amirsan
King of all Kings
Ok, Tsukemono5. Belail, you have the save right??
Amirsan3- Diety Newb Attempt- Join!!!!
- Thread starter amirsan
- Start date
Belial
Warlord
Yeah, I do now.
amirsan
King of all Kings
Ok, just checking 
.
.Belial
Warlord
The blasted forum ate my post and report. Remind me to save it to word next time or something.
I can still give an overview.
Basically, I took the Japaneese city, got peace and monotheism (I grabbed this because we'll be done with feudalism in 20) for 13 gpt and 200ish gold. I changed us to republic (no idea why we wasn't) and was sending our military units towards the Mongols next. Our income is around 60 gpt.
From where we stand now, China is a far fetched idea in grabbing the GL. Slingshotting our troops in there would result in whatever we had destroyed on the process of getting there. There is like 3 to four rings of cities to go through before we even get there. Once we finish the Mongols, we should have feudalism by then and thus, use our MDI against muskets. We're going to want to get a second core ring going too or else we're going to stand little to no chance in this game.
There was also a lot of minor mistakes we made that I had noticed on our my turns. For one, growth is power once you're out of despotism. We should have had irrigation near everywhere to get our max pop and then to focus on production. I had moved workers to dry spots, please stop mining areas that are dry and do not mine a hill unless we have a good food production in the city. People = Power.
The Japaneese city I took should probably make a harbor (not sure if I had a galley or a harbor) because it would open up trade for every civ, if I recall. Across from that city is a Korean one with incense, if we manage to take that city and the Mongols, we will have 7 luxuuries; I think we just need 6 to pretty much stay in war continously throughout the rest of the game. I think we'll be in great shape once we get caught up in tech, and with our income now, our best show maybe not to go for the GL but start buying techs towards banking and getting us into the next age. The other civs will be into the industrial ages very soon, and we're just breaking the middle ages.
Save
I can still give an overview.
Basically, I took the Japaneese city, got peace and monotheism (I grabbed this because we'll be done with feudalism in 20) for 13 gpt and 200ish gold. I changed us to republic (no idea why we wasn't) and was sending our military units towards the Mongols next. Our income is around 60 gpt.
From where we stand now, China is a far fetched idea in grabbing the GL. Slingshotting our troops in there would result in whatever we had destroyed on the process of getting there. There is like 3 to four rings of cities to go through before we even get there. Once we finish the Mongols, we should have feudalism by then and thus, use our MDI against muskets. We're going to want to get a second core ring going too or else we're going to stand little to no chance in this game.
There was also a lot of minor mistakes we made that I had noticed on our my turns. For one, growth is power once you're out of despotism. We should have had irrigation near everywhere to get our max pop and then to focus on production. I had moved workers to dry spots, please stop mining areas that are dry and do not mine a hill unless we have a good food production in the city. People = Power.
The Japaneese city I took should probably make a harbor (not sure if I had a galley or a harbor) because it would open up trade for every civ, if I recall. Across from that city is a Korean one with incense, if we manage to take that city and the Mongols, we will have 7 luxuuries; I think we just need 6 to pretty much stay in war continously throughout the rest of the game. I think we'll be in great shape once we get caught up in tech, and with our income now, our best show maybe not to go for the GL but start buying techs towards banking and getting us into the next age. The other civs will be into the industrial ages very soon, and we're just breaking the middle ages.
Save
amirsan
King of all Kings
Wow! 60gpt! Thats alot from the 20gpt that was on my turn! I didnt know that taking one city from the Japs will give us a a tech and gpt! Wow! Great Turns Belail
amirsan
King of all Kings
Here's the Roster, CF should be able to take the save today right?
Were playing pretty smoothly, the most of the SG games I played. Good Job!
Roster:
amirsan-
Takeo-
Belial- JUST PLAYED!
ControlFreak- YOUR UP!
Tsukemono5- ON DECK!
Were playing pretty smoothly, the most of the SG games I played. Good Job!
Roster:
amirsan-
Takeo-
Belial- JUST PLAYED!
ControlFreak- YOUR UP!
Tsukemono5- ON DECK!
ControlFreak
Not An Addict, Really
got it but might not post until Wednesday.
ControlFreak
Not An Addict, Really
OK, I opened the save during lunch.
Initial comments/questions:
We have 8 workers and 7 slaves. We really need to be building more workers.
We're building almost all infrastructure except dehli which is buiding horsemen with 14spt (wasting 12s every third turn).
We can't even see our color on the culture histogram.
All our military is on the border with the Mongols. I am unsure what the goal of that war is. Resources: they have Dyes in a town that is surrounded by Chinese towns and would be a big flip risk. Elimination: I doubt we have the strength to push all the way to the north to eliminate them. Tech: They are behind US in tech. Gold: They have no gold. As I see it, our best chance is to grab the dye town, rush some culture there and settle for peace. Belial, what was your plan?
I figured out why we were able to extract so much out of Japan. They are at war with Persia and the Zulu. Peace is always more expensive if you have others fighting you too. We got in and got out at a good time.
I would imagine that we could get a decent cost reduction by joining in a MA with one of these three civs. They all have techs to give. The drawback would be that we would have to stay at war with someone for 20 turns. I'm not sure we can last that long. For that, Japan would be the best to side against. They are the farthest away and need to go through Babylon or Zululand to get to us anyway. Plus we could get 1 tech from Babylon and 1 from Zululand for the same 20turn commitment. The problem is that we still have a peace treaty with Japan. Taking tech for peace means if we break this pact, our rep is trashed. If I wait until peace is over, I am sure Japan will have settled for peace with them and our opportunity is lost.
