TSG69 After Actions

[VengerBR]

Years lurking... First time posting!!! Hello all of CivFanatics.

I had a blast playing this game and thought I'd share my experience with this particular GOTM. It seems that while the game was completely dominated from early on, I have a real hard time getting to science victory as fast as some of you can, and I really wonder why is that.

- How many cities did you build and how many did you decide to acquire?

Built only 3. Annexed Zulu capital early on, eventually annexed Rome and Palenque too, as well as puppeting maybe 3 other cities. Didn't attack any CS, chose to ally them instead as I got very rich quickly.

- How did you use religion or spying to your advantage?

Early on focused on preventing my techs from being stolen and using it for Diplo advantages, later switched to rigging CS's and whatever else. My religion eventually became world religion, which pissed Brazil off, but other than that, used mostly for Mosques and the "Gain science after you convert" trait.

- How did diplomacy go with your neighbors?

Pacal wanted to war Zulu really early, which was a shock! I asked for 10 turns and proceeded to blast Shaka - mostly on my own. Razed every city except for his capital - It was adjacent to mountain, and I really wanted observatory. Became one of my most important cities.

- How did the difficulty level affect your game decisions?

After taking Zulu out, I calmed down a lot on miliary. Other than that, business as usual. I play a lot on Warlord and Noble, as I'm really not that good as a player, with no real Diety experience.

- Did the Diplomacy Victory condition exclusion change how you play a science game?

Not really. If Diplo Victory was on, I'd win maybe 50 turns earlier, but other than that, not much of a difference.

By the way I finished at 1932 AD. I managed to get GL early. Got rich and went really hardcore on wonders and science buildings... Slacked a bit but still am surprised that some of you guys could finish it as soon as 1820~ish. Looking forward to GOTM 70!

 

[leif erikson]

Years lurking... First time posting!!! Hello all of CivFanatics.

Welcome to CivFanatics and GOTM!

Glad you decided to join us and that you had a good first game.

Keep up the good work.

 

[Monthar]

Game: Civ5 GOTM 69
Date submitted: 2013-09-26 20:01:02
Reference number: 29769
Your name: Monthar
Game status: Science Victory
Game date: 1909AD
Turns played: 329
Base score: 1593
Final score: 2450
Time played: 5:24:00
Submitted save: TSG69_Victory_Science.Civ5Save
Renamed file: Monthar_C506901.Civ5Save

Another poor performance for me.

 

[FeiLing]

T278.
Fells like I had way to many cities (puppets) as I took and kept all the cities Shaka threw at me (he had 5 cities by turn ~75. Seems plausible if it is Deity... oh wait... it''s Warlord. Hmm.
Also took out Maya and Rome later.

Interesting that most here seemed to have gone Order. Went Freedom and bought the SS parts with cash.

Had pretty much every specialist working in every city (3 self settled) all the time. At the end Tradition, Rationalism, Patronage and Liberty were completed and 2 SPs in Exploration for the +3 hammers per coastal city as well... so basically somehow (didn't built Amphitheaters until very late after I had enough cash to just additionally buy all the culture stuff); so I got a ton of policies (would have been enough to win culturally in G&Ks).

Not getting HG in a non river/lake capital seems fatal.

 

[Arilian]

HG is not as important, it gave the same money as one trade ship (more later). So colossus is better in every aspect.

 

[FeiLing]

I was more concerned about the lack of a garden

 

[Tesuji]

Scout cannot demand for me and have 0 military value. I demand a lot, basically I am trying what you say. I also get free workers from the Zulu, so dont have to dow any CS.

NC comes at t50-55, but education only T100.

Capturing the Zulu capital probalby a good idea, as it is near a mountain, but it is also on a hill, so investing 3-4 CB is needed.

The 'Military near CS' value seems random. I have seen where I have an archer and a spearman next to a CS without any units, and still have value 0. Sometimes one warrior gives 40. I couldn't see any rational pattern to it.

GL is possible to build in 39 turns if you use the tribute to build a worker ASAP.

 

[Tabarnak]

The 'Military near CS' value seems random. I have seen where I have an archer and a spearman next to a CS without any units, and still have value 0. Sometimes one warrior gives 40. I couldn't see any rational pattern to it.

It's not random. If a cs has equal army inside his territory it has 0 value. Same for barbs i think. You need to be completely alone to get full value.

