Timer dicussion

[2metraninja]

2 months no posting is indeed much.

I think sending a PM to r_rolo1 to ask him if all is OK and he is around is in order.

As an alternative I see DaveMCW is online often. He was the admin in the MTDG2 and did great job. Shall we consider tryomg to contact him if we dont hear from r_rolo1 ?

 

[talonschild]

Yeah, if it comes to getting a replacement he'd be a great suggestion.

 

[Sommerswerd]

Again, I prefer we just stay out of this. RB are the only ones complaining about this. Just ignore them. Just because they are trying to make it an issue doesn't mean it is one. There is no issue on the table that requires admin action, so there is no emergent need to replace the admin.

We should just keep quiet. Only if and when a majority of teams say they want a new admin do we then make a suggestion. And if there is going to be a new admin, they should be from CFC.

 

[YossarianLives]

Ok i understand this but even 35h seems a lot to me...maybe we should agree on 30h in case of war ? because its slow the game too much...

And for the admin, maybe we don't need it ? caledorn could play this role even if he is part of a team ? i have no doubt about his ability and his honesty !

Caledorn, how do you feel about this? Would you be comfortable doing this if you got unanimous approval from all the teams? If you're ok with it, I think we should give it our official team support.

 

[2metraninja]

This one is tricky. Even if all agree now, there will be always some that say later: "He is from team CFC, of course he will judge like this." and Cal will need to take in to consideration this possible reaction and this will influence his judging.

 

[Caledorn]

This one is tricky. Even if all agree now, there will be always some that say later: "He is from team CFC, of course he will judge like this." and Cal will need to take in to consideration this possible reaction and this will influence his judging.

Exactly. I need to abstain from this.

However, the lack of a game admin is seriously starting to bother me as the host.

 

[Sommerswerd]

I agree with Caledorn and 2metra. Better to just stay out of it. I still don't think having an admin is critical until we actually need an admin decision.

We dont need to bend over backwards to rush to appoint a new admin everytie someone complains about timer length. Somebody always complains about timer length,, "its too slow, its too fast... on and on"

 

[classical_hero]

So when are we going to publicly say that we aren't in favour of Plako taking over?

 

[Sommerswerd]

Well Plako pledged that he would not take the job unless all teams voiced support, so if we just stay quiet, it has the same effect.

Plus, there are several teams that are so far remaining silent about this issue. Maybe they have similar concerns, or maybe they just don't see any need for this who knows? Anyway, I think that there is no benefit to our team making any statement against it as it will just start an argument about why... which seems pointless. If there is a point and I am missing it I am open to hearing it.

Also, our team is still divided on the issue and we are trying to agree-to-disagree and not to argue about it.

 

[2metraninja]

We need to do the following:

We must contact r_rolo1 and ask him if he is around and point him to the timer discussion. Because there is one and the same team which slows all the time the timer.

If he is not around, then we proceed and ask another CFC admin to take his place. DaveMCW comes to my mind. He knows MP and he did great job in the last MTDG2.

I also think that there must be active admin. The game is working, as we say: "The caravan is going", but if we struck on a problem which needs admin ruling, the following pause and mess can easily turn away some of the players/teams from the game. We all know there is always 1-2 drops when a game is stopped for 1-2 weeks.

 

[YossarianLives]

fwiw, I support Plako as admin (obviously), but I am going to stay out of this discussion. Good luck 2metra
motivating the team to get behind an option

Edit: Just wanted to add that I support any attempt to get an admin for this game, so I am also on board with asking DaveMcW.

Edit 2: I don't expect anyone to hold back on commenting just because I decline to do so, and won't take any offense to Sommers or anyone else posting their opinions on this topic.

 

[tobiasn]

What's the reason why some people don't want plako as admin?

I agree we need one. Also it's kind of a weird move to be stalling and keeping out of a discussion, also because we're sort of playing on "home turf".. From an objective standpoint, ideally we should be proactive in these matters.

But there's obv reasons for us to not do this? Can someone get me up to speed on why?

 

[Sommerswerd]

FTR my primary objection is to CFC suggesting a non-CFC admin. As for my concerns about plako I will just let my numerous prior posts speak for themselves.

@ tobiasn - Out of respect for what Yossa said, I am going to hold off on repeating all my lengthy arguments from this thread. Our opinions are all there for the reading though...