Another alternative would be to side with Japan against the Zulu or Babylon. Since we've been talking about attacking Babylon anyway, this would be my choice. The problem is that all our troops are up north.
Note Babylon either has had or currently has a GA since they are at war and their UU is readily available for fighting. Another note, Babylon has knights.
The counter attack will come quickly. A third note (see above comment about culture), Babylon is the world leader in culture. We would need to raze and replace their towns. This means we need to start our settler factory again or, preferably, build a granary instead of aquaduct in Bombay and build settlers/workers there.
We are still behind in infrastucture and our FP is not built. We need to do one or the other.
Here's my plan. Take Mongol dye city and settle for peace. Rush culture building to claim all of our 21 tiles if possible. Then move most of our troops to a barrack city on the east pennisula and wait (build infrastructure first, horses second, 2 galleys and 4 pikes) until we can get chivalry. Upgrade to elephants. Send two boats full of pikes to the choke point and cutoff the 4-5 Babylonian cities on our pennisula. Raze and replace all of them. Then settle for peace. If Japan is still at war with them at the start of this, I'll MA with them for a discount on another tech. Hopefully we can get another tech for peace from Babylon.
Let me know what you guys think this afternoon. I'll play after I here from everyone. (Might push posting back a day.)
Initial comments/questions:
We have 8 workers and 7 slaves. We really need to be building more workers.
We're building almost all infrastructure except dehli which is buiding horsemen with 14spt (wasting 12s every third turn).
We can't even see our color on the culture histogram.
All our military is on the border with the Mongols. I am unsure what the goal of that war is. Resources: they have Dyes in a town that is surrounded by Chinese towns and would be a big flip risk. Elimination: I doubt we have the strength to push all the way to the north to eliminate them. Tech: They are behind US in tech. Gold: They have no gold. As I see it, our best chance is to grab the dye town, rush some culture there and settle for peace. Belial, what was your plan?
I figured out why we were able to extract so much out of Japan. They are at war with Persia and the Zulu. Peace is always more expensive if you have others fighting you too. We got in and got out at a good time.
I would imagine that we could get a decent cost reduction by joining in a MA with one of these three civs. They all have techs to give. The drawback would be that we would have to stay at war with someone for 20 turns. I'm not sure we can last that long. For that, Japan would be the best to side against. They are the farthest away and need to go through Babylon or Zululand to get to us anyway. Plus we could get 1 tech from Babylon and 1 from Zululand for the same 20turn commitment. The problem is that we still have a peace treaty with Japan. Taking tech for peace means if we break this pact, our rep is trashed. If I wait until peace is over, I am sure Japan will have settled for peace with them and our opportunity is lost.
Another alternative would be to side with Japan against the Zulu or Babylon. Since we've been talking about attacking Babylon anyway, this would be my choice. The problem is that all our troops are up north.
Note Babylon either has had or currently has a GA since they are at war and their UU is readily available for fighting. Another note, Babylon has knights.
The counter attack will come quickly. A third note (see above comment about culture), Babylon is the world leader in culture. We would need to raze and replace their towns. This means we need to start our settler factory again or, preferably, build a granary instead of aquaduct in Bombay and build settlers/workers there.We are still behind in infrastucture and our FP is not built. We need to do one or the other.
Here's my plan. Take Mongol dye city and settle for peace. Rush culture building to claim all of our 21 tiles if possible. Then move most of our troops to a barrack city on the east pennisula and wait (build infrastructure first, horses second, 2 galleys and 4 pikes) until we can get chivalry. Upgrade to elephants. Send two boats full of pikes to the choke point and cutoff the 4-5 Babylonian cities on our pennisula. Raze and replace all of them. Then settle for peace. If Japan is still at war with them at the start of this, I'll MA with them for a discount on another tech. Hopefully we can get another tech for peace from Babylon.
Let me know what you guys think this afternoon. I'll play after I here from everyone. (Might push posting back a day.)
Belial
Warlord
What I was planning on doing, was taking all of the Mongol cities as they have not one, but two luxuries and right after them, while our our troops were there, was to hit the Chineese southern half, so we could have a shot at taking their GL provided we wanted to go that way. In my earlier report (before the forum ate it) I was hard pressed into who I wanted to war. I actually wanted to war the Mongols and get them done on my turn, but I just didn't want two fronts with the Japaneese as I invaded the Mongols. I also noticed the lack of workers, but I also pushed for econ first and then hit our infrastructure (which is why the city NE of Delhi (forgot names) has a marketplace going, when that's done, it should continually pump out workers until our infrastructure is complete, or at least descent enough to start pumping out units non-stop.
We need to decide who is more imporant, if we hit the Babs, we may not get caught up with tech, it's possible we get a second ring, but I fear if we wait any longer, we're going to have cavs heading our way and that's pretty much our end. In my opinion, our best spot is to take the Mongols, and then cutoff their southern half, regain peace, rebuild, and then hit their capital, putting us back in tech.
This should also get us our GA and we'll have to pump out banks in our core cities (again, while I was building marketplaces). Yes, those cities the Mongols have will be under culture pressure, however, I wanted to relieve them of that, which is why I was heading there.
If we do take the Babs instead, which is fine by me, then we absolutely have to get a FP down there or we're going to be to far behind to catch up.
Muskets are out, and when I checked the Chineese, they only had two in their capital, with two SPEARMEN, if someone wants to check, I think the only iron they may have, is the city they have right next to us.
We need to decide who is more imporant, if we hit the Babs, we may not get caught up with tech, it's possible we get a second ring, but I fear if we wait any longer, we're going to have cavs heading our way and that's pretty much our end. In my opinion, our best spot is to take the Mongols, and then cutoff their southern half, regain peace, rebuild, and then hit their capital, putting us back in tech.
