snofru space map v10 nightmare eternity

tramwajg

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hi, starting another game:) settings: nightmare eternity, raging barbarians, barbarian world, barbarian civs, neanderthal cities, no tech trading, complex traits, hide and seek, size matters, 20 AI

I edit first post, adding new info, later posts are discussion

turn 0 - bc 200 000
https://i.imgur.com/R1AsKxR.png restarteed because forgot to set eternity speed

I am looking for a nice place to settle, I want on river (1 commerce and possibility of building bridge), caves (housing building that gives production and gold), hill (defense), coast (ship building and housing after fishing tech), very tall grass (housing and economy), bamboo (economy), forest and jungle (economy), would be awesome with natural wonder, and I split initial unit to scout for a nice place to settle. I will be editing, adding continuation, if you have any advices for this game write please :)

turn 12 - bc 198 000

sadly no caves, but nice place with natural wonder on bamboo river, I think it will bring better income than caves

desert, ancient forest, swamps, hills with caves, or hills with river? or keep exploring surroundings before deciding about first settlement...

bc 196 000
we decided to choose another place, our tribe starts to settle on nearby terrain, searching for caves or other shelters such as animal burrows, or high trees, while we oversee whether everything is going according to plan. we can choose between nomadism, cave dwelling, or language, and the language will be our choice due to proximity of a very weird landscape what we will call Uluru, which will undoubtedly benefit our new culture...

a group of dozen have gone into direction of plains, and found a cave inhabited by creatures not seen before, similar to us, but seemingly much less intelligent. They live in a group, but seem to not communicate with each other like we already can. We have been watching their lives for a while, they look to be very strong, they can carry huge items. Part of our tribe, which have lived the longest among us and have the highest knowledge, have proposed to think more about this weird culture that we encountered there, and perhaps use their way of life to benefit our issues that require high strength... the project that we are working on, will be called Culture (neanderthal)...

the 2nd of journeys have led to find other tribe, similar to ours, they also communicate with something that looks to be language. Their tribe is barely visible due to darkness, but they seem to be more brave, than us, or than Neanderthals. Their settlement is Persepolis, and they call themselves Persians. Their level of wisdom is not as high as ours, they seem to have no alpha male or female, and no elder council like we have already established and which benefit our wisdom.

We have formed a group of warriors that carry wooden clubs, which have got some experience using strategy that we will call "hit and run", we also managed to ambush them by sending groups that seem to be very weak (0.66 strength with forced marsh), when they go out of their settlement and attack them, suddenly they find themselves being attacked by much more powerful 3 strength group. This is indeed war, but we are yet too weak to capture their settlement. We should increase efforts in wisdom, in order to deevelop more advanced culture and to capture thm... we managed to take some of their food reserves. This food is very delicious, better than anything we have found in our lands, it's red ball-shaped items, but there are not many of them. We already know it's safe, so that we will be regularly travelling in this direction and capturing this food, growing in their terrains.

We are almost capturing wealth of other weak settlement, and we will likely be resettling their pops to work in our areas, 99.82% chance of success

we have mastered the neanderthal's way of life, we captured part of their population, which became our gatherers and hunters, we had labourers that were working on Lascaux Paintings project, sadly they seem to not be able to do any more work. These paintings are located in our alpha male and female's cave, which is the largest and now also the most beautiful of all caves. We have a simple music and dance, access to better clubs than our opponents, we can build simple trails. Our warriors have power of 9, which allowed them to eliminate opponents almost utterly, and we are considering whether to attack now (resulting in destruction of settlement) or to wait more time to let them develop, and then take them.

