Role Play Challenge: Alexander Greek God of War III

[grandad1982]

I would wait till you have 2+ cities before you start on wonders. The Mids esspecially as they come in at a hefty price early on. Second city and chop the GW maybe 3rd city before you chop the mids, so you can still produce some units. As you say though the situatin could change when you see whats out there!

 

[Xurr]

Settle in place. It won't take long to be able to hook up that ivory for a happiness boost early on. I like this start. my build order would be work boat, work boat, worker, archer, archer, settler. By the time you are building the settler you should be at 5 or 6 pop with the ivory hooked up. At 5/6 pop you will be able to crank out the settlers and workers just chopping and no whip.

 

[BARBEERIAN]

I'd settle in place, it's a very nice spot. I wouldn't tech archery right away though, go Mining > BW right away since you can't build any mines without chopping. Tech Archery after BW if there's no copper reasonably close by, then tech Agri > Wheel > AH.

Build Orders:
> Workboat (work a 1f 2h tile, better off getting the big growth from fishies faster IMO)
> Warrior x2 (work a 1f 2h tile + the fish to get the warriors out a little faster so you can use 'em to scout for good city locations nearby.)
>Settler (you'll be size 3 after the 2 warriors. BW probably won't be close enough to being done so go Settler first and either claim the best spot you can or wait 'till BW and settle some copper)
>Worker (slave it)
>2x Warriors (or archers if you managed to get that tech by now)
>Settler (He for sure has to find copper/horse if your first settler didn't. Otherwise block out a nice chunk of land).
>Some units for anti-barb/City D (Phalanx/Archers/Chariots)

 

[madscientist]

Alexander, Greek God of War: Part I

Alexander looks over his future empire, no longer arrogant or crazed with bloodlust, but rather and calculating. He orders his peopl to settle in place, and silently and efficiently the Greek people begin constructing the first item of they're empire. Al has alot of unfinished business here.

OK, a good start I think, with plenty of decisions to make and options.

First of all the obvious, we settled in place capturing 4 food resources with easy access to an early happiness resource.



We quickly find one valuable easrly resource that immediately get's AL thinking of a more peaceful start.



Until he meets the first AI, then his warring blood starts bubbling again, patience he mutters, we must have patience.



Yes, the backstabbing protective leader. Well protective archers are no match for our agressiver Phalynx!

And another leader



Gilgamesh is one tough early customer. Those vultures and protective archers are a tough combo, plus he's creative!

We soon find Gilgamesh's location, pretty darned close to us



We meet two more AIs





AN agressive AI and an Imperialistic AI.

Now the techpath: Mining/BW/archery/wheel/Mysticism/Masonry

I went after this order because we had enough food, and wanted some early chopping action from the worker.

Build order went workboat/workboat/worker/warrior/archer/archer/workboat/settler

After teching BW, the million dollar question.



We find copper in a very nice location, it allows us to also grab cows and the stone.

We meet the last 2 AIs




Hmmm... Creative Zara and Agustus with his Prats. Both very dangerous but pretty easy to get along with.

I saved once the settler was build as we have a few options here. See our lands north and south of Athens.




OK, like I said lot's of decisions, immediate and near future.

1) Where to settler? We could settle on the NE hill collecting stone/copper/cows while keeping fresh water and some farmable grasslands. Or we can settle in the jungle cutting Gilgamesh off, grabbing teh dye but stuck with some jungle.

2) Tech order: Once we finish masonry where to next?

3) Build orders: Stonehenge is 36 turns, barracks is 8. Of course we can get another worker or 2. Once we have the stone hooked up we can make a run at the great wall or Pyramids but likely SH won't last that long.

But the biggest choice is, do we rush Gilgamesh now or buildup first? I say it's a perfect opportunity for either approach!

Right now Suliman has Hinduism and Zara has Buddhism, since neither start with mysticism I gotta assume both are further behind in the military techs. And noone cna match us militarily except for Khan.

My feeling is some expansion and wonder building, then unleash the Greek army on someone.

 

[ParadigmShifter]

There's copper right next to Gilgo's land. You don't really have any counter to str 6 vultures if he hooks that up. Wait for elephants before taking him on, unless you can stop him hooking up the metal. He is still protective though.

