A Strategy For Harriet Tubman

[Methos]

I’m a peaceful player. I’ve never been in a war and never used the espionage mechanic and I’d like to change that. I’ve tried, but I just can’t seem to bring myself to do it, so I thought Harriet’s abilities would be the perfect way to force the issue. Now to just figure out how best to do it.

Since I’m not a warmonger, nor into espionage, I thought I’d seek out others help and guidance. I've posted my thoughts on strategy below, but I'd like to hear your ideas, opinions, and what civs you would choose and why.

Spoiler Her Abilities :

+100% Influence towards initiating Espionage Actions.
Gain 5 War Support on all wars declared against you.
Units ignore movement penalties from Vegetation.

Again, lack of experience in both these subjects, so my current strategy probably sucks, but here are my current thoughts.

Civics Tree
I’d beeline towards Discipline for the Army Commander, so that I could level it up against the barbs. I don’t think I would care about Mysticism, or a pantheon. After Discipline I’d go Code of Laws II for Steal Government Secrets. After that it depends, either for Civ unique civics, or the bottom section of the Civics tree.

Science Tree
Depends on my start location, but a high priority would be Writing II for Steal Technological Advancement. After that BW and then the lower half of the tree.

Settlements
Normally I go 1:2 CIty:Towns ratio, but here I’d want the production to put out units when needed, so I think I’d go for a 2:1 ration instead. I’d focus heavily on production as well.

The Inevitable War(s)
I don’t think anyone will get mad enough until the last half of the Antiquity age, so I think I’ll have plenty of time to build up some production cities and get some units ready. I don’t want too many units as I fear that might cause the AI not to dow on me. In truth, I’m not sure how to piss them off. I’m really good and keeping them friendly, or keeping them at bay.

Civs
This one I’m not sure about. I don’t want a civ that is really going to boost my culture, or science up, as I fear that will just cause me to do less espionage actions. I want one with a good military unit and possibly a good civics tree. I figure while I focus on the civs unique tree that’ll give me more civic techs to steal. I'd probably go for a gold heavy civ, as that will also allow me to purchase units if needed.

NOTICE TO ALL
Bringing up DEI, woke/anti-woke, or any other political stuff may result in a thread ban.

 

[Isca Dumnoniorum]

I'm a peaceful player too but some things I've noticed the AI really hate (i.e. you get big relationship debuffs for) are settling close to their capital and having borders touching. If dispersing an independent people they were cultivating isn't too situational, that also causes a hefty relationship penalty. The more warlike Civs/leaders might even declare war on you for less.

Depending on how much you wanted to game the system, you could also populate the map with militaristic opponents and Macciavelli.

I had a lot of fun with Carthage (in a defensive war that I turned to my advantage) the other day but I understand if the broken combat bonus on their unique cavalry is offputting.

 

[stealth_nsk]

Some thoughts here:

1. Even for peaceful players, espionage is often the way to spend your influence once you invest enough into gaining it.

2. As a peaceful player myself (not because I don't like wars, but because I like building things more), I found Civ7 really great in introducing into more combat-oriented games once you climb up to Immortal or Deity. First you get your civilization stretched in Exploration, second you get wars declared against you in Modern and you actually have to work really hard to defend on all sides. Once you get this, it becomes much more natural to counterattack.

 

[Leucarum]

I actually think Harriet is a pretty good civ for peaceful players. She is my vote for most passive aggressive leader in the best way possible. You can pretty much make her unattackable, and then pursue whatever strategy you like without worrying about the AI

I went Gate of All Nations and one point in the millitary tree to get an extra 3 war support on top of the 5 from Harriet's ability. There's also a memento (I think it comes from Trung Trac) for an extra war support - anyone attacking you starting on 9 support against them is definitely something. You can then play whatever peaceful strategy you like safe in the knowledge that you're unattackable.

Greece is nice for the influence to start, and if/when you annoy everyone Prussia is a good finisher.

 

[Methos]

Depending on how much you wanted to game the system, you could also populate the map with militaristic opponents and Macciavelli.

