What is- in your view- the worst paragon of low culture?

[Kyriakos]

Although many seem happy to claim that our current times are some sort of historic apogee of human civilization, others appear almost to the opposite edge of this sentiment. Personally i also think that the current time is quite decadent, moreso if one takes into consideration the relatively larger wealth of material means for many or most people in the 1-2nd world.

So i would like to ask what is, in your opinion, the most crucial of the many factors of such a state of low culture and civilization.

The options are the following:

1) Hyper-consumerism. (ie a culture of buying stuff you don't need nor do they help you much with anything).

2) Social or personal envy-related issues. (such as depression identified as a result of being in a worse position than others).

3) Bad/worse education system. (schools, universities, etc).

4) Overall climate of fear or insecurity. (such as with unemployment or risk of serious harm).

5) External factors of power groups within society. (political games, lobbying, divide and rule tactics by the powers in a society. Note that this includes both material and immaterial things, eg it also includes media setting a dumbing-down/dumb/bad agenda-driven polemic tone).

6) Internal, inner human nature. (ie you are of the view that humans are prone to suck).

7) Other. (includes Alien overlords ).

Poll will be up soon

 

[Kyriakos]

For me it is External factors of power groups within society, which ties to Social or personal envy-related issues but is the main paragon there in my view...

I do not think that human nature itself is negative.

 

[Perfection]

casual friday

 

[Hygro]

Whatever that thing is where people think the first thing they hear on a subject that makes sense or "feels right" is true and then they disregard all the other possibilities.

Especially when they internalize it into their identity.

 

[Kyriakos]

^Californication
(edit: only later saw your location )...

 

[Traitorfish]

The concept of "low culture" as something distinct from and contemptable in comparison to other "culture".

 

[SS-18 ICBM]

The fact that people like stuff I don't like.

 

[Hygro]

The concept of "low culture" as something distinct from and contemptable in comparison to other "culture".

ideals pre-postmodern

 

[EgonSpengler]

The concept of "low culture" as something distinct from and contemptable in comparison to other "culture".

Here in the US, "low" culture is often something cutting edge. Jazz, bebop, swing, rockabilly, rythm & blues, punk rock, and hip hop were all once restricted to speakeasies, dive bars, honkytonks, and loft parties. Billie Holiday first heard jazz when her mother was working in a brothel, Merle Haggard was literally a train-hopping hobo, Jerry Lee Lewis actually married his cousin, and Henry Rollins once punched out an audience member who had hit him with a bottle.

 

[warpus]

I'm not sure if I really understand the question, but in my mind it's people trying to one-up eachother and attempting to increase their social status via consumerism, so that they can feel better about themselves.

A lot of people seem to for some reason think that this is going to lead to happiness. But then 90% of them end up in debt and sad. But hey, at least they have a shinier watch than the person they sit beside at work, right?

 

[Kennigit]

I dont get question

Paragon means "model" in english, afaik

Are you asking what is the worst thing for a "low culture" to have (eg "this makes it a low culture") or what we think is present in current culture that is making it lower (op talking about crucial factors of today) or what is the least-accurate model of what a low culture is?

Regardless, my answer is a "low culture" is one that does not value education. I.e. if something is bad but they try to make it better with real efforts, it is progress. But some places seem to embrace poor education (don't need that!). So related to the education statement.

Please cite the depression thing you state.

 

[Kyriakos]

I dont get question

Paragon means "model" in english, afaik

Are you asking what is the worst thing for a "low culture" to have (eg "this makes it a low culture") or what we think is present in current culture that is making it lower (op talking about crucial factors of today) or what is the least-accurate model of what a low culture is?

Regardless, my answer is a "low culture" is one that does not value education. I.e. if something is bad but they try to make it better with real efforts, it is progress. But some places seem to embrace poor education (don't need that!). So related to the education statement.

Please cite the depression thing you state.

I mean paragon indeed as a main factor, or crucial epicenter of a correct model of the subject (in this case 'low culture'). And of course low culture itself can be easily a debatable term, but i tried to clearly connote it by mentioning some factors of it. Surely one would not be prone to identify insecurity or petty/misguided envies as a by itself positive element in ones life (yes, looking at you and your northern beard, Traitorfish).

As for the depression thing, i mean that people can be depressed for other reasons but falsely attribute a larger part of that to actual bad things in society (eg the aforementioned consumerism or media dumbed-down programs or articles etc).

 

[Borachio]

"Celebrity culture" is my pet hate.

In particular, people who are valued just for being famous. So, I guess, self-promotion must play a role in that, too.

Still, where do you draw the line? Einstein was plainly a celebrity, but it wasn't just because he was famous. He was actually famous for something.

 

[warpus]

There's is nothing wrong with being famous, but there is everything wrong with celebrity worship culture.

 

[Tahuti]

I voted education. Since especially in the way it is brought in the West, it serves as a vehicle to promote all the other poll options.

Compulsory education is effectively a form of mind control: Yes, it may ensure you a near entirety of the population is able to write, read and count, though most of these children who are going through compulsory education will be intellectually debeaked by the time they are adults. Compulsory education teaches children to worship the democratic nation-state monster and consumerism and serves as a conduit towards the news media, which has the same problems.

Now, school's effects may be inadvertent. No one who was responsible for the current system of education may have striven towards artificially imposing their values on schoolchildren. Yet it is what it does, and parents have few if any ways of resisting this, if they aren't already completely brainwashed themselves.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

Tough choice. The economics of useless consumption is pretty much the only prop that keeps capitalism going, so I don't know if hyperconsumerism is culture or necessity but I do find it unbearably tacky...but the creation of the climate of fear for political purposes is pretty revolting too.

 

[Kyriakos]

^Some countries seem (or so i've heard, no actual non-anecdotal knowledge of this one for me) to have more decent edu systems, though. Eg Sweden or East Sweden

Then again those countries mostly have trees and the Arctic circle, so there is little room for self-inflicted decadence.

 

[SS-18 ICBM]

artificially imposing their values on schoolchildren. Yet it is what it does, and parents have few if any ways of resisting this, if they aren't already completely brainwashed themselves.

It's not unique to education. Maybe we should cut off any interaction of children with people or society. Then there would be no brainwashing at all. Would be interesting to see the development effects.

 

[Traitorfish]

Personally, I plan to have my children raised by wolves.

 

[Borachio]

I voted education. Since especially in the way it is brought in the West, it serves as a vehicle to promote all the other poll options.

Compulsory education is effectively a form of mind control: Yes, it may ensure you a near entirety of the population is able to write, read and count, though most of these children who are going through compulsory education will be intellectually debeaked by the time they are adults. Compulsory education teaches children to worship the democratic nation-state monster and consumerism and serves as a conduit towards the news media, which has the same problems.

Now, school's effects may be inadvertent. No one who was responsible for the current system of education may have striven towards artificially imposing their values on schoolchildren. Yet it is what it does, and parents have few if any ways of resisting this, if they aren't already completely brainwashed themselves.

I suppose brainwashing is inevitable - given the such broad definition of it which you seem to be using.

So, we're left with choosing the sort of brainwashing we inflict on children, then?

How about one which inculcates them with the ability and desire to think critically, and to be live-affirming and compassionate in all their dealings?