 

[mad-bax]

Game: Civ5 GOTM 69
Date submitted: 2013-09-27 23:19:57
Reference number: 29775
Your name: mad-bax
Game status: Science Victory
Game date: 1892AD
Turns played: 316
Base score: 1910
Final score: 3031
Time played: 6:53:00
Submitted save: Maria I_0316 AD-1892.Civ5Save
Renamed file: mad-bax_C506901.Civ5Save

Well, I was already gutted that I didn't break 300 turns, but having seen some of the other games I feel worse now.

I followed Tabarnak's 3 city tradition method as far as I could.
I settled on the spot and built scout, half a worker, shrine, other half a worker, settler then GL, Oracle, NC. I didn't get a library in time in City2 to go GL, NC.

I couldn't settle as far west as I had hoped due to Zulu expansion. Seeing games where people managed to settle 2 cities west of the start leaves me scratching my head frankly.

The Zulu's declared around turn 160 and I was a bit surprised they had so many units. I finished up taking a city and getting one in the peace deal. I should have raised the inland city and built one on the coast.

I then played quietly until quite late in the game. When I discovered that Aluminium was going to be a problem I took out a Roman city with 8 Al and got another city in the peace deal.

I had 14 scientists in the end including the two from hubble, and actually generated another one on the turn I learned the last prerequisite tech.

The rest was quite straightforward.

I enjoyed the game very much, and for most of the time was sure I was going to break 300 turns. I learned a lot however, and can see a lot of things I did badly.

 

[Tesuji]

It's not random. If a cs has equal army inside his territory it has 0 value. Same for barbs i think. You need to be completely alone to get full value.

I get 'Military near CS' value of zero in both of the following screen-shots. It doesn't seem to stroke with your explanation. How 'alone' do I need to be?

 

[Tabarnak]

A scout has 0 value. In the 2nd screenshot the barb camp nearby has possibly a warrior into it making military value back to 0. I might be wrong though. It's only a personnal thought. I didn't find any thread about it but that's all i can say. Hope it helps.

 

[Blicero]

Game:	Civ5 GOTM 69
Date submitted:	2013-09-28 16:58:35
Reference number:	29782
Your name:	Blicero
Game status:	Science Victory
Game date:	1822AD
Turns played:	281
Base score:	2180
Final score:	3892
Time played:	5:48:00

Bullied in the beginning to get a settler. The plan was to eradicate everyone on my continent before discovering the other one, and keep their capitals. But I was late getting this done and had to delay contacting everyone else. Freedom may have been a better ideology for the ability to purchase parts with cash (I chose Order). Went full Tradition, Consulates, full Rationalism, and just deep enough into Order to get factory science boost.

- How many cities did you build and how many did you decide to acquire?
3 built, and acquired the 3 capitals on my continent.

- How did you use religion or spying to your advantage?
Founded a religion for cash & growth; no spying other than rigging elections.

- How did diplomacy go with your neighbors?
Not so well on my continent because I killed them. Better on the other.

- How did the difficulty level affect your game decisions?
Just assumed I could roll over everyone, which I did.

- Did the Diplomacy Victory condition exclusion change how you play a science game?
No.

Spoiler :

 

[dthompson32]

Pretty slow game. I didn't take the Zulus seriously, and lost my first city to them (Porto). Then I spent a bunch of time knocking Shaka out of the game in retribution. Once I had his cities, things went smoothly from there on.

The Portuguese special improvement for CSes would have been a lot more useful if every CS hadn't had gold. That made it less than optimal.

In general, it was typical for a science game for me. Get distracted and forget what I'm doing. Looking forward to reading how others got quick victories, so I can learn how to be more efficient.

Game: Civ5 GOTM 69
Date submitted: 2013-09-28 18:37:55
Reference number: 29784
Your name: dthompson32
Game status: Science Victory
Game date: 1918AD
Turns played: 338
Base score: 1555
Final score: 2320
Time played: 8:37:00
Submitted save: Maria I_0338 AD-1918.Civ5Save
Renamed file: dthompson32_C506901.Civ5Save

 

[Blicero]

Looking back my screw-around and eventual loss of the GL on T55 cost me about ~15 turns? Maybe the GW trick to get secularism right after rati open would help further. Will try a replay to see what sort of difference this makes. Will also buy worker first instead of settler.

