Dynamic's proposal was to build Settler in the capital before the Pyramids, so there will be more than 2 cities and the cottage-sharing will take place, even if not with the 2nd city. Also, we ca't go to war immediately after the Pyramids as we need metal casting and machinery, so there will be spare time to put 1-2 cities in.
Sgotm 01 - C F R
- Thread starter AlanH
- Start date
Witan
Chieftain
As for me, map of cities, that Lexard proposed is the best. But Black city i planned to build 1 cell to Norht (so we have in this city 2 additional production hills). According to this I'm going to found second city SE from Horses
Cat Behemoth
Warlord
I'm fully agree with second city (blue). And completely disagree with two Lexad's others. According to that - our capital is useless and have to be destroyed. 
In common I'm very dislike too close cities in civ4.
In common I'm very dislike too close cities in civ4.Their point is to help capital grow its hamlets to towns while it's working something else, like putting 2 scientists for fast academy. The capital is planned to become a commerce centre, so we need every point of growth we can get. The others gat what is rest - and that is not that bad, taking sea with its commerce into account. As a petty bonus, distance upkeep costs for Black and Purple is 0.
Other than that, of course, I would have not put them so close.
Other than that, of course, I would have not put them so close.
CB, we need lots of developed cottages in the capital. And the capital can only work 3 or 4 at a time in the early game. So if we settle cities without overlap we'll have only 4 good cottages in the capital and many small ones.
The point is that the other cities are working cottages inside the capital's border and develop them for the capital. Then once the happiness issues are sloved these cottages are handed back over to the capital. This way our capital will work a huge number of cottages developed into cities with bureaucracy bonus, with academy, etc. for huge science output.
And other cities will move over to other tiles, like working the coast, etc. We'll also need to hire merchants in other cities to help support 100% science rate untill we get Astronomy.
That is why i wanted to settle blue dot closer, but if everybody wants is 1SE of the horses, it is fine. But i still think that it'll hurt our science in the long run, even though it gives us a good production city sooner.
The point is that the other cities are working cottages inside the capital's border and develop them for the capital. Then once the happiness issues are sloved these cottages are handed back over to the capital. This way our capital will work a huge number of cottages developed into cities with bureaucracy bonus, with academy, etc. for huge science output.
And other cities will move over to other tiles, like working the coast, etc. We'll also need to hire merchants in other cities to help support 100% science rate untill we get Astronomy.
That is why i wanted to settle blue dot closer, but if everybody wants is 1SE of the horses, it is fine. But i still think that it'll hurt our science in the long run, even though it gives us a good production city sooner.
Witan
Chieftain
2330 bc (0)
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1. Warrior-1 go NE (I'm afraid of Animals)
2. Settler go to SE from Horses)
3. Capital start to build library (26 turns, some less after grows)
2290bc (1)
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1. Warrior-2 go West.
2. Op-pa! Barbarian Warrior near Horses - I can't build city on this turn. And worker build pasture near this place.
3. Warrior-1 get 1st Star (1.8 of healht) and go S
4. Warrior from Capital go N
5. Setttler move 1/2 of turn
2260bc (2)
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1. Gm... Barbarian go N
2. Settler go to city-place and found Memphis. Worked FP and product Warrior
3. Warrior-1 go to Memhis.
4. Warrior from Capital go back
5. Warrior-2 go West.
2230bc (3)
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1. Barbarian go N again, so i don't see him
2. Warrior-2 go West.
2200bc (4)
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1. Warrior-2 go NW.
2. In Memphis MM: now worked on Pasture.
3. We have +1 in relationship with Russia
2170bc (5)
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1. Meditation was discovered, go to Priesthood (5 turns), but -1 Gold
2. Worker go to Horses, Warrior from Memphis too.
3. Warrior-2 go NW.
2140bc (6)
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1. Worker start pasture on Horses, Warrior fortifed.
2. Warrior-2 go N.
2140bc (7)
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1. Worker start pasture on Horses, Warrior fortifed.
2. Warrior-2 go N.
2110bc (8)
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1. Warrior-2 go to appendix near Moscow and see Cow (there are 2 Archers in Moscow now)
2080bc (9)
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1. Thebes grows to 4, worked on FP
2. Warrior-2 go W and SW. See new land!
3. Somewhere Judaism was founded
2080bc (10)
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1. Thebes grows to 4, worked on FP
2. Warrior-2 go W and SW. See new land!
2050bc (11)
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1. Warrior-4 was builded in Memphis and fortified.
