*Spoiler1* Gotm19-Ottomans - Green-Brown-Red

Reproducing the QSC timeline: I've tried a lot of things to get the sequence to come out the same. I haven't succeeded. Along the way I have found two tricky things which change the way events unfold:

1) The Preferences option "Always Build Previously Built Unit". It seems that when this is off, then the RNG is used in the process of picking the next unit to be built. When it is on the RNG is not called and thus the subsequent sequence is different.

2) Negotations with another Civ. (Nice guess MadScot!) Just asking what they'll offer for something seems to call the RNG and thus change subsequent events.

Experimenting a bit I managed to get my QSC to play out to match the original until 3500BC but then it went off track again vs. the notes. There seems little point trying to get it right - how many times did I originally ask Brennus what he'd offer for something? And then there's 2500 years following with lots of negotiation attempts undocumented...

And it seems there must be at least one more thing we don't know about calling the RNG - I couldn't find a combination which ever got the Celts to agree to techs+2g for their workers. I did try playing with moving my units in different sequences than in my notes, that didn't seem to have an effect. And played with some other Preferences, none I tried had an affect.

I couldn't understand why I ever thought this could work so I went back to old GOTMs. I think it must have been in GOTM17 that I proofed my timeline - in that one I didn't meet another Civ (Egypt) till near the end of the QSC and then had minimal interaction. And maybe I didn't proof right to the end, I'm not sure.

Anyway, bottom line, I don't think QSC timelines are going to be predictably reproduceable, the negotiation thing looks like a killer. :sad:
 
I'm certain the negotiation sequence affects RNG outcomes. I tried one of the trading exercises in Moonsinger's excellent training thread a couple of times, and during the trade sequence the free tech for a scientific civ is triggered. I got two different free Middle Age techs during two successive runs, and all I'd done was to conduct trade negotiations on a saved game.

I think MadScot is right. At the very least the RNG is probably used to select the rude remarks for the opponents.
 
Well I started a new job last month, so it took me a long time to do stuff this month. I guess I should have submitted this when I submitted QSC, but oh well. Life got in the way.

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4000 BC - Look at territory. I can see Grasslands to the southeast and plains to the north. The potential gain of a Grassland bonus is huge, so I send my warrior east to the mountain.
- I have revealed Game. Will create city right where it is.
- Worker south to Bonus Grassland.
- Research Pottery at 1.9.0

3950 BC - Worker1 starts a road. Warrior1 heads north. I'm going north because of the mountain. Next warrior will head south to find other civs.

3850 BC - Road is done, Worker1 starts a mine.

3750 BC - Sogut produces a Warrior2. Starts another.
- Warrior1 reaches coast, continues nw.
- Warrior2 heads due south.

3700 BC - Worker1 moves onto game square.

3650 BC - Worker1 starts to clear forest.

3550 BC - Sogut produces a Warrior, Starts a Barracks.
- Warrior3 fortifies in prep for pop expansion.

3500 BC - Warrior2 spots regular Celtic Warrior in south.
- A Polite Brennus has 10 gold, Ceremonial Burial, Warrior Code
- Brennus lacks Bronze Working and Masonry, he also has 2 workers in his capitol right now
- Trade Bronze Working + Masonry + 15 gold to Brennus for Worker and Ceremonial Burial.
- Worker2 moves nw.
- Set Tax rate to 7.3.0

3450 BC - Discover Pottery - Start Research on Iron Working
- Sell Pottery to Celts for 25 gold.
- Worker2 starts a road
- Sogut switches production to Spearman. With clear forest will get next turn.
- Taxes set to 0.10.0

3400 BC - Sogut builds Spearman - Start work on Settler.
- Worker1 starts a road on the Game.

3300 BC - Worker1 north to plains. Will Road and Irrigate, then return to the game.
- Worker2 moves northwest. Will prep road for first settler.

3250 BC - Worker1 and Worker2 start roads at their current locations.

3150 BC - Worker1 starts irrigation of plains.

3100 BC - Warrior2 contacts Carthaginian regular warrior.
- Hanibal is Cautious, has 10 gold and Alphabet. He lacks Pottery and Ceremonial Burial
- Unfortunately no good deals available. He is not giving up his letters easy.
- Worker2 moves sw on way to wheat. Will prep it for first city.

