Which city sites deserve better representation in RFC?

[Cosmos1985]

First of all, let me say that I think the map is absolutely fabolous - I am impressed by RFC everyday I play it, for one reason or another, and if the one and only should happen to read this, thank you, thank you, thank you

I do however think some cities have little or no chance at becoming what they are or were in the real world, and I think we should share some ideas as to what can be done to improve that. Some city spots are better than they ought to be - Inverness, anybody? - and of course nothing is perfect, this is a game, a simulation, but none the less... lets do what we can to move towards perfection!

Bombay/Mumbai I know has been discussed before - I think it should get a resource more in its BFC, and one more who spawns at a certain date; which ones I do not know, but it definately should be a more attractive spot. Anybody happen to know which goods that area has been known for (or is)?
(Partly fixed by NerfCothons in his excellent modmod http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=328203 - I do however still think its not enough)

Sri Lanka/Ceylon also - the mountain could be replaced by a hill, and one of the tiles should gain a resourse, or instead a seafood nearby.

Tripoli also comes to my mind, should maybe gain some kind of resource aswell?

Maybe the Canary Islands, should a city be worth building, to represent them? Or were they not important enough?

Bring on your suggestions/thoughts

 

[Lone Wolf]

Manila, Lagos, Brunei City, Singapore, Panama, the island of Cuba. Maybe some Polynesian islands also, for fun.

 

[Omega124]

Sevilla. The CPU almost always builds Cadiz 1S, even though Seville is (and was) the most important southern city in Spain.

Brest. CPU rarely even builds a city in that part of France, let alone Brest.

Sparta. Rarely built, which is a pity. I can't seem to make 300 jokes when I conquor Greece, especailly as Persia.

Albany. I live near it. I can't even build it myself, because **** New York is too close to it, and it's ALWAYS founded.

 

[fireclaw722]

Hawaii: Yes most of Hawaii is Mountainous, but not unsettlable(Was an important American Naval and air base)

Solomans: No incentive for settling such cities(makes great for later Pacific/Asia Wars)

Cyprus: Even the Ottomans don't settle this city

Rhodes: Collousus of Rhodes anyone(I know it can be built anywhere, but it just shows the historical importance)?

Madagascar: It's oftenly unsettled throughout the Colonial period

 

[fireclaw722]

SRRY, double post

 

[nody]

Cyprus: Even the Ottomans don't settle this city

You mean Crete/Kreta. Cyprus is the mountain-island west of it.
Should be settable also, I think.


Juneau area, Alaska is unsettable. You can't settle on ice, even coastal. Change ice/hill tile to tundra/hill.

Russia can never found Vladivostok and settle on Sakhalin because the Japanese are there earlier. Must be possible to code the Japanese to leave these places alone before a certain date

Also the area north of Yakutsk, eastern Siberia has a deer just outside its fatcross. Or make it possible to settle there or move the deer 1 south.

Hamburg should be standard city for Germany, better than Aarhus or Kopenhagen (which they usually found) which are no more German than Amsterdam or Paris.

 

[civ_king]

Philadelphia, I rarely see it despite it being an awesome city (Phily+Jacksonville covers the East Coast, except DC)

California, it really needs a lot more food! our coasts swarm with fish, we have a massive population, and produce prodigious amounts of food! the city there also represents Nevada and Oregon too, that is 35 million people!

I suggest a fur somewhere in Oregon or California (major business for a while), turn one mountain into a hill with Gold, A fish on the coast and the coast have flood plains (only way to represent the haul), flood plain on the plain/River in SoCal (The Central Valley only grows ONE THIRD of the country's food),

Great Lakes region (Ontario) needs more forests

we should add one food to rice (most places with resource have high population)

Afghanistan needs gems (lapis lazuli)

Corsica needs settlement

 

[Leoreth]

Hamburg should be standard city for Germany, better than Aarhus or Kopenhagen (which they usually found) which are no more German than Amsterdam or Paris.

The biggest problem for Hamburg is the Netherland's early spawn, so that the tile is under Dutch control before the AI (or even the human, if he doesn't use his starting settlers) can settle it.

 

[Panopticon]

Look at what I did in one of those links in my sig, "Dynamic Terrain".

 

[nody]

The biggest problem for Hamburg is the Netherland's early spawn, so that the tile is under Dutch control before the AI (or even the human, if he doesn't use his starting settlers) can settle it.

You have AT LEAST 10 turns before the Dutch spawn, enough time to send a settler there which will only take 2 turns from Berlin.

 

[AnotherPacifist]

Founding Hamburg will make the AI German collapse due to culture reasons, or it'll flip to the Dutch. A human player can certainly do it, but why do so when Frankfurt is so close by? (3000 BC makes some sense but even then why give France iron?)

 

[killerkebab]

Using Panopticon's Dynamic Terrain for RFC mod as inspiration, and a base (thank you for that ), and Baldyr's custom functions (thank you too) I am currently trying to alter the way the late game plays in RFC. Changes so far include:

From Panopticon:
- Lagos, Manila, Colombo, Brunei all change from jungle to forest at AD1600. This is so that the AI are capable of settling these spots.
- Lagos, Brunei, Bombay, Gujarat and Manila gain a fish resource in AD1600.
- The Indus valley changes from deserts to flood plains in AD1600 - this allows a profitable settling of Karachi.

