Religious Left Making Strides

[GenMarshall]

No...if the religions lose that status, then they'll have far too much power in the government, given how much it will contribute to its coffers. There's one thing if a church speaks out on an issue and its people (as voters) push for something, but quite another when the church itself has the power because they provide the tax dollars. Both religion and government would likely end up corrupted from the act.

I just hope that does not become a reality and become a Theocratic state .

At anyrate, I find mobboss's post to be part of a pretty big problem. I see no reason why democrats cannot also be religious....there are millions of us after all

I agree, I am a Democrat as well as a Catholic . Eventhough I feel that I am a bit disconnected with the party since I nearly dont agree with any of the pro-choice (pro-abortion) stances that the majority of Democrats have.

 

[Shadylookin]

all the peace love and jesus hippy stuff is one thing, but unless you support a strong seperation between church and state and are socially liberal. there's no real point in being part of the left.

 

[.Shane.]

The preachings of Jesus go against almost everything the religious right of America is in favour of. I have never understood how it works out in their heads.

Correct. If you really wanted to implement the teachings of JC as political policy, you'd be a socialist.

 

[Neomega]

I have met quite a Christian liberals, they were some of the biggest turnouts at the Iraq protests.

 

[amadeus]

If this is what I think it is, it sounds a lot like Peronism.

 

[CivCube]

I have met quite a Christian liberals, they were some of the biggest turnouts at the Iraq protests.

Indeed. The only thing holding the religious left back is the Republican party's strangehold on the definition of religion. What the conservatives would like people to believe is that all spirituality can be put in a box; that is, spirituality has about as much dimension as a Saturday morning cartoon, with dark forces on one side and the good guys on the other. This is why conservatives place such emphasis on single issues like abortion and same-sex marriage. It may make little sense to an outsider, but it makes perfect sense for someone who sees nothing else than a supernatural war for the human soul.

Christian liberals, or "progressives" are different. They place more emphasis on a scholarly approach to the Bible and the world itself. Secularism for them is where spirituality is non-existent. IMO, I think there is little spirituality in religion. The overall emphasis on structural dogma leaves little room for self-growth, and as a result kills any initiative to get in touch with God. Besides, to even think of having a relationship with God (and not Jeezus) is blasphemous.

Conservative definition of religion: God's way. Take it or leave it.
Liberal definition of religion: God's path. You are always on it.

 

[Neomega]

If this is what I think it is, it sounds a lot like Peronism.

I don't think so... What did Peronism have to do with religion, except that all great leaders use religion to their advantage?

 

[MobBoss]

Why?

The way I see it, Jesus was a lot closer to a San Fran Hippy than, say, Jerry Falwell for example.

Then you dont know very much about Jesus. He was a friend of the "hippy" for the sole reason he wanted them to leave their sinful life and walk a godly life. He hung out with the people he wanted to save, not with the people already saved. He didnt endorse the "hippy" lifestyle at all, but recognized that such people were lost and needed to hear the truth.

The preachings of Jesus go against almost everything the religious right of America is in favour of.

I disagree completely and wholeheartedly. Totally outlandish statement with no basis in truth.

Unless you're yanking all of our chains here, I thought the Jesse Jacksons and Al Sharptons of the world were part of a religious left. Okay, not the best examples, but the best well-known examples.

Plus John Paul II wasn't exactly a neocon!

If Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton are your best examples, then its 4th down and time to punt (i.e. really rethink your position). Neither was John Paul II an advocate of much of what the Democrat party is in favor of. Do you not remember that there was talk of the Catholic Church not allowing Kerry to take communion because of his stance on abortion? My, how quickly people forget.

 

[.Shane.]

Then you dont know very much about Jesus. He was a friend of the "hippy" for the sole reason he wanted them to leave their sinful life and walk a godly life. He hung out with the people he wanted to save, not with the people already saved. He didnt endorse the "hippy" lifestyle at all, but recognized that such people were lost and needed to hear the truth.

LOL, there were hippies in the New Testament? Is that what they called all those Pharisees and tax collectors? What about emos, where there emos? Goths? How about soccer moms?

PS I love the judgemental tone of this reply, as if you have the only true insight and vision of JC and his life.

 

[blackheart]

Then you dont know very much about Jesus. He was a friend of the "hippy" for the sole reason he wanted them to leave their sinful life and walk a godly life. He hung out with the people he wanted to save, not with the people already saved. He didnt endorse the "hippy" lifestyle at all, but recognized that such people were lost and needed to hear the truth.

Explain further, if you will?

 

[MobBoss]

LOL, there were hippies in the New Testament?

Sorry, Shane, I am using the term figuratively. Know what that means?

PS I love the judgemental tone of this reply, as if you have the only true insight and vision of JC and his life.

No, I dont have the only true insight...however, what I did say here was true and factual. If you disagree that Jesus indeed came for the lost, the drunks, the prostitutes, etc., then by all means correct me scriptually. He was known as their "friend" not because he partied with them, but because he loved them and wanted to save them. But I know one thing for certain.......he didnt live a San Fran hippy lifestyle of fleshly pleasure/pursuits.

 

[blackheart]

Sorry, Shane, I am using the term figuratively. Know what that means?

