2011 MLB Thread

[Verarde]

I want a Yankees-Brewers series really badly.

 

[Rashiminos]

ALCS prediction: New York fans watch the Jets play the Patriots and then go home early.

 

[naterator]

That was freaking amazing. The fact that the writing had been on the wall regarding the Sox for a few weeks made it easier to sit back and enjoy the big picture last night. That was, as others have said, perhaps the greatest night of baseball any of us have ever seen. Certainly the best night of regular season ball. The teams that deserved it got in, and the teams that didn't both completed their epic chokes. I agree with CH (and Joe Maddon) that if you pitched last night as a movie, it would be considered way too unbelievable.

Oh, 2 things. One, for the record, that was the biggest regular season choke ever. The 04 Yankees still own the overall title. And two, trying to put Pap in the same category as Dent, Boone, and Buckner is completely wrong. This wasn't a one game thing, this was a whole month. He had been trotted out there for too many innings over the last few days to attempt to cover the rest of the team's asses and it came back to bite us. If we forgave Wake in 03, we'll get past this too.

 

[Lambert Simnel]

Pretty staggering stuff.

That said, if either the Red Sox or the Braves had crawled into the post-season, in all likelihood they wouldn't have troubled their division series opponents for very long. The Red Sox took 2 of 7 in the last week against a not very good Orioles team, and the Braves were finding ways to lose against the Nats and (as El J has said) a set of AAA relievers that the Phillies put out to save their main arms from too much work. If there had been a game 163 in either league, I'm sure Atlanta and Boston would have found ways to blow that as well.

Nonetheless, I'm glad the Cards have made it. We have a decent enough record against the Phils this season, and while we won't be as rested, there's a lot to be said for the sense of euphoria and momentum which results from coming up on the rails like that.

By the way, does anyone now remember our early season conversations about how important the Red Sox's early season malaise might be? One thing is sure - for whatever reason, this is a ballclub which knows how to lose. In other sports, teams such as Barcelona and Manchester United don't seem to know how to give up and resign themselves to defeat; the current Red Sox seem to have a flaw which lets single losses become streaks out of proportion to the quality of their roster.

And can we now declare the Hunter Pence vs Carlos Beltran thing over ? Pence's throw to nail Uggla in the 6th was a thing of beauty. His single to win it in the 13th was as Uggly as they come. But, as a Cards fan, that's all it takes for me to declare Pence a much superior player to Beltran


Lastly, the Reyes' thing was bush league. You should play the game to win, not to end up with some better stat than the other guy. I guess when Matt Kemp gets pulled after an intentional walk in order to preserve his lead in WAR or VORP, that's when we'll really know those stats are mainstream...

 

[Lambert Simnel]

PS World Series will be Cardinals vs Rays. It's called momentum, people...

 

[El Justo]

nice L outstanding point re the bosox early season malaise. it literally cost them...those few games. amazing.

cards present some serious challenges for the phillies. they can hit and lhp garcia has had their number over the last few years. not having carpenter to start a game 1 hurts. but it shouldn't make or break it imo. getting holliday back to strength would be a bonus. that guy can rake. and he nailed the phils in '07 when he was with colorado.

verlander v sabathia tonight. should be a real barn burner.

addit: Dent, Buckner and Andino. there you have it

rumors swirling that tito is out in boston...

 

[classical_hero]

My predictions.
NLDS
Phillies over Cards in 4 games
D-back over Brewers in 5 games

ALDS
Yankees over Tigers in 4 games
Texas over Rays in 5 games

NLCS
Phillies over D-backs in 6 games

ALCS
Yankees over Texas in 6 games

World Series
Phillies over Yankees in 7 games.

 

[El Justo]

via a facebook friend post good stuff. sorry bosox and braves fans but it's deserved...

 

[classical_hero]

It is definitely deserved.

 

[El Justo]

gibby for NL Mgr of the Year. what a turnaround for them. seems like not long ago watching him hobble around the bases in the 88 WS. i'm getting old

 

[illram]

I don't think this was Tito's fault. I like Tito, he has guided this team through two championships and is generally a good manager. There is plenty of blame to go around and it makes me sad that people are calling for his head, but that is a natural thing to want after something like this. Now is one of those times that I am very thankful to live thousands of miles away from Boston sports radio.

I point the blame at the GM. Why did Epstein put a team out there that was pitching 6+ ERA starters in must-win situations in September. A $140 million + team with what amounts to 2 actual legitimate starting pitchers for more than half a season and an overworked bullpen? Inexcusable IMHO.

 

[Theige]

My predictions:

NLDS
Phillies over Cardinals in 3 games
Brewers over D-backs in 4 games

ALDS
Yankees over Tigers in 4 games
Rays over Rangers in 4 games

NLCS
Phillies over Brewers in 6 games

ALCS
Yankees over Rays in 7 games

World Series
Yankees over Phillies in 7 games.

 

[shadowplay]

I made my picks earlier today:

Tigers in 5
Rays in 4
Phillies in 3
Brewers in 4

World Series prediction: Phillies beat the Rays in 5

 

[Lambert Simnel]

With a little bit of hindsight, I think we got carried away a bit (as did MLB.com etc) by the game 162 stuff. The big deal was the month long collapse of both the Braves and the Red Sox (and a pretty impressive charge by the Cards and Rays). But Wednesday's stuff was intriguing, and surprising in the detail, but not in itself the stuff of legends.

