ROTQM13: Rolling Over The Quintet's Magic

[PPQ_Purple]

That's what I was thinking as well. I'll lay some signs later today when I get to playing.

This said, given how they are so close to the clowns and bunched together is it really a smart idea to go after them?

Personally I was thinking of maybe just blocking the south off and going after the Ljosafar instead. The plan being to wait until the Mercurian gate is done and than march to take their cities and gift them to the Mercurians. Instant empire for our ally.

 

[Tinadafish]

The clowns are weak, the dark elves have an archmage hero unit running about that could get dangerous very quickly.

 

[PPQ_Purple]

Point taken. Also are puppet states enabled? If so do you think we should puppet one or both?
And I am not talking about vassaling but the other game option.

 

[PPQ_Purple]

Just starting the game now. Speaking of which, I think we might want to consider going for the Altar of Lunoar for the sweet bonus XP to disciple units. Assuming that is not lore breaking for our game.

 

[King Bulrush]

Ok, here is my quick contribution to the war council on why I favour cautious advance.
Why wait for the Mercurians?
- they start with a reasonably powerful army (Angels are still very good units at the start of the game) and a Hero
- we can recylce most if not all of our units through them (and some of the enemy units too - we know some Amurites follow Killmorph so they are eligible to be reborn as angels too)
- they start with Iron from the palace which we can use to boost the strength of our units (and bring our axemen on par with Amurite swordsmen)
- Once they spawn they stand a very good chance of being able to hold our southeastern flank all by themselves. (Maybe we can gift them 1-2 settlers or even cities to speed up their expansion but overall I think they can be left to their own devices to hold the line there. This means that we will be able to focus on other directions
- Also we can give them some enemy cities which are too costly to be administered by us directly (Once we can capture some)

By the way: if puppets are enabled we definitely want puppets (we can direct their research so we can still enforce our houserules on them, I think)

Why major offensives now are problematic:
- Bannor civ heavily favours early building and late game expansion (we want to have lots of towns to spawn demagogues)
- At this point we can't even fire our worldspell, and even if we could it wouldn't be very profitable
- There is still a lot of unclaimed and undevelloped land between us an most enemy cities. Any campaigns we launch is going to be lengthy and involve lots of slow moving through neutral or enemy land, with the associated maintenance costs. We would need a couple of workers to accompany our armies and build roads (and also castles to use as FOBs). Or we could sit and wait for the AI to pay for the infrastructure.

What strategy I propose:
- wait for Mercurians to secure southeaster flank
- redeploy army to south & southwest
- take Spilan, Utigar and found city at B1 + fortresses to create a solid line of defense. Hold enemy there
- Found more cities & fully develop land north of that line. This will be our core empire for the rest of the game
- once our land is fully improved, redeploy workers to the south to help with logistics where needed.
- launch major campaign of conquest against one of our southern foes. See how things go from there.

 

[PPQ_Purple]

My time is short and thus shall I be.

First thing first, as I took the save I noticed that we had an army ready to go west and scout into Ljosafar lands. But than a thought hit me.

We know where they are. But we are not yet at war. Their AI is literally not aware of our presence. Which means there are no stacks going at us or even being prepared to go at us. No war plans, no invasion threat, no nothing.

Now we could go and scout them and reveal our self and start that ball rolling. But how about instead we NOT do that and thus extend that grace period we have until after we built a couple forts? That way our armies will be free to sweep south safe in the knowledge that we won't get a slap to the soft bits from that direction right as our entire force is elsewhere.

So I acted on that.

Spoiler Thus the scouting army lead by Valin was told to pull back and stand down. :

Speaking of scouting, the color Purple, blessed it be decided that it might be a good idea to go scout the area around Spilan. Just to see if our meager force up there could take it.

Spoiler Turns out that the army guarding the place is literally giant. As in a giant. :

On the plus side, the southern force had a lot more success running into but a few warriors.

Spoiler Suffice to say, Ulfgar was taken without loss. :

The keen eyed among you will also notice that in that last image there are already archers stationed on the designated castle spots. I took the initiative to fortify those two positions placing 2 archers and a confessor in each. With a worker added to build the actual two castles this should be more than enough to secure our back as the main army advances.

Speaking of which, the main army of catapults is finished with construction. So I took them and started a march south to one of the castle spots.

Spoiler They should arrive just in time to meet up with the force from Ulfgar in that position. :

Spoiler On less fun news Deluoc is on fire. Like literally on fire. Like fires are everywhere. :

However all is not bleak as our eagle scout discovered that the city protected by an army of giant isn't. As in the bloody thing just wondered off and left it unprotected. Thus the western force was immediately ordered to march on the city.

Spoiler No giant any more, just 3 warriors :

And that's my turn. Deluoc is burning, the south is being secured and the western army is marching to take another city. Glory to the color Purple and that Junil dude too.

 

[Ozbenno]

OK, I'm now up and have the save and should be able to play tonight.

