Suggestions and Requests

A really tiny request.

Could Andorra be made into a seperate province?

1 tile would suffice. It would give Aragon a tiny boost and serve as a precursor for one of the future tiniest states in the world.
 
And something very related to what I said above:
I'm also willing to add more unique things to the civs (units, buildings, or even improvements).
Wanted to talk about this with merijn for a while now, but considering his 2nd UU and UB modmod for DoC he will probably like the idea.

I actually have thought about creating a similar modcomp for RFCE as well once. But I had much more troubles finding good ideas for most civs. So I disbanded the idea.

But you are right, I do like the idea.
 
When I refer to our mod I refer to RFCE, the mod Absinthered has put so much work and effort in, which I feel priviledged to share my thoughts on and play.[/I]

Thanks, but this is really not necessary.
If you posted this because of my recent annoyance on gilgames, then you don't have to worry :)
That was only because he tends to sound like he is not only expecting updates, but expecting me to work on RFCE constantly.
Not hoping, expecting. Not cool at all.

So thanks for the kind words, but once again:
I'm just a regular guy who loves Civ IV and the history of Europe - I guess most of us share these anyway :)
 
When I refer to our mod I refer to RFCE, the mod Absinthered has put so much work and effort in, which I feel priviledged to share my thoughts on and play.

Thanks, but this is really not necessary.
If you posted this because of my recent annoyance on gilgames, then you don't have to worry
That was only because he tends to sound like he is not only expecting updates, but expecting me to work on RFCE even more than I already do.
Not hoping, expecting. Not cool at all.

So thanks for the kind words, but once again:
I'm just a regular guy who loves Civ IV and the history of Europe - I guess most of us share these anyway

I am glad you picked up on the appreciation I expressed.
That disclaimer served a dual purpuse though. In my response to Gilgames his post I hinted at the mechanism of disproportional sense of contribution (<- this is a term I just coined myself, better (more vernacular) terms might be around.). And this line serves also as a reminder to myself to stay humble.

Conceiving and writing the posts I just did took up a bit of time and effort. But that amount pales in comparison to the work (time and effort) you put in the mod.
I was particularly (a little) annoyed by my phrasing of our mod.

If you feel a little embarresed by the mention of your name in the rather blunt expression praise I can edit your name out of the original post and (try to) refrain from mentioning your name in conjunction to similar blunt expressions of praise in the future.

summary:
consider it an antidote to DSOC
 
Hi!
It seems you are here for a long time.
Nevertheless this was your first post, sooo: welcome to the forum! :cheers:

Thanks for the report, will fix those tests!
EDIT: btw, we still have some missing civilopedia entries, and a lot could use various improvements.
Would you, or anyone else care for updating some of those?
You could say so. Let's just say that I've been lurking semi-regularly since before the departure of Rhye, albeit lately I hadn't check anything CIV related in about 6 months or so. About a year ago I tried to create an account in here just to report that very same thing: however after the tenth or so failed attempt (It kept saying: that user-name already exist, not an approved username, too long, wrong email... mainly the first 2.) I gave up. But well, I finally made it.

About the texts: Well, I can try. Some seem straightforward enough (the corporation spreading units for instance, it uses the same as BTS), but I'm not a native speaker: There may be some weirdness on my text. Do I simply upload the edited file, post the lines changed, or provide the text and you do the formatting? Either works for me.