https://i.imgur.com/T1SQiUU.png (before capturing)
https://i.imgur.com/uBF4pjd.png (after)

turn 1007 - bc 48 000

we have successfully captured Persepolis, which is our apple farm now. We are learning to collect apples, but we don't know how to grow them by ourselves yet, and that seems to be complicated knowledge, way beyond our understanding of this world. Both of our settlements have around 100 people now, we have built a trail between them, and our working class is transporting goods so we could split manual work efforts between these. We started using bamboo in order to have cloth, ropes, and simple clothes so that we can dress more comfortably than ever before. We have developing culture, first two religions, which we call druidism and shamanism, we don't live in caves anymore and we learned to build first huts from bark and other wooden matter. We came into an idea of exchanging goods for goods, depending on what each member of village needs, and we call it barter. Currently we are thinking about using of stones for construction of huts, in same way as we already do with wood, however this process will take some time. We also want to explore new terrains, and establish new settlements, maintaining exchange of ideas and goods with our original homeland... no one from Persian settlement remembers their origin anymore, only our superior citizens are being educated through oral tradition, that we once were much more powerful than our enemies, and we captured them, making them our labourers. Our weapons, consisting of wood and stones, are the most dangerous we have seen in any explored part of this land, which we know quite good already. Power of our elite warrior unit is uncomparable to anything else that has ever been sent against them

our offensive unit is unmatched, but it have also came to our mind that while elite warriors are away, we should have some kind of walls that would protect interiors of our settlements against wild animals and other aggressive creatures from outside, without danger for citizens. We would call concept of such a construction a palisade, which would consist of long trees, standing one by another vertically in ground... what do you think should be our priority now?
_________________________

finishing of ancient era (16 000 BC)

we have successfully developed the skill of constructing defensive palisades, this direction of next wisdom advances was very helpful, because these palisades allowed our remote settlements to be well defended against incoming attacks of barbarian clubmen... as expected, during that time we did not need our main warrior group nearby, because wooden gate alone was enough to keep them away, they were not even able to damage it currently we see developed ancient nation, with some remote settlements and several larger city-states, with broader roads built between them. We learned to create stony huts and defensive walls, which withstand much larger pressure of enemy forces than ever before. Pottery and agriculture increases our food supplies and production, many of us, previously working as hunters and gatherers, became more specialized workers. We already know how to create apple trees in larger quantities, and we call such places orchards. We have soaps to clean everything around us, candles and oil lamps to make nights brighter than before, we can write about our stories, and we can create strong and shiny metals such as copper, bronze and gold. We constructed pyramids and sphinx in our capital, and currently we work on transforming our ruling caste into much more powerful and efficient group. We will call these philosophical concepts monarchy and despotism... soon we will go out of ancient times, and our times will be called classical. We use captured slaves to speed up scientific efforts, and we reduce maintenance costs of our cities by developing traits that are best suited for this purpose - negotiator, negligent, aloof and organized. Our settlers will soon colonize much further and denser than we could imagine in the past
_________________________

before finish of classical: kemetism religion for free school of scribes and +5% science in all cities, mesopotamism for hammurabi stele (free courthouses), golden age from valley of kings to change civics while in golden age, national beliefs (reduction of crime from slaves increased science output by about 10%)

classical era

turn 1886 - BC 14 600
https://i.imgur.com/GTrrXM0.png

In classical, tech priorities were these that add specialists in all cities;
aristocracy and military training (promotions to enable multiple attacks per turn by same unit), ancient medicine (hypocratic oath gives free healer's hut, which when obsolete will upgrade to next tier), waterproof concrete before aqueducts and sewer systems (these reduce disease, allow more advanced housing autobuilds, and lyceum building), capturing large number of captives which are transfered to cities by horsemen specialised in transportation.

medieval era

turn 2187 - BC 10 558
https://i.imgur.com/Yi6gZpj.png

by this time, whole continent is captured, I am trying to increase gold output in order to allow more cities within maintenance limits. Focusing on all world wonders that give free buildings in every city. First tech choices are engineering, vassalage, feudalism and guilds, all these will allow to change civics to much more powerful ones, by the end of medieval I am expecting to fill whole home continent with cities, and perhaps abandon slavery.

