Some observations after beating the diety level on a small map.

[Sayounara]

Did anybody won a Deity on Large or Huge ?.

I tried several times but didn't succeed. Though I'm learning new things, I will try again soon. So far, I can only go up to Immortal on huge pangea.

 

[Ungar]

I'm working on Diety, Huge Map with Standard Settings.

Tried half a dozen serious games, but I think I have a shot at winning my latest one.

It isn't easy and you need a lot of luck.

1. Starting with Incans and using Quecha rush.

2. I lucked out on my current map. Starting city is next to a river, goodie hut, cow, elephant and there was a copper mine two squares away hidden. Hut gave me a scout. Mine was next to the same river so I didn't need to build roads to it.

3. Sent my scout out to grab other huts. Got fishing, hunting and animal husbandry. My scout got attacked left and right by wild animals, but I was able to heal him up. Picked up Combat I and Medic so now I just stick him in large stacks and they get an extra 10% heal even in enemy territory.

Researched mining and bronze working on my own. Then went for Alphabet to force AI civs to give me all their tech when negotiating peace treaties.

4. Sent my one man Quecha army out for conquest. Captured one Indian worker and then an Indian city after clearing out three archers. Quecha's have 100% strength vs archers and combat I to start. Extra promotions after winning every fight helps.

Lucked out again. Bombay was a holy city for Buddism and on the same river as my capital so there wasn't a need for roads to spread religion or copper from my mine.

5. Started using captured workers and doing forest chops like crazy to build axemen. Didn't even bother with building barricks in my newly conquered city. My capital built a barrick while researching mining and bronze working.

Here's where things get interesting. I didn't do a lot of exploration so there is a lot of hidden territory. I've got 182378273 barbarians spawning. My cities are getting attacked every other round and sometimes by a stack of three barbs.

Unfortunately for the barbs, I've got one axeman in each city and another axeman parked on my copper mine. After three or four rounds my Axemen are getting 10 exp max from defending against barbs which is enough to promote them to Combat I (aggressive), City I and City II.

I send my upgraded axemen out from Bombay one at a time to join the fight. They capture New Delhi and the last Indian city and wipe them out.

I've turned all my axemen on the Chinese nearby, but it's a stalemate so far since he's got axemen, swordsmen and more cities.

6. With all the axemen I've produced from my capital I'm waging a war on the Japanese. With some spearmen to help against chariots I've taken over four Japanese cities. One of them is the holy city for Hinduism so I control two holy cities now. Japan has three cities left and one of the is the holy city for Judaism. England just discovered Christianity and I'm going after them after I finish off the Japanese. Not sure if controlling every religion is gonna help me.

I declared a truce with the Chinese and forced them to give me Wheel, Iron Working, Masonry and some other techs. Not making any progress parking armies against fortified Chinese cities while taking out raiders with my axemen/spearmen patrols.

Really need construction here for catapults.

7. Biggest problem I have right now is tech. I think I'm really far behind in terms of research speed and my units are going to get outdated really fast, but I think I'm stuck in a conquest strategy for now. My ten cities isn't enough to overpower the AIs in tech research and I've only eliminated the Indians.

The longer it takes to eliminate AIs the faster I'm going to fall behind.

Think I'm going to keep on trying to eliminate opponents one by one until I can get a Great Prophet and convert the world to the ways of Budda and let the cash start rolling in.

I can't imagine playing Diety without the Quecha rush right now unless you do custom settings.

 

[CiverDan]

One things I pick up from this thread is the ability to use techniques like the qeucha rush to "superpromote" units. That is 6+ promotions. Units like these are very powerful and are much less likely to die if your smart with them and greatly improve your kill rate. A Quecha with Combat 5+Cover will have combined +75% and -125% for the archer.

 

[Dog of Justice]

Then went for Alphabet to force AI civs to give me all their tech when negotiating peace treaties.

You realize that depending on that makes your victory worthless since it's being fixed by the patch?

 

[Sayounara]

I'm working on Diety, Huge Map with Standard Settings.

Tried half a dozen serious games, but I think I have a shot at winning my latest one.

It isn't easy and you need a lot of luck.

1. Starting with Incans and using Quecha rush.

2. I lucked out on my current map. Starting city is next to a river, goodie hut, cow, elephant and there was a copper mine two squares away hidden. Hut gave me a scout. Mine was next to the same river so I didn't need to build roads to it.

3. Sent my scout out to grab other huts. Got fishing, hunting and animal husbandry. My scout got attacked left and right by wild animals, but I was able to heal him up. Picked up Combat I and Medic so now I just stick him in large stacks and they get an extra 10% heal even in enemy territory.

Researched mining and bronze working on my own. Then went for Alphabet to force AI civs to give me all their tech when negotiating peace treaties.

4. Sent my one man Quecha army out for conquest. Captured one Indian worker and then an Indian city after clearing out three archers. Quecha's have 100% strength vs archers and combat I to start. Extra promotions after winning every fight helps.

Lucked out again. Bombay was a holy city for Buddism and on the same river as my capital so there wasn't a need for roads to spread religion or copper from my mine.

5. Started using captured workers and doing forest chops like crazy to build axemen. Didn't even bother with building barricks in my newly conquered city. My capital built a barrick while researching mining and bronze working.

Here's where things get interesting. I didn't do a lot of exploration so there is a lot of hidden territory. I've got 182378273 barbarians spawning. My cities are getting attacked every other round and sometimes by a stack of three barbs.

