Team Piffle

[BCLG100]

he's said similar things to me also.

 

[robboo]

Sweet is a smart guy but based on how much he has been out of town with our PBEM he cant be that helpful.

So am I reading this to mean that Whomp and Tubby have issues or was the Tubby comment something else.

Simon arent you playing Kickboti or is it killercane....I cant remember.

 

[BCLG100]

im playing neither, im playing killer

different killer though

 

[Robi D]

That way just midway through chatting. I didn't prompt him but when the issue came up i couldn't help but try to dig a little deeper. Bascally he was lamenting that there wasn't as much fun happening in the Piffle forum as there was is KISS. I got him to list the old KISS players in Piffle just trying to feel things out. That he spilled some beans, well good for us. Sweet seems to have had some influence, but then he did play a lot of the earier turns. We do know whomp and Tubs like the GL so they obviously have enough influence in the team to make them go that way. Whomp also mentioned at one stage that he was looking for someone else to take over playing the saves but i couldn't find that part when i was copy/pasting.

The other person he mentions is conroe, anyone played with him previously?

 

[robboo]

Hmmm...so what are they saying about us. Other than our lack of numbers in here and posting other places we seem to get along great and dont have much contention/head banging.

 

[BCLG100]

No but apparantly he's decent, plays the gotm or something.

whomp was saying he had no part in discussion for GL at all, so i think that was prob's tubby's idea

 

[BCLG100]

Hmmm...so what are they saying about us. Other than our lack of numbers in here and posting other places we seem to get along great and dont have much contention/head banging.

Well no ive managed to convince both mauer and whomp that i have a hatred of you

i think its a good idea to promote the idea of disharmony within the team, reckon the prez should maybe mass PM all the members not posting?

 

[robboo]

I cant stand you either.....bastard.

mauer is pissed off at me still for saying he was building marines in the pitboss game. He hasnt talked to me in Pm since then. Funny thing is...I ddint know he was making marines i only guessed...my spy was busy pillaging your resources.

 

[Robi D]

Does anyone else find it interesting that with Whomp out of town no one in Piffle has been around/able/willing to play the save in nearly 4 days.

I'm not one to complain but should we ask the admins to get involved?

 

[BCLG100]

just been played but yep see what you mean

 

[robboo]

leave it be...it was also an American holiday...so no one may have been around.

Just relax and when they start complainin about someone else...we bring this up.

/I will need some pitboss replacements around Christamas...12/26 to 12/31. I will have internet but not civ. In tubby's 2 Civ pitboss game and in the CDZ group hug...if anyone can play let me know. I dont care about the warlords game.

 

[Robi D]

leave it be...it was also an American holiday...so no one may have been around.

Just relax and when they start complainin about someone else...we bring this up.

/I will need some pitboss replacements around Christamas...12/26 to 12/31. I will have internet but not civ. In tubby's 2 Civ pitboss game and in the CDZ group hug...if anyone can play let me know. I dont care about the warlords game.

I understand there was a holiday in america, but they still haven't played the turn, its 4 1/2 days now. I would have expected at least one person to be availible in that time. I wont say anything about it but it is.

With the other games they will probably take them down over the christmas period as most people travel at that time.

 

[robboo]

thats cool but i agree someone should have been able to play. It appears that not every team is as well organized and devoted as ours..... and thatis only to our advantage.

 

[StrategyDoRk]

I have RE-devoted myself

Though I still can't get Civ to work on this laptop >.<

 

[Robi D]

I ran into Whomp and i figured it would be good to kick things off and get an idea of where we are. We talked about a couple of different games so i've edited the others out for your convienience . I have put things in bold that i though was particualrly interesting. My comments are in (brackets)

Rob says:
ok civ4 it is
Rob says:
simon is the man for foriegn stuff but he is away for a couple of day
Whomp says:
no probs
Rob says:
we can still talk about some things, i still remember how to do the diplomacy thing
Whomp says:

Whomp says:
Our team is happy to meet you guys for sure
Rob says:
so i gather you guys are interested in peace and friendship
Whomp says:
We are
Whomp says:
My personal #1 partner but we can discuss whether you're interested in that or not
Rob says:
we are happy to have a positive relationship with you guys
Rob says:
if we can work it out personally i'm happy to have it that us 2 are the last ones left
Whomp says:
my thinking as well
Whomp says:
sounds like a broken record
Rob says:
so who have you met/found?
Whomp says:
We've met Epsilon...eek
Whomp says:
you?
Rob says:
i though as much
Rob says:
we have found Innovia and met Loco
Whomp says:
ok cool
Rob says:
Innovia have been friendly and Loco coolish
Whomp says:
i wonder if we can figure out some tech deals
Whomp says:
epsilon has offered a 20&#37; discount on their techs
Whomp says:
and 50% if paid in cash
(this was a big thing, they are pretty desperate to trade. Also their gold offer is suicidal for Piffle which Whomp said as much later on, but its clear they are trying to find a way to run 100% research)

