SGOTM 06 - The Real Ms. Beyond

[Compromise]

I guess I know what the autologger is, but I never use it. How does it help you?

 

[TheArchduke]

I will play my turn now up to the possible discovery of bronze, as I don´t expect too much going awry and if no early strategic ressource is avaiable, I will stop asap.

 

[TheArchduke]

All bets are off, we got Bronze in the BFC and Horses nearby.

After the calculations I decide to work the bananas till the cows are online. The warrior goes exploring

T 3
A bear encounters Woody to the south, he heals up in a nearby jungle.

T 4
We grow to size 2 and I work the gold to get a 2nd warrior asap.

T 6
The warrior is finished and we encounter Alexander to the south. He has a scout and Woody kills him without any loss of health.

T 10
I scout Athens, 2 warriors, 1 fish, 1 crab and one gold. Built on Stone for 3 hammers. What a nice capital..

Save is at http://gotm.civfanatics.net/saves/civ4sgotm6/The_Real_Ms_Beyond_SG006_BC2650_01.CivWarlordsSave

T 11
We got Horses nearby! In a possible cow/horses citysite right to the NE.

As soon as BW comes in, I stop immeaditly.

Thoughts:

- We got Bronze, Alexander got an awesome capital. I think an axe rush would be most prudent, especially as his capital is a damn nice catch.

- Expansionwise I would advocate to build a cow/fish city or a horses/cow city and leave the rest to aggressive expansion.

- I expect quite a rethinking of our strategy with axes as well as horses avaiable.

- Please revolt to slavery.

- With Bronze in our BFC, we might consider postponing Hunting/Archery for TheWheel.

 

[Swiss Pauli]

Well, we're in business then, so it's time to set up the test map. Any volunteers? Looking at the Victory screen, the other AIs we know are all coastal to a greater or lesser degree (we have the most land). Given the speed we encoutered the AIs, we can assume a pretty thin island (they've all met each other). I'd stick Mali a dozen tiles east of the rice, and Carthage half a dozen east of the Jumbos. Give them supercharged capitals, with Iron for Mali, Copper for Greece and Horses for Hannibal.

Dunno what to do about Raggy: maybe stick him with a likely religion founder (preferably one who can share HR as favourite civic if such an AI exists) in order that they get all pally and push each other forward. Stick the last AI on some islands.

(I thought the autologger needed to be on for log extration on save uploads?)

 

[sunrise089]

Great news about the strategic resources. I agree with the axe rush ASAP - the only are only going to get harder to take out.

 

[Compromise]

Nice!

Okay, it'll take me a while to digest the map. I'll try to whip up a practice game some time this week, but no promises when it will be ready. It might be nice if we had another one too. That way, we could practice each other's without too much spoiler info (if that's a concern).

Not much time for me for the next few days. Are we agreed to postpone the next real turnset until the new year?

Edit: I'm happy to hear that Woody survived the bear attack.

 

[TheArchduke]

A swift and hard rush seems the best option. Imo, the excellent capital site of Athens (stone as well) would be a great idea. The last time I looked Alexander had 2 warriors there, but it won´t stay that way.

So when do we plan to continue, who wants to play testgames?

 

[sunrise089]

I can play a test game over the Christmas break.

 

[ruff_hi]

I've uninstalled all Civ4 games and reinstalled them all with the correct patches. I also kept the required DLLs so that I can still play my PBEM games ... but most importantly, I have managed to load up the save. I will have a look at it later this week. Test games seem to be the order of the day so I will see if I can get one going.

 

[Kodii]

Yay for bronze!

Assuming that Wang and HC are also in this game, its funny how Gyathaar gave the only non-financial AI a nice capital, perhaps with the intent on us taking it?

I'll play some test games, if someone can set one up for me. I'm not sure if I have the expertise to make one myself.

Dunno what to do about Raggy: maybe stick him with a likely religion founder (preferably one who can share HR as favourite civic if such an AI exists) in order that they get all pally and push each other forward.