Getting several civics from the beginning allows to reduce maintenance and increase income, serfdom civic synergises well with slaves, I build many settlers to use increased capacity. Doubtful if it's good idea to change caste system and loose unlimited engineers, but feudalism has lower maintenance and higher outputs. Unsure about guilds compared to trade when it comes to economy, smaller quantity of trade routes and higher maintenance, for better specialists. Soon leaving home continent, perhaps encountering much better developed civilizations. I have 5k culture output and 2.4 million missing to next trait selection, I am hoping to finish medieval before next trait choice so I can get scientific II or organized II immediately.

Medieval construction priorities: ancient customs, aqueduct, sever system, lyceum, port, jeweler, crafts hut, tapestry workshop, furniture workshop (some buildings have much higher incomes than majority of others)
 
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tramwajg

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Messages
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Spoiler moved to first post :
finishing of ancient era (16 000 BC)

we have successfully developed the skill of constructing defensive palisades, this direction of next wisdom advances was very helpful, because these palisades allowed our remote settlements to be well defended against incoming attacks of barbarian clubmen... as expected, during that time we did not need our main warrior group nearby, because wooden gate alone was enough to keep them away, they were not even able to damage it currently we see developed ancient nation, with some remote settlements and several larger city-states, with broader roads built between them. We learned to create stony huts and defensive walls, which withstand much larger pressure of enemy forces than ever before. Pottery and agriculture increases our food supplies and production, many of us, previously working as hunters and gatherers, became more specialized workers. We already know how to create apple trees in larger quantities, and we call such places orchards. We have soaps to clean everything around us, candles and oil lamps to make nights brighter than before, we can write about our stories, and we can create strong and shiny metals such as copper, bronze and gold. We constructed pyramids and sphinx in our capital, and currently we work on transforming our ruling caste into much more powerful and efficient group. We will call these philosophical concepts monarchy and despotism... soon we will go out of ancient times, and our times will be called classical. We use captured slaves to speed up scientific efforts, and we reduce maintenance costs of our cities by developing traits that are best suited for this purpose - negotiator, negligent, aloof and organized. Our settlers will soon colonize much further and denser than we could imagine in the past
 

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Somebody613

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LOOOL!!!
I'm way too lazy to do one myself, but this surely inspires me to try my own Eternity game again, lol.
 

Somebody613

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WTF?!
I'm playing a similar Nightmare Eternity game on Pit's Earth (no barbs to save up on turn time) - as (custom civ) Israel, no less, and that means getting TWO Nature Wonders from the start.
(Hint: Pit so far kept his map "rigged" for a "cheating" Jerusalem placement - getting both the [Mount Sinai] AND the [Dead Sea] Nature Wonders. Thanks, Pit!)
As of now, I'm around turn 700.
I suck at the bottom of the scoreboard, I got Venus stolen right from in front of me (100 turns before I could finish it, lol), and my city is still at size 1, while everyone else is at least 2 or even 3.
Sure, I unlocked Judaism in Jerusalem (duh), but that's so long-term that it almost doesn't count for now.
And I've been told that I'm not even on the Most Advanced civs list altogether, damn.
Okay, I can suffer for 700 more turns to see whether I can drag myself out of this dumpster - OR maybe I should just restart on Settler Eternity, simply to spite everyone and myself, lol.
Ah, well, I do guess that NOT waging ANY wars might have been the culprit in the first place (including freebies that come from captured units).
Still: WTF?!
 

Somebody613

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Restarted the same map from the start, now focusing on hunting and not focusing on fighting crime/disease so strictly (it seems to stay manageable for now anyways).
Well, so far so good.
Had to reload a couple times due to losing rather valuable units to stupid ambushes (and Eternity is not a speed that allows you to waste units, I don't care if it's "cheating").
We shall see what comes out of it, of course.
Stopping for today, though, need to do other stuff.
Like, lol, sleeping, ya know.
 