Changing the subject, I was playing my first game in months an noticed some curious things:
  • Kiev didn't collapse instantly. In fact, it's still there by 1206 instead of dying early on against the barbarians. No idea if something was changed, it's just a fluke or if the actual barbarian invasion happens later; but I got happy to see them around for a change. :)
  • Arabia collapsed, as always. Then respawned, got a crusade that very turn against them, lost Jerusalem (In a weird Arabia-independent-Bulgaria fashion) and is about to collapse again.
  • There have been crusades against independent Jerusalem. In fact, only 2 of the 5-6 crusades so far have been against an actual civ (Arabia).
  • Catholics are dominating the map. For most of the game the only Muslims were Arabia and Norway (!), one collapsed and the other converted. There are 2 Orthodox civs: Kiev and Byzantium. Novgorod is pagan/atheist. This leaves me with very few possible target for a Crusade :( (BTW, I must be on the 6th or so by now)
  • There are 3 Iberian Union (Albeit you are already aware)
  • The pope seems really passive now. It's almost as if he were locked on the Vatican, afraid of the world. If it weren't for the frequent crusades and the magic spread of Catholicism, I would have forgotten about him.
  • Ireland is a barbaric island. Literally. I can't remember if it was like that before.
  • The Bizantines lost a few cities against barbarians but it doesn't seem to affect them much. They are slowly getting Anatolia back, meanwhile the barbarians are building the cities up.
  • The AI keeps asking me to join wars while I'm quite bussy myself, but that's expected.
  • I hate Poland. Either they DOW me and I have to deal with a 2 front war, or I kill them and stability becomes an issue (killing denmark and burning cities didn't help). And now that they respawned, I have to deal with the poles on Pozen. And I even intended to ignore them this time, but they keep taunting me...
  • For some reason, razing 3 cities in the same turn increased my stability a little. First a city size 1, got -2 (-3 for the action, +1 for free castle). Then a size 2, got another -2 (-4 total) . But the third time with a size 3, my stability didn't change. Checking, the swing was -9 (expected) but the second section (event based part?) of cities had increased by 3. This increase didn't disappear on the next turn either. (The city-size is before my troops moved in, as I was testing if the no-permanent-penalty for razing cities applied before or after conquest). The barbarians controlled the cities, if that makes any difference (Homz, Antiochien, Tarsus). Also, the third time the stability bonus for the castle wasn't applied (but at a 3 for 1 ratio, I don't complain).
  • I still can't decide if building Kazimierz is a good idea or not.

BTW, is the auto-play supposed to stop at -1 turn?:
yRqBKzv.png
 
You could say so. Let's just say that I've been lurking semi-regularly since before the departure of Rhye, albeit lately I hadn't check anything CIV related in about 6 months or so. About a year ago I tried to create an account in here just to report that very same thing: however after the tenth or so failed attempt (It kept saying: that user-name already exist, not an approved username, too long, wrong email... mainly the first 2.) I gave up. But well, I finally made it.
Nice. It's flattering that you have 100% of your posts in RFCE :cool:

About the texts: Well, I can try. Some seem straightforward enough (the corporation spreading units for instance, it uses the same as BTS), but I'm not a native speaker: There may be some weirdness on my text. Do I simply upload the edited file, post the lines changed, or provide the text and you do the formatting? Either works for me.
Probably the best would be if you provided the texts here.
This way everyone else can further improve it.
I'm not a native english speaker myself, so it's great if there are some additional checks :)

