Why are these patches not addressing some the most basic bugs?

[beorn]

I would have to respectfully disagree with that direction of thinking, Gub.

No matter what the business or agency, you cannot disregard the public because of the least reasonable and least knowledgeable members of the public. You have an obligation to deliver the product or service correctly, and that obligation is not null and void because some portion of the public has problems of their own.

However, in this case, I do not believe that this is where Firaxis is running into problems with Civ VI. I think they have "big picture" people in charge of this project, and big picture people are notorious for letting the details get away from them.

 

[TehJumpingJawa]

Prioritisation based upon bug severity would be a logical explanation....... until you read the patch notes, and see dozens of fixes for utterly trivial issues that have zero impact upon the game experience.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

I'd take a build queue over last built bug.




Communication is overrated. It changes nothing except your feelings. So many people with so many feelings. Lost cause. Communicate in patch notes.

For all it's flaws, having a model where you can report bugs or communicate what you observe in the game directly to people who change it can make a useful difference, and this is coming from someone who often doesn't see eye to eye with said programmers priority choice.

Speaking of communication, the other way programmers do that is through the controls and the information the game presents. Even if you have 0 effort in community manager stuff, the game still needs to work. In a strategy title, that means the information needs to be there, not hidden.

 

[Mustakrakish]

Why do people assume the last built bug is simple? And considering its just an annoyance, not something that stops or breaks the game, I'd rather they fix the AI combat then spend months hunting on this (I'd rather they just remove the last built feature if its complex to get it working right.)

...if one would need months to fix this or if indeed it's too complex to ever fix... they should stop programming. I take it you're not acquainted with programming in the slightest. Fixing this would probably take half an hour considering one is in no rush and would take their time coming up with the best solution. The only reason it's not fixed is because they have some weird priorities there. "Weird" because so far the bugs they did fix were quite odd to prioritize IMO compared to others plus all these "important" features like "a sound effect for quicksave" or whatever it was. Like someone already said it seems like they're prioritized with adding those little "important" features that didn't make it into release.

 

[Victoria]

There is a fair amount of vitriol on this site and I would not blame any company for ignoring the site although it would be a shame if they do because there is Lots of good people.
It is self defeating to call them idiots etc because they just then stop listening amd you end up venting to thin air. Sure you feel better bit of you really meant what you were saying would you still be here? I respect someone that says this is rubbish, I'm off, bye. I equally respect someone that says, this does not work well because of x and y and z are approaches that may help.

The developers no doubt had tight deadlines and quite probably banned from leave until release date. With that in mind and christmas and the fact they have delivered a patch per month I do not consider things bad at all. The fact they have not addressed issues from this website may be the fact that the abuse has made them not bother reading it amd we are hoisted by our own Petard

 

[Timothy001]

Firaxis is a company in business to make money. They have a contract with 2k to distribute the game. 2k is responsible for promoting the game, and shipping the game. They determine what DLC they want (of course in consultation with Firaxis), and when its released. Firaxis is responsible for delivering a stable game, and having the DLC, and any needed patches for that DLC ready for the release date.
They have a dedicated team to fix bugs, others to create new DLC. Whenever a new patch is to be released, much like when the game was released, they need a little bit of time to make sure there are no game crashing bugs in it. This means that when a patch is released, it is at least a week old, if not older. Some bugs, which may appear simple, may be much more complicated than we think. Bugs like last item produced, may not be that simple to fix, didn't have enough time, or they thought they had fixed it, but it caused other more serious issues, so they left it for now.

 

[RealAntithesis]

The fact they have not addressed issues from this website may be the fact that the abuse has made them not bother reading it amd we are hoisted by our own Petard

How an individual may behave in a certain situation though isn't how a company should behave in the same situation. A company is (should be) more professional, which means shrugging off personal insults and engaging into discussion at a rational level. This is a bit of a chicken and egg situation - I think the level of frustration being expressed by the vocal player base is, in part, due to the lack of communication (apart from patch notes over two patches that pretty much did not address the key issues expressed by the same player base since release), and not the other way around.

Bugs like last item produced, may not be that simple to fix, didn't have enough time, or they thought they had fixed it, but it caused other more serious issues, so they left it for now.

Perhaps, but we don't know, because they haven't said anything. Is this even a recognised bug? I don't know (do we?).

 

[DizzKneeLand33]

To say that the last item produced bug is not a big deal is rubbish, especially when there is no build queue. Along with the not user friendly city screen, it would sometimes take me a few minutes to figure out what I had built (and the fact that it's still a new game to me?!). And now that it has a half-***ed fix (meaning it *sometimes* shows the right information, for districts and projects as stated above), it's even worse. As someone who has programmed enough to know better, it's not a difficult fix. Someone incorrectly defined a variable and now someone else apparently can't find the problem. It's as if the team did not keep good programming notes (best practices) but there I am just speculating. It is just in my experience when this happens it's because of turnover and bad note taking.

