Role Play Challenge: GREED THREE!!!
- Thread starter madscientist
- Start date
Hi MadScientist,
Long time lurker, first time poster. I've just finished reading all your RPC games (and consequently now have nothing to do while at work) and was thinking maybe in a future game you could get Civ4's resident alien back to his home planet. A space race win for Sury, and I'm sure you can come up with plenty of RPC rules to make it interesting. Maybe limiting contact with humans? Could be fun to watch.
Anyway, keep up the good work, it's helped my Civ playing so much, as well as helping all these hours at work go by faster. Cheers.
Long time lurker, first time poster. I've just finished reading all your RPC games (and consequently now have nothing to do while at work) and was thinking maybe in a future game you could get Civ4's resident alien back to his home planet. A space race win for Sury, and I'm sure you can come up with plenty of RPC rules to make it interesting. Maybe limiting contact with humans? Could be fun to watch.
Anyway, keep up the good work, it's helped my Civ playing so much, as well as helping all these hours at work go by faster. Cheers.
Joshua368
Warmongering builder
- Joined
- Jun 12, 2008
- Messages
- 3,072
I'm pretty sure there was some suggestions for a bizarro match with Sury versus seven or so other Surys on a torrorial map. That should be interesting if he takes it.
madscientist
RPC Supergenius
Aaran, thanks for reading all the RPCs by myself, hope you enjoyed them all! Please participate in the poll which is in my signature although it does not have the most recent ones.
Yes, I am planning an RPC with Freak Sury on a fantasy map amongst clones of Sury the Freak. He must preferably win a peace race to go home to earth or destroy all the other Surys and stay where he is. It's coming up soon, within the next 3.
Update for GREED coming. An interesting choice and a disappointment to end the segment.
madscientist
RPC Supergenius
GREED THREE!!! PArt IV
OK, moving along. As promised the focus is to eliminate the BIG problem while keeping the back-stabber, well, off my back!
Let's start techpath: CoL/Monarchy/Fuedalism/Metal Casting/start CS. Don't worry, there are alot of fillin trades.
First a pleasent surprise.
Wow, after teching CoL we founded our very own religion. Mansa is trying to figure out how to pop a Great Prophet for all that gold from the shrine!!!!
But first things first.
First a trade with MONTY
Who immediately responds with
Gotta love Monty!
But no fear, the grand dame will give us this for CoL
We also asked Peter to attack Monty which he did for free!!!!!
On a defensive war wegot a second GG which we settled in Timbuktu
With great angwish and heart wrenching, we broke a RPC rule
I know I know, But this is survival and we certainly are NOT going to be getting any corps founded fighting MONTY for for several thousand years. GREED involves a little foresight also.
And after a very long agonizing time we popped out FIRST GP
Unfortunately we have to keep him for one of the science corps
Peter and Isabella both took Aztec cities and time for us to move
We actually caught up enough in tech to offer something to Peter
My view on the RPC is to play up the Mansa Musa role to the max, which means trading for tech from any and all!!!! As long as it doesn't cost us gold.
Another trade
And the first addition to Mali cuortesy of the Axtec empire
Was quite a fight too taking longbows on a hill out with swords.
I will comment on Horse Archers here, they are quite awesome and I have found new respect for them after reading that other post on flanking damage. I have pretty much using the flanking promotions and using them as disposable attack units that are surviving 50% of the time. Great for eliminating catapult threats and using them as can openers.
Well, we quickly regroup and send our stack south, greedily looking for that Buddhist holy city!!!
Isabella has been doing some damage here as the defenses were already broken down.
Not looking to miss out here on such a plum of a prize, we attack immediately with cats and
We have the AZTEC capital AND the Buddhist Holy city.
Now for the disappointment.
