2011 MLB Thread

[Darkness]

General question I'm throwing out there for you guys:

Do you think the MVP ought to belong to a contending team? Or is the MVP the best all-round player in the game, regardless of whether or not his team has any real shot of contention?

Not neccessarily. But it would give a player from a contending team an edge over a player with a similar performance on a bad team...



In other news: Apparently Colby Rasmus is available to be traded... I wonder if now is really the time the Cards would want to trade him? I realize that Jon Jay has been the better centerfielder for the Cards this year, but with Rasmus BA at .242, you're not exactly selling at peak value if you're the Cards....

 

[sophie]

Man, Vogelsong pitched another gem last night! And he's now got the lowest ERA in the NL. I'm going to see Lincy pitch on Wednesday, hope he's on form for that game!

 

[Azale]

Continuing the Astros conversation in the Women's World Cup thread...

Yea, it was a sweep in the World Series. But terminally putrid is no way to describe consistently being over .500, making wild cards, winning pennants, etc. We've only been terminally putrid since 2009. Now, we're going to be terminally putrid for a while longer but let's not go changing history.

 

[illram]

Well "value" does include how much that player helps his team win. Modern baseball statistics even make this seemingly subjective concept objectively measurable. "WAR" (wins above replacement) and "Win shares" for example measure how much a player helps his team "win." (In a highly complicated way...)

So to an extent how much a team wins should be one of the factors, yes. But not the only one.

 

[Lambert Simnel]

Continuing the Astros conversation in the Women's World Cup thread...

Yea, it was a sweep in the World Series. But terminally putrid is no way to describe consistently being over .500, making wild cards, winning pennants, etc. We've only been terminally putrid since 2009. Now, we're going to be terminally putrid for a while longer but let's not go changing history.

Ah, at least you remember it was a sweep

Look, the initial comment was really meant as a joke, as we were discussing whether or not American fans are more prone to "glory-hunting" than other nationalities, and, when Owen made the reasonable enough point that there are a lot of baseball fans who support their team through thick and thin, I tried to accept his point in a joking fashion. Admittedly it was at your expense, but you support one of the Cardinal's rivals, and it was actually an implied back-handed compliment anyway. Since then Owen's been correcting me on points such as my claim that the Astros haven't won the NL Central since 2001, and my conjecture that they got swept in the 2005 World Series.

I really wish I'd never said anything, and the whole thing would go away, to be honest.

 

[classical_hero]

Will Pittsburgh be able to stay on top? Who would have thought they would be doing that this late in the season.

 

[El Justo]

with that pitching that they're getting, yeah, why not. but who is to say how long that will last? if they can score some runs, they should stay in the thick of it. but like any other young and inexperienced team, they will be thrown to the wolves in august and september. should be fun to watch. i remember the days when the pirates were the main rival for the phillies. i'm talking late 70s and early 80s. guys like John Candelaria, Dave Parker, Manny Sanguillen, Willie Stargell (ryan howard clone of the 60s and 70s, could hit balls a country mile), Phil Garner, Bill Madlock, and Kent Tekulve. dg remembers these days better than me though probably when he was first hooked on the phils. God bless him

re mvp award - best player in the legaue rather than contending team player but with a weight towards players on teams that are contending. i remember Andre Dawson winning the award in the NL in '87 for the awful cubs. he wash mashing all season long and deserved it imo. i guess there just wasn't anyone else more deserving in 1987.

 

[downtown]

I'm skeptical that the Pirates will hang on, but they're young and don't know any better, so who knows? On paper, they don't have anywhere near the offensive production capability of St.Louis, Milwaukee or Cincinnati, but if you can get no-names to throw fire, who needs more than a run or two?

It's great to see the city still engaged at this point in the season though. They deserve it.

 

[El Justo]

the pirates fans, yeah. steelers fans and loathsome penguins fans. meh. but buccos fans do indeed deserve better. what has it been? 18 straight losing seasons? that is pathetic.

 

[Azale]

the pirates fans, yeah. steelers fans and loathsome penguins fans. meh. but buccos fans do indeed deserve better. what has it been? 18 straight losing seasons? that is pathetic.

You know, the Steelers/Penguins/Pirates fanbase tends to overlap

I only like the ascension of the Pirates because it puts their ballpark on tv more often. It's pretty nice.

 

[El Justo]

yeah, no kidding

it is a beautiful park to look at. one day when El Justito is old enough, i will take him there

 

[downtown]

Yeah, it and Target Field are my favorites.

As a good Ohioan, I hate everything associated with the Steelers, but Buccos fans are pretty knowledgeable, and haven't been good long enough to be douchebags.

Who would have thought the Indians, Pirates and Diamondbacks would still be in contention now?

 

[El Justo]

well put old boy

 

[classical_hero]

I have something to cheer about. The D'backs that it.

 

[MilesGregarius]

...i remember the days when the pirates were the main rival for the phillies. i'm talking late 70s and early 80s. guys like John Candelaria, Dave Parker, Manny Sanguillen, Willie Stargell (ryan howard clone of the 60s and 70s, could hit balls a country mile), Phil Garner, Bill Madlock, and Kent Tekulve...

Man, those were the days. Lumber & Lightning. Frank Tavares and Bobby Tolan trying to kill each other.

 

[El Justo]

they were beasts back then.

 

[dgfred]

Candelaria, Parker, Stargell... ggggrrrrrrrrrr. I'd almost blocked out the nightmares.

I do remember Parker abolutely throwing a frozen rope to 3rd (or may have been home) from RF to nail a guy trying to take the extra base . Best throw I'd ever seen back then as a youth.

 

[MilesGregarius]

Candelaria, Parker, Stargell... ggggrrrrrrrrrr. I'd almost blocked out the nightmares.

I do remember Parker abolutely throwing a frozen rope to 3rd (or may have been home) from RF to nail a guy trying to take the extra base . Best throw I'd ever seen back then as a youth.

That might have been the All-Star game where Parker won the MVP. Through a laser from deep right and put it right in Gary Carter's mitt to put out Brian Downing at the plate.

He also put a runner out at 3rd in the same game with a throw from the warning track.

Thous shalt not run on the Cobra.

 

[naterator]

General question I'm throwing out there for you guys:

Do you think the MVP ought to belong to a contending team? Or is the MVP the best all-round player in the game, regardless of whether or not his team has any real shot of contention?

Best player regardless of playoff status. But either way, i just wish they would clarify it for the voters because it's stupid to have every sports writer figure out what 'most valuable' means to them. Some won't vote for pitchers. Some won't vote for players on bad teams. Just clarify it.

ps - sportswriter awards are crap, just like all-star selections, the NCAA bowl system, and anything else in sports that is settled by a vote.

 

[downtown]

I agree. I've had sportswriter credentials before, and I'm amazed as to how few of my peers watched any games for teams they don't cover.