Kiev didn't collapse instantly. In fact, it's still there by 1206 instead of dying early on against the barbarians. No idea if something was changed, it's just a fluke or if the actual barbarian invasion happens later; but I got happy to see them around for a change. :)
Yeah, Kiev shouldn't collapse because of the early barbs.
I try to make it very likely that they make it until the mid 13th century.
Mongols should collapse them though in the majority of the games.
Arabia collapsed, as always. Then respawned, got a crusade that very turn against them, lost Jerusalem (In a weird Arabia-independent-Bulgaria fashion) and is about to collapse again.
Arabia's starting situation will be improved soon.
There were some posts about it one of the other threads.
There have been crusades against independent Jerusalem. In fact, only 2 of the 5-6 crusades so far have been against an actual civ (Arabia).
That's intended, Crusades can start against independents too.
Arabia can't be around in most of them due to gameplay limitations - respawns are already quite common for them.
Catholics are dominating the map. For most of the game the only Muslims were Arabia and Norway (!), one collapsed and the other converted. There are 2 Orthodox civs: Kiev and Byzantium. Novgorod is pagan/atheist. This leaves me with very few possible target for a Crusade :( (BTW, I must be on the 6th or so by now)
Religion spread is an issue.
Will have to rewrite the mechanics soon enough.
Catholics should dominate most parts of the map though,
There are 3 Iberian Union (Albeit you are already aware)
Yep, the fix will be up as soon as I finish balancing my plague revision.
The pope seems really passive now. It's almost as if he were locked on the Vatican, afraid of the world. If it weren't for the frequent crusades and the magic spread of Catholicism, I would have forgotten about him.
What else should he do?
He spreads Catholicism when possible, adds gold and builds buildings to their favourite/most faithful Catholics.
Other than the Crusades and that, the Papal States doesn't have any role ATM.
Ireland is a barbaric island. Literally. I can't remember if it was like that before.
Indeed, that was changed very recently. Just before the release of 1.4.
It's experimental, it will be changed (most likely) to 1 random of the 3 new ones.
The Bizantines lost a few cities against barbarians but it doesn't seem to affect them much. They are slowly getting Anatolia back, meanwhile the barbarians are building the cities up.
This is a good thing, is it not?
Unless it was in the 15th century or later :)
The AI keeps asking me to join wars while I'm quite bussy myself, but that's expected.
Well, yeah. No real changes from BtS in that regard.
I hate Poland. Either they DOW me and I have to deal with a 2 front war, or I kill them and stability becomes an issue (killing denmark and burning cities didn't help). And now that they respawned, I have to deal with the poles on Pozen. And I even intended to ignore them this time, but they keep taunting me...
I find this great. Sry :D
For some reason, razing 3 cities in the same turn increased my stability a little. First a city size 1, got -2 (-3 for the action, +1 for free castle). Then a size 2, got another -2 (-4 total) . But the third time with a size 3, my stability didn't change. Checking, the swing was -9 (expected) but the second section (event based part?) of cities had increased by 3. This increase didn't disappear on the next turn either. (The city-size is before my troops moved in, as I was testing if the no-permanent-penalty for razing cities applied before or after conquest). The barbarians controlled the cities, if that makes any difference (Homz, Antiochien, Tarsus). Also, the third time the stability bonus for the castle wasn't applied (but at a 3 for 1 ratio, I don't complain).
I would need a savegame right before these things happened.
Otherwise no real chance to find any possible bugs.
Also, the mainscreen stability counter is not always up-to-date.
Only the stability in the F2 screen, that refreshes every time you enter it.
I still can't decide if building Kazimierz is a good idea or not.
Kazimierz got to be much better recently.
Was rather controversial before, as spreading Judaism cost you way too much stability-wise.
Now with Jewish Quarters reducing instability from Judaism it's much more friendly, so it more than feasible in some situations with the huge boost to your economy.
Also this makes it greatly in line to real life and history IMO.
BTW, is the auto-play supposed to stop at -1 turn?:
Ehh, that's a very old bug I cannot find for the life of me.
AFAIK it appears in all RFC-style mods.
I might be absolutely wrong in this, but sometimes I tend to think it's a limitation in the engine.
 
I am glad you picked up on the appreciation I expressed.
That disclaimer served a dual purpuse though. In my response to Gilgames his post I hinted at the mechanism of disproportional sense of contribution (<- this is a term I just coined myself, better (more vernacular) terms might be around.). And this line serves also as a reminder to myself to stay humble.

Conceiving and writing the posts I just did took up a bit of time and effort. But that amount pales in comparison to the work (time and effort) you put in the mod.
I was particularly (a little) annoyed by my phrasing of our mod.

If you feel a little embarresed by the mention of your name in the rather blunt expression praise I can edit your name out of the original post and (try to) refrain from mentioning your name in conjunction to similar blunt expressions of praise in the future.

summary:
consider it an antidote to DSOC

Ehh, I don't take this this seriously at all.
Got a little upset one of the other nights, but that's all.
Also, why would I be embarassed because you mentioned me?

But most importantly, and the main reason why I responded to your post :mischief:
What the hell is DSOC?
Dutch Spartan Owners Club? :lol:
 
Even if I sound like its not my intention! and you should know that!

Don't worry, no hard feeling at all, as I said before.
That post yesterday was meant to be an explanation, not anything pointed against you.
 
DSOC is the abbreviation of a term I coined for when I become a famous psychologist/sociologist.

(it is all in the original post)
|
v

ps silly you. In the Netherlands we don't have Spartans, we got Frisians!