tramwajg

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Location
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hi! what are your technology routes and trait choices? my turn 692 (the closest save to 700 I was able to find) looks like below:

at this time, I am also not present in most advanced civilizations, at the beginning others are faster. I am slowly building advantage by min-maxing science output to a maximum degree, so that:
- language for natural wonder and civic
- cave dwelling for auto build housing and world wonder
- oral tradition for civic (+1 science)
- in between, if nothing better, I build several story tellers to increase education above +100
- gathering to start building various items gatherers for a total of +5 production
- cooperation for communal civic (+1 or +2 science)
- prehistoric dance and cultural identity (1-2 science, possibly with shelter building to create dances which give education and culture, speeding up first trait choice)
- prioritising lascaux paintings and usually having it built using captives to speed up production, most games finished by 100 000 bc, AI usually has it done by 90 000 bc. I don't use all captives, rather storing them to have settled slaves after slavery
- basketry, weaving, binding, depending on which resources I have nearby
- trails for woodsman III promotion (greatly increases power of units)
- if I don't find any military units in good hut (best outcome is stone axeman) I build three brutes, merge to 150 hp 1.5 str, and start collecting experience. I try to get neanderthal culture and clubmen as soon as possible, promotions are usually combat I-III or woodsman I-III, movement speed, led by great general but that takes a lot of fights on eternity
- if possible I try to settle 3 tiles from AI or barb city, which after growing to size 2 can be captured (economy has to be prepared for maintenance), it is visible on screen above
- soft hammer percussion, scraping, chopping, piercing, carving for total +5 science from stone tools workshop
- all technologies that give national wonders, +gold from stone tools workshop, and housing autobuilds, depending on accessible resources. In this game I got philosophical as first trait and built national wonders for free specialists, but after reconsidering, I would have taken scientific as first.
- tribalism to create new cities around resources that are helpful at this point (stones, dye, obsidian), keeping at least 3000 gold in treasury and +30 income before building new city. Tribes travel together with military units which will later defend city
- druidism and shamanism, AI usually gets these by 40 000 bc
- slavery to use stored captives, which I have about 20 by this time
- tengriism to create double-merged horseman with special promotions (wind horse I-II if I remember correctly) led by great general, very powerful unit that can be used to get more captives and protect borders
- chiefdom for world wonder (also needs megalith construction and gives free chief's hut everywhere, reduced crime and maintenance in all cities, usable until republic)
- changing civics mostly if there is 0 anarchy, otherwise waiting for golden age. exception is caste system to allow unlimited scientists
- I am still not familiar with cultures, but if you look at tech tree and check which resources you have in cities, you may get a large advantage by being able to build special units
- 2nd trait choices: philosophical, scientific, aloof; 3rd trait organised (reduced maintenance and large increase to production from slavery), 4th negotiator and negligent (large reduction in maintenance and future benefit to trade routes, which are decisive for economy beginning from around atomic era)

if having hunters, I am not setting them to auto hunt, it usually leads to them coming near barbarians and dying, same with using forced march setting. Crime is not too big issue in prehistory and I am not using any buildings, starting to fight it around classical era, when effects are increasing. Disease is a problem mostly in cities with large quantities of slaves, and it significantly reduces city output by creating unhappiness and reducing outcomes. it's helpful to build alpha females, bath ritual, outhouse, healer's hut, however there's also opportunity cost, if you build medical units or buildings, this time will not be spent building science or gold income. From my experience, it's certainly worth reducing disease if it exceeds 325.

lack of war means lack of experienced promoted units to use later, no captives and no captured cities, everything needs to be build by tribes instead, and economy without slaves is weaker, it's harder to min-max size of empire and science output within current maintenance limits :) however, if you spawn on a small island or have no AI nearby, nothing can be done :)