3050 BC - Worker2 sw to wheat. Worker1 moves back to game and starts irrigation.

3000 BC - Worker2 irrigates wheat.

2950 BC - Sogut builds Settler. Start on Granary.
- Worker1 west to Bonus Grassland.
- Settler moves nw, nw, w

2900 BC - Worker1 starts road.
- A barbarian hut has appeared right next to my settler.
- I send the Spearman from Sogut to protect the new city.
- Found Iznik - Production set to warrior.
- Trade Ceremonial Burial + 24 gold to Carthage for Warrior Code.

2900 BC Post My Turn.
- 2 Barbarian warriors attack the spearman in Iznik. The first one is defeated, but the
second one kills the spearman and sacks Iznik for 23 gold.

2800 BC - Worker1 starts mine. Worker2 starts a road on wheat.
- Set Taxes to 0.10.0 (Ooops looks like I missed a tax change along the way)

2670 BC - (Apologies, this timeline will miss some stuff from now on. I kept getting caught
- up in the game and forgetting to write stuff down)
- Iznik builds warrior, starts another.
- Worker1 south to grassland, worker2 ne.
- MicroManage Sogut to use 2 bonus grassland instead of game
- MM for next two turns to max production and min food waste.

2630 BC - Sogut builds spearman, start settler
- Worker2 starts irrigation, Worker1 starts road.

2590 BC - MM Iznik To use roaded plain instead of forest. (Lose extra shield to waste anyway)

2550 BC - Worker1 s,se to dyes (2 turns)
- Taxes to 7.3.0

2510 BC - Discover Iron Working, Start Mysticism
- Iznik builds Warrior, starts Temple
- Taxes set to 0.10.0

2470 BC - Worker2 NE, Worker1 Starts road on dyes

2430 BC - Worker2 starts irrigation of plains.

2390 BC - Sogut builds Settler, start Granary
- Settler to forest 3 south of Sogut (1 north of dye)
- MM Sogut back to game.

2350 BC - Worker1 north.

2310 BC - Found Uskadar, Production spearman
- Worker1 east to Bonus Grassland

2270 BC - Worker1 starts road on BG, Worker2 starts road on plain.

2230 BC - Warrior2 disperses camp near Carthage.
- MM Iznik to use Forest.
- Taxes 4.6.0

2190 BC - Discover Mysticism start Polytheism
- Worker1 starts mine.
- Trade Mysticism, Pottery and 6 gold to Carthage for Alphabet

2150 BC - Worker2 north to prep roads for next city

2110 BC - Worker2 starts road.

2070 BC - Trade Mysticism +33 Gold to Celts for the Wheel.

1990 BC - Worker2 starts irrigation.

1950 BC - Warrior1 dies attacking Barbarian Camp.

1910 BC - Worker1 starts road. (Sorry lost track of him for a while)
- Uskadar builds spearman, starts barracks

1870 BC - Warrior2 disperses another camp. Think I'll stop that and let the camps
- be an inconvienence to Carthage.
- Taxes to 1.9.0

1750 BC - Warrior2 on way north disperses another encampment

1675 BC - Worker2 finishes irrigation on cattle in north, starts road.

1650 BC - Found Izmit 3n, 1nw of Sogut.
- Trade 3 gpt, 61g + Alphabet to Celts for Horseback Riding.
- Barbarians sack Izmit for 3 gold.

1625 BC - From now on MM game between Sogut and Uskadar (Sogut gets 2 turns, Uskadar 1)

1600 BC - Worker1 mine

1575 BC - Taxes to 7.3.0

Note: Sorry, but somewhere in here my notes got messed up. Not sure where everything is.

1550 BC - Discover Polytheism, start Monarchy
- Iznik builds Settler, starts warrior
- Uskadar builds Barracks, starts warrior
- Worker1 starts road on iron mountain.
- New Settler to coast delta
- Taxes to 9.1.0

1525 BC - Found Aydin west (nw of western spice)

1475 BC - Found Antalya on nw edge of the river delta west and a little south from Sogut

1425 BC - Have decided to take out Celts, Start building warriors + $$$ for upgrade when road
- is done

1375 BC - Sogut builds Settler, starts Spearman
- Send settler se, e, e to coast
- Returning Warrior from south dies fighting barbarians.

1350 BC - Izmit builds worker, starts another.
- Worker2 heads for BG.

1325 BC - Worker1 to sw of fish
- Trade Polytheism to Carthage for Writing + 223 Gold.
- Found Bursa (se, e, e from Sogut)

1300 BC - Upgrade 6 warriors in Uskadar to Swordsmen.
- Sogut produces spearman, start settler


1275 BC - Workers continue to irrigate plains.
- Worker1 mines BG near Uskadar
- Swordsmen move out. 2 Veterans will move due east to Camuldunom, 4 will move south to other
- Celtic city. Then will head for Entremont.

