September Update Thread

[Kaan Boztepe]

Thank you Firaxis&Developpers and the whole team behind the franchise

I love the fact that they keep tweaking and changing the game , it keeps the game somewhat fresh.

mystery :maybe something like el dorada in civ v , first to discover gets a gazillion gold and 10 settlers

nothing on fixing district repair costs

unfortunately i dont see any esports potantial with civ franchise, too many civs and leaders to properly balance and too much randomness in maps to ever attract top level players to compete for real money ( make a living out of it ). That being said , i appreciate the fact they are trying to improve the MP games and i welcome all future endevours for it.

I hope we get the next expansion hype train rolling soon™.

 

[acluewithout]

I think it would be very reasonable to give Lumbermills on rivers +1 Gold (and another +1 Gold (on rivers!) attached to a tech requirement like for e.g. Mass Production)


@Everyone: please note that major adjacency bonus means +1, not +2 like everyone seems to be thinking. Pretty sure in the video the campus policy card is active doubling adjacency bonuses.

Personally, I’d have Lumbermills give +1 Production at Mass Production if on a river, and another +1 at Steel rather then the current upgrade bonuses.

I’d also keep the +1 for Mines at Apprenticeship, but limit the +1 at Industrialisation to Mines over a Resource.

 

[MrRadar]

Terra!
I hope to find there some spots marked 'x' for those riches beyond my wildest dreams

Good balancing of Rock Bands and adding more venues for the more difficult sorts.
GAs become much more interesting and Veterancy to include Harbours was such an unexpected, but very welcome move.

However,

Shipyard provides +1 production to all unimproved Coastal Tiles.
<...>
Coastal Tiles after a lighthouse and shipyard will now be +2 food, +1 gold and +1 production.

This may seem nice, but how does that compare with Harbour specialists? If left unchanged, their +1 food +2 gold will become even more embarrassing. "Specialist" implies skill, qualification, but Civ6 makes their output worse than that of unskilled laborers.

 

[acluewithout]

This may seem nice, but how does that compare with Harbour specialists? If left unchanged, their +1 food +2 gold will become even more embarrassing. "Specialist" implies skill, qualification, but Civ6 makes their output worse than that of unskilled laborers.

Agreed. FXS should revert the changes to Harbours and Encampment Specialists. The extra science and culture was actually kinda fun, although I guess the Science from Harbours thing is now maybe covered by Dedications. Maybe Harbours and Encampments just shouldn’t have Specialists, a bit like Entertainment Complexes.

 

[RealHuhn]

Exciting and unexpected patch but I hate the added adjacency bonus for the campus. Coastal cities should be prime locations for trade and industry, not science. Playing the map and specializing cities becomes less important now.
Although I might overestimate the amount of reefs on a standard map because I never really cared about them.

 

[acluewithout]

... I hate the added adjacency bonus for the campus. Coastal cities should be prime locations for trade and industry, not science. Playing the map and specializing cities becomes less important now.

Agreed.

I’m thrilled FXS are tackling various game issues. But a few changes here or there do seem to make the map less important.

Overall these patches are great, but FXS need to be careful...

 

[NullNullError]

Agreed.

I’m thrilled FXS are tackling various game issues. But a few changes here or there do seem to make the map less important.

Overall these patches are great, but FXS need to be careful...

I like it. Currently if you were a naval based civ you wanted mountains for the adjacency but that messed with the avaiable space for your other districts in your already small land.

Furthermore Reefs are not as widespread as you might think.

This will allow most naval cities to get a +2 campus some a +4 Rarley anything above. It will let them catch up to some non-naval civs in the science deparment. Their tiles are still worse and they are still more suspectible to suprise wars and natural disasters.

 

[stealth_nsk]

This may seem nice, but how does that compare with Harbour specialists? If left unchanged, their +1 food +2 gold will become even more embarrassing. "Specialist" implies skill, qualification, but Civ6 makes their output worse than that of unskilled laborers.

Yep. they are specialists since they produce food and gold without working any terrain

In Civ5 you have a choice between working land or using specialists, so it was more or less balanced around this. In Civ6 it's more about choice between working land and building something on it. In this paradigm specialists can't be equal to laborers.

 

[UWHabs]

I like it. Currently if you were a naval based civ you wanted mountains for the adjacency but that messed with the avaiable space for your other districts in your already small land.

Furthermore Reefs are not as widespread as you might think.

This will allow most naval cities to get a +2 campus some a +4 Rarley anything above. It will let them catch up to some non-naval civs in the science deparment. Their tiles are still worse and they are still more suspectible to suprise wars and natural disasters.

It's also a very slight indirect buff to aqueducts (geothermal vents) and holy sites (mountains), since now you have a few other places to put campuses to gain those adjacencies, so there could be slightly more spaces for them. But yes, as other people said, there's not a ton of coastal reefs to gain from this, so other than really water-heavy maps, probably won't make a huge difference. Although with these new big bonuses for campuses with reefs and geothermals, I'd be tempted to scale them down to only give a minor adjacency for mountains, otherwise it's going to be really rare to find a campus spot that's not at least a +4 or better.

