Praets At Deity at Normal Speed

[MarigoldRan]

According to your starting post you seems to be trying to prove that a Prat rush is a really good strategy on Diety, which its not.

Good. Back to topic.

On the right maps, a Praet rush IS a good strategy. And on the right maps, a HA rush is a good strategy too. I'm saying they're equivalent.

But unlike HAs, even if you don't rush, it's STILL a good unit. You're going to need some axes anyways. Why not build a praet?

Am I somehow not getting my message across? It seems kind of obvious of me. A praet is a STR 8 UNIT THAT COMES EARLY AND IS REALLY CHEAP. You can get Iron, and IW pretty easily, either by self-teching or by trades. Which part of this paragraph do people not agree with?

 

[The Oz-Man]

By the way, I never implied I have a successful winning strategy. What I'm trying to argue is that a Str 8, 45 hammer unit is pretty damn good and that obsolete's dissing of praets is WRONG.

You laid out a "strategy" in the very first post of the thread. You discuss the pros and cons of this strategy. You adjust it accordingly based on your own new ideas and start chucking out old ideas and adding new ones.

That's what this entire thread is, dude.

Based on your previous comment, I think you're a and your face is ugly, but that's a separate issue.

My mom thinks I'm adorable.

 

[TheWilltoAct]

I've never played with no tech trades.

It makes the game LONGER.

I'm finding standard/normal boring. Once the early classical rush is over, all you do is SIT in one place for the next 1000 years until you get cannons or Curs.

Standard/normal is wayyyyy too rushed.

I think your charade is wearing thin, now settings other than your own are boring and everyone (but you) is arrogant?

Everyone on this forum is entitled to their opinion, but there are certain realities of the game that have been explored and proven. Unfortunately you are a bit late in the life-cycle but you have as many tools at your disposal as anyone to learn from those that have come before you. To learn you have to be willing to listen and perhaps take some criticism if others don't accept your strategy. It goes without saying, but dismissing knowledgeable players and attacking their character will not improve your game.

 

[Archbob]

Good. Back to topic.

On the right maps, a Praet rush IS a good strategy. And on the right maps, a HA rush is a good strategy too. I'm saying they're equivalent.

Dude, on some of these maps that I see posted around here with their start locations. I could honestly build anything and win. I could just as easily crank out Axemen/Swordsman with Catas and win. Sure, Prats are better, but they won't alter my strategy with the kinds of starting locations I'm seeing.

 

[MarigoldRan]

You laid out a "strategy" in the very first post of the thread. You discuss the pros and cons of this strategy. You adjust it accordingly based on your own new ideas and start chucking out old ideas and adding new ones.

That's what this entire thread is, dude.



My mom thinks I'm adorable.

Yeah, probably only your mom. And maybe that's because she's blind. Ah, don't listen to me. I'm being vindictive. I think you're adorable too. Of course, that's because I have never seen you.

The thing is that I'm not really sure how effective a praet rush is. This is why, as you've said, I discuss the pros and cons of praet rushes. In this way, they're good. In this other way, they're not so good. See my point? I was hoping you and others would make a positive contribution to comparing praet rushes to HA rushes, for example, and see which turns out better.

Grashopa did make a positive contribution by rolling two maps and posting it. Kudos to him. You and Obsolete, on the other hand, added nothing substantive to it, EXCEPT by making it entertaining to anyone who is reading this right now.

But the entire thread is part of a larger discussion in general: how good are praets as a UU at Deity? Obsolete apparently thinks it's bad. I think he's foolish. Once again, it's a Str 8 unit THAT'S CHEAP AND COMES EARLY. You can rush with it, but even if you don't rush, it's a damn fine unit. Care to disagree with this?

 

[MarigoldRan]

Dude, on some of these maps that I see posted around here with their start locations. I could honestly build anything and win. I could just as easily crank out Axemen/Swordsman with Catas and win. Sure, Prats are better, but they won't alter my strategy with the kinds of starting locations I'm seeing.

Look, let's say you start on some crappy map next to Ragnar. Do you want praets early-game, or not?

 

[Archbob]

Prats are probably the 4th to 5th best UU in the game behind the fast workers, the Quencha and the War charior or immortal.

Look, let's say you start on some crappy map next to Ragnar. Do you want praets early-game, or not?

Sure, they are nice, but there are other UU's that will serve just as well.

 

[mtr12]

I'm finding standard/normal boring. Once the early classical rush is over, all you do is SIT in one place for the next 1000 years until you get cannons or Curs.

Standard/normal is wayyyyy too rushed.

I dunno, Marathon is just too long and boring. I think Epic would be fun, but my computer isn't very good, and playing to Space on Normal is bad enough.

Also, winning by Space or Culture on Marathon means pressing End Turn even more than usual

 

[MarigoldRan]

Prats are probably the 4th to 5th best UU in the game behind the fast workers, the Quencha and the War charior or immortal.

Which makes one wonder: if you can rush with WCs, and HAs, and Immortals, and Quechuas, why can't you rush with the praet and just as effectively?