This should also get us our GA and we'll have to pump out banks in our core cities (again, while I was building marketplaces). Yes, those cities the Mongols have will be under culture pressure, however, I wanted to relieve them of that, which is why I was heading there.
If we do take the Babs instead, which is fine by me, then we absolutely have to get a FP down there or we're going to be to far behind to catch up.
Muskets are out, and when I checked the Chineese, they only had two in their capital, with two SPEARMEN, if someone wants to check, I think the only iron they may have, is the city they have right next to us.
ControlFreak
Not An Addict, Really
OH!
I thought your post said we can't attack China
The second Mongol Luxury must be way up north and we don't have the worker turns to get it connected. Plus, if Ottomans ever declare war, our trade route is broken and all the market cities lose 3 happy people.
I like your idea of hitting China but it would be an unfair fight with Horsemen against riders. We wouldn't even make it two turns in to Chinese territory. Am I being to timid thinking we at least need Chivalry to fight anyone but the Mongols?
I'm still thinking to hit Mongols now. If the first cities go easily, I may finish them off just to reduce the cost of techs. (we'll be buying at last civ rather than second to last civ prices.)
But I think we have much more Holdable land to get from Babylon than from China. I still think getting the GL with Cavs will gain us more than trying for it now or even with elephants. Remember that no matter how large the AI is, it will only bring its attacks in small waves. If we have a pointed attack with the sole purpose of getting the GL we can still succeed. I know it sound like a long wait to get banking etc but I think its our best option. I wish we had gotten engineering instead of Monotheism from Japan.
I thought your post said we can't attack China
The second Mongol Luxury must be way up north and we don't have the worker turns to get it connected. Plus, if Ottomans ever declare war, our trade route is broken and all the market cities lose 3 happy people.
I like your idea of hitting China but it would be an unfair fight with Horsemen against riders. We wouldn't even make it two turns in to Chinese territory. Am I being to timid thinking we at least need Chivalry to fight anyone but the Mongols?
I'm still thinking to hit Mongols now. If the first cities go easily, I may finish them off just to reduce the cost of techs. (we'll be buying at last civ rather than second to last civ prices.)
But I think we have much more Holdable land to get from Babylon than from China. I still think getting the GL with Cavs will gain us more than trying for it now or even with elephants. Remember that no matter how large the AI is, it will only bring its attacks in small waves. If we have a pointed attack with the sole purpose of getting the GL we can still succeed. I know it sound like a long wait to get banking etc but I think its our best option. I wish we had gotten engineering instead of Monotheism from Japan.
Belial
Warlord
You are being to timid
First, let's check their iron supply, as I said, I think their only iron is right next to us which would be a huge plus if we took that.
Once we get feudalism, we'll have MDI against Muskets, which isn't near so bad provided we have them in numbers (upgrade our warriors for this case). I'm only suggesting we hit the southern half that way we have a much greater chance at taking the GL. Yes, we could send a huge SOD they're and still succeed in taking the city, however, it is possible we lose every unit in the process leaving us wide (which is an understatement) open to any other civ who declared on us, not to mention that China is friendly with everyone (we don't know how their tech is to get other people to declare on us).
Riders are good, yes, but can still be killed, just have to outsmart teh AI, which isn't to hard.
It would be great to set off our GA with the banking tech, once we got that, we'd be set and rolling. Just my opinion, don't outrule the Babs, but if we go for them, we're going to have to get that FP over their with marketplaces and continually war them.
First, let's check their iron supply, as I said, I think their only iron is right next to us which would be a huge plus if we took that.
Once we get feudalism, we'll have MDI against Muskets, which isn't near so bad provided we have them in numbers (upgrade our warriors for this case). I'm only suggesting we hit the southern half that way we have a much greater chance at taking the GL. Yes, we could send a huge SOD they're and still succeed in taking the city, however, it is possible we lose every unit in the process leaving us wide (which is an understatement) open to any other civ who declared on us, not to mention that China is friendly with everyone (we don't know how their tech is to get other people to declare on us).
Riders are good, yes, but can still be killed, just have to outsmart teh AI, which isn't to hard.
It would be great to set off our GA with the banking tech, once we got that, we'd be set and rolling. Just my opinion, don't outrule the Babs, but if we go for them, we're going to have to get that FP over their with marketplaces and continually war them.
amirsan
King of all Kings
Wow! You guys where thinking, too bad I wasnt here . I agree all the way from the beggining, to attack China. I'm up for it .
. I agree all the way from the beggining, to attack China. I'm up for it .
ControlFreak
Not An Addict, Really
Belial,
The FP will not prevent flipping. Infact, some members have posted that their FP city flipped. Building the FP over there without a leader will take time that we don't have.
We can build the FP in the town N of delhi (the one you mentioned thats almost done with market) if I switch it right now (giving up the market) it will take 16 turns.
In the near term that will only help us a little. But hear me out:
After taking Mongol dye city, shift offensive toward the Babylon side. With 3 galleys, plant a settler, and 5 pikes on the choke point between us and Babylon. Rush a wall and then a barrack. Watch the entire Babylon army suicide on our little holdout. Meanwhile, we raze and replace the four cities on our eastern pennisula. This will increase the number of cities and land by 25% BEFORE our GA. Then upgrade to elephants, shift back over to China and go straight for the GL (with a special ops force taking out the two three cities near our borders and hopefully their only iron source). We get our GA and a ton of techs and settle for a big peace settlement. Then use the GA to improve the new cities on the pennisula and build banks etc in our core. Once one of the new cities is big enough, we can disband delhi letting the FP cover the main continent and jump the palace towards Babylon to help prevent flipping.
