CommandoBob
AbstractArt
I thought that we had dis-allowed ship chaining, so I didn't mess with it.
Rod1- Something Enjoyable
- Thread starter Rodent
- Start date
TheOverseer714
Overseer
Riding out the SG blahs. I think I OD'ed on SGs last week. I'll have this turn-set finished by Monday, once I get back in the swing of things.
TheOverseer714
Overseer
It took longer. Much longer. However, it was worth it. Gentlemen, we are the victors!
I saw an opportunity to finish this off, and I took it. So on this day of thanksgiving in America, I give thanks. Thank you Rodent and CBob for setting me up for a fine finish! Here is my turn-log:
The save:
I saw an opportunity to finish this off, and I took it. So on this day of thanksgiving in America, I give thanks. Thank you Rodent and CBob for setting me up for a fine finish! Here is my turn-log:
Spoiler :
and Shuruppak is ours! Im going to start keeping these small enemy towns, both for their cultural intrusion and the minimal flip-risk.
The save:
CommandoBob
AbstractArt
Way to go, Overseer!
darski
Regent in Training
WTG!!!!!
Good one.
Good one.
TheOverseer714
Overseer
I noticed that even with our 1 move units, the enemy was definitely outclassed. Once I hit their road network, the writing was on the wall. Also, cranking out Infantry that they refused to attack, even wounded, made it easy. Good stuff. It might have been much tougher at a higher level.
CommandoBob
AbstractArt
Let's kick this around here first. It's one less thread to subscribe to!
Initial Thoughts and Rambling
Why 23 AIs and not the full 30?
That many AIs on a small map means that we meet a lot of neighbors very, very early. That can be a game killer if we have 4 AIs trying to kill us when we have only a city or two. I think a larger map size might be easier.
As we saw here, an AW game is very different from any other. TheOverseer has more AW experience than I do. AWs are a lot of fun and are very tense in the first turns. And I would love to play in an 'outside-the-box' kind of game that you describe. I've followed the 31-Civ monster games but I haven't joined them (or asked to join) since I feel that I would slow down their rate of play.
Common Wisdom is that an AW game increases the difficulty by one level. So Regent AW = Monarch. I am confident that we three could handle a Monarch AW but if we want new people to join us (new to SGs that is) then Regent might be a better choice. Not sure, just throwing out an idea. Map size and number of civs makes a difference, too.
TheOverseer714
Overseer
Since we are all involved in another "crowded" game on different teams, an AW version of that could get wild, Regent or Monarch would be the best level to try it at. How big of a world will it be? I'd say a Large or Huge myself and with 20-30 tribes, each tribe might only have 3-5 cities before they run out of space. We might want to try things out before to get a feel of how it will work, there are so many untested variables. It should be interesting, no matter what happens. I can see potential pitfalls being incredibly long IBTs so we might want sedentary or no barbs to help there. Then there's world shape, do we want Pangaea, Continents, or Archipelago? Each one has pluses and minuses. Right now I'm leaning toward Pangaea, since that puts all resources on the mega-continent, thus all tribes have a fair shot at luxes and resources. I hope some of the folks who play the superhuge maps can point out other pitfalls.
Oh an aside to Rodent: The events in India are very distressing, and the aftermath could be very very bad indeed should Pakistan be found complicit in any part of these attacks. What with the ongoing tensions over Kashmir, a major war could be in the offing. I certainly hope it doesn't go that far, as there are nuclear weapons that could get involved. Some scary stuff going on in that part of the world right now, hopefully cooler heads prevail.
Oh an aside to Rodent: The events in India are very distressing, and the aftermath could be very very bad indeed should Pakistan be found complicit in any part of these attacks. What with the ongoing tensions over Kashmir, a major war could be in the offing. I certainly hope it doesn't go that far, as there are nuclear weapons that could get involved. Some scary stuff going on in that part of the world right now, hopefully cooler heads prevail.
CommandoBob
AbstractArt
I lean towards Huge map size with continental landmass. I've played several games on Pangea and the biggest disadvantage is a lack of natural choke points. In this game we had one choke point, at Sugar Choke, that we could defend easily. We won't be so lucky on a pangea landmass.
Huge will give us some time to build up our core before we have to go to war. Well, we hope that will happen. It may not.
I'm not certain about which civ to be. Rome, Greece and Carthage all have strong Ancient Age units, but that means our Golden Age will be early also. Early AA warfare tends to be most defensive in nature, and Hoplites and N Mercs are very, very good for that.
Random civ is fine, too.
Just preferences and wishing, so far. Lots of room for discussion.
Huge will give us some time to build up our core before we have to go to war. Well, we hope that will happen. It may not.
I'm not certain about which civ to be. Rome, Greece and Carthage all have strong Ancient Age units, but that means our Golden Age will be early also. Early AA warfare tends to be most defensive in nature, and Hoplites and N Mercs are very, very good for that.
Random civ is fine, too.
Just preferences and wishing, so far.
Lots of room for discussion.
CommandoBob
AbstractArt
(This is just a portion of a news article.)Fox News said:
Anything that would cause India and Pakistan to go to war would further the aims of the terrorists. I hope that does not happen.
(I could say more but I don't want to go on a rant.
![[pissed]](/images/smilies/pissed.gif "Pissed [pissed]")
)Congratulations guys, this looked like a fun game. I've never played AW yet, but it sounds like an interesting style I'd like to try. My usual play style is to have short wars of expansion in between periods of building. But I love the games with restrictions because they force you to learn to play with a different strategy.