 

[Sommerswerd]

We need to do the following:

We must contact r_rolo1 and ask him if he is around and point him to the timer discussion. Because there is one and the same team which slows all the time the timer.

If he is not around, then we proceed and ask another CFC admin to take his place. DaveMCW comes to my mind. He knows MP and he did great job in the last MTDG2.

I also think that there must be active admin. The game is working, as we say: "The caravan is going", but if we struck on a problem which needs admin ruling, the following pause and mess can easily turn away some of the players/teams from the game. We all know there is always 1-2 drops when a game is stopped for 1-2 weeks.

EDIT: I forgot to say that I agree with 2metra that we should ask DaveMcW if he would be willing to take the job if r_rolo does not want it anymore.

 

[tobiasn]

@Sommers I see, I'll read through it and not be so lazy..

As for who's not-CFC and who's CFC, I can't say that I know so much about these things - this past year has been the only time I've been really active in the Civ community. I agree that it makes sense that we go for a CFC guy. But the most important qualities in an admin I would say are integrity and objectivity.

Based on my relatively short history in the community I won't go into any discussion about who's fit for being admin or not. But I do agree that we should take a more active part in the discussion per se, and try and sort this situation out amicably (and proactively).

 

[bistrita]

Well my 2c plako its from cfc too,and he realy falows this game.

 

[tobiasn]

Man that was some wall of text.

From what I can discern, the real (well.. the strong) argument against plako as admin was that it could be percieved as us cozying up to RB. I find that notion to be kinda weird, but as already stated I'm fairly new to the Civ community psyche. However, the suggestion is out there anyway now, so why not back it?

Sommers, you're the only guy in the team that has voiced a strong opinion against plako - and it was not a personal argument, but a tactical one. Now that the tactical disadvantage (cfc suggesting a rb candidate) is gone, why not just go with the flow?

Here's how I would play it:
- Contact the teams that we want in the alliance vs RB and ask what they think (We know Apy is for, CP has not responded in the public forum)
- If they're cool with it, sort it out with plako, I'm sure he's a reasonable guy and understand the tactical qualms
- Voice our support in the public forum and get the timer down

 

[Caledorn]

I also think that there must be active admin. The game is working, as we say: "The caravan is going", but if we struck on a problem which needs admin ruling, the following pause and mess can easily turn away some of the players/teams from the game. We all know there is always 1-2 drops when a game is stopped for 1-2 weeks.

I am staying out of the discussion about who we should back as admin etc due to hosting the game, but what 2metraninja is saying here is a great concern to me.

If a situation arises at the moment which requires admin intervention (the timer issue is nonessential compared to situations that may arise), we effectively have an admin who is MIA. Which is the same as a game without an admin. If that happens, I will have no other choice but to save the game and shut the Pitboss down until an admin have been found. R_rolo has been absent for so long now that I no longer think he is interested in the position, and a new admin must be found ASAP. If a situation arises where an admin action needs to be taken and we do not have an admin, and the game is shut down, the ISDG will effectively be over if an admin cannot be elected within a week or two as several teams will drop out if that happens (and we all know that based on history of pitbosses that have broken down for similar reasons).

Now, speaking solely as the game host, I am urging the team to stop stalling this process intentionally and find a solution to what Team CFC wishes to propose in this situation ASAP. Also, while retaining as objective position as I can, I would also like to mention that my personal belief is that it reflects extremely bad on CFC that this important issue is being intentionally stalled for game political reasons, especially in light of the central role CFC had in making this game a reality. Remember that the other teams will one day read this internal discussion.

 

[tobiasn]

Guys. Should we do something about this? Any objections to the plan up there? Staying mute on the subject only hurts us.

 

[YossarianLives]

It appears that the most recent consensus was to remain silent and not participate in this discussion at all. I don't know how much support a different plan of action would need to garner in order to change course. I support any attempt to get a new admin. This is my order of preferences:

1. Voice our support for Plako as admin
2. tobiasn's suggestion that we contact our allies to see what their preference is, and hopefully eventually support Plako
3. 2metra's suggestion that we try to get DaveMcW to admin, then propose that to the other teams (I see alot of problems with this but it would be better than continuing to do nothing)