2. Warrior-2 go home
2020bc (12)
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1. The border of Memphis have expanded
2. Catherine adopts Org Religion
3. We have discovered Priesthood, next - Code of Laws (29 turns)
4. Memphis switch to Oracle (57 turns)
5. Attantion: In North we have 2 Barb warriors
6. Catherina convert to Judaism, so we have Religion
and she have now 2 cities (2nd site may be build some turns ago)
1990bc (13)
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1. Pasture on Horses comleted, I mistake, so worker start to buid road on Horses
1960bc (14)
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1. St Petersburg now 2, and center og Judaism, russian worker buil pasture on Horses
2. In North I see only 1 Barb Warrior (2nd may be on Silver)
1930bc (15)
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1. Menphis now 2, work on Horses
1900bc (16)
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1. Worker now start Pasture on second tile with Cow. Sorry
1870bc (17)
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1. Thebes grow, start work on Stone (lock the grow in Capital)
2. Taxes lasr turns on 90%, +1 gold. After Library was comleted we can switch to 100
1840bc (18)
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1. We have +2 in relationship with Russia
1810bc (19)
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Nothing new
1780bc (20)
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Catherina build Novgorod
http://gotm.civfanatics.net/saves/civ4sgotm1/CFR_SG001_BC1780_01.Civ4SavedGame
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1. Warrior-1 go NE (I'm afraid of Animals)
2. Settler go to SE from Horses)
3. Capital start to build library (26 turns, some less after grows)
2290bc (1)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1. Warrior-2 go West.
2. Op-pa! Barbarian Warrior near Horses - I can't build city on this turn. And worker build pasture near this place.
3. Warrior-1 get 1st Star (1.8 of healht) and go S
4. Warrior from Capital go N
5. Setttler move 1/2 of turn
2260bc (2)
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1. Gm... Barbarian go N
2. Settler go to city-place and found Memphis. Worked FP and product Warrior
3. Warrior-1 go to Memhis.
4. Warrior from Capital go back
5. Warrior-2 go West.
2230bc (3)
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1. Barbarian go N again, so i don't see him
2. Warrior-2 go West.
2200bc (4)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1. Warrior-2 go NW.
2. In Memphis MM: now worked on Pasture.
3. We have +1 in relationship with Russia
2170bc (5)
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1. Meditation was discovered, go to Priesthood (5 turns), but -1 Gold
2. Worker go to Horses, Warrior from Memphis too.
3. Warrior-2 go NW.
2140bc (6)
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1. Worker start pasture on Horses, Warrior fortifed.
2. Warrior-2 go N.
2140bc (7)
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1. Worker start pasture on Horses, Warrior fortifed.
2. Warrior-2 go N.
2110bc (8)
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1. Warrior-2 go to appendix near Moscow and see Cow (there are 2 Archers in Moscow now)
2080bc (9)
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1. Thebes grows to 4, worked on FP
2. Warrior-2 go W and SW. See new land!
3. Somewhere Judaism was founded
2080bc (10)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1. Thebes grows to 4, worked on FP
2. Warrior-2 go W and SW. See new land!
2050bc (11)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1. Warrior-4 was builded in Memphis and fortified.
2. Warrior-2 go home
2020bc (12)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1. The border of Memphis have expanded
2. Catherine adopts Org Religion
3. We have discovered Priesthood, next - Code of Laws (29 turns)
4. Memphis switch to Oracle (57 turns)
5. Attantion: In North we have 2 Barb warriors
6. Catherina convert to Judaism, so we have Religion
and she have now 2 cities (2nd site may be build some turns ago)1990bc (13)
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1. Pasture on Horses comleted, I mistake, so worker start to buid road on Horses
1960bc (14)
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1. St Petersburg now 2, and center og Judaism, russian worker buil pasture on Horses
2. In North I see only 1 Barb Warrior (2nd may be on Silver)
1930bc (15)
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1. Menphis now 2, work on Horses
1900bc (16)
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1. Worker now start Pasture on second tile with Cow. Sorry
1870bc (17)
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1. Thebes grow, start work on Stone (lock the grow in Capital)
2. Taxes lasr turns on 90%, +1 gold. After Library was comleted we can switch to 100
1840bc (18)
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1. We have +2 in relationship with Russia
1810bc (19)
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Nothing new
1780bc (20)
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Catherina build Novgorod
http://gotm.civfanatics.net/saves/civ4sgotm1/CFR_SG001_BC1780_01.Civ4SavedGame
akots
Poet
OK, looks good and I got it, will play hopefully today. Any changes to the plans? I might take 20 turns as well since there is not that much to do overall. Or may be 10 turns depending on development of events.