Good progress, I'll look towards taking Spilan and fortifying.

 

[Ozbenno]

The dwarf turned to his comrades in arms, nose in the air, and said "Can you smell that?"

"Uh, what?" said the axeman, obviously not smelling anything.

"I know that foul smell, I'd recognise it anywhere. Magic!"

"Magic!" Suddenly the axeman was alot more interested. "We should get word to...."

Before he could finish the sentence Sabathiel appeared in a puff of smoke. "Dudes! Did someone say magic! That's like totally uncool and the subject of our latest HOLY WAR!"

"Uh, yeah this dwarf did."

"Awesome little dude. Have one of these funny cigars I found out near those shining lights. From now on we'll call you Mage Sniffer."

Before anyone could even say "What the holy beep are you talking about" Sabathiel disappeared in another puff of smoke.

"OK Mage Sniffer, let's get down there and take that unholy city."

And so it came to pass but the vile magic user had moved on and could not be found.

I stopped just beyond here as we need to decide our strategy. There was an army on a goto I didn't notice and it has met up with Donal Lugh here

If we wanted to march out, we could raze the small city and move onwards but we would be a long way from home. If we don't attack, we should divert an archer and confessor to Spilan.

What do we think?

 

[Ozbenno]

Roster

Ozbenno >> just played
King Bulrush >> UP NOW
pholkhero >> On Deck
Tinadafish
PPQ Purple

 

[PPQ_Purple]

I think we should maybe invest in a couple warriors to guard those cities we capture before we start off. That way we don't have to deplete our army as we rampage through their lands.

 

[Tinadafish]

Might I recommend training some workers in sludgehome and using them to build forts on the furs to the north, most of our cities have been happiness capped for quite a while and protecting them from bears is a small expense and the escorts could also conquer the barbarian city squatting on the cotton in that direction too.

Edit: OH also I forgot to mention my turn why I was sending Valin's army to fight the lojsalfar, he's just 1 level away from being able to free brigit (though sadly 3 levels away from blitz because he hasn't picked up drill III and IV yet) and I figured he and his soldiers could take anything the summer elves could throw at them

 

[PPQ_Purple]

I figured that it was a scouting expedition. But either way I think it's best we avoid them for now simply because that's one more enemy we'd have on our neck. We can always send Valin down to join the other army.

 

[King Bulrush]

Got it but will play tomorrow. I will wait to see what the consensus is regarding the strategy to follow.

How far do we want to push into Svartalfar lands? I assume that they are a priority target as we have numerous units positioned close enough to strike.
I also assume that the next objective is to raze Pavunar (next to Pristin pass). Donal Lugh's army can reach it in 5 turns even despite the lack of roads. The question is what to do after that? To push further and try to eliminate them completely or to withdraw?

From Spilan we can easily reach the core of the dark elf lands as there are already roads in place. The problem is that our garisson there is quite weak and the city is not connected to the rest of our lands so while it makes for a good launching point for a campaign of conquest, it is hard for us to reinforce it for the moment.
Regarding Valin, I'm not sure he is needed in that area. The Mercurians are due to be summoned in 9 turns and I don't see any enemy forces close enough to disrupt them. So no need for extra defense. Should I push on towards his original objective? or turn back to reinforce the attack on the dark elves (this way he would be closer to Birgit when he hits level 15)?

Also, do we know if puppet states are enabled? And are you ok with creating puppets if we have the chance?

 

[lfgr]

(though sadly 3 levels away from blitz because he hasn't picked up drill III and IV yet)

From the previous screenshots it looks like one of the Svartalfar giants has Orthus' Axe, that would also give blitz if you can capture it.

 

[PPQ_Purple]

How far do we want to push into Svartalfar lands? I assume that they are a priority target as we have numerous units positioned close enough to strike.
I also assume that the next objective is to raze Pavunar (next to Pristin pass). Donal Lugh's army can reach it in 5 turns even despite the lack of roads. The question is what to do after that? To push further and try to eliminate them completely or to withdraw?

Honestly I say we should go in for the kill. Take everything and force them to capitulate before handing some of the cities back preferably. I am not sure if we have the army to do that though. If not just burning them to the ground is my second best option.

From Spilan we can easily reach the core of the dark elf lands as there are already roads in place. The problem is that our garisson there is quite weak and the city is not connected to the rest of our lands so while it makes for a good launching point for a campaign of conquest, it is hard for us to reinforce it for the moment.

Spilan is a dead end if you ask me. It's a good outpost to keep them from climbing up to get us but that's it. I would keep that army there and not move it at all for the time being. We can eventually use them as reinforcements for the main force once said main force climbs down.

Regarding Valin, I'm not sure he is needed in that area. The Mercurians are due to be summoned in 9 turns and I don't see any enemy forces close enough to disrupt them. So no need for extra defense. Should I push on towards his original objective? or turn back to reinforce the attack on the dark elves (this way he would be closer to Birgit when he hits level 15)?