This "crowded" scenario sounds pretty cool. I have a couple suggestions to add to the crowdedness: you may not raze any enemy cities that you capture. Every city must be kept! You can of course build new cities in between. Also, CxxC or something close to it is a must. The way I see it, with that many civs on such a small map, the early game is crucial. It could either be won or lost very quickly, especially when most of the civs will lack access to key resources.
If you have an opening, and wouldn't mind an SG newbie, I'd love to join in. I'd say I'm a regent level player, never tried harder. I'm living and working in Vietnam at the moment, so my time zone is about 12 hours different from everyone, but I have lots of free time to play.
This "crowded" scenario sounds pretty cool. I have a couple suggestions to add to the crowdedness: you may not raze any enemy cities that you capture. Every city must be kept! You can of course build new cities in between. Also, CxxC or something close to it is a must. The way I see it, with that many civs on such a small map, the early game is crucial. It could either be won or lost very quickly, especially when most of the civs will lack access to key resources.
If you have an opening, and wouldn't mind an SG newbie, I'd love to join in. I'd say I'm a regent level player, never tried harder. I'm living and working in Vietnam at the moment, so my time zone is about 12 hours different from everyone, but I have lots of free time to play.
TheOverseer714
Overseer
I see no problem with you joining and as for time zones, Rodent is in India, so you and he are not much further apart than myself and CBob and there hasn't been a problem. I say welcome aboard, pending Rodents approval of course. Keeping cities should't be a problem at Regent/Monarch, the cultural insanity really begins at Emperor. CxxC is what we do anyway, though in the farm zones it may even be CxC.
Cool, yeah, I know how everyone swears by CxxC here. I used to always build CxxxxC and rush culture to fill in the gaps, for no real reason other than that I liked how it looked. But, I've learned a lot from the forums recently, I see how so much is wasted, and it's not a good stategy for higher levels or more aggressive games. So, I've broken that bad habit... I may still have other bad habits, but I can take criticism and learn from my mistakes 
Rodent
Carnage
- Joined
- Mar 18, 2008
- Messages
- 892
Welcome, Peebo, Hope you stick around and finish this SG.
Good thoughts everyone, Lets look at the mathematical aspect of map size first.
An huge map can have roughly 4000 tiles. taking 31 civs means 136 tiles per civ (roughly), too much land for a crowded map I say.
I have no idea about Large maps, But I will assume they are in the 2500-3000 range. I will assume we have 2700 tiles. taking 31 civs means 84 tiles per civ (roughly), much better for a crowded option.
Standard maps have tiles in the 1500-2000 range. taking 1750 again we have 50 tiles per civ by estimate.
just some food for thought, An standard map can offer us enough land to get 5-6 cities running, I understand your apprehension about getting jammed in, but that is kind of the purpose of the variant, You see, I dont want this to be a normal Build up and destroy game, What I had in mind was that we were fighting for our lives
however, If you guys still want an large or huge map, I will go with it.
Good thoughts everyone, Lets look at the mathematical aspect of map size first.
An huge map can have roughly 4000 tiles. taking 31 civs means 136 tiles per civ (roughly), too much land for a crowded map I say.
I have no idea about Large maps, But I will assume they are in the 2500-3000 range. I will assume we have 2700 tiles. taking 31 civs means 84 tiles per civ (roughly), much better for a crowded option.
Standard maps have tiles in the 1500-2000 range. taking 1750 again we have 50 tiles per civ by estimate.
just some food for thought, An standard map can offer us enough land to get 5-6 cities running, I understand your apprehension about getting jammed in, but that is kind of the purpose of the variant, You see, I dont want this to be a normal Build up and destroy game, What I had in mind was that we were fighting for our lives
however, If you guys still want an large or huge map, I will go with it.
CommandoBob
AbstractArt
That's part of the fun of an AW; backs against the wall and every turn is a fight for survival.What I had in mind was that we were fighting for our lives
Map Calculations
Remember, the AI doesn't settle cities like we do. Generally, they prefer a looser city spacing, trying to give each city the full 21 tiles to develop. So at Huge, with an average of 136 tiles per civ, that divides down to about 6.5 cities (136 divided by 21).
In that same 136 tiles, we would probably place between 12 to 15 cities and make them productive.
We tend to build at least twice as many cities as the AI in the same given territory.
So on a Standard map, Pangea landmass, we would face about 30 civs with each civ having 3 or 4 cities. Huge map, Pangea landmass, each civ would have 6 to 7 cities. And we would face more units.
Now the difficulty level becomes a factor. At Regent, the AI pays the cost as we do to build a unit. At Monarch, units are 10% cheaper for the AI. At Emperor, the discount is 20% plus some extra starting units.
The Greebly and ThERat series use a non-standard map size, I think. since sometimes they cannot build any cities.
In the end I think I am saying this: I think a Huge map will be harder since the AI can throw more units at us, which will make inital attack wave of each new civ stronger. We'll have more cities, but the conflcit will have ups and downs and we'll have more things to manage. On a Standard map I think that if we can survive to 1000 BC then the game will be won since we will have a good core and no one else will.
Sounds good, but all my rambling is just theory. I would rather have someone who has played more AW games comment on this.
TheOverseer714
Overseer
You have to tweak things in the editor to get more than the standard number of civs.
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