Ruff05 - Team SG

[ruff_hi]

This is a hot seat game - the basic idea is that you have two or more people at the same location and you all play on the same PC. If you want to play with 4 people playing individual civs, that would be a 'play by email' (pbem) game. We are barstardizing the hot seat concept for use in a SG.

Re Oracle - I'd be going for Civil Service. We have two Industrious civs, so eithe rcould build it. The draw back is that Gandhi should be pumping workers and gifting them to the other civs while Qin should be pumping units. We need to do a bit more fog busting near our cities and put out good 2nd city sites - then we can go CIV hunting .

 

[Conroe]

The draw back is that Gandhi should be pumping workers and gifting them to the other civs

I was under the impression that when a Fast Worker is gifted, it would revert to a normal Worker. If that is the case, then it might be better to have all Workers under Gandhi's control.

I'm going to run a quick WB test to find out ... Nope, I'm wrong. It is still a Fast Worker after being gifted.

 

[hamtastic]

Well, that's pretty nice. Especially since I imagine the AI wouldn't use the team thing that effectively in that way. (I could be wrong though).

What's up with Delhi, anyway? No resources? That's just crazy.

Finally, how does the turn order work? Are all of our turns right in a row, or do the AIs come between them? This matters for enemy healing (so if we're attacking Izzy and her turn comes after one of ours, then we should attack with the person whose turn comes after hers so all of our units attack before her healing.) Any idea about this?

 

[ruff_hi]

I think (!) that the order is Ruff05-1, -2, -3 and then -4 and then the AI Civs. That was one reason I went with the naming convention. Maybe we should keep the (1) part in the names if we rename them back to their leaders.

Delhi has some wheat near the tundra - for some reason it doesn't come out. That city was the hardest to place and in the end I just settled in place and trusted the mapping routines - I was glad when the wheat popped up.

 

[berserks01]

You can probably simulate the hotseat game by having each player play their civ and post the save before ending the turn. It might be slower at the beginning, but as it progresses it should take longer since you're cooperating with each other for every turn. That would make for an interesting sg.

But this current sg is worth lurking as well.

 

[jeejeep]

The civs from the first start would have been infinitely better than the bunch of peaceful morons we have now. We go from three agressives and all ancient age UU's to builder civs, all with medieval or industrial UU's. Oh well, I guess we'll just have to make the best of it.

 

[Ozbenno]

Well this will probably be a long turn with little happening! Rename all the civs. Popped a hut for 33gp, 2 others for 46 and one gave the woodsman II scout more experience (unpromoted).

Research Meditation, Priesthood auto lined up (denied me even picking one thing in my turnset . )

All the AI adopt slavery in 3240BC.

I lost 2 scouts to animals.

Priesthood up next turn, workers due in 1 and 2 turns, except Gandhi, who Mr here, forgot to switch to a worker. Spotted it twice while I was playing the turn of another civ, said "when I get back to Gandhi, I better switch that to a worker" and forgot. Delhi expands to 3 in 3, so whoever takes over switch then.

I'd put up some pictures but nothing happened. Was hoping to find where at least one of the AIs were but didn't even do that!

I leave you with the save (played 9 turns to even it up).

View attachment 132889

 

[ruff_hi]

Roster:
Ruff_Hi
Ozbenno - Mr Forgetful (even worse that me)
Conroe - up
Jeejeep - on deck
Hamtastic

Should we make a detour to get Copper Working? And we found Issabella during my turnset.

 

[Conroe]

Got it -- should be able to play today.

one gave the woodsman II scout more experience (unpromoted).

Does this mean we now have a Level 4 Scout? So where do we want the Heroic Epic?

 

[Conroe]

Currently, everybody is building a Worker (except Gandhi). After the first Worker, do we want Gandhi to build Fast Workers for everybody? Also, I notice we have 0 troops. Not even a lone Warrior. I realize that the AI probably won't attack us this quick, but what about barbs? Shouldn't we be building some kind of token defense?

