v1.983 - v1.483 - v1.183

[b-m]

Adding to that list of bugs:

• The vikings still don't build more than 2 cities, which is kinda weird and nearly 100% reproducible.
• Stability.py contains a bug, where ethiopia gets a stability hit even if egypt is still around. IMHO ethiopia should not get any stability hits at all there, since atleast AI is usually unable to conquer egypt now that the arabs are actually expanding into africa. I'd even suggest to remove the stability hits for egypt and ethiopia altogether, since africa is already a huge challenge (if you don't have biology), given the barbs, impis and the desert.
• There's still a lot of barb activity in europe, atleast for AI rome. In my last game there was a barbarian rome with 3 barb cities (in italy) and 3 razed ones at 600AD even though rome was doing really well before.
• Chinese game is way too easy now, even for the AI. I played a chinese game and I had absolutely no trouble, with only 3 horse archers on my borders until 1000AD. I think there should be a lot more barb activity in pre-mongolian area.

On the list of weird things I've seen:

• An ancient babil mega empire, even including persia, with christianity founded in artraxa (or whatever that city is called) and a quite impressive tech lead.
• Maya AI does no longer found additional cities, which is kind of odd. Maya was always kinda stupid not to expand into mexico (which should IMHO be fixed if possible), but now with 2 cities the AI seems to drop to unstable even before the aztecs spawn.
• Civs still declaring war on human without ever attacking, even if the human player has only a few weak units.

On the pro side we have:

• Large AI india, which is nice.
• A lot of AI-AI wars.

 

[Lone Wolf]

by example, they knew astronomy better than european

That'd be the Mayans, which is reflected in their UP.

it was an incredible luck who allow europeans destroy this civilization

Guns, Germs and Steel... They should be destroyed.

Maya was always kinda stupid not to expand into mexico (which should IMHO be fixed if possible)

Atzec Flip Zone...

 

[-Perceval-]

the guns and steel was completly unuseful during the new world conquest because of the humidity and the number of ennemy. that is an incrdible luck who permise to cortez and pizarro to create a civil war in the aztec and incan empires. I know a lot of thing about this period of history and now all historians says that it is not superior guns who killed this empire but the internal conflicts. In fact the europeans was superior to them only in the weapon technologie but not in the other techs. So i think that is not normal to see these two empires(particularry aztecs) be destroyed all the time by europeeans.
lone wolf said:
Quote:
by example, they knew astronomy better than european

That'd be the Mayans, which is reflected in their UP.


ok but for aztec and incans?
and there is another strange thing, north american indians are really not a serious threat for american and europeeans as they was in the history.

I think some of the barbarians should be transferred in the north of china because the huns attacked the europeans AND the chinese during antiquity.
(sorry for bad english, i'm bad with this language)

 

[scu98rkr]

"Guns, Germs and Steel..."

I believe lone wolf is referring to a Jared Diamond book, which seeks to explain why some civilizations have more "stuff".

 

[ledat]

As far as the amphibious invasions go, I found that even in earlier BTS versions an AI Spanish invasion of human England was not uncommon. Then again, I rarely keep large armies as England, so it is perhaps partly because of that.

Guns, Germs and Steel

This is a reference to Guns, Germs, and Steel: The Fate of Human Societies by Jared Diamond. Also, didn't we just have this very same discussion about the conquerors event here?

EDIT: scu98rkr beat me to the punch while I was re-reading the old discussion. Leaving the links, though.

 

[Lone Wolf]

it is not superior guns who killed this empire but the internal conflicts.

Considering the not-so-nice methods the Atzecs used in holding their "empire", the internal conflict was pretty much predestined. And don't forget the Germs.

The Incas were a bit better at the empire management, but that is simulated by the occasional Incan Workboat, which prevents the Conquerors spawn.

Anyway, anything that helps the AI not to sit turtling all day is good. The Conquerors at least create an illlusion of AI competence. Therefore I wholeheartely support them.

And I've seen once the Atzecs drive the English back from Mexico. Maybe they did get a large number of flipped Dog Soliders on spawn of something.

 

[kbk]

So far so good.

I don't think emperor domination and conquest games are impossible without the Olympic parks exploit and squatting (I never used these for my dominations before, well, okay, I squatted Portugal as Spain, but you just had to do that one).

I've got a couple promising Arabian and English emperor games. As Arabia I can be stable with India, Samarkand, Persia, Turkey, Greece, N. Africa, and E. Africa all the way down to Durban. I couldn't even get past Arabia and Persia and be stable before. And the change in the tech rate and the change to no brokering makes the tech problem with emperor a lot less of a big deal.