In fact, I'd say praets are better in more situations. The reason is because it's a damn fine DEFENSIVE unit too, unlike the others you've mentioned.

 

[MarigoldRan]

I dunno, Marathon is just too long and boring. I think Epic would be fun, but my computer isn't very good, and playing to Space on Normal is bad enough.

Also, winning by Space or Culture on Marathon means pressing End Turn even more than usual

To each his own. But you don't see me going to your threads and flaming, "Standard/Normal is boring. Ugh. Why are you playing it?"

And yes. Avoid space and culture victories on Marathon. I tried that once. Never again.

 

[Archbob]

Well, WC's and Immortals have 2 movement speed so that's a clear advantage over the Prat, which is why I would rate them over the Prat overall. As for Quenchas, I use them more as an early anti-barb that doesn't require any resources. I'll rush with Quencha only if my opponents is really really close to me.

 

[MarigoldRan]

Well, WC's and Immortals have 2 movement speed so that's a clear advantage over the Prat, which is why I would rate them over the Prat overall. As for Quenchas, I use them more as an early anti-barb that doesn't require any resources. I'll rush with Quencha only if my opponents is really really close to me.

In return, praets are more efficient hammer-wise. Their usefulness also lasts significantly longer, and due to their cost-efficiency, you can split stacks and hit just as hard.

With praets, you DON'T need mathematics because unlike HAs, you don't need as many hammers for the HAs and the stables.

Consider: 6 praets hit just as hard as 8 HAs. But they're significantly cheaper, and doesn't require stables.

In order to not get DOWed upon while your stack is in enemy territory, don't select a religion in the early game. AND even if you can't rush, they're still a useful unit to have, unlike WCs and Immortals.

 

[Nick Carpathia]

(Actually no one likes you because you keep churning out bad advice. And every time you get called out on it, you start shifting the goalposts from "here is my super duper strategy" to "well it's just a perfectly valid opinion!")

 

[obsolete]

You don't see me going to YOUR threads and flaming: "Standard/Normal is boring, and Ho Ho Ho I'm an arrogant bastard," which is basically what you and Obsolete is doing.

Umm, it was YOU who said first to me that Normal was 'BORING' which prompted me to rebuttal that 99% of players find the opposite case to be true. Go back and check for yourself...

Now you are blaming me?

 

[MarigoldRan]

(Actually no one likes you because you keep churning out bad advice. And every time you get called out on it, you start shifting the goalposts from "here is my super duper strategy" to "well it's just a perfectly valid opinion!")

When did I ever write this is a "super duper strategy?" Please stick to the facts.

And whether people like me or not is up to them to decide. "No one likes you" is a silly blanket statement similar to "Nick Carpathia is a moron and likes to piss in his pants."

 

[MarigoldRan]

Umm, it was YOU who said first to me that Normal was 'BORING' which prompted me to rebuttal that 99% of players find the opposite case to be true. Go back and check for yourself...

Now you are blaming me?

Yes. Because you've CONSISTENTLY gone to threads and added nothing relevant to the discussion at hand. This has happened on MULTIPLE occasions recently. Your statements can roughly be summarized as:

1. I'm really good at this game.
2. You (thread-poster) sucks.
3. Praets are bad.

I'm not arguing the first two, because it's pretty obvious that you're too arrogant to dissuade. But the third point is down-right factually wrong.

 

[Archbob]

In return, praets are more efficient hammer-wise. Their usefulness also lasts significantly longer, and due to their cost-efficiency, you can split stacks and hit just as hard.

With praets, you DON'T need mathematics because unlike HAs, you don't need as many hammers for the HAs and the stables.

Consider: 6 praets hit just as hard as 8 HAs. But they're significantly cheaper, and doesn't require stables.

In order to not get DOWed upon while your stack is in enemy territory, don't select a religion in the early game. AND even if you can't rush, they're still a useful unit to have, unlike WCs and Immortals.

I think your seriously underestimating 2 movement speed units over 1.

I usually don't pick an early religion because a few civs won't be that religion and will randomly hate me.

 

[Lewarks]

Consider: 6 praets hit just as hard as 8 HAs. But they're significantly cheaper, and doesn't require stables.

Disagree. 6 Praets hit 6 times. 8 HAs hit 8 times. I'd rather have 8 HAs than 6 Praets. And everything is depending on WHAT you are hitting.

 

[TheWilltoAct]

Yes. Because you've CONSISTENTLY gone to threads and added nothing relevant to the discussion at hand. This has happened on MULTIPLE occasions recently. Your statements can roughly be summarized as:

1. I'm really good at this game.
2. You (thread-poster) sucks.
3. Praets are bad.

I'm not arguing the first two, because it's pretty obvious that you're too arrogant to dissuade. But the third point is down-right factually wrong.

You could be learning from him you know; you're too offended to take in any advice.

IMO this list is a good insight into how you process (constructive) criticism.

 

[Archbob]

HA are better against things like Axemen which appears really often in the game.