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A case for forum members easing up on 2K a bit

Discussion in 'Civ5 - General Discussions' started by thelibra, Jun 9, 2010.

  1. Jugalub

    Jugalub Chieftain

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    For goodness sake: get over yourself. I don't modify the game or play any campaigns or scenarios or anything but they're still going to be there. The game isn't designed just for you.
     
  2. 3 EMS

    3 EMS King

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    I only play single player so if I want to cheat or use exploits thats my business. That is not the point though. This is a ludricous far out example but: Valve decides to ban accounts that belong to people whos names start with a J. Stupid move sure. They could lose their whole business when everyone finds out and bolts. Some won't because of the money they have invested into Valve's system. You might not even agree with this move since your name starts with a J. That doesn't matter though because you just lost all your games. Now, you could open a new account and repurchase your games. What else could you do?
    That was a completely off the wall example even though they could actually do it. What will probably happen is something not as severe. Like collecting more of your hardware info. Info to which they have no legitimate claim to. Again you would probably be given the chance to disagree with this resulting in the loss of your games. Not that they have to give you that chance or even notify you that they are going to do it. Now they can collect your MB info and if you change it, for whatever reason, can tell you that you have to repurchase the game because your license to rent was only valid on your last computer. Plus they can take your data and sell it to yet somebody else who has no legitimate claim to it.
     
  3. Jugalub

    Jugalub Chieftain

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    Iran could spring a surprise nuclear attack on us all tomorrow too. That was a completely off the wall example even though they could actually do it.
     
  4. Ahriman

    Ahriman Tyrant

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    Also, they could break into your house and kill you in your sleep. They could! It doesn't matter that they said they won't and have no reason to do so.

    You can never be too sure; lock your doors and windows, Steam users.

    *edit*
    ninjaed....
     
  5. Jugalub

    Jugalub Chieftain

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    Like I said before. I'm out of Steam discussions now as they're beyond ludicrous. If anyone needs help with it or does actually want to know anything about aside from rehasing the same several points, then feel free to PM me.
     
  6. 3 EMS

    3 EMS King

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    No you didn't. Grouchey asked about steam's integration into the game.
    Your answer was about how many times steam has been taken out of a game.
     
  7. 3 EMS

    3 EMS King

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    I seriously doubt that. Besides Iran has nothing to do with steam's malware.
     
  8. 3 EMS

    3 EMS King

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    The difference being that if they tried I have recourse. If they change the terms of your precious uneeded service then you won't.
     
  9. ZachScape

    ZachScape King

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    As somebody who doesn't fully understand Steam, there are two things I would like:

    -The Legal Ability to copy the game onto a disc in case of a computer crash/etc.
    -A guide at a store such as GameSpot or BestBuy that contains a manual. I hate the fact that the manual will come via internet instead of paper. Call me old fashioned, but I don't trust a low-life-span computer to contain documents I paid for.
     
  10. Jugalub

    Jugalub Chieftain

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    Yeh, you can do a backup to disk if you don't want to have to go through the process of redownloading, if your disk were to become corrupt.
     
  11. Grouchey

    Grouchey Chieftain

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    But who is this game designed for? In other words, do most CIV players care that much about having Steam multiplayer or other Steam features-- that much?? I haven't seen anything to convince me that the main purpose of mandatory Steam isn't simply greed. That is. take2/2K doesn't want the game to be resold, and it believes it will get a stream of extra revenue from DLC sales What's your interest in that?
     
  12. pleasenoname

    pleasenoname Chieftain

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    I actually play LAN games with friends and watch some basketball with them, so the whole over internet issue is invalid for me.

    I have a book on game modeling and several on game programming now. This year I built/assembled two computers (finally after a decade of wanting to). After my experience with DRM, I stopped playing spore and decided to check out Ubuntu Linux.

    To my surprise, it functioned as good as windows, with a nice graphical interface. I have both Windows 7 and Ubuntu Linux in dual boot (each has its own hard drive though). I play all my games on Windows and use Ubuntu for everything else.

    Someone earlier posted that Windows was DRM like, yet us in the non-DRM section use it.
    Actually the funny thing is, Windows 7 actually incorporates open source programming features now. You are never logged in as administrator in Linux/Ubuntu and when accessing OS system files you must enter a password (you can change that) for temporary ["Root"]administrator access.
    This very same feature is in Windows 7 now. Though you are still named as administrator in Windows 7, in actuality the administration function is being carried out by something called; "Trusted Installer". The whole UserAccountControl thing in Windows 7 (and Vista) is based off of this and it was implemented first in Linux/Ubuntu.

    Example: Go into the cookies folder in Windows 7 and try to edit a cookie.
    It won't let you(more likely to occur if you have moved files over from XP). This is also why whenever you install anything you have to click that box authorizing it, it is doing the equivalent of temporary ["Root"]Administrator access.

    Summation: Windows actually is learning new things from free open source, not the other way around.

