[WIP] Project Civ: A Quality-Oriented Civ Pack

[isnorden]

Just proposed merging/tweaking some relevant civs (Phoenicia/Biblical Israel) that other people have modded in; if you think the proposals belong in this modpack, feel free to request a topic merge.

 

[killmeplease]

phoenicians can receive a random luxury in each of their coastal cities - cedars, purple or papyrus. just like mercantile city states.
ps i'd like to see a ship as their icon

 

[Irkalla]

phoenicians can receive a random luxury in each of their coastal cities - cedars, purple or papyrus. just like mercantile city states.
ps i'd like to see a ship as their icon

Unique Ability: Perspicacity - Reveals Luxury Resources which other Civilizations may neither see nor acquire with improvements. (Murex[coast], Gorillas[jungle], Cedars[forest], Silphium[plains], Lapis Lazuli[grassland]. A couple of these aren't related to the Phoenicians, but were ancient resources in high demand. The idea behind so many is so that no matter where they start, they should have a decent chance of picking up on of their UA luxuries.)

Drawing board, first post under the OP.

About gorillas, here's an excerpt from some writings about Hanno the Navigator's journeys.

On the third day after our departure thence, having sailed by those streams of fire, we arrived at a bay called the Southern Horn; at the bottom of which lay an island like the former, having a lake, and in this lake another island, full of savage people, the greater part of whom were women, whose bodies were hairy, and whom our interpreters called... Gorillae. Though we pursued the men we could not seize any of them; but all fled from us, escaping over the precipices, and defending themselves with stones. Three women were however taken; but they attacked their conductors with their teeth and hands, and could not be prevailed upon to accompany us. Having killed them, we flayed them, and brought their skins with us to Carthage. We did not sail farther on, our provisions failing us.

It's funny how even 2500 years ago, rational people could tell that these were our distant cousins.

 

[killmeplease]

Drawing board, first post under the OP.

About gorillas, here's an excerpt from some writings about Hanno the Navigator's journeys.

i meant a concrete mechanic of giving spare luxuries: just put one random on the city plot. maybe you meant exactly this, dont know..
so if you settled say 3 cities you get 3 random luxuries, each is one of 3 possible types. that can be 3 different luxes, or 3 of the same type, or some other combination. maybe thats to strong and a "no luxury" variant should be added? (so for each city you get 1 of 3 or none)

It's funny how even 2500 years ago, rational people could tell that these were our distant cousins.

i heared a story of Alexander trying to conquer a monkey people in india
maybe it was in the movie of the same name

 

[Irkalla]

i meant a concrete mechanic of giving spare luxuries: just put one random on the city plot. maybe you meant exactly this, dont know..
so if you settled say 3 cities you get 3 random luxuries, each is one of 3 possible types. that can be 3 different luxes, or 3 of the same type, or some other combination. maybe thats to strong and a "no luxury" variant should be added? (so for each city you get 1 of 3 or none)


i heared a story of Alexander trying to conquer a monkey people in india
maybe it was in the movie of the same name

I was just thinking of making them able to see certain resources that others could not. I may, however, guarantee one of their UA resources in their capital. (depending on where it's settled. I wonder if it's possible to add yields on the fly?)

 

[Yum Caax]

Perhaps have every luxury resource within the sphere of their first coastal city doubled?

 

[turingmachine]

Protip: I used Tyrian Purple. I think you're confusing purple and violet. Purple is a shade of violet, as is tyrian purple, but tyrian purple isn't really a shade of purple. It's more a shade of red.

I used the shell because it's the shell of a Murex, which is entirely what the phoenician economy was based on. It's what made them have the upper hand in commerce. It's where they got their "purple" dye from. Dye from murex was prized thus because it, instead of fading, would intensify when exposed to the sun over time.

The problem is, I just asked a "Phoenician Lebanese" who he thought it represented and he had no idea, so I probably will move to using Aleph as the logo. Also, Phoenician Alphabet? I'm pretty sure it works the same way as Arabic or Hebrew... Id est, not an alphabet. It's an abjad, in contrast to an alphabet (Latin, Greek, Cyrillic) or an abugida (Ethiopic.)

I'm well aware of "Tyrian Purple" but you seemed to have picked the most red interpretation of Tyrian Purple possible.

There is #66023C which is the modern sRGB designation of Tyrian Purple. There is also #990024 which is also colloquially "Tyrian Purple" but has a sRGB designation of Tyrian Red. There's also a more pink shade, #B80049 which is also known as "Tyrian Purple".

I still think you shouldn't have chosen such a red "Tyrian Purple".

Spoiler :

Personally, I've always saw Tyrian Purple as a mix between the first two.

And, yes, the Phoenician Alphabet is technically an abjad, but that's missing the point. Regardless of playing semantics over the fact that I used "alphabet" in its more generalized sense instead of the more pedantic sub-divisions of "true alphabet", "abjad", and "abugida", it doesn't change the significance of the "Phoenician Alphabet" as the direct predecessor of the Arabic, Hebrew, Greek, Latin, Cyrillic, Coptic, (almost all modern non-pictographic) writing systems.

 

[isnorden]

I'm with TuringMachine on both points:

1. Phoenicia's "Tyrian purple" should use the purplest shade associated with that name, so that players will recognize it (and the reason for choosing it).
2. No matter which type of writing system Phoenicia technically used, the fact remains that they were the first people to invent a LETTER-based system. Dozens of other letter-based systems have evolved from Phoenician writing; the first symbol of the oldest alphabet would make a perfect icon for the culture that left such a lasting mark in world history.

