Quick Answers / 'Newbie' Questions

[ggganz]

Yes it makes sense. Remeber that while you need to build 8 farms, you still have 12 more tiles to build up with.

 

[Lord Parkin]

Also remember that it's sometimes worth having extra farms for a time, just to grow faster to your happiness cap. No city is going to reach size 20 early in the game, so plan according to your currently available happiness. Grow as fast as possible to your maximum happiness level, then branch out to commerce and production.

Also, it should be pointed out that you'll only need 4 farms after Biology (which, more than likely, will come before the majority of your cities reach size 20).

 

[Roland Johansen]

What are the main focuses on scoring methods?
I ask because the end of every game strongly suggests that winning isn't good enough when it tells you your leadership ability rank.

For example someone on this forum said these:
* win quickly for max points
* global domination wins give more points than score or time victories. (not sure why though?)
* any more?

P.S. or where in the game is this explained?

Your present score is visible in the game scoreboard (lower right corner). This score is multiplied by a factor that is very dependent on the date at which victory is achieved. Domination/conquest victories tend to gain lots of land and population which improves the present score. These types of victories can also be achieved at an early date giving a large multiplier for finishing the game early. That's why domination/conquest victories have a high score.

I count my food production in new cities, using the information in the "Guide to City Specialization." Ya know, Grassland is zero, Plains is -1, City space is +2, etc.

I invariably come up with numbers around minus 8, sometimes more. Which tells me, correct me if I'm wrong, that I need to build 8 farms in order for the city to grow to maximum size sustainable in that BFC.

Sometimes the number is higher. Which, correct me if I'm wrong, means I am choosing bad locations with a lack of food resources. And then I have to build a bunch of farms, and it's killing my ability to build up hammers and commerce.

Does this all make sense?

Next to the replies given by ggganz and Lord Parkin, I would like to comment that you are disregarding the substantial effect of food resources. Improving a food resource will regularly add 2 or 3 food to the tile meaning that less normal farms are needed.

Normally, small maps will have a higher concentration of food resources than bigger maps which means that farms will be needed a bit more on the bigger maps.

Before the food producing corporations of BTS, you will often need to add some farms and windmills to cities to enable them to grow up to maximum size (when they will use all the productive tiles around a city). This doesn't necessarily mean that you should start adding farms from the moment that you build this city.

For example: Take a city with 8 plains tiles and 12 grassland tiles. You can easily use the grassland tiles as long as the city is small and if you don't want it to grow fast, then you won't need any farms. Only when the city starts getting big will you need to use the plains tiles and will you need to start adding farms to the city. Because farms are some of the less productive tiles of a city (the goal of a city is to maximise commerce and production, not food), it is often best to disregard low food tiles until you will have to use them. Use the best tiles first and use the lesser tiles later.

 

[ori]

What are the main focuses on scoring methods?
I ask because the end of every game strongly suggests that winning isn't good enough when it tells you your leadership ability rank.

For example someone on this forum said these:
* win quickly for max points
* global domination wins give more points than score or time victories. (not sure why though?)
* any more?

P.S. or where in the game is this explained?

if you mouse over you current score it breaks it down.
the short version is:
difficulty, owned land tiles, population, researched techs, build wonders and the number of turns elapsed factor in the final score with the latter being a very hefty penalty for late victories.
the long version is:
this thread

 

[HEMIT395]

i'm kinda new to downloading and adding mods but i cant seems to get the mods that i downloaded to woprk in my CIV IV games at all and i have been putting them all in the mods folder but they dont show up in my game. is there something else i need to do besides "LOAD A MOD"?????? for them to work

 

[cabert]

about scoring,

if you mouse over you current score it breaks it down.
the short version is:
difficulty, owned land tiles, population, researched techs, build wonders and the number of turns elapsed factor in the final score with the latter being a very hefty penalty for late victories.
the long version is:
this thread

I too have 2 versions :
short version : why do you care?
long version : for HoF, GotM or such things where score matters, you should focus on growing your population as big as possible and winning as fast as possible. There is a method called milking about growing as big as possible until your base score growth isn't enough to stop the number of turns "decaying" effect on score. When you see your score for winning this turn isn't growing anymore, you kill your neighbours and win.
This long version is purely theoretical for me. It's no fun.

