Yugoslav Civilization

[srdjann]

well, it seems good, but i don't understand...why two Josip Broz Tito? why don't you use a great political person (not necessarily a person who leads the country, a gandhi like person...) other than a second Tito?

Well, that's good question!

The problem with this Yugoslavia mod (which covers only 2nd Yugoslavia) is that it covers only period from 1941st (when WWII started in Yugoslavia) to 1991st (when 2nd Yugoslavia fall apart) and Tito was a ruler for 39 out of this 50 years.

Besides him, after 1980th when Tito died there were couple of persons who could qualify as a leader - Milka Planinc (she was Prime minister in mid '80s) and Ante Markovic (he was Prime minister in the beginning of '90s when Yugoslavia fall apart) since they left some positive marks, but puting them in the same level as Tito would be nothing more then blasphemy!

Therefore, for now, I decided to leave two Josip Broz's since his rule can be devided into two totally different parts - one in which he led yugoslav people to victory against nazis and domestic fascists (ustashas, chetnics...) and the second one in which he was soft dictator which tried to unite third world countries against two leading political blocks (led by USA and USSR).

By my oppinion it would be a lack of this mod not allowing players to play as Tito_The_War_Winner as well as Tito_The_Peacefull_World_Leader since you almost can say that that were two different men.

(of course, there is alway an open option of changing that in future versions, and if that is a problem with puting this mod into SuperCiv I will agree in advance that you leave just one Tito - the peacefull one )

PS. If you have some time, please check my solution of problem with multicolor flags and if you like it you can implement it into your SuperCiv mod!

 

[Manijak]

Wasn't Stipe Mesic (current president of Croatia) the "leader" of Jugoslavija after Titos death? I do remember that he was, for a short period of time.

If you ask me, he is the closest we get to a new Tito today

 

[srdjann]

Wasn't Stipe Mesic (current president of Croatia) the "leader" of Jugoslavija after Titos death? I do remember that he was, for a short period of time.

If you ask me, he is the closest we get to a new Tito today

Well Stipe Mesic was the President of Presidency which had 8 members (one from each Republic and Autonomous Province) and Ante Markovic was a Prime Minister of SFRY.

Speaking of Stipe Mesic, his today's role is much different then in those days when he wasn't contructive like Ante Markovic tried to be. Therefore I would like to see Stipe Mesic as Croatian leader much more then as Yugoslav leader. And I can agree with you that from all current leaders of former Yugoslav Republics and autonomous provinces, he is closest to Tito but still he is far far away from him...

 

[Anima Croatorum]

Mesić had a very simple, yet unachievable agenda during his presidency over Yugoslavia. Peaceful disolution of a dead country. His main achievement was to delay the war for a year, and thats about it.

 

[srdjann]

Mesić had a very simple, yet unachievable agenda during his presidency over Yugoslavia. Peaceful disolution of a dead country. His main achievement was to delay the war for a year, and thats about it.

I agree totally, but what I meant was that, besides all, in that time he was a part of nationalistic governing party in Croatia (of Franjo Tudjman) which answered destructively on Milosevic's aggressive and expansive nationalism. Ante Markovic wasn't part of that party even though he is also a Croat and that's why I think that he had much more contructive role then Stipe Mesic since he tried to oppose Milosevic on non-nationalistic platform. He did loose because in 1991. it was too late since in Yugoslavia all nationalisms were awaken...

I never said that Stipe Mesic was destructive from civilized point of view (maybe he saved more lives by his acting then Ante Markovic who didn't want to mess with nationalism and that left him without support? Who knows...) but from the Yugoslav point of view he was destructive in a way and therefore I think that he can not be a leader in Yugoslavia mod. On the other hand I'll be very glad to see him in a Croatian mod much more then any other modern Croatian leader (since 1991.).

 

[Anima Croatorum]

I wouldnt call Ante Markovic either pro or anti-nationalist. He tried to restore the economy of Yugoslavia from inflation and recession, but all his reforms were cosmetic in nature. He added some shine, but did not touch the rot underneath. If he had been more successful, perhaps 1990 would have played somewhat different and some kind of confederacy could have been agreed upon, but even so, the probabilites of such an outcome would have been minimal, it was simply too late.

From a Croats point of view, Yugoslavia was dead at least a year before Mesic became president, there was already shooting in these parts. We had hoped that once he became president that he'd be able to stop JNA from attacking us, but it was all in vain, since its loyalties were not to Yugoslavia but to Milošević.

 

[Mr_V]

I was suggesting yesterday several things about the "Serbia" mod, so I started thinking about this one as well...

