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Probably Improved Gameplay Mod

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Modpacks' started by PieceOfMind, Jul 18, 2009.

  1. TheWilltoAct

    TheWilltoAct I am observe

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    Another convert. :lol:
     
  2. Bloodstone

    Bloodstone Warlord

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    I got my version of BtS from D2D on a download, do I need to worry about this issue? I'm ready to start my first game of BtS and wanted to do so using PIG, but I have BUG already installed. Somebody answered my question about that earlier, but is there a way to uninstall BUG before installing PIG, since PIG includes the latest BUG version, short of altering the ini file? Just wondering as I'm not completely computer proficient and before I go editing files I thought I would see if there's a "no brainer" method.

    This is what my Target Short cut looks like:
    "C:\Program Files\2K Games\Firaxis Games\Sid Meier's Civilization 4 Gold\Beyond the Sword\Civ4BeyondSword.exe"
     
  3. PieceOfMind

    PieceOfMind Drill IV Defender Retired Moderator

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    Bloodstone, do you have 7zip, by any chance? If so, you can just extract the files directly from the installer.

    But as far as I can tell, no you don't need to worry about the problem you quoted. The worst that can happen is that it won't install at all. PIG does indeed include BUG (though it's not the latest version as of these days) but it includes it completely inside PIG's own folder. You don't need to uninstall BUG as PIG has nothing to do with that folder.

    If BUG is installed to customassets and you've installed PIG and it's not working, it might be worth trying deleting your customassets folder (hence uninstalling BUG if it was in there).
     
  4. Bloodstone

    Bloodstone Warlord

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    PoM;
    Thanks for the quick reply. I do actually have 7zip, so if I understand you I can just use 7zip to download and unzip PIG, from there I can just let it install through the installer, then the only thing I need to accomplish from that point is to dump my "customassets" folder and I should be good to go.

    When I downloaded PIG I believe it had BUG version 4.4, which appeared to be the most recent as of a couple weeks ago, and that's fresh enough for me. I'm just getting ready to start my first game of BtS today after finishing a IV Warlords game, so with some blind luck I hope to have this all square.

    One last stupid question. I think I have figured this out but I'm not sure. I have only ever played Vanilla and Warlords, and only ever played the boxed scenarios. When the time comes that I want to run a cool mod, i.e. Rhyse and Fall, am I going to be able to use my PIG enabled version of the game, or do you play the different MODS strictly according to how they are downloaded? This may look simple to figure out, but I'm just trying to get a grasp on it.

    Thanks to all of you for your help, it's greatly appreciated. I get real nervous poking around in files and folders I know nothing about. Maybe I need to take up the Modding Tutorial and start to figure out how this all works.
     
  5. PieceOfMind

    PieceOfMind Drill IV Defender Retired Moderator

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    PIG Mod is what I and others sometimes call a 'monolithic' mod. That is it's not designed to be modular - to work concurrently with other mods. So there's simply no way to run it in combination with a mod like Rhye's. You run PIG Mod by itself, or you don't run PIG Mod at all. Note that all the mods I say are included in PIG are essentially 'built in'. It isn't necessary to have any of them installed separately.

    There are some mods that are designed to be used with other mods. BUG to a limited extent can work with lots of other mods. Blue Marble does as well. Those mods to run with others have to install themselves to your customassets folder though. So technically I should change what I wrote above, because in fact you can run Blue Marble just fine at the same time as PIG Mod. That's because Blue Marble installs to customassets and doesn't affect any of the same files that PIG does.

    Anyway, regarding the 7zip thing, what I meant was that if you first unzip the zip file you download, you get a "PIG Mod setup.exe" file, and that that file itself can be "unzipped" (using 7zip) to reveal a folder inside. This way you don't even need to run the installer, and instead just place the mod folder in your mods directory. However the folder is called $_OUTDIR and would have to be renamed to "PIG Mod".

    But if any of that sounds tricky, by far the easiest way to install the mod, and the way I intend for it to be installed, is just to run that exe and follow the prompts.

    By the way, if you "dump" your customassets folder, it can be a good idea to make a backup of it first. That way if you mess something up, you can restore it again.
     
  6. Bloodstone

    Bloodstone Warlord

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    PoM;
    Many, Many thanks. The above post makes that which was murky to my 80's addled brain, clear!

    I kind of thought PIG and BUG were more or less "Stand Alone's" that were game playability enhancements, but I wasn't real clear since there seems to be so much modding done with Scenarios and everything else.

    But all is good, I can now Install PIG and get underway with my first game of BtS. Who knows by 2020 I'll be ready for CiV!
    Thanks
     
  7. EmperorFool

    EmperorFool Deity

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    Uninstall BUG before installing BlueMarble. In fact, uninstall BUG, delete your CustomAssets folder, and then install BlueMarble. Now when you run PIG it will use BlueMarble.

    The reason for this is that BUG in the CA folder will interfere with PIG. You can normally fix this by telling PIG to ignore the CA folder, but that means it will ignore BlueMarble as well. This is just how Civ4 handles mods, and there's no magic fix for it.