Hows that?
The FP will not prevent flipping. Infact, some members have posted that their FP city flipped.
Building the FP over there without a leader will take time that we don't have.We can build the FP in the town N of delhi (the one you mentioned thats almost done with market) if I switch it right now (giving up the market) it will take 16 turns.
In the near term that will only help us a little. But hear me out:
After taking Mongol dye city, shift offensive toward the Babylon side. With 3 galleys, plant a settler, and 5 pikes on the choke point between us and Babylon. Rush a wall and then a barrack. Watch the entire Babylon army suicide on our little holdout. Meanwhile, we raze and replace the four cities on our eastern pennisula. This will increase the number of cities and land by 25% BEFORE our GA. Then upgrade to elephants, shift back over to China and go straight for the GL (with a special ops force taking out the two three cities near our borders and hopefully their only iron source). We get our GA and a ton of techs and settle for a big peace settlement. Then use the GA to improve the new cities on the pennisula and build banks etc in our core. Once one of the new cities is big enough, we can disband delhi letting the FP cover the main continent and jump the palace towards Babylon to help prevent flipping.
Hows that?
Belial
Warlord
That's a first I've heard on the FP flipping (I wouldn't doubt it though). However, Babylons are biggest in the game and they are the only civ that did (and the Zulus) like us. They were happy with us when I declared on Japan and I think they dropped down to cautious when I ended it.
I'm all for taking those Babylon cities, but I'd also insist on grabbing the one luxury the Mongols have and at some point, grabbing that other the Mongols have.
Having 7 luxuries is a huge, huge bonus but keeping them may proove also to be pretty difficult.
I agree with razing all those cities and rebuidling, we could space it better. Also, don't forget we don't have pikes to stick in the mountains yet, we don't have feuadilsm (we could probably set sci to max and get it in a few turns). I like the idea of having a starting core and then triggering the GA to get started, that would probably be most efficient way of getting things done.
Either way, it's going to be a lot of fun for me and knocking heads togethor. Let's see what the other guys have to say too.
I'm all for taking those Babylon cities, but I'd also insist on grabbing the one luxury the Mongols have and at some point, grabbing that other the Mongols have.
Having 7 luxuries is a huge, huge bonus but keeping them may proove also to be pretty difficult.
I agree with razing all those cities and rebuidling, we could space it better. Also, don't forget we don't have pikes to stick in the mountains yet, we don't have feuadilsm (we could probably set sci to max and get it in a few turns). I like the idea of having a starting core and then triggering the GA to get started, that would probably be most efficient way of getting things done.
Either way, it's going to be a lot of fun for me and knocking heads togethor. Let's see what the other guys have to say too.
i agree with going for the mongol dyes and then peace. if we wait till chivilry to attack babylon, then all the AIs may have nationalism and/or military traditiion. if they all have one or both of those, then we are probably dead. the only thing i can think of is attacking babs and taking those few cities to the east and making a quick peace. would be helpful if we knew they were at war with someone.
i've heard of different people building their fp right next to their capital, then jumping the palace to conquered territory. the palace prevents flips.
i've heard of different people building their fp right next to their capital, then jumping the palace to conquered territory. the palace prevents flips.
ControlFreak
Not An Addict, Really
Originally posted by Belial
I'm all for taking those Babylon cities, but I'd also insist on grabbing the one luxury the Mongols have and at some point, grabbing that other the Mongols have. Yes
Having 7 luxuries is a huge, huge bonus but keeping them may proove also to be pretty difficult.
I agree with razing all those cities and rebuidling, we could space it better. Yes
Also, don't forget we don't have pikes to stick in the mountains yet, we don't have feuadilsm (we could probably set sci to max and get it in a few turns). Upgrade is only 10 or 20g, we should have feudalism soon.
I like the idea of having a starting core and then triggering the GA to get started, that would probably be most efficient way of getting things done. Yes
Either way, it's going to be a lot of fun for me and knocking heads togethor. Let's see what the other guys have to say too. Yes
Still waiting for some teammates but it looks like at least three of us are ready to grab the dyes from Mongols so I'll start on that path.
amirsan
King of all Kings
I agree wit attacking Mongolia jus as long we attack China, I realy dont care about Babylon, but if it is possible to attack then I'm up for that too.
amirsan
King of all Kings
OK, Tsukemono5, its been two days already, u got till next morning (at least morning for me) to post that you got it or your skipped for this turn. 
Gotta keep tha game going u know.
Gotta keep tha game going u know.
ControlFreak
Not An Addict, Really
Umm... its not Tsuke's fault. I'm the one who's got it and I told you it would be wednesday before I posted.
Here's my turnlog:
Preturn comments:
Our culture is SAD. Even if we take Mongol cities, we can't expect to keep them. Their all flip risks to China or the Ottomans, being much closer to them than us. Mongols have no techs or gold. What is the goal in fighting them? As discussed, I'll take the nearer luxury and settle for peace.
China has two sources of iron, on in Chendu and the other down by us. If I take the Mongol town, we'll be right next to chendu.
Babylon has NO NATIVE IRON. They're buying it from Korea. The best I can tell, their trade route goes harbor to harbor either through Japan or through us. That means, if we declare on them at the same time that Japan is at war, we break their supply of iron and probably their rep.
I want to attack them as soon as possible. Hoping Japan will stay at war with them long enough for us to prepare.
We have 8 workers and 7 slaves. Need more workers! Could use a settler or two also.
We're building horsemen in delhi with 14spt. That wastes 12spt every other turn!
