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UFO: Enemy Unknown, remake by Firaxis

Discussion in 'All Other Games' started by Rub'Rum, Jan 5, 2012.

  1. PhilBowles

    PhilBowles Deity

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    Don't rely on this - I've had starts with no steam available at all.

    I usually go for survivability on Ironman or Marathon, so carapace it is - otherwise lasers.

    I've never needed to put more than 3-4 up in month 2 (on Classic). I also give priority to alien containment, which I want online if possible before the first Slingshot mission (I haven't actually managed to capture it yet, but if you can taking the Muton alive in Friends in Low Places is the greatest benefit you can get from Slingshot, with early alien grenades and plasma).

    Yes. I'd forgotten about the movement boost from Kinetic Strike until it was mentioned here, but Servomotors makes all MECs superfast anyway; the flamethrower is still optimal. I usually take two MECs on missions, one with each loadout (plus grenade launcher and, eventually, electro-pulse - I've yet to see any use for either of the other options).

    I give pretty much everyone mimetic skin without a reason not to - Bioelectric Skin has some uses, but it's not serious competition. Playing with Training Roulette, it's best on whatever soldiers pick up the Major sniper promotion (half cover counts as full). I'll usually prioritise giving it to my Exalt agent, who I prefer to be an assault (Run & Gun) or - without Training Roulette - a sniper (Gunslinger, Double Tap). In particular using a new sniper as an Exalt agent can allow you to promote them quickly, which is often problematic with snipers.

    I tend to give adrenal fluids to snipers, as they kill very reliably, and muscle fiber density to Heavies (even with random stats, Heavies tend to be picked from lower-accuracy soldiers in my experience and so need the elevational boost). Remember that you can have one of each type of genetic enhancement (skin, torso, brain, eyes, legs) for any individual soldier, not just one enhancement of any kind. Genetic mods aren't all that effective in isolation; they become valuable when you have several on an already strong soldier. I also give Hyper-reactive Pupils to anyone with Bullet Swarm (just thinking of it, I haven't done this yet but it's also a good pick for an Assault with Close Combat Specialist and/or Close and Personal).

    Neural damping is frankly overpowered (while I don't see feedback as being useful at all). An alien who tries mind-controlling has a 5-turn cooldown - if you have a soldier with neural damping, and he's targeted, you basically nullify mind control for the rest of the combat. Since mind control is the only serious threat other than Sectopods and the ever-dangerous Cyberdiscs in the late game, and a threat mainly because your own soldiers are so powerful, this is a big issue. It really shouldn't have the "never mind controlled" part of the ability. It also has the rather unfortunate effect that Will isn't really a very important stat any more - thanks to medals soldiers never panic past the earliest game, and Neural Damping makes alien psionic powers unimportant.
     
  2. Disgustipated

    Disgustipated Deity

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    quick question. I just have the base game with no add ons or dlc. Haven't played in a year probably. I just noticed steam is downloading a crapload of something for this game. Any idea what Steam is downloading?
     
  3. sherbz

    sherbz Emperor

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    There was a large patch released around the time of Enemy Within which updated models and various other bits and pieces. That might be it. To check, when its finished launch the game and see if you have a number of new hats, helmets and armor deco's.
     
  4. Hammer Rabbi

    Hammer Rabbi Deity GOTM Staff

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    im pretty sure it was the patch to prep for EW. some general ai tweaks were included too. i decided to see if there were any changes to my also no-dlc version and i did notice some improvements. alien deployment hasnt plopped a Thin Man directly on a unit yet, haha, so that was nice. im on month 3 or 4 of a Classic Asia game and it does seem a bit more stable but that is only from the one game so i wouldnt quote this as fact.
     
  5. Pikkis

    Pikkis Prince

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    It's not crucial, at least not on Classic. I've never been able to do more than 5 satellites at the end of month 2, and I've beaten Classic/Ironman multiple times. In fact, in my current game I haven't even lost a single country yet (probably won't at all) and it's August already.

    I don't like using standard builds, but rather prefer lots of variety. With Training Roulette it's of course always there, but I also like to mix up the gene mods etc.

