Twitter mob gets fantasy novel cancelled.

[Patine]

The whole religion angle + arbitrarily deciding it's okay to dictate what people do with themselves in only some cases even regardless of state funding is among several reasons I won't call myself a conservative. I'm sure I have biases and make mistakes, but I don't like such overt hypocrisy to the point where I'd have to lie to myself (and know I'm lying) to back it.

I'm not a fan of authoritarian practices from either side, and both use them. But then zero regulation isn't attractive either. Not only do I have no sides, the incomplete information and deliberate efforts by both sides to obfuscate makes it a chore (just think about our conversation on how DHS classifies terror, and how if they were self-consistent with it they would classify other government organizations as terror...and sadly in this case they'd be right on both counts). This makes using government data awkward, but probably still less awkward than politically funded research.

Makes me wonder how anybody can believe anything regarding this stuff strongly. Like what are they seeing that gives their trust a strong anchor?

I agree with you VERY strongly. This is why, as I've said several times on this forum, I call myself a "Centrist," or even "Free-Thinking Independent," as a political label, for lack of a better extant term.

 

[fishjie]

Yikes. Even though I do see income inequality as a huge issue, anytime I see whining about how much harder life is now than it was back then, I think hmmm, I bet most of the unemployed losers who can't find jobs are SJW idiot losers who whine and cry about stupid bullfeathers such as this. This reminds me of when the SJW idiots were crying about how game of thrones was misogynist and sexist. Luckily George RR Martin is too rich and powerful for those morons. Sucks that this author got shafted. The horrifying thing is, the more these idiots do their thing, the more idiots like Donald Dump will rise in power in response. They brought this on themselves.

 

[Estebonrober]

Yikes. Even though I do see income inequality as a huge issue, anytime I see whining about how much harder life is now than it was back then, I think hmmm, I bet most of the unemployed losers who can't find jobs are SJW idiot losers who whine and cry about stupid bullfeathers such as this. This reminds me of when the SJW idiots were crying about how game of thrones was misogynist and sexist. Luckily George RR Martin is too rich and powerful for those morons. Sucks that this author got shafted. The horrifying thing is, the more these idiots do their thing, the more idiots like Donald Dump will rise in power in response. They brought this on themselves.

Anti-Trump and anti-SJW. Obviously Game of Thrones is horrible sexist and misogynistic since it’s a fantasy piece set in a medieval world. I don’t disagree with you that what happened here is silly and crazy but something can be sexist and still be worth writing.

Fwiw I believe strongly that someone should be able to write from whatever viewpoint they wish as well. If I wanted to write form the point of view of an phillipino slave in the 1750s I can do that. It might suck unless I do a buttload of research but I should get published still if a publisher thinks it’s good enough literature to do so.

 

[fishjie]

Anti SJW and Anti dump here too. A more compelling case could be made for LOTR being racist since the white guys are good guys, and the people from the south (which were depicted as black people in the movies) were the bad guys. In song of ice and fire, daenerys is a mary sue who is going to win. Arya is a magical shadow assassin shapeshifter, slaughtering bad men. The only girl who started out wanting to conform to traditional gender roles, Sansa, got quickly disillusioned. So doesn't read as sexist at all to me. There are misogynist characters in the book, but many of them get killed off. Either way, mobs getting offended without even having read the books are fools. I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of these SJW idiots crack jokes about Cthulhu all the time, except too bad Lovecraft was an actual racist and some of his stories contained actual racist stuff. Tools. Me, I'm gonna keep enjoying lovecraft, tolkien and george rr martin, before he jumped the shark with dance with dragons.

 

[Patine]

Anti SJW and Anti dump here too. A more compelling case could be made for LOTR being racist since the white guys are good guys, and the people from the south (which were depicted as black people in the movies) were the bad guys. In song of ice and fire, daenerys is a mary sue who is going to win. Arya is a magical shadow assassin shapeshifter, slaughtering bad men. The only girl who started out wanting to conform to traditional gender roles, Sansa, got quickly disillusioned. So doesn't read as sexist at all to me. There are misogynist characters in the book, but many of them get killed off. Either way, mobs getting offended without even having read the books are fools. I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of these SJW idiots crack jokes about Cthulhu all the time, except too bad Lovecraft was an actual racist and some of his stories contained actual racist stuff. Tools. Me, I'm gonna keep enjoying lovecraft, tolkien and george rr martin, before he jumped the shark with dance with dragons.

I believe in actual social justice - but the modern movement specifically called "Social Justice Warriors" don't actually believe in or promote social justice - they want something else entirely. A lot of fiction is excoriated based on one perspective, or one small part of it's narrative, or (like LOTR and contemporary fiction) forgetting when they were written. Once a focal point for grievance is found - or contrived - nothing else is taken into account - it's blind thrash-and-smash until it recedes or is destroyed, effectively.