Spoiler moved to first post :
before finish of classical: kemetism religion for free school of scribes and +5% science in all cities, mesopotamism for hammurabi stele (free courthouses), golden age from valley of kings to change civics while in golden age, national beliefs (reduction of crime from slaves increased science output by about 10%)

classical era

turn 1886 - BC 14 600

In classical, tech priorities were these that add specialists in all cities;
aristocracy and military training (promotions to enable multiple attacks per turn by same unit), ancient medicine (hypocratic oath gives free healer's hut, which when obsolete will upgrade to next tier), waterproof concrete before aqueducts and sewer systems (these reduce disease, allow more advanced housing autobuilds, and lyceum building), capturing large number of captives which are transfered to cities by horsemen specialised in transportation.

medieval era
turn 2187 - BC 10 558

by this time, whole continent is captured, I am trying to increase gold output in order to allow more cities within maintenance limits. Focusing on all world wonders that give free buildings in every city. First tech choices are engineering, vassalage, feudalism and guilds, all these will allow to change civics to much more powerful ones, by the end of medieval I am expecting to fill whole home continent with cities, and perhaps abandon slavery
 
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Somebody613

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I'm confused.
Is that really a Nightmare game?
Sure, you've captured another city at an unknown point in time, that's a serious boost overall.
But you have Great People points at a ridiculous rate (around 300 turns) in ONE city, which means you also have built quite a few Wonders and are Philosophical at the least.
So, what - should I've started by building 30 Stone Throwers and suicide-capturing Alexandria?
This would also give me Neanderthals, since there's Stone near it.
You know, maybe I actually WILL run a game just for that, even if it feels counter-intuitive in regards to building the two Nature Wonders that I get almost immediately (Language).
Since those take me like 100 turns to actually build (even one of them), so I'd have a nice army by that time, and could also just upgrade them for gold when I research better units.
Damn, this sounds like a GOOD strategy, loool.
You know what - I'm convinced: I SHALL DO IT NOW.
:badcomp: :badcomp: :badcomp: :badcomp: :badcomp:

Some notes:
I'm playing without Barbs now, because the current AI is still stupid enough to clog turn times by building droves of pointless units.
This means that I have limited unit capturing pool, but I also never use Slavery in the first place (though I do enjoy the hammer boosts from captives, yeah).
But I'm prioritizing not falling asleep while waiting for my turn over any map-related benefit, so it's currently a "problem".
Since you convinced me to try expanding as soon as possible, AND Egypt has Stone in easy access - my to-do plan is:
-Building a suicide-squad-horde to overrun Alexandria.
-Building Neanderthal culture.
-Streamlining to Axemen (pity you can't build a Wolverine, though, mwahahaha).
-Eliminating everyone I can reach with my merged NeaderAxemen Generals.
-Getting the automatic major boost from all these cities I'll capture, duh.
Oh, and I play with "indestructible cities", so I never need to care to wait until they grow to size 2, loool.
This has its own downsides (clogging the map, duh), but it just means that I need to eliminate everyone FASTER, loool.
So, yeah, I think I'll actually try THIS approach now, heh.

More notes:
Had to edit the map to make all civs EQUAL.
For some reason (whether intentionally or not), Pit gave some civs rather unfair promotions (up to TWO) from the start, and also somehow forgot to give one civ half its units.
And when I was inserting Israel, I thought it was fun to not give it ANY units besides the Tribal Guardian.
So, I now have everyone getting 2 Spiked Clubmen and 1 Clubman (as was seemingly intended), plus 1 Tribal Guardian (default) - and ALL of them without ANY promotions whatsoever.
Or maybe I should go the OTHER way around - and REMOVE the not-yet-researched units instead?
Both approaches have their pros and cons (instant hunting -vs- harder conquest), so I'm not sure which is better.
 
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Somebody613

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MWAHAHAHAHAHA!!!
Random Culture Flip Is Randomly RANDOM!!!
Though totally expected and welcome, hehehe.
Finally, I can play a game that isn't me trying to catch an ostrich while riding a tortoise.
Check the screens, lol.
Goal 1: Neanderthals.
Goal 2: Venus.
Goal 3: Master Hunter.
Goal 4: The FOOD is served - let's EAT!
 

