ALC Game #23 Pre-Game Show: Playing as Lincoln

I used to be a firm believer in the notion that Agg AI made the game more challenging. However, having tried countless games using both options, I no longer think that is the case.

Here are the options I use for a very rewarding Emperor game:

Standard map size
Epic speed
Low sea level
9 civs
Choose religions
Permanent alliances
Yeah, I fired up an AggAI game last night and very promptly started beating the AI's head in.

I kind of like those settings and may give them a whirl, except for permanent alliances, as I don't want to skew things too much.
 
I think you should (i) play a continents map, and (ii) move up a difficulty. These two things will work well together.

Why do I say this? Well, even at a higher difficulty you should still be able to claim your patch of land, even if it puts you behind for a little while. That's okay, you can catch up later - in fact, it's good, it means you're catching up just as the UB, UU and corps come online.

Leading on from what madscientist said, I want to see a game that lasts the distance. You want a radical suggestion? Turn off Cultural, Space and Diplomatic wins. Put up the difficulty. Find yourself in the 17th century well off the pace. Leverage your leader's advantages to found and exploit corporations. Then use you human knowledge of warfare to come from behind to win. Note this'll involve a lot of modern warfare... so large size map at the most, probably standard.

What do people think?
 
Sisuitil,

I know it might prove difficult on this level of gameplay.. but a feudalism slingshot is definately worth considering.

you can get writing and scientists on board before you would spawn a prophet, and try to finish researching monarchy before the oracle pops.

I've done this with native america and it is amazing how strong longbows are at 1400BC :D

check out the thread leveraging vassalage (sorry for no linky) and it should explain everything.

been a while since we saw a good gambit anyway ;)

NaZ
 
Hello, new guy here. I've been reading some of the ALCs (although I haven't caught up on all of them...yet). I was wondering if-should the game last that long :)-we could see Corporations used, even if only as tools of economic destruction.

(PS: I remember reading somewhere that an HQ will generate +4:gold:/turn for every city that is paying maintenance for an office-even under State Property. I believe the words "Rush Buying" are the appropriate words for this.)

[edit] OK, that second paragraph comes from this article. Look for it under The Basics -> (spoiler tag) -> State Property. Alternately:
Your Domestic Corporate Headquarters continue to gain +4 gold for every one of your Foreign Corporate Offices not under the Mercantilism or State Property Civic.
 
Use of corporations is very situational. I made heavy use of them in the Peter the Great and Gilgamesh games, IIRC. I've played for domination wins lately, and corporations don't generally fit will with that victory condition because State Property's removal of the distance-to-palace maintenance penalty is so hand when you have a big, far-flung empire. Use of them in this game really depends very much on what victory condition I end up pursuing. Corporations are very helpful for cultural or space victories, less so for domination, as I said. We're talking about late-game warring with Lincoln, so we'll have to see.
 
If you can put off adopting State Property long enough to found a couple of the lesser Corps and send out some Executives to the rivals that you aren't going to conquer soon, then you might be able to go to war with some more funds in the late game.

Then again, should the game last that long?
 
I know we want to play to the leader's strengths, adjust to the map, etc., but I kind of want to see a space race win. I only recently upgraded to BtS (all the way from vanilla), and have only managed to reach the new modern parts of the tech tree once. Of course, I don't think I've ever waged modern warfare with tech parity, either (takes WAY too much time if you can't just stack tanks and march unopposed), so either way it should be a good experience if the game lasts into the modern era.
 
To those advocating moving up to Immortal:

Why? What's the point within the context of the ALC?

Whilst I actually think Emperor is the appropriate level for Sis - and wouldn't be opposed to him moving down again afterwards - I think Lincoln is particularly well-suited to a come-from-behind win, and that is best done on Immortal.

Basically, I want to see him struggling early on. I want to see him relying on Lincoln's late-game strengths and his tactical expertise both to survive and to win with a smaller base of land. This is most likely to occur on Immortal.
 
Use of corporations is very situational. I made heavy use of them in the Peter the Great and Gilgamesh games, IIRC. I've played for domination wins lately, and corporations don't generally fit will with that victory condition because State Property's removal of the distance-to-palace maintenance penalty is so hand when you have a big, far-flung empire. Use of them in this game really depends very much on what victory condition I end up pursuing. Corporations are very helpful for cultural or space victories, less so for domination, as I said. We're talking about late-game warring with Lincoln, so we'll have to see.

A quick swap to any non-State-Property civic can do amazing things to new conquests with Sid's Sushi or one of the other culture bonus corporations. I find that having the extra food available for the truly important cities (Heroic Epic, National Park, Oxford and Iron Works cities especially) is an enormous benefit and well worth the sacrifice of a Great Merchant even if I'm not going to get the benefit for a lot of the end game.

Popping borders a second time on newly taken cities goes a long way toward fulfilling the Domination victory's requirements. I think that a turn of Anarchy and higher maintenance costs would be worth the hit at the end of the game in exchange for the benefits. I've found that having some of your own culture in the area also makes the conquest easier.
 