1200 BC - Declare war on Celts. Enter territory.

1175 BC - Worker to cattle in nw to prep next city
- Swordsmen capture camulodunum on coast ne of dyes.
- The stack of 4 swordsmen encounter a settler with warrior.
- I lose 1 swordsman, but take the settler with the 2nd. (slaves move north)
- The other 2 swordsmen in stack sack the city (can't remember the name)

1150 BC - Carthage dmands Territory Map and 18 gold. Can't afford to fight now, so I give it.

1125 BC - Sogut builds Settler, starts Pyramids
- Antalya builds spearman, starts settler
- Found Edirne se of fish in north east inlet.1


1025 BC - Swordsmen capture Entremont
- Trade World Map + 8 gold to Carthage for W Map. Sight red (sure it's rome) on island east
- of Carthage.

1000 BC - Found Istanbul - 2 ne from the horses in the west (using the cattle)
- Uskadar switch to Settler
- Set Tech to 1.9.0925 BC - Trade 22 Gold + World Map to Carthage for World Map

------------------------------------
End QSC - Go to sparser Commentary.

850 BC - ***Carthage build Oracle in Carthage
825 BC - Discover Monarchy - Start Mathematics
800 BC - Found Kyona
775 BC - Capture Lugdunum (Took a while to let it grow culturally)
- Peace with Celts for Verulamium
- Celts left with only Richborough
- ***Spain builds Colossus in Seville
670 BC - Found Kafa
650 BC - Found Davidople
630 BC - Monarchy established. Will stay here for a long time.
- Found Alexmanika
610 BC - Trade Monarchy to Rome for Philosophy, Code of Laws,
Mathematics and 24 Gold
- Sell Monarchy to Carthage for 263 Gold
- Research Currency
490 BC - Found Emanopidu
- ***India builds Great Library in Delhi
470 BC - Meet Egypt with Galley sent west across ocean
- Trade Polytheism to Egypt for Literature, World Map + 60 Gold
- Trade Polytheism + 147 Gold to China for Construction
- Trade Polytheism to Spain for Indian Contact, World Map + 37 Gold
- Trade Polytheism to India for World Map + 127 Gold
430 BC - Discover Currency - Ancient Era Ends
 
I have at last progressed enough to read this thread. This is my first GOTM.

In the initial position I moved the warrior to the mountains to the east, saw the Game, lux and a lot of BG and move the settler SE to found Sogat.

My first warrior explored east and then south when the coast got in the way so I met the Celts and Carthagains quite soon.

By 1000BC (when I handed in my QSC, just in time) I had 10 towns and a settler in place to build number 11. I also had a number of horsemen and warriors running arround:D

Just after 1000BC I got the :hammer: out and attacked and destroyed the celts before they could get their iron hooked up, at the time they had 6 cities two of which I kept.

I then traded for contact with the Romans. I had a lot of problems with the squid, every ship I built lasted at most two turns before being eaten:( .

It was then :hammer: time again. I checked the carthigians and saw they didn't have their iron hooked up either and attacked. It was around this point that I discovered that thier UU dosen't require iron:cry:

As it happened they couldn't stand up to my horsemen and (so far) I have taken 4 cities including their captial. They were also kind enough to build the pyramids two turns before my horsemen rode in :D

It is now 10BC (as of last night) and I am in anarchy and the middle ages (the final tech came from the peace deal with Carthage).

I suspect I wated too long to go for republic and spent too long in despotism. I have also favoured horsemen over swordsmen as trhey will upgrade to my UU (I hope).

My only worry is I wont have time to finish before the end of the month (I suspect I'll sepnd all day Saturday playing)


Andrew
 
PART ONE - ANCIENT TIMES – 4000 to 250 AD

4000 In the beginning warrior climbs mountain to the north, worker up mountain east, settler crosses river southeast.

3950 Founded Sogut, barracks in 14, worker to deer to clear and irrigate, warrior explores nearby, research pottery 90 % for zero income complete in 17 with 35 in treasury.

3800 Warrior the Hut discovers a coastline to the west with nasty looking weather off-shore.

3600 Deer forest cleared, barracks in 5, start to irrigate. PFC (production, food, commerce) is 2,4,4 and growth in 3.

3450 Culture expansion. Adjust entertainment to accommodate pop of two. There are silks and dyes down south.

3400 Celtic reg warrior comes from the southeast. We trade masonry for warrior code. We don’t get ceremonial burial.

3350 complete barracks and start warrior in 5. Worker starts mine southwest of city on south river bank.