I'm pleased. I think it may be back to trying Mali, Ethiopia, and Egypt on Monarch

 

[Barak]

Just started a new game with the new version (haven't played in awhile) and started up the Japanese to test out the new UHV.

Right off the bat, i noticed something different. Kyoto is now founded as Kyouto? Why the spelling change (English version naturally).

 

[Lord Ainsbirth]

Hello all,
I've started a 3000 BC game as the russians. Here are my impressions:
1.- Greece was the biggest empire in the world; they founded Christianity in Sparta.
2.- The second empire was Persia; they was at war with the arabs, and when I started they captured Mecca (!). They had a huge army of horse archers and elepahnts.
3.- The third empire was Ethiopia. They conquered Egypt, and colonizated most of East Africa.
4.- In Europe, France only founded 1 city (Rennes) and becomes a vassal of Rome (becoming Province of Gallia). Spain, Germany and England was OK. Vikings only founded two cities.
5.- In far east, Jemer was vassal of China, and China was at war with Japan. India still survived, but was technologically backwards.
I played the previous version (1.182) and i've got the feeling that it was quicker. Is it possible?
Anyway, great work Rhye. Thank you very much!

 

[The Drone]

This...is...good

 

[-Perceval-]

ok i just finished a game with the dutch. there is some little problemes and some good things that i will reacpitulate in one post:
-finally khmers can die! in my game a civil war killed them and that is very good!
-Aztecs and incans are really too easy to kill! there is no challenge! I prefer invade theses two empire with conquerors than an independant city in india. So i just demand to put them one or two units and technologie more.
-old mayans cities(in 600 ad game, so they are natives) are always destroy by barbs before the aztec arrive.
-the mongolian still weaker than china, the only way for them to beat china is that china explosed in independant states.
-the arabia expand in north africa is a fantastic idea.
-the north indian american(natives and barbs) are not enough strong. they do not represent a real challenge for european and american like they did in our world's history.
-vikings never buils more than two cities, germans kill them too easily.

 

[Lone Wolf]

-the north indian american(natives and barbs) are not enough strong. they do not represent a real challenge for european and american like they did in our world's history.

I've seen the Natives conquer New Orleans and Quebec from the French AI. How's that for a change?

-Aztecs and incans are really too easy to kill! there is no challenge!

I like the current situation as it is, althrough maybe the Mesoamerican plague does not need to be so devastating on first turns, so that they have a limited opportunity to kill you before the plague kills them all.

 

[Barak]

Enjoying the new version, just wondering why we cant trade certain techs? As Japan, I made contact with an English Galleon in 1545, and while I have Philosophy, I can't trade it to them.

I figure this is a new feature of some kind?

 

[Lone Wolf]

I figure this is a new feature of some kind?

No Tech Brokering - you can trade only the techs you researched yourself.

 

[Barak]

No Tech Brokering - you can trade only the techs you researched yourself.

Interesting. I think its broken then, cause while I had traded fro Philosophy, I could offer it to Portugal many turns later. I think I actually received Philosophy from a GP.

 

[Lone Wolf]

Did the English have all the prerequisites for Philisophy?

 

[The Q-Meister]

-the mongolian still weaker than china, the only way for them to beat china is that china explosed in independant states.

Well although Mongolia should def. be very aggressive towards China I don't think having a stronger China or China being able to resist Mongolia is that far fetched since historically China was a large, powerful empire and one of the most advanced nations in the world.

-the arabia expand in north africa is a fantastic idea.

Yes and not just fantastic, but something that should happen in most games.

-the north indian american(natives and barbs) are not enough strong. they do not represent a real challenge for european and american like they did in our world's history.

Fair enough.

 

[kairob]

Quote:

-the mongolian still weaker than china, the only way for them to beat china is that china explosed in independant states.

Well although Mongolia should def. be very aggressive towards China I don't think having a stronger China or China being able to resist Mongolia is that far fetched since historically China was a large, powerful empire and one of the most advanced nations in the world.

Actually IIRC at the time China was three corrupt and decadent states, although my Asian history is not too good

 

[blizzrd]

Just started a new game with the new version (haven't played in awhile) and started up the Japanese to test out the new UHV.

Right off the bat, i noticed something different. Kyoto is now founded as Kyouto? Why the spelling change (English version naturally).

It think it has something to do with Rhye's recent trip to Japan.
Tokyo starts out as Edo now also.

 

[Jet]

Interesting. I think its broken then, cause while I had traded fro Philosophy, I could offer it to Portugal many turns later. I think I actually received Philosophy from a GP.

Well, the feature is part of the unmodded game, and it works there.

One thing that could be different is if you traded for Philo before Portugal existed. That can't happen in the base game (except for colonies), so conceivably it could have caused some unexpected foulup.