 

[yung.carl.jung]

Yikes. Even though I do see income inequality as a huge issue, anytime I see whining about how much harder life is now than it was back then, I think hmmm, I bet most of the unemployed losers who can't find jobs are SJW idiot losers who whine and cry about stupid bullfeathers such as this. This reminds me of when the SJW idiots were crying about how game of thrones was misogynist and sexist. Luckily George RR Martin is too rich and powerful for those morons. Sucks that this author got shafted. The horrifying thing is, the more these idiots do their thing, the more idiots like Donald Dump will rise in power in response. They brought this on themselves.

this is the weirdest, most incoherent and most impotent rage type post I've seen in my entire life. get help.

 

[Traitorfish]

Yikes. Even though I do see income inequality as a huge issue, anytime I see whining about how much harder life is now than it was back then, I think hmmm, I bet most of the unemployed losers who can't find jobs are SJW idiot losers who whine and cry about stupid bullfeathers such as this.

What a fun and unique opinion that you definitely came up with by yourself.

 

[Lexicus]

this is the weirdest, most incoherent and most impotent rage type post I've seen in my entire life. get help.

I'm honestly surprised, that post is downright tame compared with some of the stuff I've seen in the [Gandalf voice]deep places of the internet[/Gandalf voice].

What a fun and unique opinion that you definitely came up with by yourself.

Inb4 someone posts a Jordan Peterson video

 

[yung.carl.jung]

I was just being hyperbolic for fun. it's pretty tame compared to other ppl like CivMan. It wasn't incredibly offensive, just insanely incoherent and weird. almost neurotic. like an r16 post, but without all the great things.

 

[Estebonrober]

Anti SJW and Anti dump here too. A more compelling case could be made for LOTR being racist since the white guys are good guys, and the people from the south (which were depicted as black people in the movies) were the bad guys. In song of ice and fire, daenerys is a mary sue who is going to win. Arya is a magical shadow assassin shapeshifter, slaughtering bad men. The only girl who started out wanting to conform to traditional gender roles, Sansa, got quickly disillusioned. So doesn't read as sexist at all to me. There are misogynist characters in the book, but many of them get killed off. Either way, mobs getting offended without even having read the books are fools. I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of these SJW idiots crack jokes about Cthulhu all the time, except too bad Lovecraft was an actual racist and some of his stories contained actual racist stuff. Tools. Me, I'm gonna keep enjoying lovecraft, tolkien and george rr martin, before he jumped the shark with dance with dragons.

Yea I hve to say you are just wrong on the levels of SJW here. Lovecraft was pretty much a horrible person. Whether you let that influence what you think of his writing is personal. Hemingway was horrible to his family and I admit that does influence the way I see him. So calling people tools, SJW idiots, and what not only makes you look like an ass.

 

[Valka D'Ur]

Anti-Trump and anti-SJW. Obviously Game of Thrones is horrible sexist and misogynistic since it’s a fantasy piece set in a medieval world. I don’t disagree with you that what happened here is silly and crazy but something can be sexist and still be worth writing.

Fwiw I believe strongly that someone should be able to write from whatever viewpoint they wish as well. If I wanted to write form the point of view of an phillipino slave in the 1750s I can do that. It might suck unless I do a buttload of research but I should get published still if a publisher thinks it’s good enough literature to do so.

Of course nowadays there are those who would rant about cultural appropriation.

I believe in actual social justice - but the modern movement specifically called "Social Justice Warriors" don't actually believe in or promote social justice - they want something else entirely. A lot of fiction is excoriated based on one perspective, or one small part of it's narrative, or (like LOTR and contemporary fiction) forgetting when they were written. Once a focal point for grievance is found - or contrived - nothing else is taken into account - it's blind thrash-and-smash until it recedes or is destroyed, effectively.

Hm. The fanfic I've been working on for the past several months is set in the 11th century, in a region that roughly corresponds to northwestern Europe. There's a mix of cultures, place names, character names, etc. It's still very much in rough draft, and I don't anticipate being anywhere near finished for at least a year (lots to write, lots to edit). This discussion makes me hope I won't be flamed for including arranged marriages as a fact of life that the upper classes have to live with (had to come up with some reason why all of the three major male characters are single-never-married when two of them are 30 years old and the other is ~50).

 

[Patine]

(had to come up with some reason why all of the three major male characters are single-never-married when two of them are 30 years old and the other is ~50).

Vows of celibacy and chastity (which meant clerical or monastic lifestyles) were the only historical surefire way that was not questioned publicly. But I'm assuming these characters' concepts are not easily compatible with being ordained men-of-the-cloth.

 

[fishjie]

this is the weirdest, most incoherent and most impotent rage type post I've seen in my entire life. get help.

Hmm were you the one that reported my post? That kind of proves my point doesn't it? The recent trends of brexit, dump, and that right wing guy in brazil getting elected is part of the backlash against the SJW. If you're offended by a fantasy book because the slavery isn't race based, and then offended cause i make fun of the people who got offended by that, then yes you are a SJW and know that there will be more such backlash in the future. I may get banned, but it doesn't matter. It would suck to lose my account cause of my sweet join date, but I only post here on occasion when I get an itch to play civ and am looking at the great strategy content. But an author getting her book shut down? That sucks. But more and more examples of unthinking mob mentality emerge such as this all the time.