3200 We discover pottery which we offer to Celts for ceremonial burial but they want 17 gold as well so forget it – can do without until settlers are available. Pop goes to 3 and I set entertainment to 30% and research at 10% for iron in 40. Warrior the Hut spies another shore to the west.

3100 Warrior the First is completed and we start work on a granary in 15. Riverside mine and road are completed, population is 3 and PFC is 4, 10, 7. Worker starts another mine sw of the previous next to the river.

3000 Warrior the Hut sees a giant squid in the western ocean. The Celtic warrior has been bumping around west and southwest of the city for several moves.

Ranking is Rome, India, Carthage, Egypt, Celts, Chinese, Spanish and me.

2950 A barbarian galley shows up on the western sea. Warrior the Hut finds heavy jungle south on the western seashore. I will move him west, find out where the Celts come from.

2900 Pop is 4 and PFC is 6, 12, 7 with growth in 4 and granary in 7. Warrior the Hut finds gems in the southwestern jungles by a lake.

2800 Celts still want 17 gold sweetener to trade burial for pottery – hold off till I am ready to build a temple. Start a road to the southern jungle dyes.

2750 Barb galley on the shores of the eastern sea. Celtic boundaries spotted to the south.

2670 Pop is 5. Entertainment is 40%, research 50% for iron in 29 and PFC is 7, 14, 8. There are at least two Celt cities. Mmp to slow city growth a bit until colony is in place.

2590 spot more dyes within Celtic boundaries.

2510 Now see boundary with Celts. Mmf and change to settler to plant on hill above jungle spices – a colony is not enough.

2430 Sogut completes settler and starts an archer. Set entertainment to 0% and research to 70% for iron in 15. Break even with 53 in treasury.

2390 Sogut in flames – reset entertainment to 10 and slowed research.

2350 Pop is 4, PFC is 6, 12, 8. Growth in 3. Trade pottery and 17 gold to Celts for burial – need a temple for my new city of the south.

Build Iznic three square south of Sogut and complete road to bring dyes in. Our first happy face. E/R (entertainment/research) is 10/70.

2190 A Pict shows up from the southwest. Our new archer cuts him down but does not become Elite.

Sogut pop is 6 with growth in 3. E/R is 20/50 with iron in 5. PFC is 7, 16, 9.

Iznic is building a temple and has about 30% corruption. PFC = 3, 4, 4.

1990 Ranking is Rome, India, Egypt, Spain, Cartage, China, Celts and us. Celtic warrior kills a Pict coming in from the eastern seaboard and is now a vet.

1910 Sogut completes settler and starts a temple. E/R set at 10/10. With iron one away we are putting 8 in the treasury this turn.

1870 Iron in the mountain north of Sogut. Need another worker – the first is opening a road to the gems southwest and the settler is heading that way.

1830 Warrior the Hut spots spices to the west of the gem fields. The Celtic warrior appears to have overrun a barb village on the river delta point to the east. We need a port down that way.

1790 Carthage shows up to trade alphabet for burial and 60 gold. A bit steep – maybe later if catapults look necessary.

1750 Sogut burns again. E/R = 20/60. Wheel in 12.

Found Uskudar next to the lake southwest. We will soon have a second happy face.

1725 – 1700 Bad new, Pelt rider and warrior up north. A giant squid in the eastern sea.
Celts have started a city on the eastern point – too bad.

1625 Sogut mmf. Archer kills barb horseman in north and faces barb warrior from the top of a mountain The Celts are building the Oracle.

1600 Road to gems completed. Pict in the north wanders off.

1575 Archer nails barb warrior up north and discovers a barb camp across a small lake. Good place for a city. Sogut completes worker who heads for the iron. Building an archer in three with growth in 5.

E/R = 10/70, wheel in 3, 76 in treasury, breaking even.

1525 the archer, approaching the barb village is badly hurt by a mounted barb. He will fortify in the woods.

1500 Celt and Carthage warriors nosing around out western edges – probable settlers coming soon. Could use the slaves. E/R = 0/80 with alphabet in 9, break even.

1475 overrun barbs up north for 25 gold . There are four Carthage warriors poking around in the west and a Pict up north.

1450 see a Celt warrior die attacking something out west. There is a Pict northwest of Sogut and the archer moves north.

Complete road to iron and change production to swordsman in 2. Pop is 7 with growth in 15. PFC = 10, 16, 11 with minor corruption. The two workers start a road to the silks now within our cultural influence up north.

