Maybe if you were better than the AI at managing happiness it wouldn’t be a problem? <shrugs>
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Maybe if you were better than the AI at managing happiness it wouldn’t be a problem? <shrugs>
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pza
Prince
- Joined
- Oct 20, 2017
- Messages
- 365
Then stop improving AI!
Also, please stop either beeing sarcastic, butthurt or sassy, whatever that is. I'd much rather know your thoughts on the topic, like whether you see the problem, if so, find it important, if so, have ideas for solutions, if so, are working on something, and if so, will be able to wrap it in a halloween themed box? or whatever your thoughts may be.
BiteInTheMark
Deity
It wasnt me reporting happiness drops in the hundreds.... and 76ers reported heavy happiness problems in a AI only game, so..... no bad human skill involved.
I see the question justified, why the need reductions of the buildings have increased. And ask in the same time, if a lower increase of unhappiness by the mechanic (less influence by tech, population, era, etc.....) and less reduction of needs by buildigns could solve such problems?
Then stop improving AI!
Also, please stop either beeing sarcastic, butthurt or sassy, whatever that is. I'd much rather know your thoughts on the topic, like whether you see the problem, if so, find it important, if so, have ideas for solutions, if so, are working on something, and if so, will be able to wrap it in a halloween themed box? or whatever your thoughts may be.
Sweet, glorious, all-American sarcasm, and I have zero shame about it. See below.
I can't really talk to you when you speak from a place of ignorance. -75% 'needs reduction' is not a flat %, it is a -75% thrown into a complex algorithm. The values are higher than before because - gasp!- the algorithm changed a few versions back and the 'bigger numbers' have less of a final impact on needs than before. I noted this at the time, and have mentioned it since, but you step in here and act like you have all the answers and 'stupid Gazebo' doesn't want to do the easy thing and just fix it. Please, stop.
There will always be a few aberrations when using medians and procedural weighted increases with so many moving parts. 1-2 reports of wonk in thousands of combined game hours from the community is not indicative of anything worth 'fixing,' nor is it solved by 'one weird trick!' that developers hate.
The biggest issue was the spiral, and the spiral is no more. In pza's case, it was probably a wombo combo of ending GA, ending trade routes/deals, some CS alliance changes, religious follower slip, and a bump in median caused by tech progression.
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tu_79
Deity
Or a bug. Never discard it.
I won't rule it out, but without a report with logs and a savegame, discussions of player games are nigh useless. I can't do much with 'feels bad,' unfortunately.
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tu_79
Deity
If it helps, such reports come always from people with huge empires.
I really love the sassy, benevolent dictator you've grown into over the years.If they came from people with huge tracts of logs it'd be even more helpful.
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Long live Gazebo!!
tommytoxen
Warlord
I'm an amateur by the standards of the rest of you, just a causal. I just like to play and build my empire. I don't micromanage every little detail or tryhard at everything or maximize roles and specialists and all that malarkey. I just.. play.
But I never ever have any trouble with happiness. So I'm not sure why those who are more into the intricate details of optimising their empire are having trouble with happiness. If anything I find happiness a little too easy to manage.
Though I do exclusively play extremely tall as possible and go around desperately trading for every luxury resource I don't have, declaring war and puppeting only when a civ is being unreasonable and won't gibs in a fair trade.
But I never ever have any trouble with happiness. So I'm not sure why those who are more into the intricate details of optimising their empire are having trouble with happiness. If anything I find happiness a little too easy to manage.
Though I do exclusively play extremely tall as possible and go around desperately trading for every luxury resource I don't have, declaring war and puppeting only when a civ is being unreasonable and won't gibs in a fair trade.
I found the answer. See below.
I'm curious, why are you trading for luxuries like this if you don't have happiness issues?
I only have happiness issues when I'm in war too long (because of war weariness and from recently conquered cities) and from events (several cities are put in a resistance), so that's intended. Also I have minor happiness issues at the start of a game, when I settle cities. Happiness it's not too hard for sure, it may be too easy though.
frktest
Warlord
Sorry no time to read all 8 pages of this thread but I would say that I do not find fun to play the present VP issue due to unhappiness management, that is unintelligible to me. Thus I did uninstalled May 2018 issue and reinstalled back the november 2017 issue with the old happiness management. In the last issue I found very annoying to to loss cities due to +10 unhappiness. What about to reconsider the old happiness system in future development?
I wouldn't talk about current happiness issues if the last version you tried is several months old, especially considering happiness has gone trough some heavy changes in the lat versions.
pza
Prince
- Joined
- Oct 20, 2017
- Messages
- 365
There must be some bug then. because i clearly have games where there are huge happiness problems, and theres barely no way to fix them. they usually start industrial and later, from my experience so far. until then, everything is okay-ish, maybe even too happy, but that's up to debate - i dont have too many games in the most recent versions in yet.
Omen of Peace
Prince
- Joined
- Mar 22, 2018
- Messages
- 404
The May version indeed had a lot of issues. The recent betas (starting in June or July) alleviated much of that - I second the suggestion to try them out.
If you encounter problems, make sure to turn on logging
MessageLog = 1
AILog = 1
AIPerfLog = 1
LoggingEnabled = 1
and provide the logs (including PlayerHappinessStats.csv - or the file named something close to that) when you open a bug on Github.
@pza, that suggestion applies to you too.
Personally, I haven't run into big happiness issues since May or so.
In my latest game, I did see most of the AI sustaining large negative happiness at times. I don't check it all the time, but there was a pop-up with the happiness ranking, and that time I was the only civ in the positives. I was tall Arabia with 5 cities, and all other civ had 12+ cities, so it's hard to compare.
They didn't stay in the negatives all the time either.
SpankmyMetroid
Prince
- Joined
- Jun 22, 2016
- Messages
- 320
Alright, I dropped from 14 happiness to -100 after researching a tech. TO BE FAIR, I have 35 ideological pressure, but based on my quick glance at the logs (which I don't know how to read admittedly but the naming seems self explanatory), all my needs modifiers seemed to be increased by 20 between turns. I'm not necessarily calling this a bug or not (which is why I'm not putting it on Github) but how can I read these to determine what happened?
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Github, savegame. If your empire is large enough, i.e. 20 cities, that's really only a 'bump' of 1 unhappiness type per city, so it's not an unsurprising outcome.
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