A quick swap to any non-State-Property civic can do amazing things to new conquests with Sid's Sushi or one of the other culture bonus corporations. I find that having the extra food available for the truly important cities (Heroic Epic, National Park, Oxford and Iron Works cities especially) is an enormous benefit and well worth the sacrifice of a Great Merchant even if I'm not going to get the benefit for a lot of the end game.

Popping borders a second time on newly taken cities goes a long way toward fulfilling the Domination victory's requirements. I think that a turn of Anarchy and higher maintenance costs would be worth the hit at the end of the game in exchange for the benefits. I've found that having some of your own culture in the area also makes the conquest easier.

All true.... but if it's that close to the end game is it really worth all the extra micromanagement? I'd rather just hit enter a couple extra times.
 
All true.... but if it's that close to the end game is it really worth all the extra micromanagement? I'd rather just hit enter a couple extra times.

Or max the culture slider while building culture or running specialists :p. 2nd border pops aren't THAT hard then. If you're doing this at the very end it might be quicker than using corps even, especially if you have to endure anarchy.
 
All you really lose by giving up State Property is gold. All you really lose by founding & spreading the corporations is gold. You gain lots of food and hammers. For me, that's a pretty good trade-off, especially in the end-game when you've done the research you need to win and it's all down to building armies.
 
I find mining inc to be the warmonger's corporation. its easy to get to providing you have an engineer (so some planning is required) the hammer spike produces a snowball effect that gets larger the more territory you conquer. captured cities and commerce cities become production centers able to produce units at much greater speeds than normally possible.

so don't discount them outright. yes they're awesome for spacerace.. but very useful in domination and conquest.

NaZ
 
If Sisutil doesn't move up to Immortal in difficulty level, I would at least like to see a role playing challenge element to this challenge:

Lincoln cannot adopt Slavery and must declare WAR on any leader who adopts Slavery

Cheers,

Dai
 
Instead of using state property in the modern era, what I sometimes do is smash the weakest AI on the other continent (whos usually hella backwards) and vassalize him without taking any cities. Then you steamroll the next guy, liberating cities to the vassal. If you gift him the prerequsite techs, each new city will have 2 garrison troops. Once hes near half your size I think you can forma colony though I'm not sure. This isn't the most best way but it saves a whole lot of time.

Another strategy I've been waiting to try is a marine assault with machine guns to hold the coastal capital. The AI should have more than 5 or so decent defenders (monarch) so even though they nerfed the artillery concept it should still work with 15 or so marines. Then if you drop 15 or so machine guns (CG III) with 10 or so artilery, they should be able to hold indefinitely. I wouldn't bother with regular troops cause the AI'll prolly have 20 artillery in its stack. Your artillery are just for softening up that original stack of 50 which is all that really matters. Once again, I've never actually tried this one out, but It would definetely be fitting for America.

Edit: I forgot to add this. If you grab a coastal city like that, the first thing that will happen is it wil starve down to like 5, then after the first revolt, the borders will pop to a full 20 tile BFC (unless they fixed this).
 
Re: AggAI: Of course the AI will tech slower with it on. It isn't a bonus for the AI, it just makes the AI spend more time on military and less on other aspects of development. IMHO, AggAI is an option put there to beat some sense into pathological builders. S should have used it back when he was a wonder-addict. Once a player has learned to rely on war against the AI, the option doesn't have as much effect.
 
Looking forward to this one; Abe is my favorite leader. I have played Abe as a wonderspammer and a scientist/lightbulber; either approach can work. Abe can really get a lot out of early Stonehenge and I suggest you get it. I also have noticed that the AI civs in 3.17 don't go for early wonders and religions quite as quickly as before, but YMMV.

I would also point out that barbarians in 3.17 are more of a threat. Military needs to be addressed fairly quickly.

If you go Tectonics, I suggest the 60% water map or the "real Earth old world only." 70% water gives a lot of isolated starts.

Finally, note that Tectonics maps are hill and mountain heavy. Guerilla-promoted archers are cheap and very effective early on.
 
I am definitely leaning towards going up to Immortal. I played part of an immortal game last week (off-line, of course) and got my clock cleaned; then I dropped back down to Emperor and totally dominated, so it's time to move up. Lincoln is, with two strong traits, an excellent leader to try this with, and I'd prefer to try this scary new level with the peanut gallery collectively holding my sweating, trembling hand. If I find I can't win on this level I can always drop back to Emperor for a while, but sometimes the best way to learn how to play a level is to just keep at it.

As for the map, I was thinking of a bit of a compromise of some of the suggestions above: standard size, archipelago with low sea levels and snaky continents. And I would like to add a couple of extra civs this time around.

I'll try to post the start in a new thread tonight.
 
Your next Protective leader is Churchill. Hope you're used to Immortal by then. ;)
 
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