Prince Shadow Game, Pangaea/Arid/Med Sea, Noob Player

[Jellybug]

spawnbusting prevents spawns within the 5*5 box around the unit, so moving the unit more than two squares away would allow the possibility of barbs appearing. i usually go on or next to, depending on which has a better view/ defensive terrain (seeing a barb archer from a hill may impact my future settling plans for example). for prince, just getting a unit on the spot or a nice hill/forest next to it should do the trick

note that although barbs cannot spawn in fog, they can spawn in black tiles, the totally unexplored ones, even if they are within the 5*5 box

 

[lymond]

note that although barbs cannot spawn in fog, they can spawn in black tiles, the totally unexplored ones, even if they are within the 5*5 box

That's not actually correct (unless I'm misreading your statement). A unit will completely eliminate barb spawn in a 5x5 tile area. However, what can happen is that barb cities can spawn in that 5x5 area if a tile is not "visible".

So to answer your question YS, where you place your unit to spawnbust a future city spot is kind of conditional. Standing on a hill will make a lot more tile visibles barring some forest impeding the view, so where you stand may depend on the terrain around the tile you plan to target. So, for example, in the case of your marked city #2, standing on the hill is probably best since you will get a wide view of the flat land around it, as well as being a somewhat better defensible position. In other cases, I might stand on a hill a bit farther away if it keeps my target tile in view and provides better overall spawnbust coverage.

Once a city is settle or borders extended you can adjust your busters as needed. You'll get a feel for this the more you play, so I'd not worry a great deal about it now. Just keep your key early target spots busted for now.

 

[Jellybug]

my mistake, thanks lymo. sorry to mislead you @Yeah_Sure

 

[krikav]

I was under the impression that barb cities couldn't spawn unless there was a barb unit there. I remember even testing this too, fogbusting an entire island and then mashing "end turn" for 150 turns or so, and being happy that no barb cities spawned, thereby confirming this idea..

But yesterday I had a barb city spawn on a fogged tile that was 100% fogbusted by multiple units.
So unless someone does some code-diving and prove me wrong, I'm confident that barb cities can indeed spawn on tiles that are fogged, even if they are "fogbusted" and no units are there.

 

[Gumbolt]

Barbs likely moved into spawn busted area and formed a city?

 

[lymond]

Of course, even though one has an area spawnbusted, barb units can move into the area from elsewhere. When I've actually paid close attention to it, it does seem that barb cities spawn with a barb unit in the vicinity..

x-post with gumbo

regardless, barb cities spawning in busted areas are no question a certainty. I see it all the time.

 

[Fippy]

A mystery that i never figured out.
Iso maps were hype some time ago (with the workshop thread ) and i played lots..never saw a barb city forming on 100% fogbusted maps (but with some clouded tiles remaining).
I remember running 2 tests like Krikav did, clicking thru 100+ turns on edited maps..nothing happened. Those included many clouded tiles, but everything was covered with 5x5 fogbusters.

But still, others report they have seen it. So

 

[SillyGoat]

I was under the impression that barb cities couldn't spawn unless there was a barb unit there. I remember even testing this too, fogbusting an entire island and then mashing "end turn" for 150 turns or so, and being happy that no barb cities spawned, thereby confirming this idea..

But yesterday I had a barb city spawn on a fogged tile that was 100% fogbusted by multiple units.
So unless someone does some code-diving and prove me wrong, I'm confident that barb cities can indeed spawn on tiles that are fogged, even if they are "fogbusted" and no units are there.

I think you mean "spawnbusted" (ie a unit within 2 tiles) rather than "fogbusted" (all tiles visible with no fog of war).

Barb cities cannot spawn on tiles that are currently visible but can spawn within 2 tiles of a unit so long as the city tile isn't currently visible.

 

[Jellybug]

to say nothing of fogspawn busting, for which you'll need to toss a coin to your witcher

 

[lymond]

A mystery that i never figured out.
Iso maps were hype some time ago (with the workshop thread ) and i played lots..never saw a barb city forming on 100% fogbusted maps (but with some clouded tiles remaining).
I remember running 2 tests like Krikav did, clicking thru 100+ turns on edited maps..nothing happened. Those included many clouded tiles, but everything was covered with 5x5 fogbusters.

But still, others report they have seen it. So

I think it goes to the point of a barb unit needed in vicinity of barb city spawn. 100% spawnbusting...cloudy tiles or not, you've had no barb units generating in your test right? But there are many cases where you are spawnbusting some areas with barbs still sneaking around - coming in from farther away.

(not saying with certainty that a barb unit is required but I've noticed it a lot and have played with it a bit in the past trying to figure it out)

I've seen barb cities spawn in "clouded" parts of busted areas countless of times. It's an absolute that it can happens - the how and why I'm not exactly certain.

 

[krikav]

The area was spawnbusted. It was a single fogged tile basically inside my empire. There is NO way that there was any barb there.
Yet a city spawned, something I thought was impossible but now I'm convinced that it is in fact possible.

 

[Fippy]

On my tests i placed all spawnbusters with the worldbuilder on T0, so no barb could have been there.
I think another post back then already showed thou that barbs are not required for cities to pop up.
Were all water tiles covered too against galleys, Krikav?

 

[krikav]

Hmmm... now you are making me less certain. :|
I can't say 100% certain. It was quite early in the game so galleys where not really around that much. There was a crab city that I had close by so I'm almost sure I had that covered just out of safety for the crabs.
But I can't say 100%.

 

[Yeah_Sure]

Here's T40, I decided to chop out a worker first, then chop/whip the chariots. I was thinking 4 but I may go with 6 just to be safe, as I figure I can use the units that survive for spawnbusting? I also found bronze but it's pretty far away. I marked where I think two potential cities could go so I could eventually grab it with the fish. What do you guys think about those spots? Is it even worth it to try to get the bronze at all? Besides that, I'll wait for any other general thoughts and advice.

 

[Fippy]

Chariots are are a bit silly cos from Monarch on AIs start with Archers.
For a shadow game you could learn much more by picking HAs.

 

[jnebbe]

I definitely would just expand peacefully and work the 2 million floodplains around your capital, grow to 10 cities, and go from there (unless you specifically want to rush, I think I'd settle city2 and maybe a 4th city 2S of the incense, and then start whipping out HAs)

 

[lymond]

This is Prince

 

[Fippy]

This is Prince

Obviously I meant that chariot rushes are almost irrelevant when moving up, while HAs always stay good.
Shadow games are mostly for learning purposes (?), so i would lean towards showing the useful stuff. Doesn't taking out an AI with 4 chariots feel cheesy?

@yeah Sorry for no other feedback, but it will be based on which path you pick.

 

[lymond]

Point taken

 

[Yeah_Sure]

The idea of moving up difficulty level is definitely true, so I took your advice and waited for HAs. I wasn't sure whether to research HBR first or Hunting->Archery, I ended up deciding on the latter. Here where I am on T50. I updated where I plan to settle the next few cities. After HBR I was thinking of going for currency, or should I focus on something else? Any other advice and tips?