I think we should definitively, 10000% not antagonize the Ljosafar now. We do not need a war on three fronts. I also think we should put at least a minimal garrison on those positions to stop someone from just walking around the mercurians if their AI proves to be stupid and just turtle in the city.

But I am all for sending Valin to meet up with the rest of the army and level there if the Mercurians are that close to completion. But I'd keep the rest of his army there because they are too slow and we need a mobile reserve at least in case someone tries to bypass the mercurians.

So I guess what I am saying is send Valin to join the main army and start the offensive when he arrives.

Also, do we know if puppet states are enabled? And are you ok with creating puppets if we have the chance?

I do not think they are sadly. I think we should have seen it in the city capture popup otherwise.

 

[Ozbenno]

Moving Valin across to the main force is probably a good idea. I did notice he was one level away from rescuing Brigit, so hopefully he can do that soon. Capturing Orthus' Axe would be a boon as well.

Leave the Ljosafar alone is the best play I think, let Basium find them later. There is space for a couple of decent cities if we can squeeze in some settlers somewhere as well as more workers and more military

One thing I forgot to mention, we researched Poisons on my last turn (I inserted an assassin in the capital). Mathematics was already selected. Is this what we want now? Heading towards Engineering would be a boon for war (increase production and movement).

 

[King Bulrush]

Ok, so I started playing my turns.
As decided, I focused on the svartalfalr.
Unfortunately I wasn't off to a good start. The svartalfar sent a very powerfull army towards Spilan, much stronger than we could hope to stop. And to add insult to injury, the fist skirmishes went very badly. Our most experienced hunter (the "Bear Killer") lost attacked an enemy illusionist with 96% odds and lost! After all these years playing I should have gotten used to the AI's cheating at the RNG but it is still as annoying as ever.

Alas Poor Bear Killer. You shall be avenged!

The only upside is that after we destroyed the enemy vanguard (at the cost of our heroic hunter), the rest of the Svartalfar army turned around in the foolish attempt to reinforce Pavu'nar. But it was too late for them. Our forces stormed the city, put the garisson to the sword and razed it to the ground! And in the ruins, we found the axe of Orthus, which I will give to Valin Phanuel so he can go on a skullsplitting rampage until he hits level 15.
Also, I made sure that Donal Lugh killed a drown (undead) so now his recruit ability should have reset. If needed he can be sent back to one of the core cities to recruit.

The downside to this is that the svartalvar army turned back towards Spilan. I decided that the city was untenable so I evacuated it (we only lost one Hawk that was unable to rebase to anywhere else) and take a defensive position in the hills north of the city, where we were safe from tsunamis, and wait for the main army (with the heroes) to come from the south and take the enemy from behind.

In other news, the Mercurians spawned just as two armies from the Balseraphs and the Amurites reached the city.

The result is that on turn 423, two huge battles happened:
- In the west, the Svartalfar after taking Spilan assaulted our defensive position to the north of the city. Our troops were defending a hill behind a river, so the battle was an one-sided slaughter. The entire attacking force was wiped out with no losses of our own.
- In the East, I positioned all our available troops on a hill next to the Mercurian capital and challenged the advancing Amurites to battle, before they could bypass our forces and go for our core cities. The enemy attacked here also, and the battle was even more bloody that the one at Spilan, but this time we took some losses too. Most annoyingly we lost our first asassin that had just reached the frontlines. Now we will have to build some more. Fortunately, most of our army survived. We won the day, kept the hill, and the survivors of the Amurite assault were finished off by the Mercurians.

I played until I retook Spillan (Valin did all the work here) and then saved the game. That's it for now.

EDIT: I realised that maybe I should have included some more screenshots. So I went back to an autosave and took these screenshots to illustrate the situation before the two battles described above.
First, here are the armies facing off as Spilan:

And here is the situation before the battle of Deluoc:

I don't think there is any point in taking screenshots after the battle, since both enemy armies were completely annihilated.

By the way: Amurite swordsmen continue to be challenging opponents because they have iron. Maybe we should withdraw all of our own axemen back to our core and then ask Basium for his iron to upgrade our troops with it.

 

[Ozbenno]

Alas poor Bear Hunter I knew him well. I'm sure Mage Sniffer will avenge you. Remember to divert Valin to grab Brigit once he reaches level 15

Roster

Ozbenno
King Bulrush >> just played
pholkhero >> UP NOW
Tinadafish >> On Deck
PPQ Purple

 

[Tinadafish]

Did you spot hemah or saverous anywhere?

Edit: Just noticed in the screenshots the extremely big brained Svart AI has converted from octopus overlords to fellowship of leaves which means we don't have to worry about these two anymore. I thought AIs only switched to their personality's favourite religion if the religion they were previously following wasn't founded by them.

 

[PPQ_Purple]

Forget iron. It's the numbers on those stacks that scare me.