[BTS] SGOTM 26 - Home Slices

[LowtherCastle]

Last big issue is artificially advancing Bismark.
If we do this, he will eventually conquer HRE and become a big techer I think.
Maybe even get a 2nd iron.

What could Bismarck tech for us though?

First question is, could Bismarck get bigger than Peter and be our UN opponent?

 

[LowtherCastle]

Looking at tge T150 save, looks like Clams only has one wkshp so I don’t see getting a 1t exec, unless we 4whip the forge instead of the CH.

 

[Kaitzilla]

Galley = catapult.

Do you already have a solution?

I should be able to put one out by tommorow morning.

First question is, could Bismarck get bigger than Peter and be our UN opponent?

That would be great.
Peter loves us.

As for advancing AI, we need to have a goal and positive result while avoiding Privateers, Mercantilism, and Democracy.

 

[LowtherCastle]

Okay. I get Mitch’s blown-up granary problem. Forge-ch-exec works if we skip the cat.

No. Still need pop6 for the exec 3whip.

 

[LowtherCastle]

Would take an extra whip anger to get Forge later.
Not sure if worth +10 food in Canal.

No extra whip anger because we’re not whipping the exec.

I think the solution is cat(2whip)-forge(4whip)-exec-ch(3whip). Except forge is whipped first. Both cat and forge held for completion concatenation starting T156. Exec may still not complete till T159 (we lose 25% cat OF by chaining into forge) but no whip needed.

 

[Kaitzilla]

Okay. I get Mitch’s blown-up granary problem. Forge-ch-exec works if we skip the cat.

No. Still need pop6 for the exec 3whip.

Exec. 2pop whip with Forge only needs 25/100

15 overflow from Courthouse whip should be enough.

There is also a food surge the turn sushi settles.


Oh, no whip for the exec right.
Hmm

 

[LowtherCastle]

Exec. 2pop whip with Forge only needs 25/100

15 overflow from Courthouse whip should be enough.

There is also a food surge the turn sushi settles

Right. Brainfart on the 3whip. (I had already studied your 2whip post. )

Okay, so there are options to be optimized.

 

[LowtherCastle]

Speaking of costs, will we have gpt costs getting all of Peter’s sushi?

 

[Kaitzilla]

Speaking of costs, will we have gpt costs getting all of Peter’s sushi?

Yes, as far as I recall.

He has little crab and a whole bunch of Clam.
We will have to pay gold to get those clammies.

 

[WastinTime]

First question is, could Bismarck get bigger than Peter and be our UN opponent?

I don't think there is a good reason to do this. We're going to have one opponent. Why make Bismarck bigger and then we have a bigger opponent?
And we just massaged our relationship with Bismarck.

The best reason to go against Peter is the Hindu love-fest. We don't want to have someone Friendly with us, but Friendier with Bismarck.

 

[Kaitzilla]

I don't think there is a good reason to do this. We're going to have one opponent. Why make Bismarck bigger and then we have a bigger opponent?
And we just massaged our relationship with Bismarck.

The best reason to go against Peter is the Hindu love-fest. We don't want to have someone Friendly with us, but Friendier with Bismarck.

Oh, I forgot about Friendlier with Bismarck.

 

[LowtherCastle]

I don't think there is a good reason to do this. We're going to have one opponent. Why make Bismarck bigger and then we have a bigger opponent?
And we just massaged our relationship with Bismarck.

The best reason to go against Peter is the Hindu love-fest. We don't want to have someone Friendly with us, but Friendier with Bismarck.

Obviously.

So we need to lurk around attacks and be the ones to capture, plunder and raze the big cities.

