Alternate History NESes; Spout some ideas!

[Cashie]

- What if the Persians had defeated Byzantines in Middle East and were in a position strong enough to fight back Islam, thus confining it to Arabia, which will then use the resources otherwise used for northward Jihad to colonize Africa instead? Maritime Arabian empire?

This, I like.

The Buddhist Europe scenerio would be nigh on impossible: since the Golden Horde were more Muslim than Buddhist. The Kalmyk republic is an area of Europe which is Buddhist, being settled by Mongols during their various invasions.
Just an idea, really - wouldn't make a decent Civ scenario, that's for damn sure.

 

[das]

Kalmyks? Buddhist? I always thought they were muslim...

What if the Khazars defeated the Arabs in Caucasus? Khazaria was a potential great empire, and a very unique one - not only religiously tolerant, but it was also Judaistic in religion. If it had just alittle more luck, it would've survived and probably could have destroyed Kievan Rus.

In the opposite:

What if the Arabs defeated Khazars in Caucasus early on? They could've conquered the Volga area, and Russia could've become Muslim.

 

[Amenhotep7]

Just got a book. "What if?" Volume II. Here are some:

-Cleopatra and Mark Antony victorious at Actium?
-Chinese Discover New World first?
-The Normans don't conquer England?
-Jesus was spared?
-Martin Luther burns at the stake?
-No Emancipation Proclaimation?
-Pope speaks out against Holocaust in WWII?

 

[alex994]

nah, the vikings discovered America first, the ming fleets came nearly a few hundred years after.

 

[Amenhotep7]

I meant after the vikings...

 

[North King]

Just got a book. "What if?" Volume II. Here are some:

That was an excellent book.

-Cleopatra and Mark Antony victorious at Actium?

That would be a good NES.

-Chinese Discover New World first?

As would that.

-The Normans don't conquer England?

This, I think, is one of the best in that book.

-Jesus was spared?

This is an interesting one, but I hope you don't go the route of the author. He seems to think that if Christianity never rose, then Rome would not have fallen, which really makes no sense. Rome was bound to fall, there really is not way for the complete Roman Empire to survive.

-Martin Luther burns at the stake?

This is also a very good one.

-No Emancipation Proclaimation?

Meh. Not that interesting, methinks.

-Pope speaks out against Holocaust in WWII?

Not really interesting.

 

[Xen]

A) what if england never seperated from the catholic church

B)what if China never existed

C)what if the cultures of the bronze age didnt die off (already been soem talk of it in here), and built up strong, real world influncing cultures; migth the religion of Minoan goddesses be that in which many worship today?

D)what if the Rus neve rhad to submit to the golden hord?

E)what if Italy had Unfied during the itallian Renaissance?

 

[alex994]

A)wat if Rome never existed?

B)What if Constantinople fell to the Arabs before 1000?

C)What if the Mongols beat the Egyptians?

D)What if Liu Bei of the Han Dynasty continue to push west?

E)What would happen if the Greeks lost Marathon?

 

[Xen]

heh, your A option is already covered in the pool; thats what inpired by own B option, oh observent one

 

[Xen]

and the answer to all fo those is likelyl that noen of us would nearlyl as much freedom as we all currentlly enjoy today

 

[alex994]

i no that, but i'm too lazy to read the entire thread, it's 9 pages long!!! if china never existed, the mongols would've probably never come storming down though.... no reason too lol.

 

[North King]

and the answer to all fo those is likelyl that noen of us would nearlyl as much freedom as we all currentlly enjoy today

Ha! I just love all this about how the West was the only civ that would bring personal freedom into the mix of government--which has no basis in fact. All this hype about how the Greeks and only the Greeks had freethinking societies and thus only the west had freethinking societies--yet no evidence to back it up. I fail to see how the feudal West had been any more likely to create democracy than, say, a flourishing Arabia or China.

 

[alex994]

yeah, i agree with north king!

 

[Capulet]

(here is another interesting idea, perhaps connected with the no Christianity idea, perhaps not – what if instead of creating Islam Mohammed would have converted to Judaism as he once planned? Perhaps a reformed Judaism, with Melkhama Hakdosha instead of Jihad and with a more missionary attitude?)

Muhammad (PBUH) never planned to convert to Judaism, what are you talking about?

 

[Xen]

Ha! I just love all this about how the West was the only civ that would bring personal freedom into the mix of government--which has no basis in fact. All this hype about how the Greeks and only the Greeks had freethinking societies and thus only the west had freethinking societies--yet no evidence to back it up. I fail to see how the feudal West had been any more likely to create democracy than, say, a flourishing Arabia or China.

heh, the feudal west couldnt dig itself out of hole really; it i[renaissance[/i] western europe, and re-insperation foi the personal freedoms and rights that had inspired the greek democracies, and Itallian republics that is what is the great insperation of the west.

what is my proof? simple. the est never developd them; geography and mind set have a lot to do with culture; and it shows, the greedy, self important europeans wanted to ensure that they coudl essentially do what ever the hell they wanted to do, which has lead to a culture that cherishes personal freedom. the wests greatest weakness feeds into its greatest strength.

 

[Amenhotep7]

What if Genghis Khan never pushed west? Had there not been trouble on the home front, why would he have needed to?

@NK You have that book as well? Tell me, I know they have a volume 1 and 2, but do they have others? I've had the darndest time just finding Volume II. Unfortunately, there are not many bookstores round my area. A pity.

 

[Xen]

More ideas!

A)what if Atlantis (as described in the legneds as an island contient) really existed? (as opposed ot the semi-reality based upon Tartessos, Minoa, and the Sea-peoples)

B)what if during WWII, france and the US had conceeded to British Primister Churchills wantes to make a giant, unified state?

C)what if after WWI, the US decided that, like so many other nations, a grab of land was only fair payment, and got a chunck of europe for itself?

 

[North King]

What if Genghis Khan never pushed west? Had there not been trouble on the home front, why would he have needed to?

@NK You have that book as well? Tell me, I know they have a volume 1 and 2, but do they have others? I've had the darndest time just finding Volume II. Unfortunately, there are not many bookstores round my area. A pity.

I believe I pondered that scenario above, if the governor of Ortrar had not executed the Mongol emmisaries and stolen their trade goods, then the Mongols don't go west.

As for What If, I am unaware of a What If 3, I desperately hope they make one, but I don't know of any. Not many bookstores around here, either.

 

[Warman17]

what if Neapolion's Imperial Guard didn't retreat in Waterloo and pressed forward, forcing The Duke to retreat. This may lead to Naepolion's revival and his slow reconquest of europe. You can decide if he would be eventually defeated, or if the naitons caved in and allowed him to keep his land.

 

[Cashie]

E)What would happen if the Greeks lost Marathon?

They did lose it.