1425 archer finishes off mounted warrior on shores of the north sea.

1400 archer kills Pict warrior north of the Sogut mountain range. Our first swordsman is ready and a second is on the way in four.

1375 Iznik completes temple and starts a barracks in 20 – this is the most likely area for war with the Celts.

1350 good thing I moved the swordsman north to cover the workers going after the silk – a Kassite horseman showed up and was cut to pieces – unfortunately no Elite status. E/R = 0/90 with alphabet in 2, 100 in treasury and net loss 2 per turn.

1325 road to silks complete – have three happy faces. Pict warrior and Kassite rider coming in from the northwest. See a pair of squid near the fog off the northern coast. Have seen no horse at all – where are these barb riders getting theirs? Swordsman defeats barb horseman and the archer destroys the Pict warrior – still no promotions to Elite.

1300 Mmg in Sogut. Pop is 7 with growth in nine and another swordsman in 4. PFC = 10, 16, 11.

1250 Swordsman and archer moving northeast to explore our peninsula and whack a Pict village. There is silk all over up here. The fog bank up north has move to the eastern shores.

1225 The archer moves to the hills overlooking a vast northwestern grass land. Switched to settler in Sogut due in two. Workers are building mines and roads around the capital.

1175 barb warrior dies attacking swordsman in the northeast. Pict warrior up north again.

1150 Pict village spotted way northwest. Archer and swordsman closing in. Up north archer tracks another Pict warrior.

1100 Swordsman overruns Pict village for 25g. See another Pict village on north shore beyond where next city is about to go in.

1075 Picts warrior threatens Uskudar in the east – worker retreats and swordsman move in from Iznik. Found Izmet up north and start building a temple.

1050 archer overruns barb camp across from Izmet and collects 25g.

1025 complete road to Izmet. Swordsman chops up Pict threatening in Uskudar area. Do these creatures have a death wish? Still no Elite status. Rome appears with writing, mysticism and horseback riding. We buy a territorial map for 40g.

1000 [saved game here] Must finish exploring the northwest peninsula. Hopefully I will find horses. I am most worried about Celtic swordsmen and a GA. Next step is to control iron in the south jungle in hopes of stopping this problem.

My prime strategy is to block access to the entire peninsula to the north until I have settled it. I must prepare a road system to ambush invading settler crews et al. I will soon have catapults to run on these roads.

There is a Celtic settler group to the south – if it passes Uskudar I must attack. I don’t think it is going for the iron because the AI never does.

975 There are horse in the newly explored far northwestern point and also spices. A new settler is heading west. Must fill the peninsula and hold out foreign all settlers.

510 War looms - there are two Celtic settlers poking around and that is four slaves. Settlers to the west and forces to the east. I believe we have founded a city on the only Celtic iron - if this is true they can not build Gallic Warriors and can not get GA this way.

490 World ranking for score: Rome, 653; Carthage, 388; Celts, 342; Ottomans, 290. The Forbidden Palace is available.

310 Made peace with the Celts and got a territorial map. Want to be ready to ambush some Carthaginian slaves when the settler teams come in. We got five or seven slaves from the Celtic wars and they will provide years of free labor.

270 BC captured four more slaves with ambush of two Carthaginian settler teams.


10 AD ranking for wealth: Spain, Turks, Egyptians, Romans, Celt, Indians, Carthaginians, Chinese.

30 We have captured 11 slaves in the border wars with the Celts and the Carthaginians and are now at peace. Our next move will be against the Celts when our peace treaty runs out in a couple of moves. We must get their iron west-southwest of Entremont so they can not build GSs. Our great northwestern area is not completely settled - there are lucrative Pict villages springing up and they are good earners. Roman galleys off northeast shore may carry settlers.

50 We establish an embassy with the Carthaginians. Pop there is 7 with three happy faces, two unhappy faces and two jokers. PFC = 7, 16, 21. They have the great pyramid which I need, but that comes later. They have horse and iron, and two luxuries, spices and good incense. This is guarded by a garrison of 7 Macedonian spearmen.

90 Twenty turns have passed and the peace treaty with the Celts has expired. Wait one more turn to see what the roman galleys up north are doing.

250 India put settler ashore at the empty north point. Two more slaves and a distant war against a naval power. Ironic their ship brought so much trade with the other continent. Meanwhile the war against the Celt progresses well and a second settler is about to go in along the southern shores. The mountain above Entremont is fortified and four catapults are in place.

END OF ANCIENT TIMES – PART ONE
Gotm19 4000 BC thru 250 AD.

kiregh
 
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