MONTY the idot has NOT built the shrine!!!!! Mansa was devastated by this and refused to play for moment. So I saved here but not before
OK, I have NOT accepted this deal YET!!! The question is do we want Monty as a vassal????? Peace is a no brainer for aesthetics (how can Musa pass a free tech up) but do we want to end the war, or let Isabella beat up on him some more. My guess is that he vassals to either Peter or Isabella. If he vassals to Isabella it makes her stronger, if he somehow vassals to Peter after we get peace. Peter has already declared peace with Monty, so he would have to start a war war with isabella to get Monty as a Vassal.
So there we have it
A big disappointment that we have NO BUddhist shrine.
But Essentially Montezuma has been defeated, just a matter of what to do with him.
OK, moving along. As promised the focus is to eliminate the BIG problem while keeping the back-stabber, well, off my back!
Let's start techpath: CoL/Monarchy/Fuedalism/Metal Casting/start CS. Don't worry, there are alot of fillin trades.
First a pleasent surprise.
Wow, after teching CoL we founded our very own religion. Mansa is trying to figure out how to pop a Great Prophet for all that gold from the shrine!!!!
But first things first.
First a trade with MONTY
Who immediately responds with
Gotta love Monty!
But no fear, the grand dame will give us this for CoL
We also asked Peter to attack Monty which he did for free!!!!!
On a defensive war wegot a second GG which we settled in Timbuktu
With great angwish and heart wrenching, we broke a RPC rule
I know I know, But this is survival and we certainly are NOT going to be getting any corps founded fighting MONTY for for several thousand years. GREED involves a little foresight also.
And after a very long agonizing time we popped out FIRST GP
Unfortunately we have to keep him for one of the science corps
Peter and Isabella both took Aztec cities and time for us to move
We actually caught up enough in tech to offer something to Peter
My view on the RPC is to play up the Mansa Musa role to the max, which means trading for tech from any and all!!!! As long as it doesn't cost us gold.
Another trade
And the first addition to Mali cuortesy of the Axtec empire
Was quite a fight too taking longbows on a hill out with swords.
I will comment on Horse Archers here, they are quite awesome and I have found new respect for them after reading that other post on flanking damage. I have pretty much using the flanking promotions and using them as disposable attack units that are surviving 50% of the time. Great for eliminating catapult threats and using them as can openers.
Well, we quickly regroup and send our stack south, greedily looking for that Buddhist holy city!!!
Isabella has been doing some damage here as the defenses were already broken down.
Not looking to miss out here on such a plum of a prize, we attack immediately with cats and
We have the AZTEC capital AND the Buddhist Holy city.
Now for the disappointment.
MONTY the idot has NOT built the shrine!!!!! Mansa was devastated by this and refused to play for moment. So I saved here but not before
OK, I have NOT accepted this deal YET!!! The question is do we want Monty as a vassal????? Peace is a no brainer for aesthetics (how can Musa pass a free tech up) but do we want to end the war, or let Isabella beat up on him some more. My guess is that he vassals to either Peter or Isabella. If he vassals to Isabella it makes her stronger, if he somehow vassals to Peter after we get peace. Peter has already declared peace with Monty, so he would have to start a war war with isabella to get Monty as a Vassal.
So there we have it
A big disappointment that we have NO BUddhist shrine.
But Essentially Montezuma has been defeated, just a matter of what to do with him.
Joshua368
Warmongering builder
- Joined
- Jun 12, 2008
- Messages
- 3,072
If you just take peace he'll probably still bug you even though he's severely crippled, I'd say take capitulation, the pros outweigh the cons. The other option would be to wipe him out altogether, if you think you can finish him before he capitulates to someone else.
Kev
Hired Goon
Monte can be a nice attack dog if you feed him well, but keep in mind the diplo hit you might incur from taking him on as vassal. With three cities he won't really provide much unless you plan to gift some cities back or take on Peter or Liz and return the cities they took.
I think I'd take the peace deal and let the others keep at fighting for a while - unless you would look to take another city yourself to relieve some cultural pressure on your new cities.
I'd say later that Peter would make a better vassal and can tech some items for you, but you'll have to beware vassals in general. If one of your vassals builds a corporation you'd have to find some creative way to get it from them...