 

[Mesousa]

I'd settle on the hill indeed, 2W of the copper. Maybe to the south too to grab cows/wheat/ivory. Explore the NW before settling a third city though, there might be a nice location with seafood there, for an easy early commerce boost.

Gilgamesh ... tough call, either try to get him before he can hook up copper, or wait until you have elephants (and he ideally won't have longbows yet). I'd play it safe and wait, but a rush certainly could be done. Against protective archers it will be costly though, so I'd prefer more expansion and infrastructure now over it, especially since you have access to stone.

 

[BalbanesBeoulve]

Yeah, i'd settle and build wonders. Pyramids for sure. Then get construction and send out jumbos and cats.

 

[Kerran]

Yeah, getting the copper/stone should be the target for your first settler. No need to plop down a city in the jungle that we can't chop down until we tech IW, and it could make gilgamesh upset. Maybe we can dog him to keep Augustus in check, his vultures should be able to make the praets pause for a while

About the location ... it's a bit hard when we haven't explored more of the map, but I'd go with immediate advantage rather than long-term utility. If you place the city on the grassland to the east of the hills you keep freshwater bonus, loose defense bonus and pick up a few crappy desert tiles, BUT you can mine the copper right away without having to wait for a border pop. The sooner you get the phalanxes out the better, imo.

 

[beercityhooliga]

I'd plop that city 2W of the copper, and then build up 6 or so axes and go take down Gilgy. He's easy pickin's right now. Then you can backfill the southern city site with the dye/'nanas.

 

[Melon Head]

Very awesome start. 3 seafood + wheat? As a philosophical leader? That's simply amazing. With this start, there are a lot of options. The first, and most obvious, is Pyramids for a SE. I actually don't think that's a great idea. Regardless, the other option includes caste system for massive specialists (I count at least 7 after a lighthouse, at size 11-12) or slavery for whipping about a bajillion things.

The reason I wouldn't go for the pyramids? You're agressive and the surrounding terrain is marginal and you have phalanxes. Take the hammers you'd put into the pyramids and put them into phalanxes again. That's 5-10 phalanxes. That's a captured AI. Build cats, and take a secon AI capitol. That gets you to 5-ish cities and plenty of room to rex as you tech currency and CoL, using your capitol under caste to keep science alive (including lightbulbing). You can afford to slow-build the courthouses instead of whipping them because your best cities will be AI capitols, which are usually on excellent terrain with sufficient hammers. Find the nearest 2 AI's. If they're gilgamesh or caesar, reconsider the 'mids and tech quickly to CS/machinery for maces. Otherwise kill them all.

Too many wonders will just slow you down out of the gate. Al demands a fast start!.

Also, the 'mids aren't great given the RPC restrictions. The big boon of the 'mids is representation, and we're prohibited from running it, as Al prefers police state. The extra production is certainly worth it (it'd be worth looking at what size of an army is needed to recoup the pyramids hammers, given the stone bonus. 225 hammers after stone on normal speed, 35 hammers/axe. with the 50% discount the mids save you 12 hammers/axeman. Means if you're building more than ~20 axes before you attack someone, the pyramids are worth it. Since I doubt that'd be the case, I'd rather just build the 6 axes that the pyramids will cost you, and go take a capitol with them.

Police state will also deny us hereditary rule, and with h. rule and our capitol, you can leverage the extra food and caste system for mega specialists earlier in the game than would otherwise be possible. This will give the extra-large army something to do in peace-time. It'll also keep gilgamesh, genghis, and caesar from DoW'ing since you'll have extra power rating from the police troops.

 

[paulthebug]

I counsel settling your 2nd city toward the southern copper site, and rush Gilga capital. I doubt there is another source of copper nearby and I don’t think he would have enough time for iron working. Enemy capital is always good to take. Hopefully he has already built the Stonehenge or GW for you.

Ignore all early wonders! Big Al was a Macedonian, sort of like a semi-barbarian then, go capture your Athens, Babylon, Uruk, etc with all the wonders in them…

Al’s UU expires early. Better utilize it 100%.