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Blazenclaw

eccentric eclectic
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MWAHAHAHAHAHA!!!
Random Culture Flip Is Randomly RANDOM!!!
Though totally expected and welcome, hehehe.
Finally, I can play a game that isn't me trying to catch an ostrich while riding a tortoise.
Check the screens, lol.
Goal 1: Neanderthals.
Goal 2: Venus.
Goal 3: Master Hunter.
Goal 4: The FOOD is served - let's EAT!
If this is from svn 11502... well, two tiles from the other city and you having two natural wonders is indeed pretty broken in your favor. You expanded borders twice before they could expand a single time!
If you happen to have the save from right before Egypt flipped, I still might want to take a look though.
 

Somebody613

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If this is from svn 11502... well, two tiles from the other city and you having two natural wonders is indeed pretty broken in your favor. You expanded borders twice before they could expand a single time!
If you happen to have the save from right before Egypt flipped, I still might want to take a look though.
No, I haven't updated SVN today yet, on purpose.
This is old culture spreading system, useless for your current testing.
On the other hand, I was outputting so much more culture in general that I doubt the difference in calculations would matter much.
If not making it the other way around - subduing Egypt way faster due to me outputting several times more culture-per-turn, lol.
I mean this is how I understand your update, right?
But you are welcome to take a look anyways, lol.
 

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Blazenclaw

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Trying to do the math in my head for the new system, if you output 4x the culture Egypt does, you'll have roughly equal culture in their city, I think, which would mean there'd be maybe 2% revolt risk per turn on normal speed? Will test with updated svn later out of curiosity.
 

Somebody613

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Trying to do the math in my head for the new system, if you output 4x the culture Egypt does, you'll have roughly equal culture in their city, I think, which would mean there'd be maybe 2% revolt risk per turn on normal speed? Will test with updated svn later out of curiosity.
Well, culture flips ARE random as heck.
I could have 80% of my culture in their city - and NOT get it for eons.
Or I could barely infiltrate the city and almost immediately get it to flip - like most probably happened here.
I've seen both cases happen, hence me making fun of it being RANDOM.
Cause it IS random, lol.
 

tramwajg

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I'm confused.
Is that really a Nightmare game?
Sure, you've captured another city at an unknown point in time, that's a serious boost overall.
But you have Great People points at a ridiculous rate (around 300 turns) in ONE city, which means you also have built quite a few Wonders and are Philosophical at the least.
hey, yes, it's nightmare non scaling, here save from this point so you can see how it's built, sources are: +4 from uluru wonder, +1 from lascaux paintings, +3 from free specialist, +2 and +50% from philosophical. I would not delay construction of natural wonder, creating units and capturing a city will need gold for maintenance, if done too early can destroy economy (science expenses drop to 0% and if still deficit, it starts to disband military units)

culture flipping indeed lucky, that should help in getting much better economy early. If you didn't get first trait yet, my choice would be scientific, I would also increase education to >100 in both cities. Master hunter sounds like good choice too, with two cities you should get +0.40 science per every type of built folklore (scaling with number of cities), and your continent is huge. I remember one of my previous games, that was with start near victoria falls (my favourite natural wonder), culture flip of nearby city happened at about 51% :)

updated bottom of first post (beginning of medieval era)
 

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Somebody613

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hey, yes, it's nightmare non scaling, here save from this point so you can see how it's built, sources are: +4 from uluru wonder, +1 from lascaux paintings, +3 from free specialist, +2 and +50% from philosophical. I would not delay construction of natural wonder, creating units and capturing a city will need gold for maintenance, if done too early can destroy economy (science expenses drop to 0% and if still deficit, it starts to disband military units)