I think I'd take the peace deal and let the others keep at fighting for a while - unless you would look to take another city yourself to relieve some cultural pressure on your new cities.
I'd say later that Peter would make a better vassal and can tech some items for you, but you'll have to beware vassals in general. If one of your vassals builds a corporation you'd have to find some creative way to get it from them...
No concentrating on music yet to get the Great artist? This one is going to be hard to get. Too bad of the high level here otherwise the free scientist of fission would definitely prefered over the one you are saving now for so long 
About the question wether you want Monty as a vasal or not. He has only 3 cities left and no extra techs or cash .Get peace, build up some more strength and take the last 3 cities from him. And hope he doesn't vasal to lizzy.
About the question wether you want Monty as a vasal or not. He has only 3 cities left and no extra techs or cash .Get peace, build up some more strength and take the last 3 cities from him. And hope he doesn't vasal to lizzy.
madscientist
RPC Supergenius
No concentrating on music yet to get the Great artist? This one is going to be hard to get. Too bad of the high level here otherwise the free scientist of fission would definitely prefered over the one you are saving now for so long
About the question wether you want Monty as a vasal or not. He has only 3 cities left and no extra techs or cash .Get peace, build up some more strength and take the last 3 cities from him. And hope he doesn't vasal to lizzy.
Hmmm, unless Music can sooth the savage Aztec I think survival is mor eimportant at the moment. You are correct about the free Great Artist, as well as the free GS/GE/GM at Physics/Fussion/Economics!
Also I have not mentioned but GGs are popping out all over the place overseas, must be an interesting place.
Bleys
Deity
I think bribery into war is actually a solid GREED tactic! Perhaps you should even make it one, since its so slimey and underhanded, heh.
Shadowing this one a bit myself, since the start looked so interesting with a FIN leader (rivers, yum!). Its nice having Izzy and Monty next to each other, so easy to play them off against each other in true-blue corporate raider fashion!
Shadowing this one a bit myself, since the start looked so interesting with a FIN leader (rivers, yum!). Its nice having Izzy and Monty next to each other, so easy to play them off against each other in true-blue corporate raider fashion!
He only has 3 cities left, you will suffer a diplomatic hit with Izzy for having a vassal she does not like, This drops you to "pleased" and WFYABTA will kick in. That and he will send spies against you like a little punk all game.
I don't really like having vassals on my starting continent. As long as you and issy are at war with him, Peter would be a crazy mad russian to take him as a vassal.
I would just eradicate him, and then prepare to eradicate the others. Whole continent to oneself is greedy enough, right?
I would just eradicate him, and then prepare to eradicate the others. Whole continent to oneself is greedy enough, right?
NintendoTogepi
Noble Pacifist
Don't vassal him, he'll be nothing but a pain.
BalbanesBeoulve
Emperor
- Joined
- Jan 6, 2008
- Messages
- 1,060
Finish Him.
madscientist
RPC Supergenius
Update coming! Peaceful round and we did not vassal Monty, Isabella did. Things looking up, need some suggestion on how to proceed after getting to a certain point.
madscientist
RPC Supergenius
GReed THREE!!!: Part V
OK, the standard tech and infrastructure phase leading to the liberalism race here.
First thing, we finished dealing with Monty.
We are tired of this trash, we have no need nor do we want him as a vassal.
Techpath went: Civil Service/Machinery (we simply needed the military techs)/Literature (getting the National Epic early is more important)/Paper/Education/Philosophy/liberalism and save!
After CS we changed civics
And proceeded to build the national epic in the capital.
We dropped our last city
And although we have room for more along the shores, I want a consistent and predictable science slider considering the RPC limitations.
I should say that Monty did not vassal to Isabella for peace. He vassaled later voluntarily as far as I can see. Means he can break away and be trouble later. Perhaps he vassaled after I demanded gold from him later, damned coward.
Also we proceeded to build enough CGII longbows to supply adequate defense and cottaged alot of land while building up our cities infrastructure.