Most of our empire is building infrastructure, we need to pick buildup or infrastructure, not do both. Preferably, build first so the unit costs don't kill us.
Buy WM from Mongols for 36g. The Korean harbor is not connected to anything so Fukishima's harbor is worthless at this point. I let it continue on its galley because Babylon has one floating on the inner sea.
Switch Bombay to granary from aquaduct. We'll build settler/workers from here. Wake the worker half done lumber jacking to go irrigate the grassland. We need 1 more food to make 5fpt. Same for Karachi.
Rush Courthouse in Bangalore so we can start a barracks in preparation for the defense. We'll make the 164g back quickly as this town is wasting a lot of gold to corruption.
Switch Kholapur to barracks from temple as there is no pressure and the added tiles will gain us nothing.
Switch Calcutta from market to FP. Wake workers chopping forest that won't help FP and start roading forest instead.
Chittagong will starve next turn if I hire a specialist (should have whipped temple before we rioted, now we're sunk.). I switch the doomed temple to a worker wasting 7 shields and leave it unhappy. I hope the worker completes.
Lux up to 10% for three core cities. Fukishima is our lone scientist as it will starve if it grows. Horses in Fukishima moved towards Jaipur (leaving 1 for defense.)
My head is spinning so I just hit enter.
(1) 360AD
Dehli, Madras, Lahore build horse. Undecided as to build yet. Chittagong goes to civil disorder but builds its worker and is happy. Order walls, once the Mongol's Ulaanbaatar is taken, we wont have cultural pressure here. Bangalore court>barracks.
Some major tile swapping leaves Delhi building horse at 15spt, Lahore building spear at 7spt, Madras building worker at 10spt. Bengal's market suffers along at 3spt. It would cost 204 to rush now so I wait a bit. It really shouldn't have gotten this far on the market without at least 1 worker to improve its sheild count.
Switching to anything shorter will waste too many shields. Change my mind about the Kohlapur barracks. We have a lot and its not in a great spot for a barracks so I switch to ...catapult. Some may say this is weed but I think we should build more. We're going to be facing a lot of better units than us and I want to get a free shot at them.
Warriors woken and sent to Karachi. Horsemen shift to Shantung area since we can attack Ulaanbaatar on the first turn of war from there. Hyderabad spear takes to the mountain.
Embassy with Japan. Samurai due in 3 at 13spt. They have 4 samurai, 2 musket and a catapult garrison. With a market, collesium, cathedral and oracle they still have 2 entertainers. They have 1 iron, 1 salt, 3 horses and 5 lux. Making 55gpt in the capital. Running 70 tax, 20 sci, 10 lux. Also have Great Wall, barracks and University. After buying Mongols WM for 1g + WM, we sell WM around for 13g.
BT Japan wants MA against Zulu for Right of Passage. They would give us Feudalism for MA against either Zulu or Babs and 19gpt. No thanks. Not yet.
Mongols archer steps out of the forest.
(2) 370AD
Madras worker>spear (7spt).
Karachi granary>worker(7spt no MM possible)
Chitagong finally restored.
Babs building Newtons That does it. We're going after the GL. But the plan is to take china in two short wars. The first will be to take their two iron supplies. The second will be to go for the GL.
Shuffling troops. Obviously I'm undecided in my attack plan. A few misclicks including a join move with horses and workers put me farther away than Belial left me from attacking.
Moving some horses toward Yangchow indicates its only guarded with a spear.
BT Lots of future chinese slaves move near Bangalore.
(3) 380AD
Delhi horse>horse.
Bombay granary>worker.
Taking the opportunity with the archer in the open I declare against Mongols.
Elite archer kills veteran fortified archer losing 2HP.
Horse stack moves into forest next to a mining Mongol. What I thought was a roaded grassland turned out to be forest so they're stuck there. Can't capture slave and cant protect archer.
BT veteran archer kills our archer losing 2HP.
(4) 390AD
Lahore spear>spear (they'll promote soon)
Karachi worker>worker.
Palace expansion offered.
Horses attack Ulaanbaatar.
Us Health Them Health
Horse dead Spear 2/4
Horse 2/4 Spear dead
Horse 2/4 Spear dead
Horse dead Spear 1/3
Horse 1/4 Spear dead
Horse 1/4ret Spear 2/3
Horse 4/4 2/4Spear dead
Horse 4/4 1/3Spear dead
Ulaambaatar is ours plus 1 worker. No resistors. Hire a scientist and taxguy to starve to 1. Order Temple.
Archer kills their 2/4 archer losing 1HP.
OK. Thats as far as I'm going. I'll heal. Plan is to buy to Chivalry if possible and then hit Chendu as hard as possible. hitting southern Chinese towns with Midevil infantry.
MM Madras gives sheild tiles back to Ankara and Bengal to speed harbor(3) and market(7), spear in 1. Lahore spear in 4.
I don't know why I never noticed this but China has NO HORSES connected. That make me REALLY angry that they have the 1-tile island with the horse. With astronomy, we can't block their harbor. But now is the time to attack. Or at least after our horses heal.
Feudalism costs 26gpt outright. 18 from Japan if we MA against Zulu. 11 from Zulu if we MA against Japan (and ruin our rep, no thank you.)
Interestingly, China will give us Engineering for horses. I investigate New Beijing for 24g. They are building a Library at 1spt, due in 29. Then a harbor will be at least 40 turns away. So we could potentially get 3 tech discounts from them for horses. But we would be giving them riders and abandoning all hopes of the GL. Note also that the Mongols currently have 2 horses. They have no trade route to China yet but are 1 tile away from such a route. We need to take Ta-Tu to prevent them from trading horses to China. Hey look at that, yet again, I'm 2 turns late realizing Belial's plan was pure genious. Having already sent some Horses towards Chendu, I can only send 5 horses towards Ta-Tu this turn. More will follow.