From the culture map, I can see that Isabella is east of Peter, while Victoria is east of Qin. There is a large lake seperating Moscow and Beijing. It should provide a modicum of defense for our back 40. (well, it would if we had a small guy with a big club)

Priesthood is due in 1 turn. Where do we want to build the Oracle? Beijing, I assume. Do we want to attempt a CS slingshot for the Oracle?

Game Mechanics Question: In a normal SG, we play through the end of turn 10 before passing the save to the next person. How is this supposed to work in a hotseat SG? My inherited save is at the end of Peter-4's turn. I guess that makes sense. I assume I should be playing through the end of the 4th civs turn?

 

[ruff_hi]

Currently, everybody is building a Worker (except Gandhi). After the first Worker, do we want Gandhi to build Fast Workers for everybody? Also, I notice we have 0 troops. Not even a lone Warrior. I realize that the AI probably won't attack us this quick, but what about barbs? Shouldn't we be building some kind of token defense?

From the culture map, I can see that Isabella is east of Peter, while Victoria is east of Qin. There is a large lake seperating Moscow and Beijing. It should provide a modicum of defense for our back 40. (well, it would if we had a small guy with a big club)

Priesthood is due in 1 turn. Where do we want to build the Oracle? Beijing, I assume. Do we want to attempt a CS slingshot for the Oracle?

Game Mechanics Question: In a normal SG, we play through the end of turn 10 before passing the save to the next person. How is this supposed to work in a hotseat SG? My inherited save is at the end of Peter-4's turn. I guess that makes sense. I assume I should be playing through the end of the 4th civs turn?

Well, a warrior or 2 wouldn't hurt I would queue up a warrior after the worker, then put out a settler for our second cities. I think, at that stage, we start building the Oracle using one of the Industious civs for the Civil Service slingshot and have Gandhi build the rest of the civs some workers.

While it is a team game, every civ should (sort of) pay its own way - but having the back civs wonder and commerce with the front civs mainly military.

Re game mechanics - your assumption is the way I played it - so it must be right!

Edit - looking at the save ... I would try and connect our four civs. I know that rivers connect them but what about small lakes? If we had sailing, does that connect them? If so, then Moscow needs a road to the lake and we need a longish road from Gandhi to Qin. Once they are in place (and we have the stone and copper hooked up), we should trade the stone to Gandhi and the copper to Peter.

For Civil Service, we need CoL and Writing (after priesthood). For the oracle build - Qin's city looks like it can produce more hammers than Gandhi (once cows are hooked up) so we might want to build it there (down side is that this is a front line civ). The other wonder we want is the pyramids and stone will be great for that - maybe prepare the road network to assist in that build.

 

[Conroe]

My instructions were fairly simple and straight forward. Start Delhi on a Worker in 3 turns, build some Warriors and a Settler or two would be nice. Oh and then there is that whole Oracle-slingshot thing to do. Sounds great on paper and it probably would have been fine if I had actually put it on paper! The logistics of managing 4 civs simultaneously seems to have eluded me.

Turn 20 (3200 BC)

Peter-4

Turn 21 (3160 BC)

Qin-1

IBT:
Tech learned: Priesthood

Gandhi-2
This game is so far a lot of just pressing Enter. And why are all of the Scouts wounded?

Research begun: Animal Husbandry
Except for Peter, all 3 civs have a pasture resource in the city radius. Plus, we will find where our horses are located. After this, I plan on starting for CoL.

Fun Time Sally-3
The one Scout that I get to move spies a goody hut! Will have to wait for the next turn, though (which seems like an eternity from now).
Research begun: Animal Husbandry

IBT:
Mecca finishes: Worker and resumes the queued up Warrior

Peter-4
Research begun: Animal Husbandry

Turn 22 (3120 BC)

Qin-1
Research begun: Animal Husbandry

Gandhi-2

Fun Time Sally-3
Finally, a Worker to do something. He starts farming the corn ..

And that goody hut that our Level 4 Scout located ...
Tribal village results: experience This is so sad it is funny!
Scout promoted: Guerilla I
Oops! I thought he had enough experience to get to Guerilla II and double hill movement, but he is shy 2xp. Maybe I should go find a forested hill and fight some bears. He can take them!