culture flipping indeed lucky, that should help in getting much better economy early. If you didn't get first trait yet, my choice would be scientific, I would also increase education to >100 in both cities. Master hunter sounds like good choice too, with two cities you should get +0.40 science per every type of built folklore (scaling with number of cities), and your continent is huge. I remember one of my previous games, that was with start near victoria falls (my favourite natural wonder), culture flip of nearby city happened at about 51% :)
About the last point (and I'm too lazy to check your save, sorry):
I'm playing Pit's Earth, just edited to replace "Native Indians" (a self-superfluous civ name) with "Israel" (I'm Jewish, lol, AND Jerusalem gets two Natural Wonders, which is why I'm playing it).
But the only edit is to remove one civ and add one civ-with-city, nothing else is changed whatsoever.
Correction: Pit wasn't overly consistent in what he gave each civ at the start (not sure if deliberately), I fixed that by making ALL civs receive the exact same units with no "cheaters".
But it's still the exact "official" map, and that means all other starting cities are Pit's and unedited.
Thus, I'm pretty sure the only way you could "culture flip a city near Victoria Falls" was via random civs (or maybe Barbarian uprising, you tell me).

Now, as of my current playthrough (not playing now), I'm already building Neanderthal Culture (and quite quickly, less than 40 turns) - and that's immediately a huge boost in military power.
I do hope there exists a Neanderthal Master "Hunter" (whatever actual unit will be available at the time) - and that will be a MASSIVE hunting boost, even better than in military.
Because already Chasers get x3 Strength vs animals - and the weakest Master unit is probably at 3 Strength.
Thus, I can literally blindly attack ANY animal, maybe besides some cheating "raging" Mammoths - and kill them with zero issues.
This is also kinda why I removed Barbarians (for turn length reasons, but also for easier hunting - I have trouble with bears and tigers alone, no need for MORE annoying ambushes).
Thus, once I finally get the Master Hunter, I'll be getting lots and lots of hunting boosts, too.
Ohhh! I totally forgot, but now remembered, a very neat TRICK.
You see, some Neanderthal units are "disguised as Barbarians", so I can use them all I want - and I will NOT get any war troubles.
Better yet (but debatable, I need to calculate this one) - I can capture a city, turn it into a Barb city this way, and THEN capture it with a normal unit.
And I literally can do it in the span of 2-3 turns (meaning that Barbs will not be able to build any defenses in there), thus having a "geopolitical cheat" like no other, lol.
Oh, and I also finally have a chance to build Venus, though it'd take me some effort - and I must do it blindly, since I don't know what the other civs are doing with it.
Which is both "anti-cheating" AND "beyond-annoying", because in my previous game I spent like 200 turns on building it, only to FAIL, because some shmuck was faster.
There's a reason why I HATE playing Eternity for non-military gameplays - your Wonders are much more likely to be "stolen", and you'd waste TONS of TURNS on essentially NOTHING.
But, hopefully, not this time, lol.
 

Somebody613

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Reporting SUCCESS so far:
1. Built Venus and now have both cities at Top-1 and Top-2, lol.
2. Master Chaser is wrecking chaos in the midst of poor unsuspecting animals.
3. Neanderthal Warrior harasses stupid enemies who think it's a Barbarian.
4. I'm literally at the TOP on all counts, including having 5x culture compared to the next best civ.
5. And yes, this is a Nightmare Eternity game, so this is also a Proof Of Concept that you CAN win such games (even if under very specific conditions like "cheating" civs and locations).
LOOOL!!!
 

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Somebody613

Emperor
Joined
Nov 18, 2019
Messages
1,616
Got a MAF, not gonna reload for now (I'm playing in "bursts", lol).
My NeaderBarb city-capturing strategy works like a charm.
My pseudo-Barbie-with-a-spiked-club(lol) is finally strong enough to solo take on Tribal Guardians, so I already captured Istanbul and am now harassing Babylon, loool.
And it takes a measly N.Warrior to walk into the city ruins that theoretically are infested with Barbies (but none have spawned yet, since it's TOO chaotic even for them) - and Take It For ME!
MWAHAHAHA!!!
Would've captured Babylon as well in a few turns, but the dumb MAF reminded me to make a gaming break for a while, lol, so I'll just do it next time.
I'm currently The Top Player in basically everything (probably, didn't exactly check it before the MAF), and that's only gonna increase now that I started capturing more cities.
So, yeah, I can say that it's very much possible to win a Nightmare Eternity game... as an Israeli Jerusalem, loool.
Maybe doable (with luck) in other modes, but so far this is the only game that was THIS much decisive for me.
 