The two wild card races were already tied by that point, and the direction of all four ball clubs was clear. The Red Sox and Braves found ways to lose game 162 - as they had been doing for the previous 4 weeks. The Cards strolled over an inept Astros team getting ready to rebuild - no surprise there. The Yanks did blow a big lead to the Rays, but without Robertson, Soriano and Rivera, it really wasn't a surprise that they couldn't hold a lead. The bigger shock was that they ever had that size of lead. And the drama was that the Rays, Red Sox and Braves all had the game going the other way going into the 9th.

All good fun, and an end to the season that'll be remembered for a while. But it probably didn't deserve some of the hyperbole that's been thrown around.

 

[Theige]

I dunno man, it was pretty spectacular; with the enormous late-game deficit the Rays had to overcome, the blown save by Papelbon, and the fact that the Rays won on a walk-off home-run in extra innings just 4 minutes after the walk-off hit in Baltimore... I don't think there has ever been such a miraculous turn of events occurring in two different games with direct playoff implications to one another, and in such short succession, in the history of baseball.

 

[naterator]

Pretty staggering stuff.

That said, if either the Red Sox or the Braves had crawled into the post-season, in all likelihood they wouldn't have troubled their division series opponents for very long. The Red Sox took 2 of 7 in the last week against a not very good Orioles team, and the Braves were finding ways to lose against the Nats and (as El J has said) a set of AAA relievers that the Phillies put out to save their main arms from too much work. If there had been a game 163 in either league, I'm sure Atlanta and Boston would have found ways to blow that as well.

Nonetheless, I'm glad the Cards have made it. We have a decent enough record against the Phils this season, and while we won't be as rested, there's a lot to be said for the sense of euphoria and momentum which results from coming up on the rails like that.

By the way, does anyone now remember our early season conversations about how important the Red Sox's early season malaise might be? One thing is sure - for whatever reason, this is a ballclub which knows how to lose. In other sports, teams such as Barcelona and Manchester United don't seem to know how to give up and resign themselves to defeat; the current Red Sox seem to have a flaw which lets single losses become streaks out of proportion to the quality of their roster.

And can we now declare the Hunter Pence vs Carlos Beltran thing over ? Pence's throw to nail Uggla in the 6th was a thing of beauty. His single to win it in the 13th was as Uggly as they come. But, as a Cards fan, that's all it takes for me to declare Pence a much superior player to Beltran


Lastly, the Reyes' thing was bush league. You should play the game to win, not to end up with some better stat than the other guy. I guess when Matt Kemp gets pulled after an intentional walk in order to preserve his lead in WAR or VORP, that's when we'll really know those stats are mainstream...

Umm... This is the Boston Red Sox. This is what we do. I was amazed to learn that the record we just broke for biggest september collapse was held by some other team. I just assumed we were beating our own record. Actually, having this record in Boston kinda restores some order to the universe. Agreed that both us and the Braves would have found a way to blow it in a 1 game or divisional playoff.

Blaming the early season woes for missing the playoffs is like blaming a missed free throw in the first minute of a basketball game for a 1 point loss. That is to say, foolish at best.

And ya, Reyes is a punk.

edit -- charts are fun.

 

[Lambert Simnel]

Theige, I guess I don't really see Papelbon blowing a save as "miraculous" - I mean, this was his third blown save of the season, and he has a career record of blowing about 10% of his saves. The Rays come back would be something close to miraculous, but for the fact that the Yankees weren't really trying.

This is the Boston Red Sox. This is what we do.

Heh. At least you've managed to keep some sense of humour about it.

 

[illram]

With a little bit of hindsight, I think we got carried away a bit (as did MLB.com etc) by the game 162 stuff. The big deal was the month long collapse of both the Braves and the Red Sox (and a pretty impressive charge by the Cards and Rays). But Wednesday's stuff was intriguing, and surprising in the detail, but not in itself the stuff of legends.

The two wild card races were already tied by that point, and the direction of all four ball clubs was clear. The Red Sox and Braves found ways to lose game 162 - as they had been doing for the previous 4 weeks. The Cards strolled over an inept Astros team getting ready to rebuild - no surprise there. The Yanks did blow a big lead to the Rays, but without Robertson, Soriano and Rivera, it really wasn't a surprise that they couldn't hold a lead. The bigger shock was that they ever had that size of lead. And the drama was that the Rays, Red Sox and Braves all had the game going the other way going into the 9th.

All good fun, and an end to the season that'll be remembered for a while. But it probably didn't deserve some of the hyperbole that's been thrown around.

I think it does. The Rays come back from a 7 run deficit in the bottom of the eight inning, and a half hour later the Sox blow a ninth inning lead with 2 outs and 2 strikes after three straight singles. Then literally 3 minutes later the Rays ht a walk off home run. Basically in the span of 10 minutes you had a complete flip in the wild card standings plus, it was done in very dramatic fashion. I have been watching baseball since I can remember existing in the mid 80s, and I have never seen something like this.

The Sox not making might have been something we saw coming, like a freight train slowly approaching a stalled car on the tracks, but the way they lost it was pretty stunning, I think you have to admit.

 

[GamezRule]

Why did Francona quit again? I agree with the tbs commentators, it was in no way his fault that his players forgot they had talent.

 

[shadowplay]

I don't think he quit as much as he was asked to quit which is a polite way of being fired.