Music for diplomacy - "Hej Sloveni" is obviously a must, but should it be for both leaders - wartime and peacetime? Perhaps for wartime some old WW2 song would be better? "Uz Maršala Tita" or something?

Great prophets:
-Ivo Lola Ribar
-Edvard Kardelj
-Moša Pijade
-Žikica Jovanović Španac
-Sava Kovačević

Great engineers:
-Ivan Meštrović

Great scientists:
-Nikola Tesla
...

Great artists:
-Ivo Andrić
-Danilo Kiš
-Miroslav Krleža
-Branko Ćopić
-Meša Selimović
-Branko Miljković
-Desanka Maksimović

Great entertainers:
-EKV
-Azra
-Bijelo Dugme
-Leb i Sol
-KUD Idijoti (truly yugoslav band )
-Lačni Franz
-Zabranjeno Pušenje
-Lepa Brena
-Zdravko Čolić

 

[kovach81]

you can not put nikola tesla in yugoslav mod coz he died before 2nd yugoslavia (1943), so....

 

[Mr_V]

Ah, right, didn't know that...

But it would still be the most logical thing - he was not born in Serbia, but in what is today a Croatia, but he was a Serb, at his time, a country called Yugoslavia did exist, maybe it's best to put him in Yugoslavia, rather than in Croatia or Serbia mod exclusively (or both)?

 

[kovach81]

his father was ortodox serbian priest and Tesla asked to be buried in serbia so you can put him wherever you want except in yugoslavia and croatia

 

[srdjann]

I was suggesting yesterday several things about the "Serbia" mod, so I started thinking about this one as well...

Music for diplomacy - "Hej Sloveni" is obviously a must, but should it be for both leaders - wartime and peacetime? Perhaps for wartime some old WW2 song would be better? "Uz Maršala Tita" or something?

Great prophets:
-Ivo Lola Ribar
-Edvard Kardelj
-Moša Pijade
-Žikica Jovanović Španac
-Sava Kovačević

Great engineers:
-Ivan Meštrović

Great scientists:
-Nikola Tesla
...

Great artists:
-Ivo Andrić
-Danilo Kiš
-Miroslav Krleža
-Branko Ćopić
-Meša Selimović
-Branko Miljković
-Desanka Maksimović

Great entertainers:
-EKV
-Azra
-Bijelo Dugme
-Leb i Sol
-KUD Idijoti (truly yugoslav band )
-Lačni Franz
-Zabranjeno Pušenje
-Lepa Brena
-Zdravko Čolić

Mmmm, great!

But since I turned off music in my game (because of my weak performance grafics ) I'll need a couple of information:

1. Do you speak about overall ingame music or just diplomacy music? Putting just a diplomacy music wouldn't be worthy because if you play with Yugoslavian civ you will never hear it and mod file's size would multiply...

2. If you speak about all in game music then ok, and then I'll need info from you (or anybody else) about technical stuff - what format (mp3?), where is the location in Assets folder, how to implement it into xml files... You downloaded LAnkou's Superciv mod (it's too heavy for me and my dial-up ) so if it is not a problem for you to find that out... I'll include you as a co-author of course!

3. About the music - I agree that Hej Sloveni should be a music for President, but for Marhsal it should be first something like "Po sumama i gorama" or maybe "Padaj silo i nepravdo" (my favourite ). Also there is one very strong song "Konjuh planinom" and I have a modern rock version of it. It really rocks! "Uz Marshala Tita" is also a very good choice! Anyway, I have a lot of Yugoslav songs in mp3 so that wouldn't be a problem, just tell me what is the maximum? Someone mentioned 3 on Serbia topic...

4. About Great People, I'm also not sure how to put them in and I'm not sure is it possible to connect them just with Yugoslav civilization?

5. kovach81, you showed your credibility on Serbia topic where you asked Velja to put Nikolaj Velimirovic (who admired Adolf Hitler and who was spiritual leader of fascist movement of Dimitrije Ljotic) into Serbia mod, so please don't help us here...

 

[player1 fanatic]

You hear diplomacy music when close zooming to your own cities.

And that is 100% worth it!


P.S.
That's only civilization dependent music I know.

 

[Mr_V]

1. Do you speak about overall ingame music or just diplomacy music? Putting just a diplomacy music wouldn't be worthy because if you play with Yugoslavian civ you will never hear it and mod file's size would multiply...