BT Mao kicks us out. Back to our side. I was hoping he would kick us towards the Mongols. Guess I need a right of passage? But that would but China off the list for 20 turns.
(5) 400AD
Delhi horse>horse.
Bombay worker>worker.
Madras Spear>spear(7spt).
Kolhapur cat>cat.
Chinese start Newtons. Their borders expand near their iron in the south.
Wounded fortify.
I try one more crossing attempt without ROP. SOD(5) ends next to lone Mongol Archer. Note that they have ROP with China.
Move eastern Horses towards Ottomans little town. Trading maps indicates China now has a harbor so I decide to trade the horses for what I can get. Horses+21gpt gets Engineering and Feudalism. I decide to skip the ROP for now, hoping I'll get moved closer to Mongols. Chivalry is buyable but we wouldn't be able to upgrade much.
BT Mongol archers retreat one horse and Promote a second to Elite. THEN Mao kicks us back home. At least the retreater was out of danger.
Ottoman worker finally finishes the road across our mountains by Bangalore. Lots of Chinese units move to our border, including workers so I hope they're just trying to improve things.
(6) 410AD
Karachi worker>worker.
Since I was accused of being timid I devise a daring (possibly) plan. Since we can get a lot for the horses and we need a ROP with China anyway I plan to have some 20turn deals with them. So why not a MW if I can afford it. But I don't want them to over run the poor Mongols so I need another person to be at war with. We can gain the Ottoman city, Ottomans are far away. Plus this half of the continent is not at war like the other half. I think a good war will slow these tech racers down.
I ask Ottomans to leave. He says...he will. So I declare war.
I ask Mao for ROP, he charges 2gpt.
I send a horse to kill the archer that attacked us, losing 1HP.
Horses near Mugla join on the Mountain to attack next turn.
Ulaanbaatar temple is rushed for 112g.
Sign Mao to a MA against Ottomans for 27gpt. Basically, I want them to throw all their units at each other. In twenty turns, we should be ready to grab the iron cities from China. Mao is now gracious.
Switch all pike builds to horses.
BT Ottoman longbow attacks horse on mountain and dies!
Mongol archer kills a horse. China moves archers towards Bombay.
(7) 420AD
Delhi horse>horse.
Bombay worker>worker set to build in 4, grow in 2 so we can get back to size 6 before cranking workers every 2 turns.
Ulaanbaatar temple>barracks.
Ankara harbor>temple.
Hyderabad temple>catapult.
attack Mugla:
Horse dead, spear 4/4
Horse retreat, spear 1/4
Horse 3/4, spear dead
Horse promotes 3/5, spear(1/4) dead.
Mugla is ours +1g. Order temple. 1 citizen, hes resisting.
Move elite out of city, 1/4horse into city. All others fortify.
Jaipur barracks rushed for 20g.
Kill 2 Mongol archers leaving our horses 1/4 and 3/4.
Not knowing the ages very well, I know for sure that Babylon and China are in the industrial age but am unsure about the others.
Japan is starting to slip, Babylon has taken Osaka which was a source of iron. Babylon is still trading for thier iron AFAIK.
BT Mongol Horseman kills one of our horses on the treacherous chinese roads.
More Chinese movement.
(8) 430AD
Karachi worker>worker.
Jaipur barracks>horse.
Koreans complete smiths. Babs start Newtons (cascade?)
Horse dies trying to kill Mongol counterpart. Second horse finishes the job.
Mongols offer 2 workers for peace but I want their horses.
Babylon demand TM and 62g. Bastard. I cave.
(9) 440AD
Dehli horse>horse.
Kill archer without a scratch.
BT Archer kills our horse. These trades are killing me. I vow not to attack another archer in the jungle at the end of a road.
(10) 450AD
Bombay worker>settler.
Madras horse>horse.
Lahore horse>horse.
Karachi worker>market.
Horses move to Mongol Capital, can attack next turn.
All builds are vetoable. We could really use markets and the like but we are at war so try to keep building war like things.
FP is due in 6. We don't have a second core to jump the palace to so lets keep it here for now. In the long run, jumping up to the Monogol capitol might be good. That is if we can claim some chinese cities and if the jungle is cleared and land improved. Other possiblity is to our eastern pennisula. Once at war with Babylon, use a settler to plant a city on the river between all the other cities. Then get it to max pop as fast as possible. Note that we will need tons of workers to pull that off.
I've been storing units in Karachi for use in upgrade/attacking Chinese supplyline. Next player get these ready so when our MA runs out we can catch them off guard. Note that we have some sentinels on the hills IN CHINESE territory so make sure they get removed before war is declared.
Don't go to war with Japan as we still have a peace treaty with them and if our rep is ruined we can forget about a comeback.
I'm sure that China has Gunpowder as they are in the next age already. But it looks as if they may not have any saltpeter. Their land is not high odds for Salt and they have not upgraded their pikemen yet. Cross your fingers, elephants versus pikes is much more fun than against muskets.
I think we've already lost the game but willing to stick it out. Try to have fun.
Here's my turnlog:
Preturn comments:
Our culture is SAD. Even if we take Mongol cities, we can't expect to keep them. Their all flip risks to China or the Ottomans, being much closer to them than us. Mongols have no techs or gold. What is the goal in fighting them? As discussed, I'll take the nearer luxury and settle for peace.
China has two sources of iron, on in Chendu and the other down by us. If I take the Mongol town, we'll be right next to chendu.