 

[CivCorpse]

Settle one west of the northern bronze. With all 4 food resources you can crank out another settler soon to grab the jumbos. I setteld one west of the cows in my shadow game because it meshes perfectly with the BFC of Athens and is very cottagable. No fresh water for health but on pangea going war happy, late game health should not be an issue since the game should be over by then. GET THE MIDS. With The stone you can you can get it 1/2 price. And with the corn you can work all three mined hills plus one forest plains. That is 13 hammers per turn. Mids are 750 minus 120 for the 4 forests you can chop and still have one forested plains. That is 49 turns for the mids. On marathon 49 turns is a breeze. The other cities can build Phalanxes. The jumbo city works the jumbos,cows and plains hill for some nice production. And the northern city works the cows, stone and copper. Worry about getting out the second settler before a barracks in athens. You don't want gilgamesh to box you in.
If the chinese are close. Go for them first before they get to their UU. Then Gilgamesh. If you delay Gilgamesh, his UU will become obsolete. Regardless of your first victim, get those mids and let philosophical Al rock with rep. IW should be a priority to start developing the jumbo's jungle area.
I would forget about stonehenge and the great wall. With two close neighbors you won't have many cities to benefit from it and captured cities are a one pop whip for a monument. Cultural battles are won with troops. Chinese pavilions and gilgamesh creative beat moniuments. And on Pangea, barbs are almost a nonissue unless you're near the tundra. Which it looks like you're not.
Kill Big Al Kill......revenge for the other dead Al's

 

[CivCorpse]

Very awesome start. 3 seafood + wheat? As a philosophical leader? That's simply amazing. With this start, there are a lot of options. The first, and most obvious, is Pyramids for a SE. I actually don't think that's a great idea. Regardless, the other option includes caste system for massive specialists (I count at least 7 after a lighthouse, at size 11-12) or slavery for whipping about a bajillion things.

The reason I wouldn't go for the pyramids? You're agressive and the surrounding terrain is marginal and you have phalanxes. Take the hammers you'd put into the pyramids and put them into phalanxes again. That's 5-10 phalanxes. That's a captured AI. Build cats, and take a secon AI capitol. That gets you to 5-ish cities and plenty of room to rex as you tech currency and CoL, using your capitol under caste to keep science alive (including lightbulbing). You can afford to slow-build the courthouses instead of whipping them because your best cities will be AI capitols, which are usually on excellent terrain with sufficient hammers. Find the nearest 2 AI's. If they're gilgamesh or caesar, reconsider the 'mids and tech quickly to CS/machinery for maces. Otherwise kill them all.
With your plan, Al must research a lot of expensive techs with some crappy land for generating commerce early. Stone city will probably always be a food poor cash drain, and a commerce city to the south will take a while to clear jungle and cottages to mature. Plus the drain from troop maintenance and conquered civs. This is marathon speed....rushes can really cripple your economy. Just ask Big Al act 2.
Too many wonders will just slow you down out of the gate. Al demands a fast start!.

Also, the 'mids aren't great given the RPC restrictions. The big boon of the 'mids is representation, and we're prohibited from running it, as Al prefers police state. The extra production is certainly worth it (it'd be worth looking at what size of an army is needed to recoup the pyramids hammers, given the stone bonus. 225 hammers after stone on normal speed, 35 hammers/axe. with the 50% discount the mids save you 12 hammers/axeman. Means if you're building more than ~20 axes before you attack someone, the pyramids are worth it. Since I doubt that'd be the case, I'd rather just build the 6 axes that the pyramids will cost you, and go take a capitol with them.

Police state will also deny us hereditary rule, and with h. rule and our capitol, you can leverage the extra food and caste system for mega specialists earlier in the game than would otherwise be possible. This will give the extra-large army something to do in peace-time. It'll also keep gilgamesh, genghis, and caesar from DoW'ing since you'll have extra power rating from the police troops.