1. As Player1_fanatic said, you would hear it only during diplomacy and when you zoom in the city. I still think it would be a nice touch

2. If you speak about all in game music then ok, and then I'll need info from you (or anybody else) about technical stuff - what format (mp3?), where is the location in Assets folder, how to implement it into xml files... You downloaded LAnkou's Superciv mod (it's too heavy for me and my dial-up ) so if it is not a problem for you to find that out... I'll include you as a co-author of course!

2. I did download Lankou's SuperCiv mod, but the version without soundfiles, damn! I will try to find out somewhere in the customization subforums how do you add custom mp3s if you decide to do it.

3. About the music - I agree that Hej Sloveni should be a music for President, but for Marhsal it should be first something like "Po sumama i gorama" or maybe "Padaj silo i nepravdo" (my favourite ). Also there is one very strong song "Konjuh planinom" and I have a modern rock version of it. It really rocks! "Uz Marshala Tita" is also a very good choice! Anyway, I have a lot of Yugoslav songs in mp3 so that wouldn't be a problem, just tell me what is the maximum? Someone mentioned 3 on Serbia topic...

3. Yes, there is an option for three music files per leader as someone mentioned on Serbia topic, but I think that general consensus over there was to keep it down - both for the mod size's sake and for the old truth - simplicity is the key. I would just put one tune per leader but hey, it's your mod

4. About Great People, I'm also not sure how to put them in and I'm not sure is it possible to connect them just with Yugoslav civilization?

4. I think it must be (a guess), because from what I remember in the game, nations have their own great people, don't they? Unfortunately, I'm away from my PC for the better part of the weekend so I can't check, but when I get round to it, I will.

 

[Anima Croatorum]

1. As Player1_fanatic said, you would hear it only during diplomacy and when you zoom in the city. I still think it would be a nice touch

I did this with my Hungary mod, and it works fantastic. Everytime you zoom on the city you hear Csardas. Definitively worth the effort. A suggestion when making diplo sounds: You have to rip them into two parts, the intro, and the main theme. Round up the intro in a 10-15 second recognizable lead-in from the start of the song and then skip to the chorus/recognizible part when starting the main theme, IE. 'Ej šeki šeki...' or 'Mile voli disko...'... although I'd suggest 'Jugoslavijo' for the diplo song.

 

[Mr_V]

Just a sudden thought - how 'bout chorus of "Pljuni i zapjevaj" for a short recognizeble diplo music?

Juuuugooooslaaaaviiijo na noge,
pjevaj nek'te čuuuuujuuuu...

Anima, any clues about Civ-specific Great People? I just did a quick search, and didn't find a lot about it, althought his thread seems to suggest that Great People cannot easily be tailored or introduced for a specific tribe.

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=141669

If that is really the case, it's a big miss from Firaxis. Special Great People to new tribes would be a classy add-on to a mod.

 

[Anima Croatorum]

You can add people to the list, but making them civ specific is another issue. I dont think its worth it. Anyway, you probably played enough games to know that Imhotep can be American, Moses and Englishman... whats the point of adding Lepa Brena if she turns out to be Japanese?

 

[srdjann]

OK, thanx for info to all of you!

I found in CIV4LeaderHeadInfos.xml file where the connection with music is. Every leader has got a possibillity of not just 3 but 7 different music themes – each for every era (even though in the game for original leaders there are only 3 music themes – one for ancient and classical, one for medieval and renaissance and one for industrial, modern and future )

Anyway since mp3 files can be so big, of course that there will be just one for all eras... Yugoslav civilization didn't last that much therefore it wouldn't be historical mistake to have just one theme...

But which one will it be? It's kinda too official for me to be "Hej Sloveni/Slaveni"... Maybe "Uz Marshala Tita"? That looks/sounds good... Imagine – you enter Beograd with the sounds of "Uz Marshala Tita junackoga sina nas nece ni pakao smet! Mi dizemo celo, mi krocimo smelo..." Mmm, it's shivering... And on the other hand "Po sumama i gorama" sounds great to... Maybe I'll put a vote to it.

Anyway, I have a couple of questions for you Anima (since you have an experience with this)

1. What did you mean when you wrote that the song should be devided into 2 parts? Did you mean into 2 different files or what? Since "Uz marshala Tita" starts right away with no introduction I don't know what to do...

2. What format should I use in xml file? How can I replace existing (for an example) AS2D_DIPLO_NAPOLEON_MIDDLE text? Let's say that I have tito.mp3 file which I would like to play as diplo music...

3. And the final is where in the Assets folder should I put mp3 file?

Thanx in advance!

 

[srdjann]

You can add people to the list, but making them civ specific is another issue. I dont think its worth it. Anyway, you probably played enough games to know that Imhotep can be American, Moses and Englishman... whats the point of adding Lepa Brena if she turns out to be Japanese?