 

[taulph88]

1. Sorry don't understand the question.

You know how there's a fortified unit showing on top of each city? Wasn't there an option before that you could not show them on the main map?

I don't think you can. There may be the option to play Custom Scenario, and then turn off Time Victory, but then the game will just keep going until someone achieves one of the victories.

Well, I'm playing another person's scenario. Can't go into custom. I guess the thing is hard-coded then?

his is the easiest question to answer. Press Ctrl+O, click the Graphics tab and disable Detailed City Info.

And here I thought it was impossible. If only the others weren't.

 

[BrantleyL1]

I'm still struggling with a couple of concepts. There are several different "kinds" of city specializations. I've "heard" these discussed in the forums, but don't quite get the concept.

I know that the answer to every question is "it depends". But what I'm looking for here is a couple of general rules.

For example, here's a few things that I know:

I know that flood plains are a good spot for cottages, because they already provide 3 . And since every citizen requires two food, working that tile will produce an extra food - allowing the city to grow.

I know that farms (and pastures, and wheat, corn, rice) produce - and you need to grow a city.

And not every location has enough of the right tiles nearby to grow to a huge size.

I know that cottages and some tiles produce
And mines and some tiles produce

I think I'm missing a nuance or two on these. I can generally hold my own (on noble), so I'm not 100% a newbie. But pretty darn close.

I'm just looking for a couple of tips on each of these. I find that I get lost in the huge walkthrus. I get to the end and find myself wondering HOW this city came to be SO huge & do whatever....

Anyway, to the question.....

Preface all of these with "Assuming the right location, what is the best way to grow a...." And what would also be helpful is to know what would contribute to one of these kinds of cities:

A commerce city: I'm assuming here that you'd build a LOT of cottages, a few farms to keep things going. The value of this city would be to create wealth for your civ.

A production city I don't quite see how to implement. The idea would be to maximize hammers. By building _____ and what about converting some to "citizen" specialists - which produce extra hammers. Since production is how everthing happens, isn't it a good idea to have a number of these?? These cities can be helpful to build spaceship components in the later years. I know forges add and factories add 25% more and another 25% if you have power (coal, etc or the TGD). But what about the early game?? And are factories a good idea for all cities?

Science City I would assume that the idea here would be to add to your research capability - but how??

Military city What's different between this and a production city?

Religion city??I think I read some post or other that mentioned this, but this one really escapes me.

Thanks. I'd really be thankful for a push in the right direction to understanding the idea of city specialization. I seem to muddle through OK, but don't really know how to plan the locations to tie into the right specializations....

 

[Michael Alan]

Thanks Roland Johansen, Ori & Cabert for replies above.

I'll examine the score breakdown as I mouse over it.
I guess I like to win with whatever strategy I like and then try harder levels of difficulty and win as well. But I'm not sure I should care much about "how much I win by". Maybe a decent leadership ability rank tells me if I am ready to go on to higher levels of difficulty, I don't know.

It bothered me that they put me down with a snide "Dan Quayle" label after I win the game. Seemed something wrong about that. Also seems to oppose the replayability of the game, because if you only go for super high score then you probably tend to only play the game one way. While all along I thought a main feature was replayability, that is; so many different ways to win.
I dont care about HoF or GotM.

 

[JujuLautre]

A commerce city: I'm assuming here that you'd build a LOT of cottages, a few farms to keep things going. The value of this city would be to create wealth for your civ.

You have the point. Enough food to sustain growth, rest of cottage.
Note that they usually produce commerce, not gold. If you don't know the exact difference between these both terms, I suggest you take a look at it

A production city I don't quite see how to implement. The idea would be to maximize hammers. By building _____ and what about converting some to "citizen" specialists - which produce extra hammers. Since production is how everthing happens, isn't it a good idea to have a number of these?? These cities can be helpful to build spaceship components in the later years. I know forges add and factories add 25% more and another 25% if you have power (coal, etc or the TGD). But what about the early game?? And are factories a good idea for all cities?