But how this gets done by T207 is beyond me. Particularly when you consider it took me 11 turns to build Apollo and then about ~13 turns to build all the parts, means all your science must be done by T183...!

 

[tommynt]

A scout has 0 value. In the 2nd screenshot the barb camp nearby has possibly a warrior into it making military value back to 0. I might be wrong though. It's only a personnal thought. I didn't find any thread about it but that's all i can say. Hope it helps.

a scout dont have 0 value!

As for your own military strength been shown as 0 i m not totaly sure whats the reason - u guys think the CS having a own unit?
I m pretty sure that close barbs dont affect the stength shown

 

[Arilian]

I was never able to demand tribute with a scout. It always shown me 0 value.
But I did not try in this game, because, I was sure, it is 0 value, so did not even built a scout...

 

[tommynt]

Well yes the strength of a scout is not enough to be 20 and demand tribute, but bringing 2 changes things ...

Also scout increases total value in demos, bringing u to rank 1 if every1 else got only warris ...

 

[erisiamk]

Game: Civ5 GOTM 69
Date submitted: 2013-09-29 13:13:19
Reference number: 29788
Your name: erisiamk
Game status: Science Victory
Game date: 1905AD
Turns played: 325
Base score: 1563
Final score: 2404
Time played: 2:45:00
Submitted save: TSG69_Start.Civ5Save
Renamed file: erisiamk_C506901.Civ5Save

Apparently this is quite slow, but it's the fastest Science victory I've ever gotten!

The early game seemed fairly tight; I went OCC Tradition until I got the National College, then I sent three cities out. I must have been the only one to settle in the tundra since it was away from Shaka and I severely overestimated him.

Early wonder grabbing went really well, I got GL / NC / HG / Oracle which is pretty much unheard of. Shaka forward settled on me pretty aggressively, but I managed to take his offending city by turn 150 so that was okay. In retrospect I think the main thing slowing me down was trying to take that city... perhaps I should have just focused on my back three?

Spoiler :

The rest of the game was fairly passive after that, I was never beaten to any important wonders, and the AIs seemed to keep to themselves. They were all doing fairly well and so I managed to get a fair few RAs from them over the game. I didn't find any Aluminium until the last 50 turns or so, recycling centers to the rescue!

I picked a Freedom based route, making my cities super-huge with all those lovely cargo ships and filling as many specialist slots as reasonable. I started with Tradition, then went Patronage to Consulates, then Rationalism, then Freedom to the policy where you buy Spaceship parts, then finish Rationalism. Perhaps an Order route with Workers Faculties would have been more efficient for this setup?

I'm not sure what I exactly I did wrong in the end, it was probably just sub-optimal play. I made sure to assign specialists and tiles appropriately, but I realise that I may have been somewhat sloppy with my build order towards the end. I may well have shaved 20 turns off that time if I'd timed Nanotechnology well or built a Spaceship Factory with Robotics, but idk.

I also seemed to have settled more Academies than anyone else! I thought that the extra Science from a few of them would give more overally Research than bulbing the early guys, but I may well be wrong. With Freedom I managed to get them to 16 Science each, but clearly that wasn't worth not bulbing them?

Spoiler :

Also, this is the first game where I've seen Pedro actually do anything, so there's that, I guess.

Overall, it was a fun game, and I'm looking forward to future GOTMs!

 

[Melofeign]

t312 win.

I decided to go ahead and make the continent mine. I wanted to see how having several cities (2 Zulu, Pacal's home, and Rome, Plus 4 of mine) would work out. It felt better and I had more to do, but I am not sure if the time it took to take and develop these cities was worth it. Ended up making Ulundi my science city since it had a observatory, but had to run food caravans there for most of the game. Caravans only ran food; it made my later cities quite competitive with my core cities by the end.

Fun game thanks! I should try a replay without the aggression (or just capping Shaka) and see if I can get a better result. But tomorrow is the next one... so I guess I'll just get ready for that!

Oh, and you'll see my played time on these things is huge, I leave my computer and Civ up throughout the weekend to try and sneak a turn or two in while my 4 year old daughter and 6 month old son are distracted, and if I shut it down each time I'd lose even that small window =)

 

[TyfoonTurk]

if the CS is settled on a hill, you need 2 units in a radius of 8 tiles