Version 0.82 discussion thread

The reason why people like using scouts and explorers (and chariots, which wol't work for the AI because the AI will promote them) for medics is because they are cheap and have a low base strength so they wol't defend.
 
It sounds like we need a UNITAI_MEDIC. In BTS, I'd give it as an option for recon units, cavalry, and gunships. Possibly Paratroopers.
I've actually added in a UNITAI_MEDIC. But I think that if a modder isn't going to add a dedicated medic unit to the game, it's better not to use it as the default for any unit because then it will only do medic activities. Having a unit be changed to UNITAI_MEDIC when it promotes itself with a medic promotion makes sense though.

The reason why people like using scouts and explorers (and chariots, which wol't work for the AI because the AI will promote them) for medics is because they are cheap and have a low base strength so they wol't defend.
We could certainly analyze those factors independently rather than simply have units with a recon UnitAI be more likely to choose medic promotions. The problem though is that the unit's strength and cost are really dependent on the strength and costs of other units.
 
if a modder isn't going to add a dedicated medic unit to the game, it's better not to use it as the default for any unit because then it will only do medic activities.

Brief interjection here. RoM, and I believe NextWar have a dedicated Medic unit. I don't think the AI use them...
 
Spy AI: This has been majorly retooled. You will notice. The AI will now steal your treasury and more intelligently use poison and unhappiness. Also, the AI is now able to use espionage on offense in war to remove city defenses in front of its incoming stacks. It's pretty awesome when it happens.

Does there are exist any code for AI's spies to target spaceship construction and cities going for legendary culture?..
 
Does there are exist any code for AI's spies to target spaceship construction and cities going for legendary culture?..


The stock AI does destroy space part, seemingly getting for space part above a lot of other building. I have seen it. What I can't say is if it use enough of its ressource on it, and if it's not just a random city pick, then space part destroyed because it's the more hammer to destroy.
 
The city selection for espionage missions in the stock AI is very random ... it will tend to go for bigger cities over small ones, but does not use any knowledge of what kind of win the other player is going for. This is on the list to change, but probably won't be in for a couple more versions.

For space it's clear what spies should do, interfere with production of parts. For culture, they can try knocking out culture buildings (+50% buildings being most important). What else?
 
Revolt city, but I guess it's already changed.

Change civic seem too complicated for too little gain.

Spread culture seem simple to implement and can be very, very nasty.

For city improvement destruction, if not in a space race or culture race, I tend to believe that they should mainly / only destroy production building like forge and factory. They are rather costly, and destroying them is really a pain. And it's ALWAY a pain : if it's a prod city, then it's painful obviously, but if I had some factory on a cottage city, destroying it seem really, really nasty because of the long time needed to have it again and the difficulty to build stuff like observatory, university or bank whithout prod building or whip.

Destroying, for example a granary OTOH is random : not having a granary is nasty if I'm in my whiping infra phase, but in a well developped city it may do next to nothing. Happiness building seem to be too difficult compared to spreading unhapiness directly.

Destroying advancement on a wonder coveted by the AI could be a good improvement, but I don't know if it's possible at all, never tried. It may be the single most annoying thing an spy can do to me, especially in end game on stuff like 3-george dam.
 
The city selection for espionage missions in the stock AI is very random ... it will tend to go for bigger cities over small ones, but does not use any knowledge of what kind of win the other player is going for. This is on the list to change, but probably won't be in for a couple more versions.

For space it's clear what spies should do, interfere with production of parts. For culture, they can try knocking out culture buildings (+50% buildings being most important). What else?

:):) Incite revolt!

Seriously, that's what I do to AI near-Legendary cities. If I have enough :espionage: points, it's sometimes the easiest way to send their cultural output per turn to 0.:lol:

(cross post with lazyhase ;))
 
Destroying Monasteries after Scientific Method is neat, as they can't be rebuilt, particularly if the civ gets free hammers/gold/beakers/culture from religious buildings. This can also help a civ spread its shrine religion(s) with less competition.

Defending against a culture victory, destroying the third city's Monuments and Monasteries should be a useful brake, though I don't know the relative price compared to Incite Revolt.
 
Destroying Monasteries after Scientific Method is neat, as they can't be rebuilt, particularly if the civ gets free hammers/gold/beakers/culture from religious buildings. This can also help a civ spread its shrine religion(s) with less competition.

Defending against a culture victory, destroying the third city's Monuments and Monasteries should be a useful brake, though I don't know the relative price compared to Incite Revolt.

Well, those monasteries won't be providing any of the bonuses from AP, UoS, SM, or Sistine Chapel after Sci Method so destroying the monasteries is only destroying the 2 or 4 culture.
 
jdog5000
For culture, they can try knocking out culture buildings (+50% buildings being most important). What else?

I suppose first of all there is should be some check whether civ actually could be going for cultural victory and if positive only then make priority on disrupting culture production. For example, there is no point in prioritizing such missions if there is only one ot two cities going legendary. It also doesn't make much sense to attack different culture-producing cities so efforts better be concentrated only on one of those.
 
Well, first things first : the first target of spy operations should be most of the times buildings that decrease the odds of getting a sucessful spy mission in that city :D After that, and suposing a identified culture win effort, probably calculate what will delay more the cpt production in that city: if the city has a high base cpt/ few culture multipliers, probably putting it in perma-revolt is far more effective that sabotaging buildings....
 
Really? I thought they still counted as religious buildings for the purpose of those wonders...

There is a mistake in the help text hover thingie, that says +2:hammers: from the monastery (i.e. from the AP) but in fact that is lying and there is no longer a hammer bonus. All the other bonuses disappear from the help text correctly.
 
While I don't usually build scouts for the sole purpose of becoming a medic, I'll often have one early anyway. If it gets to 5xp (hut, or lots of wolves), and real barbs are out (even warriors), I'll make it a medic and send it home.

Then I can skip the medic chariot and wait to attach a GG to something that can eventually get woody3 too.

Seems a difficult AI decision though. Can it be a medic? Do I need one? Is it a 40turn walk back to my capital so I can actually use it?

Building a medic-scout with barracks+theo or something is a bit more straightforward.
 
Tech diffusion seems to have been disabled for this version (see GlobalDefinesAlt.xml). Is that intended? Why?
 
Noticed something weird in my current game.

I was playing with the city governor emphasize buttons in one of my city and when I turned on emphasize production, the governor changed a citizen from riverside mine(grassland/hill) to non-riverside mine(grassland/hill) thus losing out one commerce without increasing production(or food for that matter). Only difference I could see on the new tile was that it has a road build in it.

I attached a save game. The city is Tekedda.
 

Attachments

Wow what mapscript and what mapsize is that, Poppis? Looks awesome! :goodjob:

I had a look at the city and I can't think of a reasonable explanation for that governor behaviour.
 
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