Solving the "opioid crisis"

[hobbsyoyo]

Yeah, no. My younger brother has bad ADHD, it's not a "made up" diagnosis. It's not "acting like a kid," without medication he literally can't function as a normal person.

ADHD is a real thing.

It's also a real thing that parents push their doctors to proscribe meds for their 'ADHD' kids when they're just being kids or are misbehaved. It's a real problem. Unfortunately I can't give my anecdotal evidence but I've seen it and I've known of people second hand who did it.

By no means am I judging your brother, your parents or anyone who is afflicted with this disorder. But there are crappy parents who do a terrible job raising their kids and turn to drugs as a corrective action inappropriately.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

I don't know the timeline, but yes, there was obviously a time before ADD/ADHD was discovered, when parents "just had to deal with" it. The same is true of any number of other developmental disorders, mental illnesses, and so on.

But if you're going where I think you're going, why not just come right out and say you think my parents were so incompetent or lazy or whatever that instead of "dealing with it" they resorted to medication to solve a non-existent problem?

That's not where I'm going. Incompetence and laziness aren't the issue. Reliance on "medical professionals" is the issue. I grew up in the early days of "better living through chemistry." Absolutely anything that my grandparents had dealt with my parents were promised that they didn't have to...there was a pill for that. The whole concept of medical repair was tossed out the window in favor of medical improvement. Forty years later as my mom's body basically disintegrated under the gigantic dosages of all kinds of stuff that she had built up decades of tolerance to the whole idea that it had all been improvements seemed laughable, but back then no one had any inkling of the damage long term usage would do.

We've turned things around, somewhat, but the concept that it is better to ride things out and make the body regulate itself is still generally scoffed at. Anti-depressants; life sentence. Blood pressure regulators; life sentence. Ritalin; life sentence. I'll pass, thanks.

 

[Synobun]

Super easy to say that when you're not in a position to need those things.

 

[stinkubus]

The medical field is full of plenty of bad actors; a bit of skepticism (and a second opinion) is always a good thing.

 

[Lexicus]

Medications can be used and prescribed improperly. But the idea that they, or conditions like ADHD, are some giant scam is harmful and is something I take personally.

 

[Azem.Ocram]

Overprescription of painkillers and mental health drugs is a problem. Yes, they can be a lot of help in many situations but they do more harm than good in certain situations in which they are used.

Why can't we all, all just be honest
Admit to ourselves that everyone's on it
From grown politicians to young adolescents
Prescribing themselves anti-depressants
Now how can we start to tackle the problem
If you don't put your hands up and admit that you're on them
The kids are in danger, they're all getting habits
From what I can see everyone's at it

 

[Lexicus]

We just need to get the paradigm toward human-centric instead of pharmaceutical-corporation-profit-centric. Should be a relatively easy task

 

[Timsup2nothin]

Originally there was a lot of human centricness about it. Happy family, low stress, just a vast improvement over the life previous generations were stuck with because we came along at the right time for Mother's Little Helper. Who could have guessed that an entire generation of parents bombed out on Quaaludes would be some sort of problem? And the beat goes on. The drugs change, the diagnoses change, but the concept that somehow our generation has it better because chemistry is a blessing never dies.

 

[Narz]

Probably already been said but just legalize weed idiots. And subsidize counseling & yoga for everyone, Americans are some traumatized mofos

There is 0% focus on self-care in the US, I'm learning it (barely) finally in my late 30s.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

By performing asanas the sadhaka first gains health, which is not mere existence. It is not a commodity which can be purchased with money. It is an asset to be gained by sheer hard work.

 

[inthesomeday]

Originally there was a lot of human centricness about it. Happy family, low stress, just a vast improvement over the life previous generations were stuck with because we came along at the right time for Mother's Little Helper. Who could have guessed that an entire generation of parents bombed out on Quaaludes would be some sort of problem? And the beat goes on. The drugs change, the diagnoses change, but the concept that somehow our generation has it better because chemistry is a blessing never dies.