    In line with my earlier comments, I decided to start a Classic/Ironman with the goal of winning EW without using any mechs. So far (August 11) I'm doing good; Deluge is up next. Portent wasn't that hard without MECs after all, but very small steps each turn are a must in that case.

    I've given Hyperreactive Pupils to almost every soldier (with all the rest either having Depth Perception or being SHIVs; i.e. every human soldier in the squad is gene modded); it helps tremendously in the earlier game with Rookies/Squaddies/Corporals/Sergeants (and it costs very little). After that it loses value, but is still definitely of use.

    SHIVs aren't that bad at all after you get the Sentinel Module (from Drone Autopsy): I haven't yet discovered a limit for either repairs or close combat reaction shots (per turn!; it definitely can do more than one). I still rarely use them since I want to get Colonels.

    The only major fault with the current game has been with the Base Defense, but that wasn't because of the lack of MECs; I decided to take a break with the intention of arming all my Colonels after the mission that was up next. I didn't remember that after the break, however, and half of my elites only had conventional weaponry and armor. I ended up losing three Colonels (that hurt), and was very close to losing the mission and the game altogether (there was one extremely critical 40% hit). I did the alien base assault earlier than in my previous games, and therefore there was no Ethereal in the base defense (had there been, I wouldn't have made it with those weapons). The base defense came up surprisingly early though, I think it was only three weeks after the alien base assault (I was expecting four weeks notwithstanding my unrealized precautions).
     
  6. Hammer Rabbi

    Hammer Rabbi Deity GOTM Staff

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    anybody ever lost because they wont provide enough weapon fragments? im almost through an entire stalled month trying to get 75 for the next story tech. 2 missions and a downed spacecraft havent even netted me 40. dont know how else to get fragments.
     
  7. PhilBowles

    PhilBowles Deity

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    Not lost, but stalled for a while. Use fewer explosives to kill aliens - explosives make fragments unusable. And never ever sell fragments in the early game (they're hardly worth anything anyway), or give them away as Council requests.

    Also, because of the way abductions work you may want to leave one country with no satellite coverage throughout the game, so that you will still get abduction missions. However I don't know if this will increase the overall number of missions; you get extra UFO missions later in the game to compensate for the loss of abductions.
     
  8. Hammer Rabbi

    Hammer Rabbi Deity GOTM Staff

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    ah, okay. too late on the abductions though. ive got the map covered and only had 2 countries leave. im going with no-sniper strategy so i use some heavies rockets but out of my 6 guys only 1 or 2 have alien grenades. i thought it might be something to do with plasma or laser weapons leaving little behind (like vaporizing them into dust or something). i knew better than to sell any fragments early but i was doing a lot in the foundry and that (and research) took a lot of fragments.

    i wish i could beg another country for them. im sitting on $1k of unspent unneeded money at the moment.

    i need to check where im at with months. i forget how far im in on that game.
     
  9. sherbz

    sherbz Emperor

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    Not lost. Although it can slow you down. As phil says, use fewer explosives. I also find that the real killer for fragments is ammo conservation. If you do decide to pick it up, spare a thought for your fragments. Either that or prepare to do without things like plasma pistols and alloy cannons.
     
  10. sherbz

    sherbz Emperor

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    I disagree here. It isnt crucial, but its certainly optimal. An extra 400 credits or some continent bonus a lot earlier is a really epic bonus. It is possible to rush a satellite uplink in month 1, but you need to luck out on missions. It is however perfectly fine to build 2 uplinks in month 2 and you dont need to luck out (there is one small possibility that you only get a steam vent on the last level and at the end, which can screw you over).

    I think with the above you can finish the game at least a month earlier than usual. Which means less exposure to Sectopods, Muton Elites and all the rest.
     
  11. sherbz

    sherbz Emperor

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    I find that meld is too scarce to build 2 mechs and fully upgrade them. That is if you also want a full gene modded bunch of soldiers as well.

    I consider it too expensive to give everyone this perk. Maybe its because you play/are playing on marathon. But really you only need a couple of soldiers with this ability. Its better to spend the meld on other things IMO. Although, a snapshot sniper is now actually a very powerful soldier with mimetic skin and in the zone.

    As my principal sniper always has squadsight, none of his companions ever get the benefit as they are always miles away from them.
     
