RifE 1.20 Ideas, Requests, and Feedback

[Valkrionn]

Making this post to give people a place to provide ideas for/request new features, and give feedback on the changes we've made so far. If we like the ideas, I'll add them to this first post.

Planned Features:​

1. White Hand. Needs music, improvement art.
2. New civ, Bezeri. Detailed here.
3. New Mechanos leader, based off of Jabie's High Techpriest.
   • Spiritual/Organized
   • Evil, but does not consider himself so. Will do whatever it takes to rid the world of the twin 'Evils' of Magic and the Gods, all in the name of what's 'Good' for the future of man.
   • Gains the Fallow trait as the game progresses, at some tech along the machinery line.
   • Will be able to 'build' population... Will be via a special buildorder, and will NOT be transferable between cities. Thinking of setting the cost low, but increasing cost with each pop-point in a city.
4. New Resources.
   • Current ideas...
     • Coal
       • Coal + Iron = Steel, the new tier 3 metal. Mithril will be bumped up a tier, and made stronger and more rare.
     • Potato
       • Want some more Farm resources, mainly.
     • Lemon
       • We don't actually have any fruits, after all.
     • Olives
     • Apple
       • Ditto for both of these.
     • Duskwood
       • Increases building speed, provides extra strength to Archery units.
     • Hemlock
       • Adds extra strength to Recon units.
   • Possible ideas...
     • Tea
       • Luxury
         • Not sure we need this, I just like Tea.
     • Salt
       • Increases food saved after growth
         • Not sure this one is possible, or it would be in the first list.
     • Spices
       • Desert resource, as they only have Incense, Gold, and I believe Reagents. (And Camels if you're Malakim)
         • This would essentially be another commerce resource, like all other desert resources. Main reason it's only a 'possible'.
     • Silver
       • Luxury
         • Again, not needed, but we do have gold, might as well have silver.
5. New Agrarianism Mechanic
   • Could be made it so that organic resources (animals, grains, plantation crops, seafood) will spread twice as fast - maybe 1 in 750 with Agrarianism, and 1 in 1500 without) along with the +1 food to farms - and add that to pastures as well - but give it a 20% malus to production and gold produced... maybe even just a 10% malus will be enough to balance it.
6. Top Secret^TM Feature. Yes, there is indeed another.

Possible Features
​

1. Possibly bring in Cypher's Hinterlands game option.
2. Merge in Sephi's (vastly) improved Wild Mana, along with the arcane AI tweaks.
3. Religious tweaks
4. Archery changes
5. Early Arcane Units - Follow up post.
6. Overseer Unit. Slave Commander, increases their workrate.
7. Steal Opera's Peaceful trait.
8. Hobbit resource?

Updated as of post 207.

 

[Pohlmann]

i did some short brainstorming

there are some civs already that are nature-friendly like ljos and doviello (mby svart)

but there's no civ in who would rather leave nature untouched than build stuff in/on it.

how about a civ that does not use any improvement except for a nature preservation improvement (national parklike)

they would gain health and happyness through parks and they would not work any tiles because they dont exploit their surroundings.

instead they would focus entirely on specialists. every citizen should then produce food or there should be buildings providing food like the granary or smokehouse because they wouldnt need the health bonus.

or make every tile provide zero food on default and all ressources grant their boni then (so pig would be 4 food) to be able to work tiles before u get specialist buildings

they could aswell focus on great persons then and have a major bonus on them (e.g. merchant 3-5 food 8-12 gold or so)

units would be close to nature of course. mby mutated or evolved from plants/animals or stuff. or is this too strange even for ffh?

just wanted to share this thought

 

[Darksaber1]

huhuhuhuhuhuhuh[twitchy, gleeful smile, with drool on chin]

 

[far_wanderer]

i did some short brainstorming

there are some civs already that are nature-friendly like ljos and doviello (mby svart)

but there's no civ in who would rather leave nature untouched than build stuff in/on it.

how about a civ that does not use any improvement except for a nature preservation improvement (national parklike)

they would gain health and happyness through parks and they would not work any tiles because they dont exploit their surroundings.

instead they would focus entirely on specialists. every citizen should then produce food or there should be buildings providing food like the granary or smokehouse because they wouldnt need the health bonus.

or make every tile provide zero food on default and all ressources grant their boni then (so pig would be 4 food) to be able to work tiles before u get specialist buildings

they could aswell focus on great persons then and have a major bonus on them (e.g. merchant 3-5 food 8-12 gold or so)

units would be close to nature of course. mby mutated or evolved from plants/animals or stuff. or is this too strange even for ffh?

just wanted to share this thought

A fairly simple way to do that is to make them Fallow but not give any way of adding population, then base everything off of things that provide free specialists. Then you don't have to worry about providing alternate sources of health, happiness, or food. Plus, their cities will stay looking small and unobtrusive.