Babylon has NO NATIVE IRON. They're buying it from Korea. The best I can tell, their trade route goes harbor to harbor either through Japan or through us. That means, if we declare on them at the same time that Japan is at war, we break their supply of iron and probably their rep.
I want to attack them as soon as possible. Hoping Japan will stay at war with them long enough for us to prepare.We have 8 workers and 7 slaves. Need more workers! Could use a settler or two also.
We're building horsemen in delhi with 14spt. That wastes 12spt every other turn!
Most of our empire is building infrastructure, we need to pick buildup or infrastructure, not do both. Preferably, build first so the unit costs don't kill us.
Buy WM from Mongols for 36g. The Korean harbor is not connected to anything so Fukishima's harbor is worthless at this point. I let it continue on its galley because Babylon has one floating on the inner sea.
Switch Bombay to granary from aquaduct. We'll build settler/workers from here. Wake the worker half done lumber jacking to go irrigate the grassland. We need 1 more food to make 5fpt. Same for Karachi.
Rush Courthouse in Bangalore so we can start a barracks in preparation for the defense. We'll make the 164g back quickly as this town is wasting a lot of gold to corruption.
Switch Kholapur to barracks from temple as there is no pressure and the added tiles will gain us nothing.
Switch Calcutta from market to FP. Wake workers chopping forest that won't help FP and start roading forest instead.
Chittagong will starve next turn if I hire a specialist (should have whipped temple before we rioted, now we're sunk.). I switch the doomed temple to a worker wasting 7 shields and leave it unhappy. I hope the worker completes.
Lux up to 10% for three core cities. Fukishima is our lone scientist as it will starve if it grows. Horses in Fukishima moved towards Jaipur (leaving 1 for defense.)
My head is spinning so I just hit enter.
(1) 360AD
Dehli, Madras, Lahore build horse. Undecided as to build yet. Chittagong goes to civil disorder but builds its worker and is happy. Order walls, once the Mongol's Ulaanbaatar is taken, we wont have cultural pressure here. Bangalore court>barracks.
Some major tile swapping leaves Delhi building horse at 15spt, Lahore building spear at 7spt, Madras building worker at 10spt. Bengal's market suffers along at 3spt. It would cost 204 to rush now so I wait a bit. It really shouldn't have gotten this far on the market without at least 1 worker to improve its sheild count.
Switching to anything shorter will waste too many shields. Change my mind about the Kohlapur barracks. We have a lot and its not in a great spot for a barracks so I switch to ...catapult. Some may say this is weed but I think we should build more. We're going to be facing a lot of better units than us and I want to get a free shot at them.Warriors woken and sent to Karachi. Horsemen shift to Shantung area since we can attack Ulaanbaatar on the first turn of war from there. Hyderabad spear takes to the mountain.
Embassy with Japan. Samurai due in 3 at 13spt. They have 4 samurai, 2 musket
and a catapult garrison. With a market, collesium, cathedral and oracle they still have 2 entertainers. They have 1 iron, 1 salt, 3 horses and 5 lux. Making 55gpt in the capital. Running 70 tax, 20 sci, 10 lux. Also have Great Wall, barracks and University. After buying Mongols WM for 1g + WM, we sell WM around for 13g.BT Japan wants MA against Zulu for Right of Passage. They would give us Feudalism for MA against either Zulu or Babs and 19gpt. No thanks. Not yet.
Mongols archer steps out of the forest.
(2) 370AD
Madras worker>spear (7spt).
Karachi granary>worker(7spt no MM possible)
Chitagong finally restored.
Babs building Newtons
That does it. We're going after the GL. But the plan is to take china in two short wars. The first will be to take their two iron supplies. The second will be to go for the GL.Shuffling troops. Obviously I'm undecided in my attack plan. A few misclicks including a join move with horses and workers put me farther away than Belial left me from attacking.
Moving some horses toward Yangchow indicates its only guarded with a spear.
BT Lots of future chinese slaves move near Bangalore.
(3) 380AD
Delhi horse>horse.
Bombay granary>worker.
Taking the opportunity with the archer in the open I declare against Mongols.
Elite archer kills veteran fortified archer losing 2HP.
Horse stack moves into forest next to a mining Mongol. What I thought was a roaded grassland turned out to be forest so they're stuck there. Can't capture slave and cant protect archer.
BT veteran archer kills our archer losing 2HP.
(4) 390AD
Lahore spear>spear (they'll promote soon)
Karachi worker>worker.
Palace expansion offered.
Horses attack Ulaanbaatar.
Us Health Them Health
Horse dead Spear 2/4
Horse 2/4 Spear dead
Horse 2/4 Spear dead
Horse dead Spear 1/3
Horse 1/4 Spear dead
Horse 1/4ret Spear 2/3
Horse 4/4 2/4Spear dead
Horse 4/4 1/3Spear dead
Ulaambaatar is ours plus 1 worker. No resistors. Hire a scientist and taxguy to starve to 1. Order Temple.
Archer kills their 2/4 archer losing 1HP.
OK. Thats as far as I'm going. I'll heal. Plan is to buy to Chivalry if possible and then hit Chendu as hard as possible. hitting southern Chinese towns with Midevil infantry.
MM Madras gives sheild tiles back to Ankara and Bengal to speed harbor(3) and market(7), spear in 1. Lahore spear in 4.
I don't know why I never noticed this but China has NO HORSES connected. That make me REALLY angry that they have the 1-tile island with the horse. With astronomy, we can't block their harbor. But now is the time to attack. Or at least after our horses heal.
Feudalism costs 26gpt outright. 18 from Japan if we MA against Zulu. 11 from Zulu if we MA against Japan (and ruin our rep, no thank you.)