At this point we have a Buddhist lovefest going on here. Fear not, GREEDDDDDDD shall presevere!!! I plan on taking the continent with rifles. So far power numbers are pretty close.
The AP rears it's head which is fine as we can build temples at double speed for the +2 hammer bonus!
Peter got control as I voted for him, viewing him as the main threat.
If you notice the BUG mod screen, you will see that power numbers are fairly equal between us and Issabella with Peter a little higher. Good not maniacs brewing.
We popped our second GP, a combination of the pyramids and the mint;'s engineer has helped us
We set Timbuktu to run just merchants for the GM and to push the science slider up.
Once we have education and halfway through liberalism we start being a little more daring in trading, as we are ALOT behind, but no fear. I cna also see Peter's research and he's going after the free GM (HEY we can't have it all).
Always glad to get theocracy to make Issabella happy. By the way, Isabella has founded Christianity, and MAY have the shrine (as Mansa leers over at the very ripe and vulnerable Isabella, oh what a shrine she has indeed)!
Peter did not have that mush to offer as he was partway through it. Still GOLD is GOLD!!!
We got a nice random event
Pikes with free shock!!! Between them and shield melee we can have some strong mideival units to go with our eventual rifles!!!! Mansa Musa'a eyes glitter with all that land to acquire, but not just yet. Patience!!!!
OK, we got another GP, this time a GM!!
OK, so far we have a GS, GE, GM stocked away for corps!!!!! I will beeline Physics for the free GS, probably force out a GM next. The last GE we may have to wait until Fussion. That leaves a GA, which we may need to force out. Perhaps that former northern Barb city can be a good NP/GT city to try and pop out one GA from there.
Now, the former Aztecia capital did not have too much culture pressure. And we want to keep it that way. Therefore we built
There. That +2 beakers per Buddhist building will help make up for the lower science slider.
We then finally get
Given the criteria on using GS's and thus not bulbing Printing Press, we took it for free from Liberalism.
And after switching civics.
Great CE civics! Plus representation! Thoecracy to start building up a strong army.
Mansa being the true greedy bastard and techwhore couldn't wait to unload liberalism.
Actually pretty damned good techs! And gold, almost as good as money!.
We saved here. Tech situation
Isabella has Astronomy, so I started teching gunpowder.
A view of the sourthen map, showing Isabella's limited lands.
And Peter's
Niether look particularly tough to take out.
Our cities
OK, where to go from here.
1) We have optics, so I say we launch caravels and see who can we can sheat, I mean trade with.
2) Tech: a strong push to rifling: gunpowder/banking. replacable part/rifling.
3) We start taking the entire continent with our rifles!
Alteration to the RPC guidelines: While not in teh opening post the idea of unit upgrades with cash came up. We have ALOT of CR II and III swords! I see no reason not to upgrade these units. It's all in the interest of GREED and getting more land!
OK, the standard tech and infrastructure phase leading to the liberalism race here.
First thing, we finished dealing with Monty.
We are tired of this trash, we have no need nor do we want him as a vassal.
Techpath went: Civil Service/Machinery (we simply needed the military techs)/Literature (getting the National Epic early is more important)/Paper/Education/Philosophy/liberalism and save!
After CS we changed civics
And proceeded to build the national epic in the capital.
We dropped our last city
And although we have room for more along the shores, I want a consistent and predictable science slider considering the RPC limitations.
I should say that Monty did not vassal to Isabella for peace. He vassaled later voluntarily as far as I can see. Means he can break away and be trouble later. Perhaps he vassaled after I demanded gold from him later, damned coward.
Also we proceeded to build enough CGII longbows to supply adequate defense and cottaged alot of land while building up our cities infrastructure.
At this point we have a Buddhist lovefest going on here. Fear not, GREEDDDDDDD shall presevere!!! I plan on taking the continent with rifles. So far power numbers are pretty close.
The AP rears it's head which is fine as we can build temples at double speed for the +2 hammer bonus!
Peter got control as I voted for him, viewing him as the main threat.