Still don't know, but ROFL
 
Probably the best would be if you provided the texts here.
This way everyone else can further improve it.
I'm not a native english speaker myself, so it's great if there are some additional checks :)
OK. Will do, starting now:
Proposed history bluff for "Swiss Line Infantry"
Spoiler :
The Swiss mercenaries were valued through the Late Medieval Europe for their overall effectiveness in the use of pikes and halberd on formation. However, after having dominated the European battlefield for near a century, advances in tactics and the incorporation of firearms and artillery saw a decline in their effectiveness. In the following years, the Swiss mercenaries saw extensive changes in tactics, drill and weapons. The Swiss Line Infantry is the culmination of this process, and saw action on the French, Spanish, Dutch and British armies until their dissolution on the 1820-1830 period. Currently, the only remaining Swiss mercenary unit remaining are the Papal guards

Proposed change to the history of Black Rider: (in red)
Spoiler :
Black Riders were also known as "Devil Riders", because of the blackened armor they wore. They first appeared in Germany in the sixteenth century. The Riders developed a special tactic known as "Caracole", which allowed them to effectively bombard infantry units with constant weapons fire. In Caracole, cavalry units created a tight formation. The units in front fired their weapons, and then quickly charged to the back to reload. The units that were just behind them fired immediately after the first row charged backwards to reload, repeating as many times as required.

Proposed change to "Historical Starts": (in red)
Spoiler :
Historical Starts
This is why your game won't start immediately for most Civs. Rhye's mod, above all else, was designed to mirror history. As such, most civs spawn many years into the game, as late as 1581 for the Dutch. If you want to play as a late spawning civ now, you can use the 1200AD scenario. Don't worry about being behind; you will start with many units and techs to place you on an even footing with the AIs.
In addition to all those units and techs, you may even have some cities flip for you. Although, be aware when playing imperialistic civilizations such as Byzantium, Germany and France. New civs will carve their empires out of your land! If you refuse to let go of the cities, units in the area will join the resistance for several turns. If you decide to resist the wave of nationalism, make sure your army is large enough to handle defectors!

Proposed change to "Colonies and Access Resources":
Spoiler :
Add the following line as a header:
Colonies and Access Resources
Reason: To be consistent with the other pages.

Also, I propose to change the third paragraph with this:
Colonies are furthermore divided into several regions (South America, North America, Asia and Africa). Excluding the colonies in Africa, establishing a colony in a given region will grant the player an additional access resource that will make further colonies in that region easier to create (i.e. having Virginia would make it easier to colonize New England).

Also: the history of the Zaporozhian Cossack uses "forced" when in contexts makes more sense "force" (...military force that challenged the authority of...)
The stability guide seems to need updating (Expansion section, founding a city), but I'll just copy the one on here http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=564135. Am I correct to assume that Portugal no longer gets instability-free expansion?
I was also translating some of the texts on that file to Spanish, if you are interested. Albeit true be told, besides the names and displays I doubt anyone else will ever read it.

Yeah, Kiev shouldn't collapse because of the early barbs.
I try to make it very likely that they make it until the mid 13th century.
Mongols should collapse them though in the majority of the games.
So the Mongols come later? Still, last time I played they were dead by then and I as Germany had to deal with them (Poland also fell.. mostly my doing)

Religion spread is an issue.
Will have to rewrite the mechanics soon enough.
Catholics should dominate most parts of the map though,
A simple fix would be to give some (1-3) free missionaries of the "supposed to be" religion to the more problematic civs (Morocco and Andalusia for instance) after a while.

What else should he do?
He spreads Catholicism when possible, adds gold and builds buildings to their favourite/most faithful Catholics.
Other than the Crusades and that, the Papal States doesn't have any role ATM.
I remember that in earlier versions he sent a few units around the map. He still did nothing relevant (except perhaps some religion spreading via missionaries), but seeing a few papal units moving around made me remember that he was still there. Still, not an actual problem, just a comment.

This is a good thing, is it not?
Unless it was in the 15th century or later :)
Indeed. I'm just trying to resist the temptation of diverting the crusade to Constantinople and making them fall ahead of schedule (and razing all the cities on barbarian hands).