Peter-4

IBT:
Moscow finishes: Worker and resumes the queued up Warrior

Turn 23 (3080 BC)

Qin-1

IBT:
Beijing finishes: Worker and resumes the queued up Warrior

Gandhi-2

IBT:
Delhi grows: 3

Fun Time Sally-3

IBT:
Mecca finishes: Warrior

Peter-4

Turn 24 (3040 BC)

Qin-1

Gandhi-2

Fun Time Sally-3
Mecca begins: Warrior
I'm sending the Warrior that Mecca just trained to the front lines towards Peter.

Peter-4

IBT:
Moscow finishes: Warrior
While defending, Scout loses to: Barbarian Lion (0.56/2) at 82.7 percent.
It would be nice if the autolog said who's Scout was killed and I neglected to notice the flag color during the combat sequence. It wasn't our super Scout, though. I later learn that it was one of Saladin's Scouts.

Turn 25 (3000 BC)

Qin-1

IBT:
Beijing finishes: Warrior

Gandhi-2
The little guy's Scout spies a goody hut ...
Tribal village results: experience
Just what we needed.

Fun Time Sally-3

Peter-4
Moscow begins: Warrior followed by a Settler, I think.

Turn 26 (2960 BC)

Qin-1
Beijing begins: Warrior followed by a Setter, as well.

Gandhi-2
Uh-Oh! Tokugawa is located to the west of Mecca! And judging from the demographics screen, he has been building some troops!

No wait, the map wraps. Same effect, though, our "back-side" is exposed to Japan.

Fun Time Sally-3
The newly built Warrior that was bound for Russia is recalled to Mecca!

IBT:
Mecca grows: 3

Peter-4

Turn 27 (2920 BC)

Qin-1
Oops! I totally forgot about the Oracle plan last turn.
Beijing begins: The Oracle
If we miss it by 1 turn, ya'll will know who to blame!

Gandhi-2

IBT:
Tech learned: Animal Husbandry

Fun Time Sally-3
Research begun: Writing

Peter-4
Research begun: Writing

Turn 28 (2880 BC)

Qin-1
Beijing has horses inside the city radius.
Research begun: Writing

IBT:
Beijing grows: 3

Gandhi-2
I got a message that Tokugawa's Archer killed our Scout, however, I did not see any combat sequences on the IBT. There might be some bugs in this hotseat setup.
Research begun: Writing
Oh, and Gandhi has horses inside the city radius, as well. Unfortunately, some bozo forgot to queue up a Fast Worker 5 turns ago.
Delhi begins: Fast Worker

Fun Time Sally-3

IBT:
Mecca finishes: Warrior

Peter-4

IBT:
Moscow grows: 3

Turn 29 (2840 BC)

Qin-1

Gandhi-2

Fun Time Sally-3
Mecca begins: Settler

Peter-4

Turn 30 (2800 BC)

Qin-1

Gandhi-2

Fun Time Sally-3

Peter-4

Notes
Writing is due in 5 turns. The Oracle is showing 22 turns, but that will come down once the horses are hooked up.

Delhi is 7 turns away from a Fast Worker. After that, it should probably start on a Settler for the copper NW of Delhi. The copper city will have little food; however, it is probably the quickest way we will get copper hooked up. There is a plains hill next to the copper so that a border expansion is not required.

Mecca is the only city with a Settler in production (due in 9 turns) and has 2 Warriors in the city. We should probably target a stone city with this Settler if we really want to go after the Pyramids.

This is a large map, so I couldn't get all of the land into a single screenshot. But, I wanted to give everybody an idea of where our opponents are located in relation to our civs.

The East:

The West:

And, here is the mini-map (enlarged), should anyone find it useful:

And lastly, the save:

 

[ruff_hi]

Nice turn set and report. Hmm - we have no front court and no back court - seems everyone is on offense. Did you really get the auto-logger to work with this? If so - how? And finally, that scout can kill as many bears as he likes - he will get zero experience from them (max v animals is 5, max v barbs is 10). It also looks like we are close to the circumnavigation bonus!