The AI is a complex fix that could take months. The last item produced fix is a simple variable/database line location update. We don't know what they are prioritizing because there is NO communication with the player base. I am becoming more and more disappointed and frustrated. This game has the potential to be AWESOME, if only there was communication.... as RealAntithesis said above, we don't even know if they know that it's broken....

 

[liv]

I do not find the last item thing very important. I hardly ever think about it since production is organized in districts I have a good idea what is going on just by looking at what is left to produce. For me it is a minor thing. I had the crash bug that they did fix and that was really great.
I

 

[DizzKneeLand33]

Actually, whether it's important to you or not, there is no excuse for a software package of this magnitude to have such basic errors. Would you use a tax software package that calculates your income on box 2 of your W-2 instead of box 1? After all, it's only one box off, no big deal....

 

[Timothy001]

We don't know if they consider it a bug. We do know that they do read the forums. They look at the bug reports. If you look at all the patch notes, you will see in the past, several requested features on the forums, included in a later patch. Most (but not all) bugs eventually get fixed. Those that don't, who knows why.

 

[blasto]

I visited a friend at Firaxis yesterday and notice the giant spinning dart board covered in sticky notes labeled "Bugs to fix".

 

[Kimurae]

The last built bug is more than just an annoyance. It kind of goes to the heart of the game - which is producing stuff to expand and defend your civ. If you don't know what the city just built, especially if it's actually telling you incorrect information, then how do you know what the next step should be in your strategy?

Yes, you may remember, but this is more difficult with many cities. Yes you can inspect the building and production lists to see if a building has just been built (if it's obvious and you can remember) and close the city view screen to see if a unit has just been built that isn't fortified or asleep, but all this just adds to the micromanagement slog of getting through each turn.

Quite simply, and without Firaxis giving themselves an opportunity to defend themselves due to their lack of communication, it's easy to just put this down to neglect and / or incompetence.

If you set your expectations so high, maybe you should stop playing video games, seems like all they will do is disappoint you.

You are also not convincing me that this last built bug is more important then fixing the AI. I'm now more in favor of them removing it, seems like all it does is encourage bad strategic planning.

 

[DizzKneeLand33]

Seriously, what is with defending the last built bug? Is there a Civ game were the previous item was NOT listed? I'll have to fire up Civ 2, but I KNOW it was in 3, 4, and 5.

Actually, mental pictures of 2 tell me it was there as well.

 

[Kimurae]

...if one would need months to fix this or if indeed it's too complex to ever fix... they should stop programming. I take it you're not acquainted with programming in the slightest. Fixing this would probably take half an hour considering one is in no rush and would take their time coming up with the best solution. The only reason it's not fixed is because they have some weird priorities there. "Weird" because so far the bugs they did fix were quite odd to prioritize IMO compared to others plus all these "important" features like "a sound effect for quicksave" or whatever it was. Like someone already said it seems like they're prioritized with adding those little "important" features that didn't make it into release.

Your assumption is wrong. If you think you can fix it, then do it. I recall Civ IV was released with a huge graphical bug. Some fan managed to patch it.

Maybe you're just an optimist; I imagine the CIV VI codebase is horrible; with zero documentation, and no unit tests. Hence the tech debt is a large influence on complexity.

 

[liv]

Seriously, what is with defending the last built bug? Is there a Civ game were the previous item was NOT listed? I'll have to fire up Civ 2, but I KNOW it was in 3, 4, and 5.

Actually, mental pictures of 2 tell me it was there as well.

Civ BE they started the game without it but people wanted it back so it was patched in later.
In that game it was much more crucial than in this one as you had so many choices of what to build. In this one my priority list for what to fix is just different than yours

 

[DizzKneeLand33]

Civ BE they started the game without it but people wanted it back so it was patched in later.
In that game it was much more crucial than in this one as you had so many choices of what to build. In this one my priority list for what to fix is just different than yours

Well, I understand, I guess I'm just thinking that interface issues will be easier to fix than the AI. Of course I think all of it should be fixed -- until it is, I will not be buying the DLC's nor any other untested Firaxis product, and I bet I'm not the only one. But I do understand your point about prioritization -- I wonder who determined what they actually fixed considering I bet most of that wasn't on either of our lists....

 

[Usama84]

I was not even aware of the last built bug, but I agree with the people who are frustrated. I hope they don't just start working on expansion packs and even Civ 7, instead of just making this one better. I doubt i will pay any more money for this game, unless they fix the major bugs on this one. They just want to keep creating new games, I just realized, I dont even own the game, just a licence on a CD what a rip off! Civ is not what it used to be, I just hope the mods can make this one playable...

 

[Timothy001]

The last built bug can be annoying. With the current patch, it works sometimes, but not always. I haven't figured it out. I just work around it.

 

[Victoria]

Yes, I forgot to say that while I love the game and will keep playing I will not be buying expansions until they fix some more key components.