playing - be it 7, 8, 9 or more - this will enable us to move on with a large number of other things. For instance, we will know exactly what constitutes a majority vote in settings (e.g. with 7 teams playing a majority would be 4). We'll have enough information to pass onto a map maker so that they can start their work (information on majority preferences for map design plus, critically, the number of teams playing). We'll also have enough information, hopefully, for teams to start seriously debating their civ/leader choices. This will be a huge leap forward from the current situation where nothing much is happening.

    The main things for the teams to do at the moment, then, would be:

    1. Have your team captain, leader, or spokesperson post your team roster in this thread before 31 May 2012.

    2. Publish your team's settings votes as soon as possible, if you haven't already. If you have no preferences on some or all of the issues, please say so. (Example of what this should look like.)

    In particular please pay attention to:
    - Map preferences: Needed for a map maker to be able to begin designing a map. If you don't have any preference or want it to be a surprise, say so.
    - Civ selection process: Needs careful consideration because there may be 9 or 10 teams playing, which is many more than in previous games. The teams who get 9th or 10th civ/leader pick will be at a serious disadvantage using the normal randomization system. If we instead use a "snake pick" with unrestricted leaders, then the team that (for instance) gets first choice of leader gets last choice of civ... while the team that gets one of the last leader choices gets one of the first civ choices.

    3. Start considering your team's civ/leader choices. This will be related to the two major decisions highlighted above, particularly civ selection process. If we use "regular" randomized selection then each team will need to make a list of 10 (or more) civs/leaders in order of preference, and be aware that there's a possibility they may be landed with their very least desired option. If we use the "snake pick" selection then each team can make separate lists of ~10 preferred leaders and ~10 preferred civs, knowing that their choices will be balanced: if they get stuck with one of their bottom preferences on one of the lists then they'll be able to choose one of their top preferences on the other list, and vice versa.

    Other things which would be useful:

    - A list of all the people interested in map making. If you know of someone, or are yourself interested (bearing in mind this means that you cannot play for one of the teams in the game), then post below. If you've already registered your interest, please post again anyway so we can get a reminder.

    - A person (or several people) experienced, impartial and with a thick skin willing to admin the game setup and the game itself. Not absolutely necessary, but useful in resolving any disputes that may crop up. Often the map maker can take on or share this role if they wish. (If we don't end up with an admin we'll just have to resort to having team votes to resolve disputes, the disadvantage being that teams will not be impartial to the situations that arise.)
     
  11. Sommerswerd

    Sommerswerd I'll sit with you

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    Thanks LP, Can I assume that you will take responsibility for communicating this deadline, along with the link to the roster page, to all the sites that have expressed interest?

    Also, ainwood suggested that I get a CFC Content Staff person (actually, he suggested you specifically;)) to post the advertisements for the game on CFC (on the front page, and the universal announcement that appears in all forums) with imbedded links etc. Can we rely on you to do that?:please:

    I don't think anyone has any problem with you taking the initiative LP:). You're certainly a much better known and respected member of CFC than either myself or 2metra;). TBH I'm still a little flabergasted that you are refusing to play for CFC... I mean you're CFC staff for Chrissakes:confused:... Anyway, thanks alot for all your work in getting this thing going:clap:

    I will post our current roster on the thread you made now.

    I also think your deadline is fine. TBH any team that hasnt said they are playing firmly by now is probably not playing, its been about a month.

    As for a Map Maker, I think the issue is that everyone who is a trusted/known Mapmaker is playing (I dont blame them, it sucks to have to sit out because you made the Map). I think we really need to take a serious look at solutions that dont involve a Mapmaker, unless you can suggest someone that you know/trust who is not going to be playing.

    Enough delay on this Mapmaker thing... either you know someone or you don't. If you don't then we just have to accept that we can't have a Mapmaker and do it a different way. I'm not trying to be pushy here, just reflecting the reality that you pointed out, that we want to get things moving forward.