If you notice the BUG mod screen, you will see that power numbers are fairly equal between us and Issabella with Peter a little higher. Good not maniacs brewing.
We popped our second GP, a combination of the pyramids and the mint;'s engineer has helped us
We set Timbuktu to run just merchants for the GM and to push the science slider up.
Once we have education and halfway through liberalism we start being a little more daring in trading, as we are ALOT behind, but no fear. I cna also see Peter's research and he's going after the free GM (HEY we can't have it all).
Always glad to get theocracy to make Issabella happy. By the way, Isabella has founded Christianity, and MAY have the shrine (as Mansa leers over at the very ripe and vulnerable Isabella, oh what a shrine she has indeed)!
Peter did not have that mush to offer as he was partway through it. Still GOLD is GOLD!!!
We got a nice random event
Pikes with free shock!!! Between them and shield melee we can have some strong mideival units to go with our eventual rifles!!!! Mansa Musa'a eyes glitter with all that land to acquire, but not just yet. Patience!!!!
OK, we got another GP, this time a GM!!
OK, so far we have a GS, GE, GM stocked away for corps!!!!! I will beeline Physics for the free GS, probably force out a GM next. The last GE we may have to wait until Fussion. That leaves a GA, which we may need to force out. Perhaps that former northern Barb city can be a good NP/GT city to try and pop out one GA from there.
Now, the former Aztecia capital did not have too much culture pressure. And we want to keep it that way. Therefore we built
There. That +2 beakers per Buddhist building will help make up for the lower science slider.
We then finally get
Given the criteria on using GS's and thus not bulbing Printing Press, we took it for free from Liberalism.
And after switching civics.
Great CE civics! Plus representation! Thoecracy to start building up a strong army.
Mansa being the true greedy bastard and techwhore couldn't wait to unload liberalism.
Actually pretty damned good techs! And gold, almost as good as money!.
We saved here. Tech situation
Isabella has Astronomy, so I started teching gunpowder.
A view of the sourthen map, showing Isabella's limited lands.
And Peter's
Niether look particularly tough to take out.
Our cities
OK, where to go from here.
1) We have optics, so I say we launch caravels and see who can we can sheat, I mean trade with.
2) Tech: a strong push to rifling: gunpowder/banking. replacable part/rifling.
3) We start taking the entire continent with our rifles!
Alteration to the RPC guidelines: While not in teh opening post the idea of unit upgrades with cash came up. We have ALOT of CR II and III swords! I see no reason not to upgrade these units. It's all in the interest of GREED and getting more land!
D_almighty
Wanna-be Deity
- Joined
- Mar 14, 2008
- Messages
- 135
You're playing brilliantly Mad, AND thanks to your very good RPCs, I'm now up to Monarch myself! =)
Just a couple of points.
Civics: You have 8 towns plus 1 that will become a town in 1 turn. That means an extra 18 commerce from Free speech. The capital has 48 base commerce, so you would get 24 extra commerce from Bureaucracy Plus the hammer bonus. Beauracracy cost a little more but the hammers make up the differenece. Also you're in Caste System but not running any extra specialists. Perhaps slavery to whip some buildings in hammer poor cities. And OR since you are not building units in any cities besides Mecca. Perhaps even serfdom for a boost in developing your new lands. Though a switch to U.S. to rush buy some buildings with all that gold might be in order, since you're not really pushing the Specialists.
Cities: Niani needs a courthouse and a university more than a monastary. Gao is building a castle when it needs to start the university. A castle will provide 1 commerce per turn and.5 eps. Not a good hammer investment. all the AI are in Merc, maybe peter will switch out to Free Market after researching econ. If you farm the plains E or 2e of Gao it will irrigate your wheat and help the city grow. Tthe aztec capital...techalechatitititlan or whatever it is should be farmed over and workshopped. It has two settled GGs and the cottages are really young so it will be a couple hundred turns before they are towns. The Globe would help with the culture fight and the corn and fish make it a nice drafting city. Once you have the Pentagon it can draft 2promo units. Timbuktu should be farmed, mined and workshopped. it doesn't have the food capaicity to work it's BFC and won't until Sids, and maybe not even then. Niani is also food poor and production rich. Consider farming and mining. Later research can come from the fertile green lands of Montezuma. But without more cities to produce troops, you won't be able to take them.