For a production city, see the paragraph about commerce city, but replace "cottage" by "mines, workshops, mills" and you have the point. You usually need more food because you will often work 1 food tiles in production cities.
In the early game, production cities are usually here o produce units. In this case, one food special and 4 grassland mines already make a very capable production city. Whtn the city has more potential, grow it more and get some more farms and production improvements online.

Science City I would assume that the idea here would be to add to your research capability - but how??

Assuming you have lots of cottages through your civ, you will usually run a high science slider, thus making every one of your commerce cities great science cities. Just don't forget to add libraries/universities/laboratories when you can.

Military city What's different between this and a production city?

For most of the game, your production cities are military cities. Their goal is to quickly produce good troops. So they usually get also military buildings: barracks, drydocks, stables, military academies, heroic epic, west point...

Religion city??I think I read some post or other that mentioned this, but this one really escapes me.

I think this one is know usually recognized; at least, that's the first time I hear about it

One kind of city that you did not mention and lots of people use is the GP Farm. Basically, get high food ressources, farm a lot, and run specialists to generate great people at a high rate.

In all cases (commerce, production, GP, which can after be declined in science, military...), food is essential. You need some to compensate food-deficit tiles (plains, hills), and you need some more to get a good growth rate. Try to place most of your cities near food ressources (one or two, three if possible for a GP farm), it's one of the best way to think that problem.

 

[Roland Johansen]

I'm still struggling with a couple of concepts. There are several different "kinds" of city specializations. I've "heard" these discussed in the forums, but don't quite get the concept.

I know that the answer to every question is "it depends". But what I'm looking for here is a couple of general rules.

For example, here's a few things that I know:

I know that flood plains are a good spot for cottages, because they already provide 3 . And since every citizen requires two food, working that tile will produce an extra food - allowing the city to grow.

I know that farms (and pastures, and wheat, corn, rice) produce - and you need to grow a city.

And not every location has enough of the right tiles nearby to grow to a huge size.

I know that cottages and some tiles produce
And mines and some tiles produce

I think I'm missing a nuance or two on these. I can generally hold my own (on noble), so I'm not 100% a newbie. But pretty darn close.

I'm just looking for a couple of tips on each of these. I find that I get lost in the huge walkthrus. I get to the end and find myself wondering HOW this city came to be SO huge & do whatever....

Anyway, to the question.....

Preface all of these with "Assuming the right location, what is the best way to grow a...." And what would also be helpful is to know what would contribute to one of these kinds of cities:

A commerce city: I'm assuming here that you'd build a LOT of cottages, a few farms to keep things going. The value of this city would be to create wealth for your civ.

A production city I don't quite see how to implement. The idea would be to maximize hammers. By building _____ and what about converting some to "citizen" specialists - which produce extra hammers. Since production is how everthing happens, isn't it a good idea to have a number of these?? These cities can be helpful to build spaceship components in the later years. I know forges add and factories add 25% more and another 25% if you have power (coal, etc or the TGD). But what about the early game?? And are factories a good idea for all cities?

Science City I would assume that the idea here would be to add to your research capability - but how??

Military city What's different between this and a production city?

Religion city??I think I read some post or other that mentioned this, but this one really escapes me.

Thanks. I'd really be thankful for a push in the right direction to understanding the idea of city specialization. I seem to muddle through OK, but don't really know how to plan the locations to tie into the right specializations....

The whole city specialisation thing again, it's really overrated.

The whole city specialisation thing is based upon the idea that a city doesn't need every building if it is a specialised city. A city specialised in science doesn't need gold and production increasing buildings, a city specialised in gold doesn't need science and production increasing buildings, a city specialised in production doesn't need gold or science increasing buildings. So you could build these 3 types of cities for your empire and each only needs a third of the buildings. It sounds very logical and that's why newer players believe it and think it's the thing that they're doing wrong and what's keeping them from playing at the higher levels. The problem is that it's 90% nonsense and 10% truth. I play at immortal and deity levels without regenerating the map or stacking the deck in my favour and I don't use city specialisation on a large scale. It's not the thing keeping some players from playing at the higher difficulty levels. It is more important in games using the specialist economy, but not very important when you use a cottage economy like most players do.