Yap, I figured that out as well, and that's why I'm so sceptic about adding great people... It is ok to add some world wide known who miss in the game (like Nikola Tesla) but that should be job not just for single mod but for next game patch...

 

[Anima Croatorum]

OK, thanx for info to all of you!

I found in CIV4LeaderHeadInfos.xml file where the connection with music is. Every leader has got a possibillity of not just 3 but 7 different music themes – each for every era (even though in the game for original leaders there are only 3 music themes – one for ancient and classical, one for medieval and renaissance and one for industrial, modern and future )

Anyway since mp3 files can be so big, of course that there will be just one for all eras... Yugoslav civilization didn't last that much therefore it wouldn't be historical mistake to have just one theme...

But which one will it be? It's kinda too official for me to be "Hej Sloveni/Slaveni"... Maybe "Uz Marshala Tita"? That looks/sounds good... Imagine – you enter Beograd with the sounds of "Uz Marshala Tita junackoga sina nas nece ni pakao smet! Mi dizemo celo, mi krocimo smelo..." Mmm, it's shivering... And on the other hand "Po sumama i gorama" sounds great to... Maybe I'll put a vote to it.

Anyway, I have a couple of questions for you Anima (since you have an experience with this)

1. What did you mean when you wrote that the song should be devided into 2 parts? Did you mean into 2 different files or what? Since "Uz marshala Tita" starts right away with no introduction I don't know what to do...

2. What format should I use in xml file? How can I replace existing (for an example) AS2D_DIPLO_NAPOLEON_MIDDLE text? Let's say that I have tito.mp3 file which I would like to play as diplo music...

3. And the final is where in the Assets folder should I put mp3 file?

Thanx in advance!

If you have the time download my latest version of Magyar mod, all the changes to all files have been marked in text files for all xml files.

1. Diplo sounds. When you open negotiations intro sound plays. Once it finishes main theme starts to play and it goes into constant replay until negotiations end. Main theme is also the one that plays when you zoom on a town.

2.First, you need to define the music you will use in audiodefines.xml, just copy the way I did it, or how its done for any leader by firaxis. As for the folders where you will store the sounds use whatever you like, just make sure you link them proper within <Filename>Folder/Name</Filename> part.

<SoundData>
<SoundID>DIPLO_MAGYAR_INTRO</SoundID>
<Filename>ACR-Magyar/Sounds/Diplomacy/Magyar_Intro</Filename>
<LoadType>STREAMED</LoadType>
<bIsCompressed>1</bIsCompressed>
<bInGeneric>1</bInGeneric>
</SoundData>
<SoundData>
<SoundID>DIPLO_MAGYAR_THEME</SoundID>
<Filename>ACR-Magyar/Sounds/Diplomacy/Magyar_Theme</Filename>
<LoadType>STREAMED</LoadType>
<bIsCompressed>1</bIsCompressed>
<bInGeneric>1</bInGeneric>
</SoundData>

Second, modify audio2dscripts.xml and define you sounds:

<Script2DSound>
<ScriptID>AS2D_DIPLO_MAGYAR_INTRO</ScriptID>
<SoundID>DIPLO_MAGYAR_INTRO</SoundID>
<SoundType>GAME_MUSIC</SoundType>
<iMinVolume>75</iMinVolume>
<iMaxVolume>75</iMaxVolume>
<iPitchChangeDown>0</iPitchChangeDown>
<iPitchChangeUp>0</iPitchChangeUp>
<iMinLeftPan>-1</iMinLeftPan>
<iMaxLeftPan>-1</iMaxLeftPan>
<iMinRightPan>-1</iMinRightPan>
<iMaxRightPan>-1</iMaxRightPan>
<bLooping>0</bLooping>
<iMinTimeDelay>0</iMinTimeDelay>
<iMaxTimeDelay>0</iMaxTimeDelay>
<bTaperForSoundtracks>0</bTaperForSoundtracks>
<iLengthOfSound>0</iLengthOfSound>
<fMinDryLevel>1.0</fMinDryLevel>
<fMaxDryLevel>1.0</fMaxDryLevel>
<fMinWetLevel>0.0</fMinWetLevel>
<fMaxWetLevel>0.0</fMaxWetLevel>
</Script2DSound>
<Script2DSound>
<ScriptID>AS2D_DIPLO_MAGYAR_THEME</ScriptID>
<SoundID>DIPLO_MAGYAR_THEME</SoundID>
<SoundType>GAME_MUSIC</SoundType>
<iMinVolume>75</iMinVolume>
<iMaxVolume>75</iMaxVolume>
<iPitchChangeDown>0</iPitchChangeDown>
<iPitchChangeUp>0</iPitchChangeUp>
<iMinLeftPan>-1</iMinLeftPan>
<iMaxLeftPan>-1</iMaxLeftPan>
<iMinRightPan>-1</iMinRightPan>
<iMaxRightPan>-1</iMaxRightPan>
<bLooping>1</bLooping>
<iMinTimeDelay>0</iMinTimeDelay>
<iMaxTimeDelay>0</iMaxTimeDelay>
<bTaperForSoundtracks>0</bTaperForSoundtracks>
<iLengthOfSound>0</iLengthOfSound>
<fMinDryLevel>1.0</fMinDryLevel>
<fMaxDryLevel>1.0</fMaxDryLevel>
<fMinWetLevel>0.0</fMinWetLevel>
<fMaxWetLevel>0.0</fMaxWetLevel>
</Script2DSound>