I think we can continues according to our plan.
The only thing that bothers me now is that land tile that is visible across the strait SW of Moscow. Maybe it is just a small island, but maybe it is another continent reachable by galleys. I think we should slot fishing somewhere into the tech sequence and build a boat in the new city to explore there.
The only thing that bothers me now is that land tile that is visible across the strait SW of Moscow. Maybe it is just a small island, but maybe it is another continent reachable by galleys. I think we should slot fishing somewhere into the tech sequence and build a boat in the new city to explore there.
Cat Behemoth
Warlord
Obormot. I can understand the reason for black city (so I think it have to be placed 1 tile to the south from Lexad's point). But I don't see any reason for orange. In my opinion - it's just an increasing of maintainance. 
Dynamic
But not hurry
You can play 20 turns if all will be clear. But, we still not decide 3-d city place...
I don't see where is Lexad's dotmap? I scoleed 3 pages back and still couldn't find it. If you are referring to my dotmap (orange is the city on the west coast, near the fish), then the reason is to work the cottages that will be built after chopping the forest and then handed over to Thebes. After that it can work coastal tiles. Maybe it is not a great city, but it'll definitely give us mor ethen enough gold to pay for it's mayntenance and it will develop the cottages for Thebes It can be moved a little bit to optimise the overlap though since the blue dot was moved.
I don't like moving the black dot 1S, because then it won't have fresh water and will have lots of green faces from FPs. And the desert hill is pretty useless IMHO. That is another pure commerce city.
These cities should all be founded some time later, so they won't hurt us much. The current settler should go to the pink dot IMHO. We just have to decide on the build order there. As i said we need work boats. One to work the clams and at least one more to explore. So i suggest researching fishing now (as Dynamic calculated we get Oracle a few turns after CoL anyway and that is propably delayed even further because we delayed settling Memophis because of barbs. So it won't delay the slingshot at all or maybe just for a turn or 2).
It can be moved a little bit to optimise the overlap though since the blue dot was moved.I don't like moving the black dot 1S, because then it won't have fresh water and will have lots of green faces from FPs. And the desert hill is pretty useless IMHO. That is another pure commerce city.
These cities should all be founded some time later, so they won't hurt us much. The current settler should go to the pink dot IMHO. We just have to decide on the build order there. As i said we need work boats. One to work the clams and at least one more to explore. So i suggest researching fishing now (as Dynamic calculated we get Oracle a few turns after CoL anyway and that is propably delayed even further because we delayed settling Memophis because of barbs. So it won't delay the slingshot at all or maybe just for a turn or 2).
akots
Poet
It does not look like we will need the 3rd city soon, not on my watch anyhow.
Do we accept Judaism as state religion if it comes to us? I think we should.
Do we accept Judaism as state religion if it comes to us? I think we should.
Cat Behemoth
Warlord
Obormot said:
You think pure desert is more usable than desert hill?
akots
Poet
Obormot said:
I think we need another worker form the capital. But may be settler. The city on desert will have clams and fish, and that is a lot of food and health. The city on desert hill will get only fish but it gets extra flood plains and may be border extension will enable us to travel beyond these mountains with a galley. It is a close call but I don't think it is really important. Both cities are OK imho.
Dynamic
But not hurry
After Library we have time for Settler and 2 workers before Pyramids. Timing was made for Masonry and Mining in time for Workers, and CoL as fast as possible for Religion. But, if we will have other religion in Capital... we could delay CoL. But, in this case Workers will not use Stone in time. Ptitsa and Witan already delayed scheduler, so may be we will need to correct calculations...
Dynamic
But not hurry
I don't think we need orange city. I even not tested 2 cities on East...
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