From me:
Edited the world starting situation in AD600 so that:
- Inverness is replaced by Edinburgh
- Brest, Baghdad, Tehran, Khartoum, and Hong Kong exist at turn 1. Some of these flip (such as Brest/Khartoum) and others are usually taken by civs nearby (such as Baghdad)

Dynamic changes:
- If Spain is played by the AI, Panama spawns in AD1545. If Panama is still controlled by the AI and America is played by the AI, Panama flips to US control in AD1914.
- The Suez Canal appears in AD1850 in the form of a Fort improvement, regardless of who controls the area.
- Colombo gains a fish resource in AD1600, with a cow and a fish in its BFC, it should be appealing enough to European colonists.
- A winery and pasture appear in Crete and Corsica respectively in AD1250. This is because the AI never improves these tiles and suffers as a result.
- For the same reason, a plantation appears in Jamaica and Puerto Rico in AD1800.

Changes for AI:
- Since AI Vikings and AI Japan are terrible at choosing city spots...
Edo, Sapporo, and Nagasaki are given to Japan if Japan is played by AI. To balance this, Japan has only 1 settler at turn 1.
Oslo, Stockholm, Lulea, Copenhagen and Reykjavik are given to Vikings at various dates if Vikings are played by AI. To balance, they have 1 settler at turn 1.
- If Arabia is AI controlled, they get given Tunis, Algiers, Casablanca. I was tired of AI Arabia never spreading to to Morocco. This way hopefully, religious wars will have more consequences, with Arabia within striking distance of Spain/France.
- If Russia is AI controlled, they get St. Petersburg and Kiev, usually this means their border with Germany is between Poland and Ukraine, with Germany usually founding Lemberg.
- If America is AI controlled, they get West coast cities: Seattle, Los Angeles, Honolulu and Anchorage. This is because in my games at least, AI America never goes further west than the Rockies.

That said, this needs more testing. The Vikings end up being very strong in the few games I've played. Arabia is also very strong but usually collapses around 1500.

If the human player doesn't get there first, Portugal usually founds Lagos, the Khmer usually found Brunei and the Japanese usually found Manila. As of yet, I haven't seen anyone found Colombo.

I'm also trying to work out a way for cities like Bogotá, La Paz, and Manaus to be founded by the AI because as it stands, the AI never ventures in the rainforest which is a shame - you can found some great cities there.

Any ideas would be greatly appreciated so I can improve this

 

[AnotherPacifist]

- Inverness is replaced by Edinburgh

Completely agree.

Hong Kong exist at turn 1

Disagree. Hong Kong is nothing if it weren't for the British. Guangzhou is well known as the largest southern Chinese city for a long time.

- The Suez Canal appears in AD1850 in the form of a Fort improvement, regardless of who controls the area.

What if there was a city there?

- If Russia is AI controlled, they get St. Petersburg and Kiev, usually this means their border with Germany is between Poland and Ukraine, with Germany usually founding Lemberg.

Completely disagree! This begs the question of who gets there first. There were substantial German populations in those areas. And it would completely trash the strategy that we've all been using playing either as Russia or Germany. And remember the Teutonic Knights? Their holdings in 1300-1455 would correspond to Reval (which I routinely found):

 

[killerkebab]

Disagree. Hong Kong is nothing if it weren't for the British. Guangzhou is well known as the largest southern Chinese city for a long time.

They occupy the same tile, the change is merely cosmetic (the name of the city is altered to Xianggang. I could make it so that British occupation renames to Hong Kong instead of Canton. I don't know much about Chinese history and I accept I've just made a big mistake

What if there was a city there?

The improvement would then not appear, I believe.

Completely disagree! This begs the question of who gets there first. There were substantial German populations in those areas. And it would completely trash the strategy that we've all been using playing either as Russia or Germany. And remember the Teutonic Knights? Their holdings in 1300-1455 would correspond to Reval (which I routinely found):

It could trash the strategy of controlling the entire Ukraine as Germany (although no one said you can't conquer that place - as it stands the cities appear as Independents ve3ry early and just flip to Russia 2 turns after Russian spawn because of their location). Here is the border in one game I've played as England:

Spoiler :

Looks to me like the entire area owned by the Teutonic knights is accounted for. In fact, I think the border would be almost perfect if the AI Germany had settled Riga+Lemberg, or Warsaw or even Vilnius instead of Lublin

That said, if you have any ideas I am more than happy to hear them, after all you are the far more experienced player

 

[BurnEmDown]

I agree with all your changes except for the Hong-Kong once which you can and should easily fix.
Too often do I see the Germans controlling the area near St. Petersburg, even though in the medieval ages they did control this area somewhat, I think if this means in the later ages if Russia doesn't control it it's really hurting the historical flavor of the mod.
And you're right, if the Germans settle on any tile in Warsaw's area they can compete with the Russians for the Cows and Wheat.

 

[HistoryFan]

Or how about Damascus? I've never once seen it, and it is and has been one of the most important trading cities in the world/in history.

 

[killerkebab]

Damascus doesn't appear because:
In AD600 starts, Iskenderun is present at turn 1. Since Damascus is either: 1 tile South-East (since Damascus isn't on the sea) or one tile South (Although you could argue that should be Beirut's tile) it obviously has very little chance of appearing.

Even if we assume Iskenderun isn't there, the city has little chance of appearing, sandwiched between Jerusalem and Baghdad.

 

[Panopticon]

Aye, HK was a rock before the British Empire plonked her flag on it.

 

[NerfCothons]

Damascus is actually a fantastic city location. When I play Arabia on the Reformation mod (hence no judaism/relevance for Jerusalem) and the Tigris/Euphrates are open I settle Damascus

 

[killerkebab]

Damascus is actually a fantastic city location. When I play Arabia on the Reformation mod (hence no judaism/relevance for Jerusalem) and the Tigris/Euphrates are open I settle Damascus

Is it still a good location when Jerusalem, Konya, and Baghdad already exist? Genuinely curious here