 

[Irkalla]

I'm with TuringMachine on both points:

1. Phoenicia's "Tyrian purple" should use the purplest shade associated with that name, so that players will recognize it (and the reason for choosing it).
2. No matter which type of writing system Phoenicia technically used, the fact remains that they were the first people to invent a LETTER-based system. Dozens of other letter-based systems have evolved from Phoenician writing; the first symbol of the oldest alphaabet would make a perfect icon for the culture that left such a lasting mark in world history.

Alright alright. Sheesh. I'm trying what you say. I'll also try some different colour schemes.

I originally thought a grapheme from their abjad would have been too... cliche.

The Tyrian Purple is for the dye, the Gold is for loads a sweet dosh. Not really. I just thought they went together.

oldest alphabet

Ugaritic called and told me that that's an extremely common misconception. The more you know!

Ugaritic is basically cuneiform, except instead of representing ideas or syllables, they represent consonants, like an abjad. It also represents some vowels, though they're preceded by glottal stops (like the way us americans pronounce mitten, bitten, rotten, Hawai'i, uh-uh, uh-oh et cetera.)

 

[killmeplease]

i like the first one, with golden letter

 

[isnorden]

I stand corrected on the Ugaritic fact...live and learn, as the saying goes. Aside from that, I'd like to add another vote for the gold-letter icon. It does look snazzy, especially combined with the Tyrian purple background.

 

[turingmachine]

Oh I Like those

Just, be careful with the color scheme. The first one may look too much like Mongolia, but is probably passable. The second one will almost surely look identical to England in-game. Also, be forewarned, a combination of red+gold has to be one of the most common color schemes used in civ mods (I think 5 different civ mods at the moment make use of it).

 

[Yum Caax]

It's not really red though, just as it's not purple. It's something in-between.

 

[Irkalla]

Oh I Like those

Just, be careful with the color scheme. The first one may look too much like Mongolia, but is probably passable. The second one will almost surely look identical to England in-game. Also, be forewarned, a combination of red+gold has to be one of the most common color schemes used in civ mods (I think 5 different civ mods at the moment make use of it).

Yeah, just in my mods I'm using gold on tyrian purple for the phoenicians, and I'm using red on bronze for the spartans

For the spartans, I was thinking of changing their logo from a stylized lambda to a scorpion, and possibly going to black on bronze. Any input?

Also, I was originally planning to go red and light blue, as tyrian ships are said to have flown bicoloured vexillae with a light blue hoist and red fly.

 

[Genghis.Khan]

Ok, about the Portuguese Logo I think you should include the Order of Christ Cross [Placed on Portuguese Caravels] Image in the Spoiler. Include the Armilar Sphere too, but place it behind it, pls

Spoiler :

Btw just uploaded an .dds for Naus/Carracks. It can be found here

If you want a preview a .png version is here

This icons are NOT mine and are NOT sized.

 

[Irkalla]

Ok, about the Portuguese Logo I think you should include the Order of Christ Cross [Placed on Portuguese Caravels] Image in the Spoiler. Include the Armilar Sphere too, but place it behind it, pls

Spoiler :

Btw just uploaded an .dds for Naus/Carracks. It can be found here

If you want a preview a .png version is here

This icons are NOT mine and are NOT sized.

I may get rid of the Armillary or make it less prominent, as I dislike how it turned out.

 

[Genghis.Khan]

I would defiantly include them. Both would be perfect

 

[isnorden]

Yeah, just in my mods I'm using gold on tyrian purple for the phoenicians, and I'm using red on bronze for the spartans

For the spartans, I was thinking of changing their logo from a stylized lambda to a scorpion, and possibly going to black on bronze. Any input?

Also, I was originally planning to go red and light blue, as tyrian ships are said to have flown bicoloured vexillae with a light blue hoist and red fly.

If there's a good source for the scorpion being important (even symbolically) in Sparta's history, go for it. Another non-written symbol that might work: the stylized Greek shield with crossed weapons ("Come back with your shield or on it").

 

[Irkalla]

Been working on the placenames list for Sparta. At first I could only scrounge together 16, but I've hit the magic number! How am I going to scrounge together 31 placenames for Phoenicia? Well, good thing is, they were a coastal civ (which means many cities,) and they had many colonies.

1. Sparta
2. Helos
3. Therapne
4. Amyklai
5. Pellana
6. Belmina
7. Aegys
8. Sellasia
9. Gytheion
10. Brasiae
11. Asopos
12. Boiae
13. Kythera
14. Oetylos
15. Teuthrone
16. Kardamyli
17. Tyros
18. Zarax
19. Epidauros Limera
20. Thalamae
21. Thouria
22. Koroni
23. Asine
24. Pylos
25. Arkadia
26. Aulon
27. Pharae
28. Las
29. Akriae
30. Kyphanta
31. Oion

 

[isnorden]

I'll make one for you and attach it, it's a civ's artwork that I'm currently working on. Yes, I'm still obsessed with artwork. Wouldn't be surprised if a mod comes along and renames the thread "Project Civ. Or: Irkalla's Civ Icons and Maps"



Your homework? Using what you've learned, make icons based on one, some, or all of these hypothetical civs.

• Australia
• Bosnia
• Corinth
• Taiwan
• Tibet (Hard Mode?)

Could you please find a different hosting site for your pictures? When I tried to download the PSD, I kept getting pages that downloaded an FLV player I neither want nor need...and never got the PSD file itself. To make matters worse, BitDefender blocked some of the host links as unsafe adware-pushers.