    I keep multiple CustomAssets folders in my BTS folder that I swap using Ruff_Hi's CustomAssets switcher application. All it does is rename the folders so you can do it manually if you like. This would allow you to keep BUG and BlueMarble both installed separately.
     
  8. Bloodstone

    Bloodstone Warlord

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    OK, so now let me make sure I've got this right before I embark on this adventure tonight. Right this minute I have BUG 4.4 installed (only). I am going to uninstall it (somehow), download and install Blue Marble*, then install PIG which includes BUG and various other goodies I'm looking for. Sound about right?

    *I presume Blue Marble is somewhere in the downloads section? I'm trying to write this in between projects at work and don't have a lot of time for a protracted search, but I can go looking for it tonight if need be. Again, thanks to all of you for the abundance of help and guidance, I'm getting a better grip on how to get this accomplished and play my first BtS game.
     
  9. TheWilltoAct

    TheWilltoAct I am observe

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    No attention given to my observation? :/

    Spoiler :
    if I have 2 preceding techs [Theology, Civil Service] I should be able to research Paper. I'm not beelining if I have to research Theology.
     
  10. EmperorFool

    EmperorFool Deity

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    @Bloodstone - Yes, that will get you a working BlueMarble + PIG combination. You can uninstall BUG using the uninstaller placed in your Start menu. If you told BUG not to create the start menu, then you can find it in the BUG Mod folder in your My Games BTS folder.
     
  11. Bloodstone

    Bloodstone Warlord

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    I went to the Link you included for the Blue Marble item, and it's not letting me download and save the file because "it can't read the source code", anybody had this problem with that particular site or is it maybe just me? Just curious, I can live w/o it if necessary. Thanks
     
  12. PieceOfMind

    PieceOfMind Drill IV Defender Retired Moderator

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    I'm not sure what the problem is?
     
  13. TheWilltoAct

    TheWilltoAct I am observe

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    Sorry, let me explain myself. I'm simply noting that it's possible to have 2 prerequisite technologies for Paper yet you would still need to research a 3rd to actually unlock Paper. In other words, I'm suggesting that there should be an alternative means to derive Paper through the combination of having both Civil Service and Theology.

    You are trying to weaken beelining, correct? I think you've potentially gone too far and made Paper a big hassle to research. Most people will research Civil Service, but Theology is often less vital, so if you allow the combination of the two to unlock Paper you at least achieve your goal of granting more importance to the bottom half of the tech tree.

    Am I communicating my thoughts here?
     
  14. PieceOfMind

    PieceOfMind Drill IV Defender Retired Moderator

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    So you want:

    Civil Service AND (Theology or Machinery) ?

    Then no one would ever research Machinery as one of the prereqs so one may as well make it CS AND Theo.
     
  15. TheWilltoAct

    TheWilltoAct I am observe

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    Well it could happen if one was avoiding religious techs, but you're right that would only be some odd alternative play.

    Still, is gameplay improved by forcibly slowing teching? Machinery sometimes feels like a beaker sink and nothing more. :/
    That's not your fault though, I guess I would just say the tech tree itself is a bit wonky.
     
  16. PieceOfMind

    PieceOfMind Drill IV Defender Retired Moderator

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    As much as it may be annoying to those people for whom the lib beeline has become a crutch (lol don't kill me if the grammar there is messed up!), I do think reducing the strength of the oft-used lib beeline improves gameplay. It's all about the GS bulb preferences. With the lib beeline it was too easy to get a string of ideal techs using great scientists.

    The change I have made here has probably made Deity quite a bit harder for seasoned BtS deity players. (Plus the Better AI, :lol:, not that that's my change of course)

    At more moderate difficulties, the change will appear to mainly just slow down tech progression. In fact at Deity, the AIs get Machinery quickly enough that with tech trading the tech progression is probably not slowed much anyway.
     
  17. karadoc

    karadoc AI programmer

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    If it really is all about the GS bulb preferences, then maybe the bulb preferences should be changed instead of changing the tech prerequisites.
     
  18. PieceOfMind

    PieceOfMind Drill IV Defender Retired Moderator

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    Good point.

    However, I was just thinking as I wrote the previous post, it's also about reducing how easy it is to do what is effectively a spear beeline straight up the middle of the tech tree. At least on the realism side it's a bit hard to swallow, going all the way up to Education, building universities etc. before a civ has even worked out machinery or construction.

    I will keep all this feedback in mind though, in considering whether to change how this works.

    By the way, the order of the GS bulb preferences makes a fair bit of sense already I think.
     
  19. Bloodstone

    Bloodstone Warlord

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    OK, last stupid question (I Hope) then I'll be off and running a new game. Is there an install order for blue marble/PIG? Does one need to be installed before the other?

    Thanks
     
  20. PieceOfMind

    PieceOfMind Drill IV Defender Retired Moderator

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    No, they can be installed in any order. PIG Mod only installs files to the mod folder called "PIG Mod". Blue Marble only installs files to the folder called "CustomAssets" (and that is even outside the mods folder!). There is no possibility for clash.
     

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