The problem is that every successful science city needs to be happy and healthy. So gold increasing buildings like the grocer (which improves health) and the market (which improves gold) are almost certainly required. And a production improving building like the forge is also very useful, not only because of the happiness bonus that it offers, but also because of the 25% production bonus which will help construct all the other buildings a lot faster.

Apart from a Holy Shrine city, a gold city doesn't really exist in a cottage economy. You could create one in a specialist economy with many merchants.
In a cottage economy, a city with a high commerce output should also get the science improving buildings and also the forge to help build all these buildings and increase the happiness.

A production city with lots of mines, farms and workshops and designed to be a production city still needs to be healthy and happy. So you will want markets and grocers in such cities. And once such a city does get a good commerce output due to trade routes in the late game, it would be a waste to not place some science improving buildings in such a city.

So the whole idea that specialised cities need far fewer buildings and are thus more efficient to construct is mostly nonsense.

What you can do is try to improve the terrain in such a way that a city becomes very strong in a certain aspect of the game.

For example. If you find a spot with a good food output and quite some hills, then you could improve it with mines and farms and later some workshops for great production. Then you add some instructors to the city and a forge and whatever buildings are needed to keep the city healthy and happy and you get a city which is quickly finished with building construction and can move on to unit construction for your empire.

If you find a floodplain city with multiple sea food resources or multiple land food resources then you could farm the whole area and build the buildings that allow specialists and make it a city for the creation of great persons.

If you find a city with lots of flatland and only a few hills, then it will be one of your 'economy' cities. Improve it with lots of cottages and only a few mines and workshops. The few production tiles are still needed so that the city can build the buildings that improve the gold and science output and the buildings that keep the city happy and healthy. But most of the tiles will be improved to increase the commerce output of the city. This commerce will be divided into gold and science and multiplied by the gold and science multiplying buildings in the city.
If the above city would also have quite some coastal tiles, then a harbor is useful to improve the commerce output of the trade routes (and add a health bonus).

In most of these cities, you will only add farms and windmills to improve the food output of the city so that it can grow and use more tiles. Some cities might get some extra food output if they don't have mined hills so that they can use the power of poprushing for production. Only the great person farm(s) will get much more food output through farms and windmills.

Most of my cities will be of the economy type. That's my general city. They might still build some units, but far less than the military cities. The number of great person farms is low: 1,2 maybe 3.

The real specialisation is achieved with the national wonders. They give such a high bonus that it is interesting to pick a city that can be molded so that the bonus is maximised.

The Heroic Epic and West Point will be build in a city with a high production and some instructors. Wall Street is benefitting from the gold output of a corporation headquarters, a holy shrine and a great commerce output from the land. Oxford University should be build in a city with a huge commerce output. Once these national wonders are build in a city, then you should mold the city to maximise the bonuses of the wonder. Change the terrain improvements and build the right buildings.

I usually play on huge maps and tend to have 15-20 or more cities without aggressive conquest. A few of those will have a national wonder and thus be specialised to maximise the benefits of this wonder. 1 or 2 with a great food output will typically produce specialists for great persons. A few with hills and good production will build the units and the wonders. But most of the cities will be general commerce cities which means some production and quite some commerce. These are the motor of my economy. Specialisation helps a bit, but it doesn't achieve wonders. You won't be able to skip lots of buildings and it won't magically improve your economy.

 

[ggganz]

You know how there's a fortified unit showing on top of each city? Wasn't there an option before that you could not show them on the main map?

I think press Ctrl+B or something? Or press the button above the minimap.

 

[cabert]

@brantley.
Roland and jujulautre already answered, with good posts your thread.
I just wanted to add a few things :
1 - city specialization must really depend on your strategy.
It has no sense building several commerce cities if you plan on a quick conquest.
It has no sense building several early production cities if you plan on a space race. 1 with the heroic epic to be safe is enough. You can convert any cottage spammed city into a super production city in the late game (after communism).
Some strategies focus on slavery, or $ rushing or drafting.
First you know what you plan to do, then you build up/improve your cities accordingly.
Then again, you need to recognize a situation where production cities aren't really possible and you should think about which strat to use to overcome this problem.
2 - Whatever the specialization (if any), food is key.
It's no use having 3 gold pits if you cannot feed the miners.
3 - It's usually (not always : Flood Plains make a hige difference) better to farm up a city in order to grow to your happy cap, then work cottages. Same thing for a production city. First you grow, then you work.
4 - have fun

 

[taulph88]

I think press Ctrl+B or something? Or press the button above the minimap.