I advise against a 'park' improvement, though. Not having any improvements in their territory means you have that terrain slot open for design space, allowing them to do interesting thing with their terrain.

Are you envisioning a human civilization that lives in harmony with nature or a completely primordial/elemental race? Either way, I like the idea.

If you're serious about the idea, this seems worthy of starting a new thread.

 

[WarKirby]

A random thought. It'd be nice to see some sort of huge cannon for mechanos/khazad. It would have a high hammer cost, and be permanantly held once built, so mainly defensive, but would have an extremely long range. maybe 10 tiles or so, and a lot of strength.

I just love artillery


Also, I'd love to play Grigori just so I could build one in Junon somehow.

 

[FireBlaze]

A random thought. It'd be nice to see some sort of huge cannon for mechanos/khazad. It would have a high hammer cost, and be permanantly held once built, so mainly defensive, but would have an extremely long range. maybe 10 tiles or so, and a lot of strength.

I just love artillery


Also, I'd love to play Grigori just so I could build one in Junon somehow.

You could also make it a unit cap of four and nerf it slightly, so you can use them in your core/biggest cities as defense, instead of just one city.

 

[Pohlmann]

as i said it was just a thougt.

i was thinking about what mechanisms are not in ff yet concerning civ and the nature theme suits quite well for a non-improving civilization.

as "improvement" one could use animal dens but not providing your civ with animals but cerunnos.

trap improvements could be nice aswell. if a unit enters the field it gets trapped or damaged or control of the unit could switch or the unit could turn barbarian (enraged) or could be polymorphed to an animal.

hmm.

im already drifting away from a nature civ to a recon/assassin civ

im not sure if i could stick to one idea to finish it.
also ive no hint in modding yet (im just about to start modding and am not sure if to begin with such a difficult task ^^)

 

[Valkrionn]

Actually, I already had an idea for a civ like that. Holding off until Xienwolf finishes his aspect system... They'll be heavy into that. Will be either Fallow, or Production-Fallow... Haven't decided. But basically, plant-people.

As for the Mechanos/Khazad Cannon, the Mechanos are getting something like that with the fort. The Khazad could maybe auto-spawn a defensive unit in any Palace city? This would be the Capital, Winter Palace, Bone Palace, and the other one. Forget all the names. Would let you defend your best cities.

 

[Quetz]

[*]New Mechanos fort, and railroad route to compensate for the loss of Obsidian Gates.

• Mechanos Fort Commanders of sufficient level will be able to upgrade, literally becoming the fort. High defense, high ranged strength, auto-sanctify.
• The new fort will technically be a unit, but is only able to move on railroad tiles. Will need to merge in zRoutes to accomplish this.
• Essentially, this 'unit' will be a mobile fortress, able to provide cover and support for your army, and will automatically Sanctify as it does so. I'm picturing a fast moving swarm of workers going out ahead, constructing the route, and the fort moving up onto the tile.... In order to balance it, this unit WILL be able to be killed, and will grant a rather large sum of money to whoever does so.

This is an interesting idea but the FFurther Mechs are very OP already, almost as much as Jotnar.. Not sure they really need another super-unit. Are these forts going to be limited somehow. and are all Mechanos units able to use railroads? What level does the fort commander require to upgrade? And does creating it destroy the fort it spawned on - curious as to that because you said it WILL be able to be killed as if it was going to be invincible before! XD

As I've mentioned elsewhere, I'd still like to see Orbis imperial roads in for everyone

@above: I'd say give it to Luchiurp too. But I think Kirby's idea was more for a giant, extremely long-range cannon just for the sake of having one, as ooposed to saying Khazad really need more for city defense. Would make a neat Dwarf-only world unit.

 

[far_wanderer]

If it's really just for the sake of having a giant canon in the game, why not make it a game option, give one to everybody, and make each one have a civ-specific appearance/theme (but the same mechanics). It would be a neat use for some of the more crazy theme ideas that occasionally come up. Like:
Khazad - Earthquake generator
Mechanos - Megacannon
Hippus - Herd of horses that 'stampedes' for its ranged attack
Amurites - Calls meteors
Austrin - Lightning cannon
Balseraphs - Rain of herring
Malakim - Solar ray

 

[WarKirby]

something of this nature for every civ seems alittle extreme. Perhaps for every religion

it could be the Ordo Machinarum Super Unit, similar to the Mythril Golem and Meshabber of Dis.