    As for Direct X, It is in Microsoft's interest and strategy to make sure that everyone has free and unhindered access to it. That way every PC enthusiast who programs a game has a potentially directly/easily ported Xbox360 game, garnering more exclusives for Xbox and thus a larger share of the market for Microsoft.

    In general I find programming/computer industries, tend to purposefully give vague information regarding what everything is and what it does.

    I avoided letting Microsoft Silverlight install on my laptop because it was described as such:
    "Silverlight is a powerful development platform for creating engaging, interactive applications for many screens across the Web, desktop, and mobile devices."

    There is no statement of what it does in there. Finally, one day I noticed that it is just like flash.

    Civ4 - Systems in use in the game:
    C++
    Python
    XML
    Gamebryo/netimerse 3D computer gaphics engine (.nif, .kfm files and such).
    Gamebryo is actually written in C++.
    .bik movie files.

    My question to (2k)greg; Will these systems be used in Civ5? Which ones will be used in Civ5?
    As someone interested in customization this interests me.

    Many steam games also have SecuRom DRM, depending on the game.
     
  13. Jugalub

    Jugalub Chieftain

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    Look at the success of MMOs, online multiplayer games and XBOX live etc, and you'll see the answer to that. Playing games online and interacting in an online community is now mainstream, and isn't seen as a "geeky" niche at all. If you don't want to do that then too bad! I do in some games and don't in others. I'm a single player in Civ too, so I perhaps still won't play Civ online but there's plenty who will.

    Businesses in wanting to make money shocker! I don't blame them for wanting to cut down on used game sales and/or one copy of the game being used for multiple users/friends/households.
     
  14. PieceOfMind

    PieceOfMind Drill IV Defender Retired Moderator

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    If you prevent used game sales, you just push more people into the group who wait for significant price reductions before buying the game. If you aren't sure whether you'll like a game, why pay so much money for such a high risk?
     
  15. Jugalub

    Jugalub Chieftain

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    Is there any evidence of that whatsoever? Modern Warfare 2 has just broken 20m in sales with all the various threats of boycotts from different sections of their community over different issues - that has no used sales either. Regardless, £10 reduced sale is still worth more than a £20 used sale to the publisher and, moreover, the number of people who'll make the conscious decision to wait for a reduced price over the cheapest price available on release, if a preowned title isn't available, is slim-to-none.
     
  16. treadwin

    treadwin Warlord

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    I think people are being a bit hard on 2K and, like it or not, this is the way things are going in the future. Piracy was rampant and game developers were not getting the full value for their product. This is the price everyone has paid for cheating in the past, don't bother telling me that you never stole software, (or download music for free) I'm not listening.

    I use steam for Civ IV and I like it. I don't have to carry the CD from place to place when I travel and I don't have to worry about losing the security key. Yes, it works very well offline.

    For those of you genuinely worried, I think we have to realize as Civ players, we are an older and more conservative crew, sometimes a little resistant to change. I respectfully ask, that you lighten up and realize we need perhaps to go a little backwards to go forwards and that change isn't always bad.
     
  17. The_Coyote

    The_Coyote Emperor

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    20m sold copies where? Console and pc version togehter? The last figures (estimates) i saw, there were 6 million sold copies on the console and estimated 0.3 million for the pc ...(source)
     
  18. Thormodr

    Thormodr Servant of Civ Supporter

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    Good post. It is the way of the future, like it or not.

    Piracy is a huge problem. It sucks that honest people have to pay for the sins of the others but that's life.

    Anyway, I'm looking forward to ciV. It looks outstanding.
     
  19. Senethro

    Senethro Overlord

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    This has to be false or poor quality data. At release of MW2 there were 140k Steam accounts playing multiplayer simultaneously at peak times. I'm skeptical that 45% of sales could be online at once.
     
  20. The_Coyote

    The_Coyote Emperor

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    Honestly, it´s only the way of the future if most of the customer accepts this change.

    lets summarize: more conservative, older, a little resistent to change - nice use of clichés

    I wouldn´t call them so, i would describe it that way: They are more willing not to accept deals, which they personal see as bad. They are no longer accept every change, only because someones cries: this is the future. They are weighting the aspects of deals much more in a matter of fact and no longer affected by the beloved game or any other temporary fashion.

    Some of them still concludes that this will be a fair deal for them and they will buy civ5, some other concludes something different. Both opinions are tolerable, simply because the background for the personal made decision can differ greatly (judging points, which points are more, and which points are less important, ...)

    And following and acceping every (temporary) trend has been proved to be a very bad thing. Exactly the same way bad as never following any trends.

    @ Senethro

    I use this figures because the articel itself seems to be biased in a way opposite to my personal beliefs (even if there are really some good points). But it can be - it´s more a justifying DRM article therefore using extrems (low sold figures, high pirates figures) could be possible.

    Eg checking the sources, the sales estimate used for 2009 shall come from Gamasutra, but it was an estimate for november 09 only - not the entire year 2009 (170000 retail + 100000 steam estiamte). But nevertheless, still saying one million pc copies to six million console copies and assuming this proportion holds, we would have around below 3 million copies for the pc and 18 millions console copies.
     

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