  12. Pikkis

    Pikkis Prince

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    Of course it's optimal, but there's a big difference between crucial and optimal.

    Not beelining eight satellites helps with the early game missions, though; you have more money and freedom for squad upgrades (in April, that is) which I believe helps a lot. In the big picture it may help even as much as finishing one month early (the later months tend to get easier).
     
  13. Pikkis

    Pikkis Prince

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    Completed the "no MECs" game of EW. I'm now even more confident than before that MECs aren't worth going for. They're fun, but that's about it.

    --

    This was the first game I completed with the Aiming Angles option. It worked pretty well; it's more balanced than Absolutely Critical, and most of the time you don't think of it being there, i.e. it fits the game well.

    --

    There are some constant balance issues in the game ever since XCOM:EU. There's not much use for Light Plasma Rifles, because Plasma Rifles can often be researched before them. Skeleton Suits are nice, but rarely the optimal research direction; at least the Ghost Armor tech should require the Skeleton Suit tech (b/c of the grapple), but in this game, for example, I finished w/o them either. There's also quite a lot anti-UFO weaponry considering the number of distinct UFO types and the firepower that is required to shoot most of them down.

    --

    I've been getting more and more elite soldiers game by game; this time I finally got the Ain't No Cavalry Comin' achievement with her:

    Spoiler :




    The fact that she was a Colonel for five months highlights the fact that the promotion tree isn't that deep in the end. What kind of kill counts have your soldiers got up to?
     
  14. sherbz

    sherbz Emperor

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    This is not actually true about the light plasma rifle. If you capture an outsider and about 2 thin men early doors then research light plasma (after you have beelined xeno biology and arc thrower), you can be fielding better guns than lasers earlier, which in effect means you can bypass laser tech altogether, which saves a huge amount on research times and even means you can take the alien base in the second month (once you have armor).

    Agree RE Skeleton armor. Now there is no point really with gene upgrades. They can be useful for snap shot snipers still if you want to save on the meld.

    Also agree about the weaponry, although each weapon actually enables you to shoot down a specific class. Not sure on this but i would say:

    Phoenix/interceptior/no bonusses - Can always kill a large scout

    Laser/interceptor/bonusses - Can always kill the abductor UFO

    Plasma/interceptor/bonusses - Can always kill the supply barge

    You could add the firestorm into the mix above. But i think with that weaponry you should be able to as a minimum take down the above mentioned craft. Give or take a few bonusses here and there. You could always complicate it further by adding multiple interceptions. I have seen a lets play where bonusses were used on an interceptor with phoenix cannon and 2 were able to take down the abductor.

    Agree though that the above is not a particularly interesting debating point.
     
  15. Pikkis

    Pikkis Prince

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    I have tried that at times, but it's quite hard direction. With capturing Muton there's the additional bonus that Muton Autopsy halves the research time of either rifle (and Plasma Rifle doesn't have significantly higher research cost than LPR.) I actually once managed to bypass lasers even with waiting until Plasma Rifles.

    Interceptor with Avalanche and no bonuses is very often enough for a large scout, but of course 100% is nice. It's nice there are options; I'd just like to see more UFO types.
     
  16. Hammer Rabbi

    Hammer Rabbi Deity GOTM Staff

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    i'd like it if along the way that i made some LPRs or laser rifles that I could disassemble them for Weapons fragments or some kind of raw materials once i got better options. I wouldn't feel like i totally wasted efforts in them. That or if i could sell them to other countries without waiting for them to ask me for a trade. Maybe list them on a global market and wait to see who wants them. They could offer parts, money, or scientists/engineers depending on what you offer.

    I dont have EW so i dont know if they added that to it.
     
  17. Wolfbeckett

    Wolfbeckett Jerkin' and nonsense.

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    They didn't, outdated weaponry still just sits there doing nothing for you unless a country happens to randomly ask for it.
     
  18. PhilBowles

    PhilBowles Deity

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    You can sell EXALT weapons, though.
     
  19. sherbz

    sherbz Emperor

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    My experience has been more mixed. I would say about 66% of the time you succeed without any bonusses. With bonusses you should be fine. If they are available, then for the sake of a few credits it might be worth it considering the loot you get from the craft. This is less important now than in vanilla because the reward for slingshot is so huge.
     
