Summer and Education in the States

[Gooblah]

Well. Summer vacation is nearly upon me, which brings to mind a good question about education:

Should school districts have longer school years? If so, how should this be implemented?

A second, slightly unrelated question:

Should the United States create a national exit exam for all students graduating from high school?

Note: For Question 2, disregard feasability, I would prefer a discussion of potential effectiveness. By exit exam, I mean something like the French system, where there is such an exam, except optional "specialties" would exist; thus, if you intended to go into Engineering, you'd take the general exam, then the engineering exam, so even if you decide later to screw engineering, you still have the rudimentary skills necessary for other forms of work. The SAT and ACT would be scrapped as requirements for college admissions, and colleges wouldn't look at them.

My opinion: Preferably no, but I can see a few cases where it would be necessary. Maybe shorter school days during summer? To the second question: yeah. At this point districts have too much control (IMO) of what goes on in the school district. NCLB went ahead, but was poorly designed and implemented. With national standards, all students and districts would be forced to step up to the plate.

 

[bhsup]

And just why should some bureaucrat half a continent away in DC have any bloody say over Missouri schools? Big frakkin' no to #2. Stay out of our schools, Federalies.

 

[Trajan12]

I think school should be year round but the days should be cut in half.

 

[Bigfoot3814]

No, I think the length of the scool year is just fine.

As for the exit exam, I sort of like the idea, but I more like the idea that more vocational skills would be taught in school. Sure, you may be able to do calculus, mister graduate, but can you fix a flat tire?

Here's my question. Is high school supposed to prepare you for the real world, or just for college? The truth of the matter is, some kids aren't going to college, at least not right away. What are those people supposed to do to get by?

 

[DNK]

Since I'm no longer in school, yes, yes they should. Shove more learnings into those little heads!

Honestly, the school system needs a lot more than longer years, though. I'd look to start removing a large portion of the teachers and raising pay and incentives to attract more talented individuals first.

Edit: Yeah, the federal government should stay out of education. It's a state thing.

 

[JollyRoger]

Just have an exit exam each May - if you pass, you get the summer off, if you flunk, you're stuck in school until next May.

 

[OttoManD]

I think longer school years are a good idea.

As to #2, I disagree. Instead, perhaps an expansion of the SAT tests into more subject areas? It is definately useful to universities to have some sort of accepted common standard, and this would provide it at arm's length.

 

[Bigfoot3814]

As to #2, I disagree. Instead, perhaps an expansion of the SAT tests into more subject areas? It is definately useful to universities to have some sort of accepted common standard, and this would provide it at arm's length.

Have you forgoten the SAT II's?

 

[OttoManD]

I haven't forgotten them, but I'd like to see them expanded beyond US History, Languages, Math, Chem and Physics. for example I think Biology, and some sort of pre-Engineering combo of physics and math could be useful.

 

[Tomoyo]

There is an SAT II Biology (I took it! In fact there are two versions of Biology -- ecology and molecular), and two Math exams plus Physics seems to be enough...

As for the actual topic, I say no. It's way too hot. I'm melting...

Though there are more factors at play. In the city, many teenagers work during the summer for money which is essential to their families (or for their college education), and taking that time away from them would be kinda bad. I went to a conference once where someone suggested, basically, "paying kids to learn," where you paid kids to participate in after-school clubs in lieu of taking up jobs. The extra schooling does come at a cost.

And exit exam would be nice. More exams are always nice. I love exams. Just as long as it's not in some sweltering facility where my mental capacity is near quartered.

 

[Bigfoot3814]

Biology is now availible. Anyways, most people who take these tests, at least at my school, are just in it for the college application boost, and have no genuine interest in the subjects.

Anyway, this is beside the point to me. Adding more standardized tests is only going to make things worse. When a standardized test is required, it forces classes to conform soley to the material on the test. In other words, a biology class will become a biology test preparation class. People won't really be learning anything anymore. And isn't that what school is supposed to be about? Learning?

 

[Fifty]

I'd like to preemptively say that I agree with whatever downtown has to say on the subject.

 

[bhsup]

I'd like to preemptively say that I agree with whatever downtown has to say on the subject.

I hate to disappoint you, Fifty, but I feel ready to confess that Downtown is actually my alternate persona that I've been fooling you all with for years now.

 

[El_Machinae]

I wouldn't mind if the various States went and standardized their testing. But it would be tough, because some regions would really show their weakness under standardized testing.

 

[Drewcifer]

Some of the most important moments of my youth were summer vacation related.

If we make growing up all about type A success oriented things then we will create a nation of automatons who live to work and won't be able to appreciate the other side of life. A happy, well adjusted and well rounded person needs to be good at playing as well as at working in order to live a full life; that is what summer vacation is for. It would be foolish to take it away. As it is kids lives are so much more structured today then they were when I was growing up, I'm not sure it is a good thing.

 

[Elrohir]

Longer school years: No. They're already too long, and I'm tired of government burauecrats stealing summer from people.

Exit exams: Sounds like a good idea, but I think the states should be the ones to make and administer them.

 

[Bill3000]

And just why should some bureaucrat half a continent away in DC have any bloody say over Missouri schools? Big frakkin' no to #2. Stay out of our schools, Federalies.

Because your schools suck.

 

[CCRunner]

As a student, it would be a terrible idea to lengthen school. It's long enough as it is
Also, when would people be able to go on vacation?

I don't like the idea of a national exit test from High School either. Everyone that it would matter to is already taking the SAT/ ACT so why make them do even more?

 

[Shadylookin]

I think the school year is long enough as it is. If you have problems you could take summer school.

And just why should some bureaucrat half a continent away in DC have any bloody say over Missouri schools? Big frakkin' no to #2. Stay out of our schools, Federalies.

Agreed the federal government would have to make it so easy so people in Missouri could pass that it would be pointlessly easy for everyone else (joking of course)

I'm against number 2 because another standardized exam at the end of the school year would make everyone's head explode

 

[Gooblah]

I meant to scrap the SAT, ACT, and other such forms and replace them with one national test, then optional tests (like the SATIIs) designed to test proficiency in certain areas. A student who plans on majoring in Engineering and/or going to a school where the maths are heavily favored should take the general test, then a Math/Engineering/Physics optional exam to increase their chances of getting into lucrative universities.

Our education system currently...sucks. To be blunt, we are getting screwed over. Singapore, Scandinavia, Japan, S. Korea, Europe...all kicking our ass right now. We used to be the most advanced nation on the planet. Now we're dying. We put a man on the moon. Now we're failing by international standards (see the TIMSS study). Well, not failing, per se. More like doing poorly.

Now, I know that a lot of these nations have pretty homogenous populations, where the overwhelming majority of the population speak the same language very fluently, and everyone is basically alike in terms of culture; the US has one of the highest rates of language disparity (for lack of a better term) in the world (IIRC), so a lot of kids need to go through ESL in order to have it all work out, resulting in a drop in average scores. But I think one of the main problems with our scores and schools is culture, more than anything. In basically all other nations in the world, the smart kids, the straight-A students, the ones who set the curve are revered by their peers. Here, they're bullied for being "nerds" and "geeks"; our society favors brawn over brain in high-school, leading to less kids being willing to sacrifice a "social life" for school.

Thankfully, if I mentioned my "social life" getting screwed to my parents, they would probably shoot me (literally), and then make me study harder. Due to this Indian culture, I think I"ll be fine...