EDIT:
anywho let me clarify the post for you and hopefully not get reported/banned

1. Certain group of people whined about a book because the slavery wasn't race based, and got it shut down.
2. Said certain people whine and get offended by a lot of things
3. Said certain group of people whine about income inequality - a legitimate complaint
4. I almost feel bad for this group of people, but the fact they whine about everything makes me realize they .... lack resilience and mental fortitude in life ... to put it nicely.
5. Then I realize when they whine about not getting jobs, a large part of it probably has to do with this lack of resilience and mental fortitude. note that according to wikipedia, i make the cutoff for "millenial", although i am an old millenial. also i am not white so i do not have this "white privilege" this group of people complain about, although i am asian, and now this group of people hates asians as well and makes rants about "asian privilege".
6. Hence I do not feel sorry for them when they whine about not getting jobs, and ignore most of the other stuff they complain about. This latest story makes me laugh at them even more. In impotent rage of course. Except its not impotent cause I have a job, and apparently they can't even find one lol

Moderator Action: The trolling will stop now. You may have a strong opinion, but find a less abusive way to say it, please. --LM
Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889

 

[Patine]

Hmm were you the one that reported my post? That kind of proves my point doesn't it? The recent trends of brexit, dump, and that right wing guy in brazil getting elected is part of the backlash against the SJW. If you're offended by a fantasy book because the slavery isn't race based, and then offended cause i make fun of the people who got offended by that, then yes you are a SJW and know that there will be more such backlash in the future. I may get banned, but it doesn't matter. It would suck to lose my account cause of my sweet join date, but I only post here on occasion when I get an itch to play civ and am looking at the great strategy content. But an author getting her book shut down? That sucks. But more and more examples of unthinking mob mentality emerge such as this all the time.

Which of course means, you're basically saying taking any issue AT ALL with what you say, or things you believe should be freely expressed or you support, makes one an "idiot," or "proves your points," but "SJW types," (used as a broadly-applied attack phrase, not just for those self-identified with a specificly-defined group) should just "shut up because they're idiots" and part of an "unthinking mob mentality." I see you share the far-right-wing view that freedom of speech and expression should only apply if you're expressing ideologies, and not others, based on a general socio-political right-leaning viewpoint.

 

[fishjie]

Which of course means, you're basically saying taking any issue AT ALL with what you say, or things you believe should be freely expressed or you support, makes one an "idiot," or "proves your points," but "SJW types," (used as a broadly-applied attack phrase, not just for those self-identified with a specificly-defined group) should just "shut up because they're idiots" and part of an "unthinking mob mentality." I see you share the far-right-wing view that freedom of speech and expression should only apply if you're expressing ideologies, and not others, based on a general socio-political right-leaning viewpoint.

i think its great if you take issue with what i say. then we can have a conversation. reporting me to shut me down, is basically what happened to this author, except at a much larger scale.

so you seem to think that me making fun of these people that got offended because there was non race based slavery in the book means i am a far right winger. lol. or was it something else that offended you? please by all means share

 

[metatron]

Inb4 someone posts a Jordan Peterson video

You're welcome?

 

[Patine]

i think its great if you take issue with what i say. then we can have a conversation. reporting me to shut me down, is basically what happened to this author, except at a much larger scale.

so you seem to think that me making fun of these people that got offended because there was non race based slavery in the book means i am a far right winger. lol. or was it something else that offended you? please by all means share

I didn't report you. That was someone else - someone I'm not privy to. However, the fact is, freedom of speech and expression work both ways. One has freedom to make the expression or speech or literature, etc., in the first place. Others have the freedom to speak and express their disapproval and condemnation, even excoriation of the first use of speech or literature. I am not entirely certain the full reason why this book was shelved and not published anyways, but it was not because a Fascist or Communist Censor said so - it was obviously a choice, in the end, made by the author or her publisher for whatever reason. I am commenting on the fact that you are weighing the validity of the two conflicting uses of freedom of speech and expression as "an innocent, unjustly-targeted victim" versus "a thoughtless mob" whom you seem to portray, by intimation, as lacking the same legitimacy of free expression and speech.

 

[Patine]

You're welcome?

It's you again. Well, given the detached, distorted, warped, and contradictory tenor of your posts, and the fact that your avatar picture is the biggest and worst sociopathic ideologue of the 20th Century who didn't outright and directly advocate genocide by active volition, I don't think your posts are going to get anymore credence from me.

 

[metatron]

It's you again. Well, given the detached, distorted, warped, and contradictory tenor of your posts, and the fact that your avatar picture is the biggest and worst sociopathic ideologue of the 20th Century who didn't outright and directly advocate genocide by active volition, I don't think your posts are going to get anymore credence from me.

What?

My avatar picture is... a picture. I feel we can establish as much.

 

[Patine]

What?

My avatar picture is... a picture. I feel we can establish as much.

You don't really think I don't know what the batty old witch and high priestess of Mammon, Ayn Rand, looked like when she was young, do you?