Rob says:
as for Loco we are not sure whether or not thats down to the lack of MTDG expierence in the team
Whomp says:
i'm putting my trust in you by giving you that info
Rob says:
interesting offer
Whomp says:
but i'd like to make a long term deal with you guys
Rob says:
we haven't had much time to talk about it in the team since most are off on holidays so i don't want to mislead you by getting to specific but we would be interested in looking at tech swapping on a beaker for beaker basis
Whomp says:
i'd think loco is timid because they don't know who to trust
Whomp says:
ok
Rob says:
i suppose you guys would be interested in maths?
Whomp says:
i would like to take advantage of Epsilon's lead
Rob says:
what do they have?
Whomp says:
having Bureau has helped them enormously
Rob says:
i agree with that
Rob says:
that has given them a boost
Whomp says:
i'd have to look but they are powerful already
Whomp says:
interesting map with the isthmus'
Rob says:
yes from what we can see its an interesting layout, but we haven't done as much exploring as we would have liked
Whomp says:
civ4 is a tough game trying to balance out everything you want
Rob says:
especially when your scouts get eaten
Whomp says:
we had a couple shocking losses
Whomp says:
curse Sirian
Rob says:
hehe
Rob says:
what are you researching currently?
Whomp says:
CoL
Rob says:
ok
Rob says:
we can probably still work some deals out of the next few turns
Whomp says:
OBs with no units?
Whomp says:
boats maybe?
Whomp says:
could you use the trade route?
Rob says:
do we have a trade route available? (i'll need to check that)
Whomp says:
not sure
Whomp says:
should soon i'd think
Rob says:
well i don't think anyone would disagree with having OB
Whomp says:
ok
Whomp says:
see what your team thinks about a long term partnership
Rob says:
and i don't see the need for any unit restrictions (I not bothered about their galley and i want our scout to be able to wander through their territory)
Whomp says:
we'd rather not partner with epsilon for reasons I think we're both well aware of
Rob says:
haha yes quite correct
Rob says:
there is about 4 i can think of
(for those that arn't aware, Epsilon consists mainly of people from MIA in the first C3C MTDG, who won (1st reason) During the game, while they did not break any agreements as such, they willingly pushed the limits of them and always looked for the tiniest loophole to take advantage of at the expense of the other team(2nd and main reason). Also DaveMcW who's on the team won the MTDG pitboss(3rd reason) and with Beuro early are leading this one too(4th reason). Not that i have sour grapes but its time to share the love around )

Rob says:
well next time one of us gets the save OB can be sent
Whomp says:
ok
Whomp says:
i'll post this
Whomp says:
and when simon gets back we can talk or Killercane
Rob says:
no probs
Rob says:
btw have you guys discovered Iron Working?
Whomp says:
i'd like to manipulate that epsilon offer
Whomp says:
there's got to be a way for us to get to tech parity and lead i'd think
Whomp says:
I think we have
Rob says:
have you found Iron deposits anywhere?
Whomp says:
hehe
Whomp says:
no and i assume you haven't either
Rob says:
nope (looks like we are going to have to work out tactics for an ironless world)
Rob says:
damn sirian
Whomp says:
haha
Whomp says:
elephants lol
Rob says:
*shakes fist*
Rob says:
there is a positive to that
Rob says:
only one team has an iron dependant UU
Rob says:
guess which one
Whomp says:
Epsilon
Rob says:

Rob says:
somehow i can't bring myself to feel sorry for them
Whomp says:
Sirian really messed up the traditional way of doing things
Rob says:
i like it myself, make you think about things because you can't use the same tactics as always
Rob says:
No iron means no pike, crossbows, knights, cannons and frigates oh and swords
Rob says:
i must say epsilons offer is an interesting one, they definately are eager for gold? were they asking 1 gold per beaker?
Whomp says:
they're eager for a partner
Whomp says:
the gold part is suicide
Rob says:
absolutely, they want to run 100% research
Whomp says:
right
Whomp says:
unless we're able to stick it to them somehow i doubt we'd do that and are very leery of the 20% too
Rob says:
Well from our stand point at this current time it could be possible to have a 3 way alliance with us and Innovia since like i said they have been friendly (if we could work this one out then we can negate Epsilons lead and get one of our own, and out of the 3 teams i think we would be in the best position to win)
Whomp says:
that would be fine too
Rob says:
If Epsilon want to deal with Loco then good luck to them
Whomp says:
well i think we'd be open to a 3 way partnership
Whomp says:
and crush the others either financially or militarily
Rob says:
a 3 way trading alliance would nullifly any advantage Epsilon would have gotten from getting CS early
Whomp says:
they made no stipulations on trades either
Whomp says:
so the 20% one could haunt them (getting cheap tech from Epsilon to catch up their lead would be funny )
Rob says:
interesting
Whomp says:
right so if we can all coordinate research all the better
Rob says:
they couldn't be that silly
Whomp says:
no stipulations
Whomp says:
they're looking for a partner...i think they know they're Davemcw
Rob says:
oh well thats something to look into at some stage
Rob says:
so they haven't met anyone except you?
Whomp says:
they haven't asked and neither have we
Rob says:
the only other possiblity is Loco
Whomp says:
that's not helping them i'd think
Whomp says:
though i don't know loco's makeup since we haven't met them
Rob says:
i'm happy for them to stay isolated
Whomp says:
Me too
Whomp says:
but i'd like to take advantage of them somehow
Rob says:
anyway i should go and post this stuff so our boffins can have a look at it and see that we can get some deals up and going quickly
Whomp says:
ok sounds good
Rob says:
lets not do the taking advantage again
Whomp says:

Rob says:
didn't work last time and i'm not trying it again
Rob says:

Whomp says:
different deal
Whomp says:
we have no stipulations
Whomp says:
so we'll see
Rob says:
ideally we would like to meet them with a greeting party of about 15 cossaks and support staff
Rob says:
outside one of their cities of course
Whomp says:
heheh
Whomp says:
ok well i better go too. Vegas tomorrow.
Rob says:
no probs, have a good time

Basically my 2 cents are
- I'm happy to trade with Piffle and if possible get a 3 way tech trading allaince between Innovia, Piffle and us. Epsilon's lead would disapear very quickly.
- I don't want to commit to any military action until we know where everyone is on the map and how everyone would gain from the removal of a team. I don't want to expend units for another team to get more out of it than us.
- We do have to look at the ways no iron will effect the game and work out a way to use it to our advantage.
- We are in a good position, if we can have our 9 or so cities covering our peninsular quickly, then we can start developing them and expanding outward into the empty regions.

 

[robboo]

that deal with whomp sounds reasonable. I will post more when i have more time( ie from work)

 

[robboo]

OK longer version....

Epsilon....DaveMcW offered the same thing to me in the pitboss game right before the "Westerns" attacked. I expect he is using the same formula for success in this game. I think Epsilon needs to die first.

Map...whomp gave away alot with this statement and with the iron. Also he either has the UU memorized or he also did what we did about who doesnt have iron. The irony of this is what if epsilon has iron.

3 way tech allaince....we need to get Innovia on board and quick before loco gets them on board. We also need to figure out if its an open exchange or beaker for beaker. This could be a major sticking point which could stop mid fight from killing Epsilon. This is a variation of what happened in the pitboss game. In addition...we need to make sure we dont help someone more than ourselves by removing Epsilon( as you said Robi)


This is the kind of open discussion I feel we have been waiting on. We need one just like this with Innovia. Now its time to see if Innovia is ready to join the 3 way. If not...then we need to figure out where they stand.

 

[Robi D]

As far as Epsilon having Iron, i would be surprised if Sirian did that on purpose. Them losing the use of a UU is far less unfair the the rest of us losing the use of 3 key mid game units (cannons, knights, frigates)
Then only way anyone would get iron is the potluck method of mining a hill and working it. Even then their is only a 5% chance of discovering something and its not just iron, it could be gold, silver, copper, gems and later on coal and uranium. If they could get that lucky then good luck to them. The other possibility is that there is a pile of iron around the middle where no ones explored yet.

I think Innovia would go for a 3 way trade alliance, all 3 of us are in a similar position tech wise, and it would give all 3 a big advantage in that area. We could easily make up the early Epsilon advantage got from Beurocracy. I think the best way to proceed with the techs is beaker for beaker, its absolute and leaves no room for arguments latter on. If i learned one thing about multi-team alliances from pitboss its that the smallest things can create friction.

Military wise i'm not sure if Innovia would be eager or not. But before we start making plans on that front we need to pinpoint everyones location in respect to us, so the military thing is not the biggest concern at the moment.


As for right now with Piffle there is an oppertunity now to do a few trades for backfill of techs. We can get Meditation, Masonry and Archery off them for Maths and have a few beakers left over for future trades or even ask for the account to be settled with some gold. Is that a good deal for us? yes/no/maybe?

 

[robboo]

i like that trade and settling for gold is cool with me too or they may want to "open and account of beakers"

Leave the settlement up to them, lets not demand gold for a balance just tell them they have to make it right with either gold(x per beaker) or with a future tech trade.

 

[Kuningas]

We declare war to team Epsilon eventually, before they get too strong. Team Piffle would make a great ally in that. Team Innovia will not join us in crusade against Epsilon, neither they join Epsilon's side. Team Loco is a question mark, may be that Epsilon would try to convert Locos to their Vassal States.