I would need a savegame right before these things happened.
Otherwise no real chance to find any possible bugs.
Also, the mainscreen stability counter is not always up-to-date.
Only the stability in the F2 screen, that refreshes every time you enter it.
The values that I gave were from the F2 screen. Albeit, I'm unsure as to how much good the save will do as the situation was partially induced with the WB. Anyway, assuming I figure out the attachment system of the forum, I'll put it in here. Otherwise, I'll use mediafire.
I tested it in this order:
  • attack the size 1 city, razed. Stability changed as expected (expansion +1, swing -3)
  • attack the size 3 city, razed. Further -3 in swing, but no change on expansion.
  • attack the size 2 city, razed. expansion +1, swing -3, cities(left side) +4 (?)
I assume other combination should do something similar.
Kazimierz got to be much better recently.
Was rather controversial before, as spreading Judaism cost you way too much stability-wise.
Now with Jewish Quarters reducing instability from Judaism it's much more friendly, so it more than feasible in some situations with the huge boost to your economy.
Also this makes it greatly in line to real life and history IMO.
True. Still not a good idea if you don't have a stability buffer, but that may fall in the "you're insane" category rather than a mechanic problem.

Ehh, that's a very old bug I cannot find for the life of me.
AFAIK it appears in all RFC-style mods.
I might be absolutely wrong in this, but sometimes I tend to think it's a limitation in the engine.
I think someone mentioned that had fixed that on RFC at some point, but I may be misremembering. Anyway, not a big deal.
 

Attachments

@Arcangelus

Great post, looks really helpfull to me.

I recall the Swiss Pikemen being part-time mercenaries and part-time farmers. There wasn't any mention of that in your post. It always stroke me as a nice touch of trivia. (your post was on Swiss Line Infantry though, so it might still be in under the heading Swiss Pikemen.)

And yes, you figured out my DSOC.
:old:
It will be a very important term in future psychology and sociology.​
 
@Arcangelus

Great post, looks really helpfull to me.

I recall the Swiss Pikemen being part-time mercenaries and part-time farmers. There wasn't any mention of that in your post. It always stroke me as a nice touch of trivia. (your post was on Swiss Line Infantry though, so it might still be in under the heading Swiss Pikemen.)

And yes, you figured out my DSOC.
:old:
It will be a very important term in future psychology and sociology.​
While true for the Swiss formation of the 16th century and earlier, by the 1700 the Swiss mercenaries were more akin to regular battalions that happened to be conformed by foreigners and with a higher pay-check. It seems that by then they were used as integral part of the army (France, Spain, Britain) and ceremonial guards (France, Dutch, Rome) at full time, so they didn't have the time nor need to be farmers. However, when their units were disbanded and basically forced to return to Switzerland (by need), then they "reintegrated" with some effort to the life of a farmer.

It's not mentioned on the Swiss pikemen, nor anywhere for that matter. However, I'm not sure if it would be appropriate to mention it here. I guess I could add an extra paragraph saying something along the lines of:
"After the disbanding of the main Swiss mercenaries battalions, most of the former soldiers returned to Switzerland. In there, and after some effort, they were reintegrated to the rural life. An amend on the Swiss constitution on 1874 banning the recruitment of Swiss citizens by foreign powers put the final nail on the group, with the sole exception of the papal guards."
Besides that, I consider that it would be more appropiate to include it in either the Swiss pikeman description or the description of the Swiss mercenary (Not sure if it's only code, an actual unit or internal classification).

I hope so.​

Anyway, a few more proposed changes: (in red)
Spoiler :
Unique Powers and Historical Victories
There are no leader traits in Rhye's and Fall of Civilization. They were removed and replaced with a system of Unique Powers: each civilization has one unique ability according to its historical role. Given the different start years, each civilization have its own modifiers (which rendered leader traits useless). Their effect are summarized in the civ selection screen, at the beginning of the game, with general parameters rated 1 to 5 stars.[PARAGRAPH:2]Each Civilization can achieve a "Historical Victory" fulfilling 3 goals that differ from civ to civ and match their own historical background or just what they were trying to achieve. This way even a civilization with a weaker starting situation such as the Dutch has a chance of success. When 2 goals out of 3 are achieved, a "Triumphal Arch" is automatically built in player's capital, triggering a Golden Age.