now you simply use these script names for your Civ4LeaderheadsInfo.xml:

<DiplomacyIntroMusicPeace>
<DiploMusicPeaceEra>
<EraType>ERA_ANCIENT</EraType>
<DiploScriptId>AS2D_DIPLO_MAGYAR_INTRO</DiploScriptId>
</DiploMusicPeaceEra>
<DiploMusicPeaceEra>
<EraType>ERA_CLASSICAL</EraType>
<DiploScriptId>AS2D_DIPLO_MAGYAR_INTRO</DiploScriptId>
</DiploMusicPeaceEra>
<DiploMusicPeaceEra>
<EraType>ERA_MEDIEVAL</EraType>
<DiploScriptId>AS2D_DIPLO_MAGYAR_INTRO</DiploScriptId>
</DiploMusicPeaceEra>
<DiploMusicPeaceEra>
<EraType>ERA_RENAISSANCE</EraType>
<DiploScriptId>AS2D_DIPLO_MAGYAR_INTRO</DiploScriptId>
</DiploMusicPeaceEra>
<DiploMusicPeaceEra>
<EraType>ERA_INDUSTRIAL</EraType>
<DiploScriptId>AS2D_DIPLO_MAGYAR_INTRO</DiploScriptId>
</DiploMusicPeaceEra>
<DiploMusicPeaceEra>
<EraType>ERA_MODERN</EraType>
<DiploScriptId>AS2D_DIPLO_MAGYAR_INTRO</DiploScriptId>
</DiploMusicPeaceEra>
<DiploMusicPeaceEra>
<EraType>ERA_FUTURE</EraType>
<DiploScriptId>AS2D_DIPLO_MAGYAR_INTRO</DiploScriptId>
</DiploMusicPeaceEra>
</DiplomacyIntroMusicPeace>
<DiplomacyMusicPeace>
<DiploMusicPeaceEra>
<EraType>ERA_ANCIENT</EraType>
<DiploScriptId>AS2D_DIPLO_MAGYAR_THEME</DiploScriptId>
</DiploMusicPeaceEra>
<DiploMusicPeaceEra>
<EraType>ERA_CLASSICAL</EraType>
<DiploScriptId>AS2D_DIPLO_MAGYAR_THEME</DiploScriptId>
</DiploMusicPeaceEra>
<DiploMusicPeaceEra>
<EraType>ERA_MEDIEVAL</EraType>
<DiploScriptId>AS2D_DIPLO_MAGYAR_THEME</DiploScriptId>
</DiploMusicPeaceEra>
<DiploMusicPeaceEra>
<EraType>ERA_RENAISSANCE</EraType>
<DiploScriptId>AS2D_DIPLO_MAGYAR_THEME</DiploScriptId>
</DiploMusicPeaceEra>
<DiploMusicPeaceEra>
<EraType>ERA_INDUSTRIAL</EraType>
<DiploScriptId>AS2D_DIPLO_MAGYAR_THEME</DiploScriptId>
</DiploMusicPeaceEra>
<DiploMusicPeaceEra>
<EraType>ERA_MODERN</EraType>
<DiploScriptId>AS2D_DIPLO_MAGYAR_THEME</DiploScriptId>
</DiploMusicPeaceEra>
<DiploMusicPeaceEra>
<EraType>ERA_FUTURE</EraType>
<DiploScriptId>AS2D_DIPLO_MAGYAR_THEME</DiploScriptId>
</DiploMusicPeaceEra>
</DiplomacyMusicPeace>

Plain as beans.

 

[srdjann]

Thanx! I'm downloading your 1.04 Magyar mod and I'll take a closer look!