It really all started with penicillin tbh. Ever since they started “prescribing” “antibiotics” to people with “diseases” like “cholera” our society became hooked on “medicine” from “doctors”.

 

[Berzerker]

when Trump is lining up the drug dealers for execution, he can start with his corporate donors

 

[Timsup2nothin]

It really all started with penicillin tbh. Ever since they started “prescribing” “antibiotics” to people with “diseases” like “cholera” our society became hooked on “medicine” from “doctors”.

I have never heard a doctor prescribe an antibiotic and say "yeah, this is a management program you'll be on for the rest of your life." Ask the next person you meet that is on a blood pressure medication what their doctor says about how they get off it. Ask the next person you meet that takes a "mood enhancer" what their doctor says about getting them off of it. Ask the next person you meet that uses pills to get to sleep when their doctor predicts their unmedicated future will start.

 

[inthesomeday]

Nobody is contesting that doctors are shady about mental health. To claim that ADD was invented to sell pills is so shockingly abstracted from that I don’t know how you can possibly even see the two as connected.

It is horribly ableist to perpetuate the idea that people lie about their mental health to get high. It is just as ableist to claim that people’s mental health problems don’t exist at all, or that they don’t need the medication that helps them to overcome them.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

Nobody is contesting that doctors are shady about mental health. To claim that ADD was invented to sell pills is so shockingly abstracted from that I don’t know how you can possibly even see the two as connected.

It is horribly ableist to perpetuate the idea that people lie about their mental health to get high. It is just as ableist to claim that people’s mental health problems don’t exist at all, or that they don’t need the medication that helps them to overcome them.

Mental health is a spectrum. If you acted like I act and weren't prepared to explain yourself you'd likely end up in a box somewhere "for your own protection and the safety of others." That's my normal place on the spectrum. Plenty of doctors would certainly be willing to provide me with a "more normal life," and would no doubt believe, even in what I laughingly call their greedy little hearts of hearts, that they were doing me a service. Also undoubtedly, a great many people would take them up on their offer if they were in my place, but I am quite normal enough for me.

So the question becomes, who makes the calls? Ritalin is generally prescribed to people deemed too young to be allowed to make any sort of call for themselves. We live in a society where not taking a doctor's advice is itself designated as a sure sign of being too abnormal to be allowed. Law enforcement would certainly prefer that every inmate be medicated into submission and any potentially dangerous not yet inmate right along with 'em, and our national pass time of stacking the elderly like cord word would hardly be possible if we didn't reduce them to drooling bed bound shells, so it's hard to imagine any great societal impetus to treat unruly kids any differently. That's not any one person's fault, it's the world we've built.

 

[BvBPL]

Forty years later as my mom's body basically disintegrated under the gigantic dosages of all kinds of stuff that she had built up decades of tolerance to the whole idea that it had all been improvements seemed laughable, but back then no one had any inkling of the damage long term usage would do.

What's your opinion on the legalization of recreational drugs?

 

[Bamspeedy]

As a frame of reference to the scope of the problem:

Two pharmacies in a West Virginia town with a population roughly 3000 distributed 21 MILLION doses of hydrocodone and oxycodone between 2006 and 2016.

https://futurism.com/west-virginia-town-3000-received-21-million-opioid-pills-10-years/

Hamlen County Tennessee had 3 opiate prescriptions written PER PERSON in 2008.

https://www.tennessean.com/story/ne...ioid-progress-see-interactive-map/1088031001/

Was there an online distributor in that town or something? Selling pills over the internet should be illegal if it's not already.

Keep in mind small town pharmacies attract people outside the town and if nearby towns don't have their own pharmacy you attract people from other towns. In Appalachia that may even mean people from other counties.

Hamlen County has a Veteran's Clinic which can attract veterans from outside the county. Counting 'prescriptions' is kind of tricky isn't it? Do people on long-term prescriptions stilll have to pick up a 30-day supply, thus gettting 12 prescriptions per year for that one medicine?