I do wish, though, that other districts could also get a few more options for adjacencies. For example, campuses now have mountains, geothermals, and reefs that are all prime spots for them. Holy sites have natural wonders and mountains (and maybe pantheon choices), both of those not even counting rainforest/forest bonuses. Industrial zones at least have strategic resources and green districts. Commerce hubs have rivers or harbors, Harbors with resources and city-centres. But theatres only have wonders, and entertainment complexes have literally nothing that matters in their placement (other than area effects), it just feels like they need something to matter where they get placed.

 

[kb27787]

It's also a very slight indirect buff to aqueducts (geothermal vents) and holy sites (mountains), since now you have a few other places to put campuses to gain those adjacencies, so there could be slightly more spaces for them. But yes, as other people said, there's not a ton of coastal reefs to gain from this, so other than really water-heavy maps, probably won't make a huge difference. Although with these new big bonuses for campuses with reefs and geothermals, I'd be tempted to scale them down to only give a minor adjacency for mountains, otherwise it's going to be really rare to find a campus spot that's not at least a +4 or better.

I do wish, though, that other districts could also get a few more options for adjacencies. For example, campuses now have mountains, geothermals, and reefs that are all prime spots for them. Holy sites have natural wonders and mountains (and maybe pantheon choices), both of those not even counting rainforest/forest bonuses. Industrial zones at least have strategic resources and green districts. Commerce hubs have rivers or harbors, Harbors with resources and city-centres. But theatres only have wonders, and entertainment complexes have literally nothing that matters in their placement (other than area effects), it just feels like they need something to matter where they get placed.

I feel giving theatres a standard bonus from neighborhoods and entertainment districts would be realistic and reasonable. It would buff Kongo quite a bit too.

 

[FeiLing]

I do wish, though, that other districts could also get a few more options for adjacencies. Theatres only
have wonders, and entertainment complexes have literally nothing that matters in their placement
(other than area effects), it just feels like they need something to matter where they get placed.

I feel like if Entertainment Complexes (and Water Parks) raised nearby appeal they'd be in a good spot (really just a very minor buff but it makes it much more interesting).

Theaters, well, not sure if they need a buff. But I agree that in Deity and Immortal you tend to not get (m)any wonders and your theater squares are often left to stand there without a bonus
or only a mere +1 from the city center and one nearby district which is kinda saddening. One option could probably be to give them an adjacency bonus for nearby luxury resources (+0.5 or +1).

Things I hope might still make there way into the next Patch:
Give Lumbermills a bonus for being in Rivers.

I think it would be very reasonable to give Lumbermills on rivers +1 Gold (and another +1 Gold (on rivers!) attached to a tech requirement like for e.g. Mass Production)

 

[SephiBBZ]

Bonus on campus is just ridiculous, my main is Australia, which was already a very strong civilization, will be just insane, non sense for me.

 

[criZp]

Bonus on campus is just ridiculous, my main is Australia, which was already a very strong civilization, will be just insane, non sense for me.

so you propose they nerf australia.

 

[Krajzen]

This one surprised me too. It seems likely to be overpowered. Is there a real-world analog that justifies production for unimproved coast?

That's the problem with the way civ's borders and pops work. Water heavy cities must be competetive.
But in real life there is no infrastructure in water because, well, water. Sea cities IRL profit greatly from three acrivities - trade, fishing and oil. That's it. For Civ game system that's not enough so they need to come up with strange arcade solutions like production out of thin air.

 

[jozef57]

IT SEEMS VERY GOOD. love the new maps i think. further they adress some things that anou=yed me to much lol so i am happy. stil hoping for cruiseships and such more use of the oceans, this dev team has it in them to make this best civ ever. ofcourse i ahve personal preferances, we all do i think and all differant, but it is an very interesting civ version and yes for me too it makes me have to finish my current game fast.

 

[kryat]

Another perk of the housing bonus to lighthouses and fisheries: now you are less constrained to put your coastal cities on rivers. This is great for those times there’s a reef at the river mouth.

 

[Lonecat Nekophrodite]

Magellan? a retire option should be a free astrology boost (Two Magellanic Clouds), or discovery (if boosted already), or else more movements for all ships.

https://www.moddb.com/mods/star-blazers-mod/images/queen-starsha-of-iscandar

 

[Karmah]

This one surprised me too. It seems likely to be overpowered. Is there a real-world analog that justifies production for unimproved coast?

There is a very real life lobbying on this forum to put coastal cities production in par with land-based cities. So dunno if that counts for immersion , but it does for civ patching features

 

[AntSou]

I'm really excited for all of the new map types. Wondering how the AI is going to handle Terra? It will be disappointing if the AI is incapable of actually taking advantage of it like the human player.

Fractal with islands sounds great. Love the idea of Inverted Axis!

Can't wait to try them all.

 

[Ziad]

That's the problem with the way civ's borders and pops work. Water heavy cities must be competetive.
But in real life there is no infrastructure in water because, well, water. Sea cities IRL profit greatly from three acrivities - trade, fishing and oil. That's it. For Civ game system that's not enough so they need to come up with strange arcade solutions like production out of thin air.

Why do unimproved Plains provide production?

Why do coast tiles yield gold?

Why do Maori get production from unimproved woods?

Imagine unimproved coast tiles have unorganized labor that retrieves ocean materials from deeper in the sea (thanks to ships from shipyards).

Then Liang comes in and throws them all out to build Fisheries obviously.