    We already have one committed game Admin, r_rolo1, who is a Junior Mod here at CFC. I posted this a while back, but just a reminder. We still need at least one other admin minimum, so LP if you will please reach out to someone I would greatly appreciate it, as I have asked every single person I can think of.

    The last thing, is we are doing leader choices by snake pick, period. There is no other way. I don't think this is controversial, if anyone thinks it is, then they are just wrong, we are doing snake pick. So let's assume snake pick, and put that issue aside.
     
  12. Pucc

    Pucc Chieftain

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    Nice to see some progress in organizing this ISDG.

    Civforum.de has voted the setting ideas and here are the results:


    Our roster in the specific thread will follow soon.


    And one more thing. civforum.de won't need a teamforum on civfanatics. We made one on our own forum and think that it will be sufficient.
     
  13. DNK

    DNK Member

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    If we release the map prior to play for everyone to look at, I don't see why the mapmaker can't play also. Another option.
     
  14. Lord Parkin

    Lord Parkin aka emperor

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    That'd rather ruin the thrill of exploration and the unknown though. ;) If we really can't find an experienced map maker outside the game (and we're still looking), then personally I'd much rather have a random map than one everyone sees beforehand. Hopefully we'll be able to locate one, though. :)
     
  15. Moineau

    Moineau Chieftain

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    Yeah count me as captain. Thank you Bowsling btw.

    When settings will be decided, i am gona post them in our french forum and see if we can get a team. If so, we gona participate. I dont want that people say me they wana play and finally not cause of settings, that's why i am waiting for them.

    I saw, even if we are all players from different places (SP/MP etc...), you well pointed out important things like Nuke/hutts/double moves etc.. then i am sure settings will be cool.
     
  16. cav scout

    cav scout The Continuum

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    So, it seems we haven't had any luck securing a map maker yet...

    I think this is pretty critical if we want to have a map that is both interesting and balanced. Going with a script runs the risk of unbalanced starts and all the hard feelings that come with that. And a mirror map is just plain boring.

    Since none of the CFC usual suspects seem to be available is there anyone from another forum we could reach out to? Perhaps someone who has signed up to play but might be ok switching over to mapmaker/admin duty?

    It would be ideal if we could get a trusted and respected person from each participating forum to help balance out a scripted map and then serve as a game admin.
     
  17. 2metraninja

    2metraninja Defender of Nabaxica

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    I knew for one mapmaker over at Apolyton who showed desire to make maps for us in the past - his nick is Imhotep, and I tried to send him a PM, but at the end it turned out he is disabled PMs, so I have no other way of contacting him :(
     
  18. Lord Parkin

    Lord Parkin aka emperor

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    Perhaps r_rolo1 would be willing to tweak a map for us, if he is acting as an admin for the game. I'll ask him anyway. :)

    Here are the tallied votes so far, from the 6 teams that have posted their preferences. I have divided them into sections based on areas of relevance.

    House Rules:
    Game Options:
    Options requiring mods (if any):
    Map Options:
    Choosing Civs/Leaders:
    Moineau, I hope the French team can make a decision based on that information as to whether or not they wish to play. We really do need to know for sure by 31 May 2012 the complete list of which teams are participating. Otherwise this whole process will continue to be delayed. :)
     
  19. Lord Parkin

    Lord Parkin aka emperor

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    This reminds me of a few other things that teams should think about voting on:

    - (House Rule) Should we ban city gifting outright, or define certain circumstances where it is okay?
    - (Game Option) Should we go with tried and true Monarch difficulty level, or something else?
    - (Map Option) Which map size? Obviously somewhat dependent on the final number of teams.
    - (Map Option) Should we define how the teams should be able to contact one another, or leave it to the map maker? For instance, should all teams start on the same land mass and/or be able to have pre-Optics contact... or will we allow the possibility of them being separated on two or more distant land masses?
     
  20. cav scout

    cav scout The Continuum

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    Thanks for the update on the team votes LP. What about the no score mod?
     

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