Interesting idea. I'm not sure I would do them all. I think I'd set one or two (probably Xerxes) and leave the rest to randomness.

2. As a peaceful player myself (not because I don't like wars, but because I like building things more), I found Civ7 really great in introducing into more combat-oriented games once you climb up to Immortal or Deity. First you get your civilization stretched in Exploration, second you get wars declared against you in Modern and you actually have to work really hard to defend on all sides. Once you get this, it becomes much more natural to counterattack.

This could be part of my issue, as I've never played the Modern age. I don't know how many times I've played Antiquity and only played the Exploration age two or three times. I just keep restarting.

I went Gate of All Nations and one point in the millitary tree to get an extra 3 war support on top of the 5 from Harriet's ability. There's also a memento (I think it comes from Trung Trac) for an extra war support - anyone attacking you starting on 9 support against them is definitely something. You can then play whatever peaceful strategy you like safe in the knowledge that you're unattackable.

I meant to mention I was going to go for GoaN, but forgot. That and a militaristic memento point. I don't have the other one you mention yet.

 

[Leucarum]

I very much underestimated how useful war support is during the previews and hence I think Harriet is the leader I most underestimated. She went from "I doubt I'll ever play her" to easily being one of my favourites.

 

[Vincent_lacruz]

I’m a peaceful player. I’ve never been in a war and never used the espionage mechanic and I’d like to change that. I’ve tried, but I just can’t seem to bring myself to do it, so I thought Harriet’s abilities would be the perfect way to force the issue. Now to just figure out how best to do it.

Since I’m not a warmonger, nor into espionage, I thought I’d seek out others help and guidance. I've posted my thoughts on strategy below, but I'd like to hear your ideas, opinions, and what civs you would choose and why.

Spoiler Her Abilities :

+100% Influence towards initiating Espionage Actions.
Gain 5 War Support on all wars declared against you.
Units ignore movement penalties from Vegetation.

Again, lack of experience in both these subjects, so my current strategy probably sucks, but here are my current thoughts.

Civics Tree
I’d beeline towards Discipline for the Army Commander, so that I could level it up against the barbs. I don’t think I would care about Mysticism, or a pantheon. After Discipline I’d go Code of Laws II for Steal Government Secrets. After that it depends, either for Civ unique civics, or the bottom section of the Civics tree.

Science Tree
Depends on my start location, but a high priority would be Writing II for Steal Technological Advancement. After that BW and then the lower half of the tree.

Settlements
Normally I go 1:2 CIty:Towns ratio, but here I’d want the production to put out units when needed, so I think I’d go for a 2:1 ration instead. I’d focus heavily on production as well.

The Inevitable War(s)
I don’t think anyone will get mad enough until the last half of the Antiquity age, so I think I’ll have plenty of time to build up some production cities and get some units ready. I don’t want too many units as I fear that might cause the AI not to dow on me. In truth, I’m not sure how to piss them off. I’m really good and keeping them friendly, or keeping them at bay.

Civs
This one I’m not sure about. I don’t want a civ that is really going to boost my culture, or science up, as I fear that will just cause me to do less espionage actions. I want one with a good military unit and possibly a good civics tree. I figure while I focus on the civs unique tree that’ll give me more civic techs to steal. I'd probably go for a gold heavy civ, as that will also allow me to purchase units if needed.

NOTICE TO ALL
Bringing up DEI, woke/anti-woke, or any other political stuff may result in al thread ban.

The problem of doing this is that you will most likely forego CS, since most of your influence will be spent on espionnage (and you will get influence penalties every time you are caught...)... But if you beeline your commander you can consider razing most of the IP, which is not bad (I like razing military IP for the big production boost).

The other downside is that you really need the good AI to declare war, since for expansion you will need to get their towns (as badly placed as they are...). Declaring war yourself would be too big a loss...

 

[protocol7]

My Tubman strategy is to build Gate of All Nations, get the +1 war support military attribute card, and then troll all the AIs as hard as possible to get them to declare war on me as soon as possible. Then, snowball militarily for an easy win. Not sure why a design for playing this way would be associated with Harriet Tubman of all people, but it's what she's best at.