The RPC rules do not forbid representation. They encourage police state but do not require it like they do Theocracy and Vassalage. The Mids also open up police state quite early and also grant HR if you want to go that route. With +3 happy from rep, +2 happy from the odeon, and one from thejumbos. that is pop 11 in the capital,. With the corn and three seafood. The capital can run 7 specialists at construction. That is pretty good early on. And it is assuming we don't a religion or another happy resource. It also denys the AI the benefits of the pyramids. Al did the early phalanx thing last game and wrecked his economy. He can still produce mass phalanxes from the other two cities while building the mids. That way he can get some decent science even with the slider fairly low.
With just the plains hill, jumbos and cows the south east city can produce a phalanx every 10 turns, the copper city with the stone/copper/cows can produce one every 6 1/2 turn. 50 turns for the mids equals 13 phalanxes AND the mids. We can then take cities while using scientists to research CoL and currency.

 

[Killroyan]

Wonders??? WONDERS?????? Big AL is a warmonger. He doesn't allow other people to live on his lands!!! Gilgamesh is way too close for comfort. Get the northern copper first. Only SH is an option if you ask me. After that it is spamming phalanx and elimination Gilga which will propably get the southern copper (thank you for that city Gilga) and then get his capital.

 

[grandad1982]

Stone the crows, you've got stone! Its also a fair cop(per)! This really is a lush little start!

I'd go 2W of the copper as you pick up an extra grassland tile, lose a useless desert tile, and gain a marginaly less usless coast tile.

Also I'm not so sure about Stonehenge. Before you start the mids I'd rather get a 3rd settler out quikley. I'd maybe settle him 1S of the mountian dye to stop Gilga getting that copper. Of course with a bit more exploration a better site may pop up!

I wonder if there's any horses in your imediate sttling area? That would really be make this start shine! Sorry vultures my chariots want a quite word...

 

[DrJambo]

If this was on Emperor I'd be seriously worried. Those are some pretty strong AIs you're up against. Both Augustus and Sulieman get fairly impressive armies and Gilgamesh and Qin are both protective which will cause you headaches taking their cities. Plus AI creative civs tend to do very well in general. In fact, one of my best games was as Zara Yaqob.

Is this will Agg AI?

 

[madscientist]

All good advice!

A few clarifications, police state is preferred but not required. Vassalage and theocracy are required.

Stone with a Phil leader seams like a no brainer for Pyramids. With so much food in teh capital I think it's foolish to not try and get the pyramids for a solid SE.

Al is aggressive. so his Phalynx which can start with Shock beat Summerian Vultures plus are not succeptible to chariots. Remember Jumbos take a long time to tech but they are one of the few counters to Roamn Prats.

As far as the leaders, I agree they are all very tough and well spread out as far as abilities. Three creative leaders and 2 protective make them tough nuts to crack. Suliman REX's well with Imperialistic and uses the Phil trait very well. The icing is one War-monger who can mess things up.

I think an early rush of GILG while building the Pyramids is realistic. But I think teh key will be how the religious aspects play out and who Khan hits first.

 

[Groogaroo]

A strong start but plenty of tough AI's to worry about. If Gilgamesh is your first target takeing him out sooner is definatley a good idea, he has Jumbo's too and will have copper soon aswell.

If I was going to take out Gilg early, as in nowish, I would settle directly on top of his copper just to stop him getting it, would make a naff city but without those pesky vultures he will be much easier to take out.

The northern city is a no brainer and you should settle here if you want to wait a bit longer, build the mid's. I don't know if you can realistically build the mids and prep for war?

I really want Al to succeed this time, If he doesn't then Pericles has pretty much already won the challenge over peace and war.

 

[IagoAlberto]

I second or third settling on the hills 2W of the copper, this is the best city we can get for now. If we settle near the southern copper we are going to get massive pressure from gilga. If we can settle that spot with our second settle by all means do so, but we need that stone and copper post haste!

As far as the pyramids go, Al is gonna need them in this game to keep up tech wise, if only to ensure his phalanx don't get massacred by crossbow's and maces. I am just in the process of finishing up a monarch conquest game with Al where I had the pyramids and I can definately say that I would not have had the needed techs to win had it not been for the mid's.

 

[Xurr]

Settle the first settler where your warrior is on the grass hill to grab the copper, stone and cows. Chop out a second settler fast and settle 1N1W of the copper Near Gilg. If that prevents gilg from getting any copper rush him before he can get Iron.