Farm the plains1W of Kumbla's rice to spread the irrigation.
Tech path should be banking first if you are going to stay in rep. Eleven cities means 33 extra raw beakers. Sixty-six if you run scientists. Since all your cities have libraries that is 82 beakers per turn. Or a 25% increase in science. And it goes up as you get universities and observatories. It easily replaces lost beakers for converting Niani and Timbuktu into production cities. If you research banking it cuts the research time for gunpowder to about 9 turns and also makes replacable parts cheaper as well. And rifling etc etc etc.
When you DoW Monty it might drop you to pleased with peter since he is friendly with both monty and izzy. I would make plans for knocking off Peter. Taking out monty means you have a long exposed border with ole Pete. Consider building just maces and promoting them to rifles. They are cheaper to promote than pikes and much much cheaper to promote than swords. I would disband the swords that are CR2 and below. as well as every other units you are keeping for garrison duty. Power rating is not important just yet as you are friendly with both izzy and peter so they won't DoW. And they are costing you precious gold. MMMmm@ gold.
Civics: You have 8 towns plus 1 that will become a town in 1 turn. That means an extra 18 commerce from Free speech. The capital has 48 base commerce, so you would get 24 extra commerce from Bureaucracy Plus the hammer bonus. Beauracracy cost a little more but the hammers make up the differenece. Also you're in Caste System but not running any extra specialists. Perhaps slavery to whip some buildings in hammer poor cities. And OR since you are not building units in any cities besides Mecca. Perhaps even serfdom for a boost in developing your new lands. Though a switch to U.S. to rush buy some buildings with all that gold might be in order, since you're not really pushing the Specialists.
Cities: Niani needs a courthouse and a university more than a monastary. Gao is building a castle when it needs to start the university. A castle will provide 1 commerce per turn and.5 eps. Not a good hammer investment. all the AI are in Merc, maybe peter will switch out to Free Market after researching econ. If you farm the plains E or 2e of Gao it will irrigate your wheat and help the city grow. Tthe aztec capital...techalechatitititlan or whatever it is should be farmed over and workshopped. It has two settled GGs and the cottages are really young so it will be a couple hundred turns before they are towns. The Globe would help with the culture fight and the corn and fish make it a nice drafting city. Once you have the Pentagon it can draft 2promo units. Timbuktu should be farmed, mined and workshopped. it doesn't have the food capaicity to work it's BFC and won't until Sids, and maybe not even then. Niani is also food poor and production rich. Consider farming and mining. Later research can come from the fertile green lands of Montezuma. But without more cities to produce troops, you won't be able to take them.
Farm the plains1W of Kumbla's rice to spread the irrigation.
Tech path should be banking first if you are going to stay in rep. Eleven cities means 33 extra raw beakers. Sixty-six if you run scientists. Since all your cities have libraries that is 82 beakers per turn. Or a 25% increase in science. And it goes up as you get universities and observatories. It easily replaces lost beakers for converting Niani and Timbuktu into production cities. If you research banking it cuts the research time for gunpowder to about 9 turns and also makes replacable parts cheaper as well. And rifling etc etc etc.
When you DoW Monty it might drop you to pleased with peter since he is friendly with both monty and izzy. I would make plans for knocking off Peter. Taking out monty means you have a long exposed border with ole Pete. Consider building just maces and promoting them to rifles. They are cheaper to promote than pikes and much much cheaper to promote than swords. I would disband the swords that are CR2 and below. as well as every other units you are keeping for garrison duty. Power rating is not important just yet as you are friendly with both izzy and peter so they won't DoW. And they are costing you precious gold. MMMmm@ gold.