 

[MirrorGuard]

As for the clams exec whip
The build&whip order looks like this.
T152-4 whip forge T153 catapult completes T154 courthouse~ T157 whip courthouse T158 get sushi, work 1 mine 1 workshop
T159 2 whip exec

Play with this test save to verify.
Test save T103=Real game T152

 

[Kaitzilla]

As for the clams exec whip
The build&whip order looks like this.
T152-4 whip forge T153 catapult completes T154 courthouse~ T157 whip courthouse T158 get sushi, work 1 mine 1 workshop
T159 2 whip exec

Play with this test save to verify.
Test save T103=Real game T152

Thanks Mirrorguard!

I think I have the traditional solution worked out now.
T152 - Catapult; x2Clam, x3Coast, Pfarm, x2 Scientist
T153 - 4-pop whip Forge; x2Clam, Coast, Pfarm
T154 - Catapult; x2Clam, Coast, Pfarm
T155 - Courthouse; x2Clam, Coast, Pfarm
T156 - Courthouse; x2Clam, x2Coast, Pfarm
T157 - 3-pop whip Courthouse; x2Clam, Pfarm
T158 - Sushi Exec (we have plenty of hammers and food now, work tiles as needed)

The main issue is making sure we have enough on T153 to get Liberalism done since both Clam City and Silver City will need to whip away their 2 scientists. (-33)
The PPP written so far with the added build should be enough?

Let me think over LowtherCastle's 1-turn Sushi exec. idea

 

[Mitchum]

Ha. I worked out the Clams MM before seeing this page in the thread. Here is what I did:

Clams (6/120 Courthouse and 4/120 Forge, Catapult 18/50)
Gets Sushi T158
T152 - 4-pop whip Forge 154/120 +2; x2Clam, Coast, Plainsfarm; 4 pops 4/28 +9
T153 - Catapult 18/50 + 27 OF + 2 OF + 2; x2Clam, Coast, Plainsfarm; 4 pops 13/28 +9
T154 - Catapult 49/50 + 2; x2Clam, Coast, Plainsfarm; 4 pops 22/28 +9
T155 - Courthouse 4/120 + [(1 OF + 2)*1.75 = 5) ; x2Clam, x2 Coast, Plainsfarm; 5 pops 26/30 +9
T156 - Courthouse 9/120 + (2*1.75 = 3); x2Clam, x3 Coast, Plainsfarm; 6 pops 20/32 +9
T157 - Whip Courthouse (168/120) +2; x2Clam, Plainsfarm; 3 pops 29/26 +9
T158 - Sushi executive; 4 pops 25/28 +9

I will compare it to the others now.

 

[Mitchum]

I like Kait's idea of building the Cat on T152 so that we can work scientists for an extra turn. I agree that we easily have enough hammers and food to 4 pop the forge, 3 pop the CH and 2 pop that executive.

 

[Mitchum]

The PPP has been updated with my updated MM in Clams (will change to Kait's or 1-turn executive plan if it makes sense).

I've also update the Mesa Verde plan. Please have a look.

 

[Mitchum]

We also have to decide how to groom Bismarck to tech something useful for us. We have to wait until we get France in our war though otherwise Bismarck will keep moving higher in score. Should we sell him techs any time he gets 30+ gold for trade? If so, we need a list of what to sell him and in what order. It will take many turns before we have eyes on his research so we're a bit blind at the moment.

 

[Kaitzilla]

@Mitchum
Ah, kind of embarrassing, but I've not actually checked that we are close to the edge now that I think back, it was just a feeling.

Maybe open the Real Game and see how much cushion we have before 3-Turn Liberalism is our pace? (if you get some time)
I don't want to unpause the Real Game now that it has passed on to you.

Basically, I'm pretty sure we need to Build in Profit + Whale T152 to get Liberalism in 2 turns due to Scientists getting whipped away, but I'm not sure.

 

[Mitchum]

Liberalism is close. At 90% slider, we are quite a bit short of getting Liberalism in 2 turns. I will built Research in Profit and Whale this turn and delay whipping the Forge in Clams for 1 turn and work 2 sci. I can fine tune things on T153 to make sure that we complete liberalism in 1 turn.