I've always thought that the other religions could do with some massive creatures too...

 

[Darksaber1]

Balseraphs - Rain of herring

That is so apropriate

 

[Valkrionn]

This is an interesting idea but the FFurther Mechs are very OP already, almost as much as Jotnar.. Not sure they really need another super-unit. Are these forts going to be limited somehow. and are all Mechanos units able to use railroads? What level does the fort commander require to upgrade? And does creating it destroy the fort it spawned on - curious as to that because you said it WILL be able to be killed as if it was going to be invincible before! XD

As I've mentioned elsewhere, I'd still like to see Orbis imperial roads in for everyone

@above: I'd say give it to Luchiurp too. But I think Kirby's idea was more for a giant, extremely long-range cannon just for the sake of having one, as ooposed to saying Khazad really need more for city defense. Would make a neat Dwarf-only world unit.

The forts will need a high level fort commander... Say level 12. Shouldn't be a common occurrence, self-limiting. It does indeed destroy the fort, so you'd go from a citadel to nothing... Can rebuild, but it'll take a few hundred turns to get back.

All Mechanos units will be able to use railroads... But again, very late game. Same as the Gates on the arcane line... Can be used more widely than the gates, but can't get you nearly as far, so I think it's fine. I don't particularly like the Imperial Roads for FF, honestly... With an expanded tech tree I could see it, but not with the current one.

If it's really just for the sake of having a giant canon in the game, why not make it a game option, give one to everybody, and make each one have a civ-specific appearance/theme (but the same mechanics). It would be a neat use for some of the more crazy theme ideas that occasionally come up. Like:
Khazad - Earthquake generator
Mechanos - Megacannon
Hippus - Herd of horses that 'stampedes' for its ranged attack
Amurites - Calls meteors
Austrin - Lightning cannon
Balseraphs - Rain of herring
Malakim - Solar ray

Would be funny, but not worth it, really.

something of this nature for every civ seems alittle extreme. Perhaps for every religion

it could be the Ordo Machinarum Super Unit, similar to the Mythril Golem and Meshabber of Dis.

I've always thought that the other religions could do with some massive creatures too...

Hmm... That could be interesting too. Will have to think about it.

 

[Darksaber1]

Well, then you'll need to make sure that Fortress Commanders can get Forfite Promotion, or what ever it's called, because Fort Commanders don't get enought promotions to make lvl 12.

 

[Valkrionn]

They will have enough soon.

 

[armyofwhispers]

The mechanos Goliath unit already fills the super unit role in my opinion. With tanks and any amount of refined mana, lategame mechanos are practically unstopable. For instance, with a standard map, I started with about 4 mana nodes which I snatched up quick. I rushed writing, and by the time other civs had researched iron working, I was pumping out str 24 tanks and I could afford to upgrade them all with blitz, mobility, and the siege str upgrade because I was making so much damn cash. I gotta start playing at higher than noble difficulty...

 

[Darksaber1]

Umm, Valk, maybe Steam Tanks sould be limited. Maybe no more then, say ten? They can easily get more then 20 stregth, and much more power with a Master Siege smith.

 

[Quetz]

The refined affinity is the main culprit really. It's quite easy to be running around with str 12 blimps (including the swordy naval promotion, which they really should not be able to access) while everyone else is using axemen and such, with a mere 4 nodes + palace mana. Really need partial affinity (i know that's being worked on, yes) or to have it limited to way fewer units and ideally a signifigant reduction in base strength as well, forcing them to rely on capturing nodes to get the units so strong.

In the 2 mech' games I've played I never even bothered to research past blimps.. why bother with tanks when you get str 12+ flyers that can haul their own siege engines, especially since no melee/archers get a promotion to counter naval units afaik.

edit: 10 seems extemely high for tanks to me. Why not 4 max like all the other national units? Blimps/Zeppelins should be on that list too.

 

[armyofwhispers]

Well the main, thing with the mechanos is that they get a massive hammer boost with most of thier stuff, and a research boost with each additional refined mana. This is a massive advantage, and practically unbeatable if they aren't nerfed in some way.

Perhaps with each additional refined mana, you get +1 or perhaps -1 that way it balances the gain.

Being able to produce tanks at 1/per at a city seems OP even with a # cap.

edit: you could even ascribe it to the radiation given off by the refined mana (from the civopedia entry).

 

[WarKirby]

Perhaps with each additional refined mana, you get +1

I really like this idea, actually. In the mid-lategame, I usually had about 7 or so refined mana. having an extra 7 in every city would be a big penalty, but not an insurmountable one.