Roster:
Ruff_Hi
Ozbenno - Mr Forgetful (even worse that me)
Conroe - Also Slightly Forgetful!
Jeejeep - up
Hamtastic - on deck

 

[Conroe]

Did you really get the auto-logger to work with this? If so - how?

Yes, but it is a bit of a pain to use. Since the game is ignoring CustomAssets and only using Assets, I copied the Assets folder to a new folder called RuffAssets. I then copied CustomAssets into RuffAssets. Then when I want to play a hotseat game, I just rename the folders. Remembering to rename them back is a bit of a pain, though.

Oh, and I also modified the logger code to put the civ name in the file. Some things were a bit difficult to understand without that. Let me know if you want a copy of that code. View attachment 133024

And finally, that scout can kill as many bears as he likes - he will get zero experience from them (max v animals is 5, max v barbs is 10).

When I said that, it was actually an attempt at humor. And apparently, not a very good one at that. Bear hunting isn't exactly the most effective use of a wood II scout. Besides, our scout will get that next promotion the next goody hut he pops.

 

[hamtastic]

Looking good on the turns I guess - production does seem slow, though. It's complicated to follow this thing, ya know?

By the way, why do you call the stuff on your compuet Ruffassets? You're not ruff_hi?

 

[Ozbenno]

To stop the IBT battles being unoticed (ie to stop "who killed my scout?"), I changed my options to show enemy moves. It won't show the battle but will show a bear moving onto your scouts tile.

 

[Conroe]

By the way, why do you call the stuff on your compuet Ruffassets? You're not ruff_hi?

Because (1) my CustomAssests folder contains Ruff's Cobbled SG Modpack, and (2) I only need the extra folder because I am playing in Ruff05. Ergo, I named my new folder "RuffAssets".

To stop the IBT battles being unoticed (ie to stop "who killed my scout?"), I changed my options to show enemy moves.

That's not it -- I have both show enemy and show friendly moves turned on. The first battle, I watched it happen. But didn't think to note the flag color of who was fighting the battle. The second time, the battle sequence was not even shown. The scout just disappeared and I got a message that he was killed by Tokugawa. Its the second one that I think may have been a bug. I say this, because there wasn't even a message placed into the autologger IIRC.

 

[ruff_hi]

Yes, but it is a bit of a pain to use. Since the game is ignoring CustomAssets and only using Assets, I copied the Assets folder to a new folder called RuffAssets. I then copied CustomAssets into RuffAssets. Then when I want to play a hotseat game, I just rename the folders. Remembering to rename them back is a bit of a pain, though.

I take it you mean assets under the 'prog files' directory.

Oh, and I also modified the logger code to put the civ name in the file. Some things were a bit difficult to understand without that. Let me know if you want a copy of that code.

Yes please!

When I said that, it was actually an attempt at humor. And apparently, not a very good one at that.

It would have been right on target if posted in the Chaos II & III thread - here, I just thought you didn't know - a stupid assumption on my part. We should promote that scout (have we already done that) and post a screen shot in the 'funny photos' thread.

 

[jeejeep]

Got it, will play tomorrow afternoon or night.

EDIT: Actually, the afternoon of the 20th.

 

[jeejeep]

Here is my civ-by-civ summary.

Qin: Building the Oracle for the CS slingshot. Even though I MM'ed for commerce everywhere, it will still be done at least five turns before CoL is researched. CoL is 20 turns away, so if the next player thinks the Oracle may be built by then, they can veto it.

Gandhi: Not much. Built a fast worker near the end and went for a warrior next. After that maybe a settler for the copper city.

Salladin: Built a settler, but I was not sure where to put it. I fortified it in Mecca for a turn so we could think of a good location.

Peter: Built two warriors, one of which is going to explore near Qin. The other is going towards Arabia to escort the settler. Peter is also building his own settler, but that is vetoable.

Sorry, no screenshots. Nothing really exciting happened.

View attachment 133122