Figuratively for you seems to mean literal truth to me.

No, I dont have the only true insight...however, what I did say here was true and factual. If you disagree that Jesus indeed came for the lost, the drunks, the prostitutes, etc., then by all means correct me scriptually. He was known as their "friend" not because he partied with them, but because he loved them and wanted to save them. But I know one thing for certain.......he didnt live a San Fran hippy lifestyle of fleshly pleasure/pursuits.

What are you talking about? Jesus came for everyone.

 

[ironduck]

Correct. If you really wanted to implement the teachings of JC as political policy, you'd be a socialist.

Possibly an anarcho-socialist.. I think a centralized non-divine power structure goes against the essence of his teachings, and socialism/communism is closely tied to a central power that forces people to act in a socialistic way. In a theoretical anarcho-socialism I would assume people would share everything by their own desire.

 

[.Shane.]

Sorry, Shane, I am using the term figuratively. Know what that means?

Easy big fella! Just joshin! But, I do want those soccer mom verses.

No, I dont have the only true insight...however, what I did say here was true and factual. If you disagree that Jesus indeed came for the lost, the drunks, the prostitutes, etc., then by all means correct me scriptually. He was known as their "friend" not because he partied with them, but because he loved them and wanted to save them. But I know one thing for certain.......he didnt live a San Fran hippy lifestyle of fleshly pleasure/pursuits.

Ah, so hippy = drunk prostitutes!

ROFL, the "San Fran hippy lifestyle", you're awesome!

 

[MobBoss]

What are you talking about? Jesus came for everyone.

Everyone who would listen. He didnt hang out very much with the Jewish leadership for the sole reason he knew they were never going to change their view of him. But those that truly followed him left their old lives and changed. They stopped being prostitutes. They stopped being drunkards. JC came to deliver them from that life...not to endorse that life.

 

[blackheart]

Everyone who would listen. He didnt hang out very much with the Jewish leadership for the sole reason he knew they were never going to change their view of him. But those that truly followed him left their old lives and changed. They stopped being prostitutes. They stopped being drunkards. JC came to deliver them from that life...not to endorse that life.

So you're equating being a Christian leftist with drunkenness and prostitution or what?

 

[.Shane.]

So you're equating being a Christian leftist with drunkenness and prostitution or what?

No, those are the hippies, you're mixing your stereotypes. Now, I'm wondering if you're not one of these drunk hippy leftists!

o.0

 

[MobBoss]

So you're equating being a Christian leftist with drunkenness and prostitution or what?

How on earth did you make that leap of logic? Evil Knieval couldnt make that leap.

I equate Christian Leftists as "feel good" christians. No one is bad, no such thing as sin, its all love - type of thing. They prefer turning a blind eye to sin, even if its right in front of them.......basically anything goes.

Me, I cant understand not having standards in your life. To me, Christ set a standard and it is up to us to meet that standard as closely as we can. I dont see how Christian leftists can say they are Christian when they dont seem to have any standards.

 

[downtown]

How on earth did you make that leap of logic? Evil Knieval couldnt make that leap.

I equate Christian Leftists as "feel good" christians. No one is bad, no such thing as sin, its all love - type of thing. They prefer turning a blind eye to sin, even if its right in front of them.......basically anything goes.

Me, I cant understand not having standards in your life. To me, Christ set a standard and it is up to us to meet that standard as closely as we can. I dont see how Christian leftists can say they are Christian when they dont seem to have any standards.

I really dont agree with your assessment at all of liberal christians, although there are churches like that.

What a lot of very religious people are upset about is seeing Christian morality, as far as policy is concerned, being boiled down into ONLY two issues: Abortion and Gay Marriage. Thats it. Republicans, and the Religious Right leaders seldom, if ever, talk about God or anything else, outside of those issues.

Surely a scriptorian like you Mobboss knows that the gospel of Christ is much...MUCH more than that. Sermon on the mount anyone?

Christianity, if it is to be applied to politics, to me anyways, is more than that. There is nothing Moral, or Christlike, about destroying God's greatest creation, the earth, nor is there is anything christlike about abandoning the needs of our children AFTER they are born, by screwing their educational prospects, as well as their economic prospects by borrowing against them. Jesus in his mortal ministry went out of his way to bless the children, our goverment spits on them.

There is nothing moral, or Christlike about forgetting the poor. Did Jesus, or his followers say unto the begger "Thou art Lazy, and if thou hast faith in the free market system, thou shalt be saved?"

No. There was no Supply Side Jesus. Jesus commanded us to help the poor.

See what I'm getting at? The religious right has part of the picture, but not all of it...doesnt mean we dont have standards.

 

[.Shane.]

See what I'm getting at? The religious right has part of the picture, but not all of it...doesnt mean we dont have standards.

Yep, if JC was a political party here would be the platform:

*pro-life, meaning no abortion (but, they wouldn't protest clinics, they'd actually help escort those getting the abortions), no death penalty,
*pacifist, meaning no Iraq War or even a legit war (like Afghanistan)
*high tax on the rich
*food stamps for the poor
*a job for everyone
*medical insurance for everyone
*tougher environmental laws

etc....