 

[Methos]

The problem of doing this is that you will most likely forego CS,

I hadn't considered the CS. I'll probably use them to level up my army commanders.

The other downside is that you really need the good AI to declare war, since for expansion you will need to get their towns (as badly placed as they are...). Declaring war yourself would be too big a loss...

As mentioned in the OP, I don't expect anyone to dow on me until probably the second half of the game, so I should be able to build up my own empire in the beginning.

Not sure why a design for playing this way would be associated with Harriet Tubman of all people, but it's what she's best at.

I once played the Romans so that I can use their legions to practice my warmongering. I couldn't get myself to dow on anyone, so instead I used my legions against the CS's. Since I know I'm hesitant to dow on someone else, I feel playing as Harriet and getting them to dow on me is probably my best option.

 

[Krikkit1]

My Tubman strategy is to build Gate of All Nations, get the +1 war support military attribute card, and then troll all the AIs as hard as possible to get them to declare war on me as soon as possible. Then, snowball militarily for an easy win. Not sure why a design for playing this way would be associated with Harriet Tubman of all people, but it's what she's best at.

IRL she "played" Union America (as a spy master)
.. do things another civ doesn't like (the possibility of abolition made Confederates mad)
...have the better War support and Military to win ( the possibility of abolition made the Union more popular in Europe.. and the Union had the better overall situation)

 

[CoconutTank]

I've mostly played Sovereign difficulty, but it hasn't been difficult for me to make other civs mad at me for the most part. Mainly doing anything of the following would help:
- Spend little to no influence on achieving positive relationships. So no friendly greeting, no support for endeavors, let denouncements through, turn down alliances if they somehow happen. I don't usually have to block or deny endeavors, I'd much rather spend the influence on suzerainty or espionage actions anyway.
- Keep using espionage actions and sanctions on a single civ if you want to goad that particular civ into war. Spreading out the espionage actions and sanctions will make it less likely that any civ will declare war on you.
- Having touching borders with another civ will definitely annoy that civ a lot. You don't have to be forward settling a lot, just having one settlement touching is usually enough.
- Trade with city states or other civs you're not planning to go to war with.

Tubman is a lot fun to play tho imo, so I hope you get a great experience with her If you do end up playing into Modern Age, note that differing ideologies can generate lots of bad blood, and if you pick an ideology, the AI is more likely to pick a different one.

 

[Sagax]

Civs
This one I’m not sure about. I don’t want a civ that is really going to boost my culture, or science up, as I fear that will just cause me to do less espionage actions. I want one with a good military unit and possibly a good civics tree. I figure while I focus on the civs unique tree that’ll give me more civic techs to steal. I'd probably go for a gold heavy civ, as that will also allow me to purchase units if needed.

My first thought is Prussia for Modern. You’re very likely to piss off everyone around you if you commit to constant espionage, at which point you might as well turn that into even more combat strength.

As for Antiquity and Exploration…assuming that you don’t plan to just defend, and actually want to use the AI’s declaration as an excuse to conquer the map - then the warmongering staples will do: Rome, Persia, Mongolia, maybe even Maurya. I’ll also call out some less aggressive civs that have influence bonuses, since you’ll want to keep espionage going: Han, Greece, Norman, Chola. Some of them are less aggressive, overall, but have strong units nonetheless.

 

[JaeChunDaeSung]

One thing I notice in VII, it's easy to please, even EASIER to displease. Until the next update fixes the habits of forward settling, your neighbors, friend or foe will always find some way to shake things up, since rejecting or turning away Endeavors or Allied Wars will sour things in equal measure. Often times, the occasional Espionage won't be too hard of feelings with your 'friends' if you play your cards right, but basically, if you're sitting on influence, best use it.

An obvious play would be to build the Gate of All Nations, mass up Influence, and spend away for domestic support if anyone even DARES to pick a fight with you. While Niccolo profits from any diplomacy regardless of results, you're in to use diplomacy and espionage to stay ahead of everyone regardless of relations. If they aggro, that's on them.