You know, I think I was talking about Civ3...maybe there was no option to disable that in Civ 4 but there was in Civ3...bleh thanks anyway.

On another note,

Does Civ4 do a complete full uninstall? Or is it like how Civ3 was, leaving the spoils behind for us to clean up?

 

[ori]

You know, I think I was talking about Civ3...maybe there was no option to disable that in Civ 4 but there was in Civ3...bleh thanks anyway.

On another note,

Does Civ4 do a complete full uninstall? Or is it like how Civ3 was, leaving the spoils behind for us to clean up?

it leaves the save games and patches in my games\sid meier's civilization 4\

 

[taulph88]

it leaves the save games and patches in my games\sid meier's civilization 4\

And that's it? No registry keys or hidden files in the Uninstall or Installed folders in C:/?

How do I use siege units in this game. I can't use them to attack a city or unit.

 

[ori]

And that's it? No registry keys or hidden files in the Uninstall or Installed folders in C:/?

now that you mention it:
it also leaves
C:\Program Files\InstallShield Installation Information\{CFBCE791-2D53-4FCE-B3FB-D6E01F4112E8}
and erratically (i.e. sometimes)
\documents and settings\<username>\application data\my games\sid meier's civilization 4\
the
\documents and settings\<username>\my documents\my games\sid meier's civilization 4\ was the one I already mentioned

 

[plandr]

How does this game handle gender and race?

Wasn't sure where else to post this so I went for the most populated board as I'm going to buy this today...

Never played a civilization before, thought I'd pick it up from what I read so far but I had a few questions about it. One is about gender.

Throughout history women's rights/place in society has been a big part of the world and its development. I was wondering how civilization 4 addresses this.

Are citizens/units separated by gender at all? If so, how are they treated. Can you determine what proportion of what gender is sent to say, the military? Can age limits be set in place for this? Can you assign citizens rights based on gender/age?

Hoping someone can shed some light on this. ^_^

Also, how does the game handle race? Does it address this or no?

 

[ori]

How does this game handle gender and race?

Wasn't sure where else to post this so I went for the most populated board as I'm going to buy this today...

Never played a civilization before, thought I'd pick it up from what I read so far but I had a few questions about it. One is about gender.

Throughout history women's rights/place in society has been a big part of the world and its development. I was wondering how civilization 4 addresses this.

Are citizens/units separated by gender at all? If so, how are they treated. Can you determine what proportion of what gender is sent to say, the military? Can age limits be set in place for this? Can you assign citizens rights based on gender/age?

Hoping someone can shed some light on this. ^_^

Also, how does the game handle race? Does it address this or no?

The short answer is: not at all.
There are some female leaders (victoria end elizabeth of england, hatshepsut of egypt, catherine of russia in Civ4 and some more in the expansions) - but their gender is not an issue gameplaywise.
Race does not play any role at all - there not even unique skins for civs from different continents, apart from some unique units.
Much of what you ask for (though not all) can be modded into the game and some things (e.g. distinguishing between male and female leaders in diplomacy) has been introduced by fan made mods like fall from heaven - but this is not part of the game you can buy and I fully expect Firaxis/Take2 to stay away from any hot topic like the ones you mentioned. They did shy away from giving the religions they introduced any distinguishing features because of this...

 

[taulph88]

now that you mention it:
it also leaves
C:\Program Files\InstallShield Installation Information\{CFBCE791-2D53-4FCE-B3FB-D6E01F4112E8}
and erratically (i.e. sometimes)
\documents and settings\<username>\application data\my games\sid meier's civilization 4\
the
\documents and settings\<username>\my documents\my games\sid meier's civilization 4\ was the one I already mentioned

Thanks. I was afraid of this. I'll keep it in mind if I have to uninstall it. This is one problem they'll never solve. Fully uninstall the game, like other games do.