Unfortunately for the barbs, I've got one axeman in each city and another axeman parked on my copper mine. After three or four rounds my Axemen are getting 10 exp max from defending against barbs which is enough to promote them to Combat I (aggressive), City I and City II.

I send my upgraded axemen out from Bombay one at a time to join the fight. They capture New Delhi and the last Indian city and wipe them out.

I've turned all my axemen on the Chinese nearby, but it's a stalemate so far since he's got axemen, swordsmen and more cities.

6. With all the axemen I've produced from my capital I'm waging a war on the Japanese. With some spearmen to help against chariots I've taken over four Japanese cities. One of them is the holy city for Hinduism so I control two holy cities now. Japan has three cities left and one of the is the holy city for Judaism. England just discovered Christianity and I'm going after them after I finish off the Japanese. Not sure if controlling every religion is gonna help me.

I declared a truce with the Chinese and forced them to give me Wheel, Iron Working, Masonry and some other techs. Not making any progress parking armies against fortified Chinese cities while taking out raiders with my axemen/spearmen patrols.

Really need construction here for catapults.

7. Biggest problem I have right now is tech. I think I'm really far behind in terms of research speed and my units are going to get outdated really fast, but I think I'm stuck in a conquest strategy for now. My ten cities isn't enough to overpower the AIs in tech research and I've only eliminated the Indians.

The longer it takes to eliminate AIs the faster I'm going to fall behind.

Think I'm going to keep on trying to eliminate opponents one by one until I can get a Great Prophet and convert the world to the ways of Budda and let the cash start rolling in.

I can't imagine playing Diety without the Quecha rush right now unless you do custom settings.

That's a strange way to try on win on a Deity HUGE map. You've got to research.

Btw, you can keep up with the AI in tech on Deity. Just make sure you keep all your cities linked with trade routes. Key early techs: Alphabet, Drama and Currency.

 

[Heroes]

I'm working on Diety, Huge Map with Standard Settings.

Unfortunately for the barbs, I've got one axeman in each city and another axeman parked on my copper mine. After three or four rounds my Axemen are getting 10 exp max from defending against barbs which is enough to promote them to Combat I (aggressive), City I and City II.

I send my upgraded axemen out from Bombay one at a time to join the fight. They capture New Delhi and the last Indian city and wipe them out.

I am using swordsmen to attack cities in an immortal level/immortal rush game, and they are pretty good. I note you use axeman instead of swordsman. Emm, maybe axeman is indeed better if you have copper, because it's cheaper and can kill spear and axeman in city. The only disadvantage is axe is more likely to be defeated by archer.

 

[Heroes]

You realize that depending on that makes your victory worthless since it's being fixed by the patch?

What happened in the patch?

 

[rjjb]

What happened in the patch?

They removed the cheesy exploit that lets you take everything a civ has just by declaring war on them and then offering peace as soon as they'll speak to you again.

Hell, even an ignorant monkey on glue could beat deity using this exploit. It's kinda hard to say you won at a given difficulty if you cheat your way to victory.

 

[Heroes]

They removed the cheesy exploit that lets you take everything a civ has just by declaring war on them and then offering peace as soon as they'll speak to you again.

Hell, even an ignorant monkey on glue could beat deity using this exploit. It's kinda hard to say you won at a given difficulty if you cheat your way to victory.

In my understanding, the exploit is this: you aks them the price for peace, they list sth, you try to put sth in your side, the system says only one side can give when negotiating peace, then you demand everything they have, and they always accept. This is of course explotive. However, if I beat them to OCC, ask them price for peace, then they could probably give all the techs they have. That seems quite right.

 

[rjjb]

In my understanding, the exploit is this: you aks them the price for peace, they list sth, you try to put sth in your side, the system says only one side can give when negotiating peace, then you demand everything they have, and they always accept. This is of course explotive. However, if I beat them to OCC, ask them price for peace, then they could probably give all the techs they have. That seems quite right.

No..

1) You call up the enemy civ and ask to trade. If the civ wants something from you (generally gold or a tech or two) remove them from the list.
2) Add everything you want from the enemy civ to the other side beit tech, gold, cities, or all of the above.
3) Ask what it would take for peace.
4) The AI tries to add stuff (likely cities) to your side but the game won't let it. It doesn't notice that the stuff isn't added to your side.
5) You accept the terms (taking what you wanted and giving the AI nothing).

As far as 'beating them to OCC,' you've lost me completely. How do you beat someone to a one city challenge? You choose that as a rule for yourself at the beginning of the game and the AI isn't bound by it. If you were playing a OCC, chances are the exploit wouldn't work unless you were way ahead in techs along a different path than the AI took and the AI was willing to trade techs. On deity, chances are you will never be in such a state.

I haven't played enough wars yet to say this with authority, but I doubt the AI would give you all their techs even if you beat them back to their last city. I've rolled over a couple civs on Noble trying to get their weakest city for peace and they refused right up until they were purged. Perhaps the AI would give one up if it was in a remote region, small, stagnant, and going into unrest via cultural pressure (or otherwise guaranteed to fall in a turn or two).

Point is, it sounded (I declared a truce with the Chinese and forced them to give me ...) like Ungar expects to have this glorious victory on Deity having used the exploit and that's just silly. As far as I'm concerned, Ungar admitted defeat the moment the exploit was used.

Jeremy.