Somebody613

Emperor
Joined
Nov 18, 2019
Messages
1,616
Aaand I think I don't really need to continue playing this particular game - it's clearly WON.
First in absolutely everything, more than double score compared to second best, five cities compared to everyone's mere one - and nothing stops me from expanding further.
I. Have. WON. This. One. Really.
Nice to know it, lol.
 

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tramwajg

Warlord
Joined
May 9, 2014
Messages
202
Location
Poland
congratulations, you built much better economy than I had at this point (83 000 bc), I am curious which one of our civilizations would win in long term game if we played multiplayer :) I will soon be posting topic with new game from prehistoric era, I have new idea for trait order. How do you balance maintenance costs? -33 gold/turn seems efficient for 5 cities with some that far away from capital

update: I checked your save:) if you play again, look at building called "stone tools workshop", it requires rock gatherer to be built first, and with some technologies from prehistory, it adds +5 production, gold and science, until metal casting related technologies from late ancient era.
 
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Somebody613

Emperor
Joined
Nov 18, 2019
Messages
1,616
congratulations, you built much better economy than I had at this point (83 000 bc), I am curious which one of our civilizations would win in long term game if we played multiplayer :) I will soon be posting topic with new game from prehistoric era, I have new idea for trait order. How do you balance maintenance costs? -33 gold/turn seems efficient for 5 cities with some that far away from capital

update: I checked your save:) if you play again, look at building called "stone tools workshop", it requires rock gatherer to be built first, and with some technologies from prehistory, it adds +5 production, gold and science, until metal casting related technologies from late ancient era.
I only started getting negative gold-per-turn after capturing Persepolis (and it's still in Disorder, so the upcoming dip will be harsher), lol.
Even Babylon (pacified, obviously) didn't dip it beneath zero income.
In fact, I'm pretty sure this DOESN'T even come from the cities to begin with - but from the bunch of Gatherers that I built recently.
So, given how they DIE per improvement, this will diminish fairly quickly all on its own.
I'm not entirely sure where all this existing gold (over 2k) came from, though, but probably my "travels" helped a lot, giving 500 gold per "discovered Wonder".
And I also wasn't focusing on raising income via buildings, since it was positive all on its own, lol.
Anyways, not sure I need to continue this game altogether, because I'm undeniably the winner here - and you can see that Tribalism is also coming soon.
Thus, I can literally take over the entire region, capturing the existing cities and filling the gaps with my own new ones.
To sum up:
1. Israel is a cheat, lol. TWO Natural Wonders from the very start is a huge bonus. Sure, in other plot aspects Jerusalem is rather mediocre, but the Wonders do wonders, lol.
2. No Barbarians is also a cheat, and not just with turn time (which was the real reason why I turned them off). They would cause a lot of trouble for my far-traveling units, sadly.
So, while I definitely proved that I can easily win a Super-Hard-and-Super-Slow game with Israel and without Barbarians, it's not yet a full Proof Of Concept for a Random Civ with Barbarians.
Not that I'd care much about that, though, loool.
But it was a nice challenge, indeed.
Still, it's way too slow and boring, so I'm probably not gonna continue this game for now, if ever.
Maybe I'll try a Full Barbarian run next - with Barb Cities and Barb Civs and Neanderthals as well, loool, which also gives the interesting benefit of Captives used as hammers, lol.
I only hope that wouldn't clog the turn time beyond any reasonable amounts - because THAT is an instant reason to NOT play with those options.
It'll be somewhat harder to play in general as well, but that's what the challenge is about - but unreasonable turn time is something I outright HATE.
We shall see, lol.
 
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