Huayna Capac

 

[LKendter]

Expansionwise I would advocate to build a cow/fish city or a horses/cow city and leave the rest to aggressive expansion.

I vote against fish. Keeping seafood online require a fortune in investment in navy and isn't worth it IMHO. Take one look back at SGOTM#4 and the headache we had with seafood at the capitol.

 

[LKendter]

Can someone post a link to the right HOF module?

I just checked, and I can't load the game.

 

[Compromise]

I'm pretty sure I downloaded the HoF mod from here. Good luck!

 

[Swiss Pauli]

I vote against fish. Keeping seafood online require a fortune in investment in navy and isn't worth it IMHO. Take one look back at SGOTM#4 and the headache we had with seafood at the capitol.

But that was coastal seafood, and this would be ocean seafood, and therefore safe until caravels (blockade) and galleons (pillage). I think it would make an interesting comparison for the test games.

I'm away from Wednesday til Sunday, so I can't help with setting up the test games .

 

[TheArchduke]

We should find out if ocean seafood can be pillaged. In any case, I think it is worth it longterm and especially if we want to keep Athens if we conquer it (we should do both), we need some sort of navy sooner or later.

 

[LKendter]

I can load the game now.

How much more do we want to explore? We've already gone further the I would like as to many civs are aware of us with just one warrior. I've seen the AI come with a warrior stack.

 

[TheArchduke]

I can load the game now.

How much more do we want to explore? We've already gone further the I would like as to many civs are aware of us with just one warrior. I've seen the AI come with a warrior stack.

The only AI we could have avoided for some time longer was Alexander, the others brought their scouts right to our doorstep. Imo, a bit of exploration is always justified, as only by that the horses could be found and we know what we are up against (Alexander´s nasty capital for instance.)

 

[Compromise]

I'm happy with the exploration; knowledge is power. If the AI sends warrior stacks at us, that's fine. I think it's better to have them pumping energy into ineffective mini-assaults than building for later assaults. Unlike most games, we won't be neglecting our military early on.

I'm going to try to set up a couple of practice games, but given pre-holiday time constraints, it may take me a week or so. So, if you have time this week, you may have to set up your own game (just use Worldbuilder to get our capital roughly right). And no guarantees: I might just not have enough time, but I'll try.

Regarding the map, I would like people to post some opinions:

1) What AIs do you think we'll have on this map? (So I can set up the proper civs)
2) Roughly where do you think the AIs will be? And with what connectivity (land, coast, ocean) to us? (So I can place AI capitals somewhat reasonably.)
3) What questions are we trying to answer with our test games? (E.g.: do AI stacks attack cities on hills? Will forts help us? What unit combinations work well for pillage parties? Etc. Anything you can think of.)

And I guess a zero-order question: do we want to run another turnset soon? I tend to think no. I think we have enough information to move forward with some testing.

 

[AlanH]

(I thought the autologger needed to be on for log extration on save uploads?)

There are no restrictions on what HoF Mod settings you use. The save records all the information needed for results analysis and presentation. The Autologger just gives you a more detailed listing for your own purposes than the one provided by the standard game software.

 

[Swiss Pauli]

See above for my answers to 1 & 2.

3) What questions are we trying to answer with our test games? (E.g.: do AI stacks attack cities on hills? Will forts help us? What unit combinations work well for pillage parties? Etc. Anything you can think of.)

I think that's the kind of tactical info we'll need to provide from each game, but I think we can try out a few different strategies:

1. Rush and Raze - kill em all

2. Rush and keep (the alpha sites)

3. All attack, all the time (no wonders, only military pumps)

4. Kill, then build [repeat] (a wonder here, a commerce city there, etc)

5. Oracle-Feudalism gambit (gotta try it with Winnie)

I may be able to get a map together tonight or tomorrow evening as a couple of appointments got cancelled, but I'm not 100% sure I'll have the time.