Spoiler :
Welcome to Rhye's and Fall of Civilization: Europe
v1.4
RFC Europe is a mod that derives from Rhye's and Fall of Civilization. It is Eurocentric in nature, spans the Middle Ages and Renaissance periods of Europe from 500AD to 1800AD.
For any other question you can visit the official site (http://rhye.civfanatics.net) or the development forum (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=250322)
Everything in this mod is currently under construction and open to debate.

NOTE: I removed the mention of the wiki as it no longer exists

This line about how the crusades work:
Spoiler :

- A Crusade is called only if Jerusalem is controlled by a non-Catholic, non-Orthodox player
NOTE: I removed "and non-Independent" as it's no longer the case.

Next: Changing the text about corporations (hopping that I don't break something in the process).
BTW, where is deemed appropriated to describe concept with icons? Like instead of saying "healthiness" using the icon for it.
 
Proposed text for corporations:
Spoiler :
Corporations
Founding a Corporation
There are two requirements that must be fulfilled before a player can found a Corporation. First they must have researched a specific to each Corporation. Once researched, they must then move a Great Person into a city that has one or more of the resources required by the Corporation they wish to create. By expending the proper type of Great Person, they may found the Corporate Headquarters in their city.
There are two kinds of corporation: Military Orders and Merchant Guilds. Each kind requires a different type of Great Person:
The Military Orders require a Great Theologian to be build, and compete with each other and one merchant guild. These are Knights Hospitallier, Knights Templar and Teutonic Knights. (note: links should be added)
The Merchant Guilds require a Great Merchant to be establish. These are the Hanseatic League, Medici Banks, Augsburg Families and Banks of St. George. (note: links should be added)

Corporate Benefits and Hindrances
Each Corporation requires a resource or a group of resources be present in a city in order for the Corporation to be constructed there. Once a Corporation is constructed, it incurs a maintenance cost, but also provides the city with a resource or yield bonus. These bonuses can range from providing a significant boost to a city's culture to granting access to relics to a player who could not otherwise acquire it. The owner of the Corporate Headquarters will also receive a gold bonus for each city in which their Corporation is present.

Spreading a Corporation
Once a Corporation is constructed in a city, that city may produce Corporate Executives. The emissaries of economy and the missionaries of moolah, Corporate Executives spread Corporate presence outside the Headquarters city. By building a Corporate Executive and moving it to a city with the appropriate resources, a player may expand the influence of a Corporation and increase the income produced by his Corporate HQ.
When a Corporate Executive spreads a Corporation to a new city, it removes a certain amount of Gold from the player's treasury. This amount is increased if the player is attempting to spread the Corporation to a foreign city. Two corporations that consume the same resource cannot coexist in the same city and it will cost extra to replace one Corporation that consumes a resource with another that consumes the same resource.
You may block foreign Corporations from entering your cities by adopting the Mercantilism Civic.

BTW, when Footman s used as the name of a unit (Seljuk Heavy Footman, for instance) Is it supposed to mean soldier on foot (foot-man) or male servant (literal meaning)?
 
Thanks for the text, but the corporations will get a massive overhaul soon. (We will incorporate the company system of SoI) This makes these texts obsolete. Sorry that you "wasted" your energy on this. :blush:
 
Thanks for the text, but the corporations will get a massive overhaul soon. (We will incorporate the company system of SoI) This makes these texts obsolete. Sorry that you "wasted" your energy on this. :blush:
I'm not familiar with it. Are there many differences? In any case, it still works as a reminder of what the previous system was like to see if there was any improvement. And if soon means over a week, it was still worth it regardless.
Anyway, I've spend most of my energy translating (or updating) texts to Spanish. Mostly for it's own sake, really (and not even tackled the bigger files: just concepts, mercenaries and the main parts of units. But I'll get there).
The following buildings lack bluff text: Shieling(Shielding?), Seaport, Research Institute, Public School, Konets, Kashab. I think I'll continue with those.
 
In SoI corporations/companies are no longer founded or manually spread, but instead spread automatically based on the city's situation and properties. That basically invalidates your whole description.
 
So, like a disease? That can be either very interesting or very frustrating, depending on implementation. How well does it work in practice? I'll assume that pretty well, if you want to import it. Well, I guess I'll find out soon enough.

PD:I just realised that Judaism works on a similar fashion. The parallel wasn't intended.
 
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