But even with that, it seems too high, so...it is more likely they had a 'Candy Man' type doctor like the one who got busted at the VA hospital near me who was known for giving out generous painkiller prescriptions.

Just out of curiosity, were you saying "rescue medicine is needed right now" twenty years ago? Or did this just start when overdoses became more common among more affluent, more white, addicts?

I know this wasn't directed at me, but 20 years ago I didn't know of any illegal stuff other than "this is your brain on drugs" messages.

10 years ago after being involved with a 'pill popper' I was on this forum telling people that 'self-medication' is a terrible thing (and can link the posts to prove it).

Now I just don't care. Sure, the doctors and drug companies are to blame, but so are the users (in many, but not all cases). While the stats may say the vast majority of opioid overdoses are from legal prescriptions, they don't tell you how many of those started using prescriptions that were not prescribed to them who then later went to their doctor to get their own after they developed 'pain' after their 'recreational hobby'.

https://blogs.scientificamerican.co...lem-but-pain-prescriptions-are-not-the-cause/

But I agree somewhat with your other posts about some issues (like anxiety) turning too rapidly to 'pop a pill' than trying other solutions. (and not to say there aren't some that have severe issues where they really do need medication).

 

[inthesomeday]

Mental health is a spectrum.

Right, so it’s pretty unfortunate every single person alive receives the same prescribed dose. If only we found some way to deal with mental health problems proportional to their severity...

If you acted like I act and weren't prepared to explain yourself you'd likely end up in a box somewhere "for your own protection and the safety of others." That's my normal place on the spectrum. Plenty of doctors would certainly be willing to provide me with a "more normal life," and would no doubt believe, even in what I laughingly call their greedy little hearts of hearts, that they were doing me a service. Also undoubtedly, a great many people would take them up on their offer if they were in my place, but I am quite normal enough for me.

But this is the thing, it’s not really just based on basically how you behave that diagnoses are made, it takes a long interview and analysis process and, depending on the intended diagnosis, also extensive medical tests. ADD diagnoses aren’t like “we’ll Jimmy’s pulling Fs in class, better prescribe him 2k mg of Ritalin to be taken twice daily”, they require a much deeper and more extensive process to achieve a diagnosis.

That said, I’m not by any means saying the way we medically handle mental health is flawless, nor how we socially handle it, obviously. I’m just saying you’re being horribly unfair to it yourself, and what you offer as a solution is not actually a solution at all. The situation is this: patients being prescribed medicine have to pay an arm and a leg to get it. The solution you’re offering is: stop prescribing us medicine. The clearer and more coherent solution is: stop charging us so goddamn much.

More importantly, the question at hand, about this specific “opioid crisis”, equally can’t be solved by making health services less available, considering it’s a public health problem. The way to solve this is the same way you “solve” any societal drug problem, which ultimately ends up leading you to a socialist solution. Decriminalization of drug use, free and abundant health services, and re-evaluation of the drug’s practical danger to users and society. Definitely not by making unrelated things worse for unrelated people, like the ability of depressed, anxious, or low-spectrum autistic people to acquire medication for themselves.

 

[Lexicus]

Originally there was a lot of human centricness about it.

Yeah, back when we used to lock people up in asylums and lobotomize them. Totally human-centric.

I have never heard a doctor prescribe an antibiotic and say "yeah, this is a management program you'll be on for the rest of your life." Ask the next person you meet that is on a blood pressure medication what their doctor says about how they get off it. Ask the next person you meet that takes a "mood enhancer" what their doctor says about getting them off of it. Ask the next person you meet that uses pills to get to sleep when their doctor predicts their unmedicated future will start.

The fact that Berzerker liked this post should give you some indication of the waters in which you're treading.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

What's your opinion on the legalization of recreational drugs?

In favor, due to economic reality. Prohibition didn't work. There are very sound, very simple principles of economics that explained why it didn't work and why it couldn't work. Yet we continue to try. As to the drugs themselves, people have to deal with them in their own ways. Some people can be very happy in their recreational use, and some people will be chronic overusers. That isn't changed by legalization.