Abortions: yes or no?
- Thread starter Dionysius
- Start date
RedWolf
Deity
Paradigne said:
Again - the crux of the issue is that we don't consider fertilized eggs "people". You do.
Masquerouge
Deity
Abortions should be legal.
RedWolf
Deity
Dionysius said:
I don't know the answer to that question...
But I would consider just about every animal on the planet more "alive" and "self aware" then a fertilized egg... And we kill and eat animals every single day without any remorse.
The argument for the cut-off at birth is the argument that the mother has ultimate control over her body.Eran of Arcadia said:
But yes, those who argue from a "sentient" point of view (as I mainly do) would probably draw the line somewhat before birth to be safe.
But if you're going to claim we have no way of knowing what is conscious, by that logic we should campaign for the rights of bricks.Dionysius said:
Anyhow, we have plenty of evidence which shows the brain as the source of consciousness and ability to feel pain.
You've been reading through the thread, so how are you unaware of the fact that such people have the radical belief that a bunch of cells does not equate to a person?Paradigne said:
Even ignoring this point, I don't see what is funny. Firstly, few people are "against war", rather they are against specific wars. Secondly, since abortion is "killing" for a reason, at least as much as wars, I don't see how one should be more likely to oppose abortions than wars.
Even if we decided that fetuses were people like you and I, then if you are okay with killing tens of thousands of innocent civilians in order to achieve some goal, I do not see it worse that someone might terminate a pregnancy, in order to free the woman of the fetus that is leeching off her body.
Shadylookin
master debater
Dionysius said:
it would be in your best interest to
just because a fetus has a possibility of being born doesn't mean in has the right to.
I would seriously rather not be born than to spend my first 18 years in a state ran institution plain and simple.
whose them and what are you putting them into?
fetuses are no more people than sperm and eggs. a fetus feeds off of the woman's body for nutrients therefore a woman should have the right to get rid of it.
If condoms were 100% foolproof option some of us wouldn't be here today
where i live abortion is legal and we're doing good so far as well. A countries stance on abortion is obviously not the largest concern or factor for it's success.
Nonsequitor baby =/= fetus. babies have developed central nervous systems, respond to stimuli, and feel pain.
I agree (if somewhat grudgingly) with the two month limit. That gives the woman enough time to know that she is pregnant, and if she was raped but unable/unwilling to press charges, that will give her enough time to come to a decision. At the same time it is before the fetus starts developing brain activity.
But after that, I see it as murder. And it doesn't matter what gender I am or how much it would cost to save a life, no one uses those arguments to justify other fomrs of murder and I don't see how they are relevant here.
But after that, I see it as murder. And it doesn't matter what gender I am or how much it would cost to save a life, no one uses those arguments to justify other fomrs of murder and I don't see how they are relevant here.
Shadylookin said:
1. Whatever...
2. i am talking about a foetus that will be born.
3. suicidal then.
4. do you have a low attention span, or something? poor parent putting their children into orphanages.
5. so, a person surviving on state benifit can be cast aside?
6. would you or them prefer if the condom at their conception was foolproof?
7. again, whatever...
8. Answer the damn question. but of course you wont, will you...
Dionysius said:
I'll go out on a limb here, and guess that it involves the brain ...
The 777 Hoax
future skeleton
- Joined
- Dec 14, 2005
- Messages
- 1,599
toh6wy
Emperor
You cannot make abortion disappear by making it illegal. No matter how harsh the punishment is for having an abortion, there will always be women who are determined enough to get one that they'll find a clinic somewhere. But if abortion is illegal, the clinic would have to rely on its own, probably inferior, facilities and equipment -- not to mention the training of the staff and the clinic's location would probably be poor. If abortion was, on the other hand, legal, the government could freely give some help to clinics, so that women who would get an abortion one way or another would at least be able to get one safely.
As might be implied from the above, I think abortion should be legal but discouraged.
As might be implied from the above, I think abortion should be legal but discouraged.
BloodyPepperoni
King
Until recently I had mixed feelings about that issue. Then, about a month ago, I was banging a chick and the condom broke. It wasn't my fault, I took my responsabilities as a (too young to be a father) man. Thankfully, nothing happened. But accidents do happen, and if it ain't your fault I hardly see how you could be held responsible, and forced to keep and raise a baby if youre not ready, and blow your life, the girl's life and the baby's life
I don't care what a woman does with her body, that is for her to decide, and she will take on the personal consequences.
The REAL issue is, that I -a tax payer- shouldn't have to pay for her 'elective surgery'.
I'm a conservative - and I'd like to see each life be given a chance. But, in reality, you can't legislate what someone does with their own body, unless you want to live in a society of fake freedom. But what does matter, is that if she wants to abort the pregnancy, it should not be paid for by ME and YOU, and a clinic funded by the gov't.
No one ever seems to talk about that, though. They just go BACK AND FORTH endlessly, over 'what is morally right'. I suspect this was the intention of those with a higher political power / consciousness. -Get the pawns butting heads forever over the wrong issue.
Whatever.
The REAL issue is, that I -a tax payer- shouldn't have to pay for her 'elective surgery'.
I'm a conservative - and I'd like to see each life be given a chance. But, in reality, you can't legislate what someone does with their own body, unless you want to live in a society of fake freedom. But what does matter, is that if she wants to abort the pregnancy, it should not be paid for by ME and YOU, and a clinic funded by the gov't.
No one ever seems to talk about that, though. They just go BACK AND FORTH endlessly, over 'what is morally right'. I suspect this was the intention of those with a higher political power / consciousness. -Get the pawns butting heads forever over the wrong issue.
Whatever.
Don't think of it as a welfare situation, though, but as an investment. Paying for an abortion might cost the society $1200 or so per surgery, but long-term you'll likely be saving money. Just like putting money into the school system makes a country money, because an educated populace is more prosperous.
Though, upon proof-reading, that does look awfully cold. But that's because abortion is seen as a moral issue.
It's also a way of preventing a child from existing, and having a below-average life. Much like abstaining, but tougher on the woman than the man.
Though, upon proof-reading, that does look awfully cold. But that's because abortion is seen as a moral issue.
It's also a way of preventing a child from existing, and having a below-average life. Much like abstaining, but tougher on the woman than the man.
Yeah, it probably is more cost effective to abort all the 'below-average' ones, and just import some illegal alien workers, in their place. Plus, we have much more legal/authoritarian control over them, unlike (what would have been the case) with the abortees.
And of course money -and control- are everything, naturally.
And of course money -and control- are everything, naturally.
Similar threads
- Poll