  20. PhilBowles

    PhilBowles Deity

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    I collect most of the meld in missions, so I'm not often short. In my current Ironman campaign I'm stuck for things to do with it, actually - I haven't yet built a gene lab (still extending the base on the second level, so I have some excavating to do). I've been playing without MECs, although not by design. I had no promoted soldiers good enough to stick in MECs early on; I got one and promptly grafted her in time for the second UFO mission. She promptly took so much damage from Thin Men and the Outsider - down to 2 HP - that she's been out of action ever since, since the remaining missions that month came somewhat early. Ended up losing two newly-minted supports, a rookie or two, and my sniper during that month (the replacement sniper is an absolutely terrible shot - somehow she finally got promoted to Corporal after my last mission, Friends in Low Places, so maybe she'll promote into a useful soldier eventually).

    EDIT: Well, she has - her Major promotion was Saviour, which is pointless for a sniper, but she's now pretty good and has HEAT ammo and Sentinel, making her a pretty vital team member (vital enough that I've given her a secondary heart).

    Having mixed success with MECs - that one went out of action straight away again after it recovered, then was killed on the final turn of Confounding Light (thought it was just out of sight, but Thin Men move very fast). The next one was a Heavy with great starting stats, who I had a lot more success with but who fell foul of a Mechtoid with an itchy trigger tentacle. I actually think it may be best to convert already-advanced soldiers - my current MEC is an Aim 100+, Will 80+ Support Captain I got as a reward soldier - he's tough to promote further, though, even though he just roasted four Mutons on his last mission (they'd been hit by Zhang's rocket).

    In my current game I got 3 satellites up in month 2, enough to give me We Have Ways and to go from a funding deficit to $280 in the black each month (Brazil alone gives $162 a month), as well as to prevent any Council departures (I got lucky in that regard three countries went into the red that month, but two were in Asia and the terror mission was in China. I saved 16 of 18 civilians, reducing panic by 4 in China and 2 everywhere else in Asia).

    Mission-wise I was pretty much running money missions all month - with my star Heavy promoting to Major I unlocked every bonus in the Officer Training School (this is why Asia is the best continent starting bonus. Looking forward to cheap Tactical Rigging when the foundry's up, too), so I didn't have the engineers to get 6 satellites up anyway.

    Portent killed my previous Classic Ironman efforts, MECs or no MECs (I usually lose someone I can't afford to), so I was taking very small steps this time through. I came out with hardly a scratch, and no fatalities, but I still wouldn't call it 'easy' by the standards of other missions where you do the same thing (such as Friends in Low Places, although I did have bad luck and lost a secondary heavy to the Muton) - you need to be very careful with positioning, have a couple of well-promoted soldiers in action at that point, and still be fairly lucky with your fire. I ended up having to let one Thin Man get away after he dropped, since he dropped just beyond my line of sight and I wasn't going to move with him on overwatch - it so happened that my assault found and killed him next turn, but it could have been messy if he'd lurked and overwatched.

    Interrogation, not autopsy.

    I've ended up going down the 'no laser' route in my current CI campaign - I took carapace instead, so by the time it completed I could start on plasma having stunned a Muton in Confounding Light.

    I don't particularly recommend it - it's a long time to have standard guns, and you'll be up against Cyberdiscs and Mechtoids without advanced weapons. I had one terror mission that was a Cyberdisc, drone, and 9 starting Chryssalids plus the zombies they created. It took ages to down the Cyberdisc (and I had to sacrifice my Support) and whittle down the surviving Chryssalids and zombies. I also lost an assault on Gangplank because standard guns aren't reliable enough at killing Chryssalids (that was a very brutal mission - only one of my soldiers made it out without taking critical wounds, and only three survived in total). Plus EXALT agents take a lot of killing without lasers.

    I'm now at the start of July and only just have heavy plasma - still using basic sniper rifles (assaults are using plasma rifles instead of shotguns). One thing to bear in mind is that you'll need a lot of cash to manufacture plasma weapons (and manufacturing two HPs and a particle cannon has used up all my elerium) and won't be getting heavy plasma from aliens for quite some time; laser is much more efficient in the early game.
     

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