Interestingly, China will give us Engineering for horses. I investigate New Beijing for 24g. They are building a Library at 1spt, due in 29. Then a harbor will be at least 40 turns away. So we could potentially get 3 tech discounts from them for horses. But we would be giving them riders and abandoning all hopes of the GL. Note also that the Mongols currently have 2 horses. They have no trade route to China yet but are 1 tile away from such a route. We need to take Ta-Tu to prevent them from trading horses to China. Hey look at that, yet again, I'm 2 turns late realizing Belial's plan was pure genious. Having already sent some Horses towards Chendu, I can only send 5 horses towards Ta-Tu this turn. More will follow.
BT Mao kicks us out. Back to our side. I was hoping he would kick us towards the Mongols. Guess I need a right of passage? But that would but China off the list for 20 turns.
(5) 400AD
Delhi horse>horse.
Bombay worker>worker.
Madras Spear>spear(7spt).
Kolhapur cat>cat.
Chinese start Newtons. Their borders expand near their iron in the south.
Wounded fortify.
I try one more crossing attempt without ROP. SOD(5) ends next to lone Mongol Archer. Note that they have ROP with China.
Move eastern Horses towards Ottomans little town. Trading maps indicates China now has a harbor so I decide to trade the horses for what I can get. Horses+21gpt gets Engineering and Feudalism. I decide to skip the ROP for now, hoping I'll get moved closer to Mongols. Chivalry is buyable but we wouldn't be able to upgrade much.
BT Mongol archers retreat one horse and Promote a second to Elite. THEN Mao kicks us back home. At least the retreater was out of danger.
Ottoman worker finally finishes the road across our mountains by Bangalore. Lots of Chinese units move to our border, including workers so I hope they're just trying to improve things.
(6) 410AD
Karachi worker>worker.
Since I was accused of being timid I devise a daring (possibly
) plan. Since we can get a lot for the horses and we need a ROP with China anyway I plan to have some 20turn deals with them. So why not a MW if I can afford it. But I don't want them to over run the poor Mongols so I need another person to be at war with. We can gain the Ottoman city, Ottomans are far away. Plus this half of the continent is not at war like the other half. I think a good war will slow these tech racers down.I ask Ottomans to leave. He says...he will.
So I declare war.I ask Mao for ROP, he charges 2gpt.
I send a horse to kill the archer that attacked us, losing 1HP.
Horses near Mugla join on the Mountain to attack next turn.
Ulaanbaatar temple is rushed for 112g.
Sign Mao to a MA against Ottomans for 27gpt. Basically, I want them to throw all their units at each other. In twenty turns, we should be ready to grab the iron cities from China. Mao is now gracious.
Switch all pike builds to horses.
BT Ottoman longbow attacks horse on mountain and dies!
Mongol archer kills a horse. China moves archers towards Bombay.
(7) 420AD
Delhi horse>horse.
Bombay worker>worker set to build in 4, grow in 2 so we can get back to size 6 before cranking workers every 2 turns.
Ulaanbaatar temple>barracks.
Ankara harbor>temple.
Hyderabad temple>catapult.
attack Mugla:
Horse dead, spear 4/4
Horse retreat, spear 1/4
Horse 3/4, spear dead
Horse promotes 3/5, spear(1/4) dead.
Mugla is ours +1g. Order temple. 1 citizen, hes resisting.
Move elite out of city, 1/4horse into city. All others fortify.
Jaipur barracks rushed for 20g.
Kill 2 Mongol archers leaving our horses 1/4 and 3/4.
Not knowing the ages very well, I know for sure that Babylon and China are in the industrial age but am unsure about the others.
Japan is starting to slip, Babylon has taken Osaka which was a source of iron. Babylon is still trading for thier iron AFAIK.
BT Mongol Horseman kills one of our horses on the treacherous chinese roads.
More Chinese movement.
(8) 430AD
Karachi worker>worker.
Jaipur barracks>horse.
Koreans complete smiths. Babs start Newtons (cascade?)
Horse dies trying to kill Mongol counterpart. Second horse finishes the job.
Mongols offer 2 workers for peace but I want their horses.
Babylon demand TM and 62g. Bastard. I cave.
(9) 440AD
Dehli horse>horse.
Kill archer without a scratch.
BT Archer kills our horse. These trades are killing me. I vow not to attack another archer in the jungle at the end of a road.
(10) 450AD
Bombay worker>settler.
Madras horse>horse.
Lahore horse>horse.
Karachi worker>market.
Horses move to Mongol Capital, can attack next turn.
All builds are vetoable. We could really use markets and the like but we are at war so try to keep building war like things.
FP is due in 6. We don't have a second core to jump the palace to so lets keep it here for now. In the long run, jumping up to the Monogol capitol might be good. That is if we can claim some chinese cities and if the jungle is cleared and land improved. Other possiblity is to our eastern pennisula. Once at war with Babylon, use a settler to plant a city on the river between all the other cities. Then get it to max pop as fast as possible. Note that we will need tons of workers to pull that off.
I've been storing units in Karachi for use in upgrade/attacking Chinese supplyline. Next player get these ready so when our MA runs out we can catch them off guard. Note that we have some sentinels on the hills IN CHINESE territory so make sure they get removed before war is declared.
Don't go to war with Japan as we still have a peace treaty with them and if our rep is ruined we can forget about a comeback.
I'm sure that China has Gunpowder as they are in the next age already. But it looks as if they may not have any saltpeter. Their land is not high odds for Salt and they have not upgraded their pikemen yet. Cross your fingers, elephants versus pikes is much more fun than against muskets.
I think we've already lost the game but willing to stick it out. Try to have fun.
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